Conquest Changes in Game Update 5.9

[olagatonjedi]

Once-a-day per legacy restrictions favour players who can log in for one or two hours every day, over those who can only log in for one or two days of the week. Even if someone can do 6 hours in one day, the legacy restrictions mean they will not be able to match the person who can do 1 hour a day, for six days.

Inot sure what you mean. IMO, there are plenty of activities to do over, say 6 hours of, time without losing out on any points.

[olagatonjedi]

How does removing the restrictions create a lopsided competition? All players would be given the same freedom to grind the same repeatables meaning the same perks of a open conquest system would be afforded to all.

The more restrictions are lifted, the more it favors players who have more alts and more playtime. A system that significantly favors one type of playerbase over another is broken.

 

Players willing and able to spend more time on conquest would be rightfully rewarded for their effort.

And, they can be, with a reasonable (not abusive) maximum contribution from alts.

 

What you propose reminds me of communism, where you feel everyone ought to be given the same thing regardless how much time or energy they put into what it is they do.

I would enciurage you to re-read my posts in totality to determine a more accurate understanding of my stance.

 

The way the conquest system works now is because legacy restrictions are in place players must choose what toon and guild they want certain points to go to, and with no incentive or gain for alts many people are pigeonholed to focus only on specific characters to accrue the points.

Your posts suggests you may not understand how cinquest works. Players can currently play alts and complete conquest multiple times.

 

This system diminishes alts from being played,

Conquest has no direct effect on ability to play alts.

 

If people are encouraged to play alts that means more FPs are active, more heroics are killed, more OPs are ran, more GSF and WZs are cycled...

No, it encourages SPECIFIC fps, ops, wzs, heroics to be run. Does it encourage participation in the other 95% of content? Nope.

 

No advantages are given to anyone when all players are granted the same opportunities to play and complete conquest goals if the restrictions are lifted.

By nature, not all players have the same opportunity to play.

[DWho]

The more restrictions are lifted, the more it favors players who have more alts and more playtime. A system that significantly favors one type of playerbase over another is broken.

So by your own definition above, the current system is broken because it favors the PVP playerbase (most PVP conquest activities are infinitely repeatable, have no cost, and yield a sizeable number of points while "solo" content and "raiding" content are severely limited in repeatability and are significantly more costly in both time and credits)

[DuchessKristania]

I would be satisfied with once a day, week, etc per faction over legacy. We don't have cross faction guilds and since conquest is a guild activity, things I do on one faction shouldn't prohibit me from gaining those points on the other faction as well. The guilds I'm in are sister guilds and due to our small size and the once per legacy restrictions we can rarely hit the minimum goal on both Imp and Pub. There really is no reason the restrictions shouldn't be based on faction rather than legacy.

[DWho]

I would be satisfied with once a day, week, etc per faction over legacy. We don't have cross faction guilds and since conquest is a guild activity, things I do on one faction shouldn't prohibit me from gaining those points on the other faction as well. The guilds I'm in are sister guilds and due to our small size and the once per legacy restrictions we can rarely hit the minimum goal on both Imp and Pub. There really is no reason the restrictions shouldn't be based on faction rather than legacy.

 

Personally I would like to see three things

 

1) Heroics back to per character instead of per legacy (they are already per day per character by default)

2) Operations to per character instead of per legacy (these are also limited to once per day per character by default

3) Planetary bonus for planet invaded (lower base point but give a bonus for the planet you are invading)

 

1&2 bring raiding and "solo" play in line with PVP/Flashpoint conquest goals while 3 would limit the ability to farm the rampages/heroics for planets you are not invading. Personally I'd like to see heroics reinstated to more than one per planet but if a sacrifice for "balance" needs to be made, that would be acceptable. The rampages somewhat mitigate the loss of points from the multiple heroics. As an alternative, you could make the rampages once per week and the heroics daily repeatable in the previous multiple heroic format.

[olagatonjedi]

So by your own definition above, the current system is broken because it favors the PVP playerbase (most PVP conquest activities are infinitely repeatable, have no cost, and yield a sizeable number of points while "solo" content and "raiding" content are severely limited in repeatability and are significantly more costly in both time and credits)

As i have said before, there are many variables involved in trying to balance a complex competitive system like conquest. I do believe that any unrestricted content is subject to potential abuse or favoritism towards a certain group. Nobody except BW knows how many people regularly participate in PvP vs those in PvE, nor do we know what percentage of total conquest points are contributed by PvP. I am 99% certain BW balancing team considers how much the contributions from pvp can or will affect overall balance, and adjust accordingly. They have even stated that they evaluate various aspects of conquest, including point totals and repeatability before making changes.

Edited August 12, 2018 by olagatonjedi

[olagatonjedi]

I would be satisfied with once a day, week, etc per faction over legacy. We don't have cross faction guilds and since conquest is a guild activity, things I do on one faction shouldn't prohibit me from gaining those points on the other faction as well. The guilds I'm in are sister guilds and due to our small size and the once per legacy restrictions we can rarely hit the minimum goal on both Imp and Pub. There really is no reason the restrictions shouldn't be based on faction rather than legacy.

On the surface, this seems like a more likely change than opening up restrictions entirely, as some are suggesting. With more discussion about this change specifically, maybe a happy medium could be achieved.

 

One thing to note though, is even allowing for faction based restrictions allows the same overusers/abusers to double their production, thus causing a doubling of the same competition, since both factions still go against each other in the overall conquest.

 

Good thought, but i already see a concern.

Edited August 12, 2018 by olagatonjedi

[Khaleg]

For some, having a balanced, competitive conquest system is fun. Restrictions allow that, while open alt-productivity decreases the fun for them. Who-'s fun is more important?

 

Exactly on point.

[Tahana]

The way the conquest system works now is because legacy restrictions are in place players must choose what toon and guild they want certain points to go to, and with no incentive or gain for alts many people are pigeonholed to focus only on specific characters to accrue the points.

 

So basically you don't want Guild A to know that you have toons elsewhere that spent their time grinding conquest for Guild B..

[Darevsool]

So basically you don't want Guild A to know that you have toons elsewhere that spent their time grinding conquest for Guild B..

 

I think they're saying they want to be able to put points in multiple guilds.

[Master_Morak]

Remove once / legacy / day

 

Remove once / legacy / day

 

Remove once / legacy / day

 

Just wanted to let the Devs know, with the recent update... just because we've stopped hounding you to implement this, despite hundred upon hundreds of posts, across multiple threads that you've responded to asking for feedback... that we are still not happy that you have ignored this request, and its implementation still actively hurts conquest for all guilds.

 

You're just ignoring player criticism long enough for us to get sick of wasting our time requesting it.

 

If anybody in the player base agrees with me, please support keeping this thread alive. I really, REALLY loathe this once / legacy / day.

 

Fully agree with you - remove this idiotic restrictions and let the players play.

[Toraak]

Legacy restrictions causes an affect on my access to content if less people are in queu for GSF (which causes less pops). I've noticed a LARGE increase in my down time from GSF since 5.8 came out (which is when conquest changed), so these restrictions have definitely affected access to content. Before 5.9.2 I was seeing 40+ min queu's during Primetime on SS some nights (and even weekends). Even after 5.9.2 I'm seeing 40 min-1 1/2 hour queu's during the day. I seldom saw that before 5.8 even during the afternoons on SS. Edited August 13, 2018 by Toraak

[olagatonjedi]

Legacy restrictions causes an affect on my access to content if less people are in queu for GSF (which causes less pops). I've noticed a LARGE increase in my down time from GSF since 5.8 came out (which is when conquest changed), so these restrictions have definitely affected access to content. Before 5.9.2 I was seeing 40+ min queu's during Primetime on SS some nights (and even weekends). Even after 5.9.2 I'm seeing 40 min-1 1/2 hour queu's during the day. I seldom saw that before 5.8 even during the afternoons on SS.

We should probably get rid of conquest altogether.

 

Before conquest, most people would queue up for ALL fps because of the GF rewards. Since conquest started, most people only queue for SPECIFIC fps. I have noticed the overall negative effect that conquest has on the game, amd would like all of conqiest removed immediately.

 

Swtor population sites correlate perfectly with this data, too. Look it up.

 

Is that kinda what you were getting at?

Edited August 13, 2018 by olagatonjedi

[Lhancelot]

I think they're saying they want to be able to put points in multiple guilds.

 

Exactly. ^

 

So basically you don't want Guild A to know that you have toons elsewhere that spent their time grinding conquest for Guild B..

 

How you got this from what you quoted me writing is beyond me.

Edited August 13, 2018 by Lhancelot

[Toraak]

We should probably get rid of conquest altogether.

 

Before conquest, most people would queue up for ALL fps because of the GF rewards. Since conquest started, most people only queue for SPECIFIC fps. I have noticed the overall negative effect that conquest has on the game, amd would like all of conqiest removed immediately.

 

Swtor population sites correlate perfectly with this data, too. Look it up.

 

Is that kinda what you were getting at?

 

My point was with the old conquest people would be in queu all day long. Perhaps 30-hour queus during off hours, however with the new system the queu's are to the point on SS your lucky to get 2-3 pops in a 4-5 hour window.during off hours. During primetime it was even a 40 min queu at times I see this as a sign of the new system intentionally reducing peoples interest. GSF may not be as popular as some of us would like but Conquest farmers were a key component in keeping the queu's going at a reasonable pace.

 

For the record FP's haven't been popular even the GF for a very long time even before 5.8 because the rewards haven't been worth the time. I've seen a complete lack of FP interest since 5.0 came out due to the fact you get no useful gear from any of them like you did in the 1.x cycle (needing the FP gear to gear up for Operations), the CXP isn't comparable to other activities, and people generally not wanting to deal with random pugs and having wipefests on old content.

Edited August 13, 2018 by Toraak

[Lhancelot]

We should probably get rid of conquest altogether.

 

Before conquest, most people would queue up for ALL fps because of the GF rewards. Since conquest started, most people only queue for SPECIFIC fps. I have noticed the overall negative effect that conquest has on the game, amd would like all of conqiest removed immediately.

 

Swtor population sites correlate perfectly with this data, too. Look it up.

 

Is that kinda what you were getting at?

 

Or, you could just make all FPs reward you conquest points, so none are more popular than others.

 

In fact, you could use their metrics and figure out what FPs are least popular and grant MORE conquest points for doing them!

 

Conquest could be the lubricant that makes all content worth doing on swtor. A glue to hold it all together, if you will.

[TUXs]

My point was with the old conquest people would be in queu all day long. Perhaps 30-hour queus during off hours, however with the new system the queu's are to the point on SS your lucky to get 2-3 pops in a 4-5 hour window.during off hours. During primetime it was even a 40 min queu at times I see this as a sign of the new system intentionally reducing peoples interest. GSF may not be as popular as some of us would like but Conquest farmers were a key component in keeping the queu's going at a reasonable pace.

One factor in this is how few players take the initiative to start a group - plenty will join, but few will start one. The few who aren't afraid to sit on Fleet and spam "LFX", are removed from the pool as soon as they've done a single run for the daily reward, or done one of the 7500pt Ops. Without those players refilling the pool, fewer and fewer people run things. Bioware has intentionally hurt the game with this once per Legacy crap.

Edited August 13, 2018 by TUXs

[NeoBlakkrstal]

The more restrictions are lifted, the more it favors players who have more alts and more playtime. A system that significantly favors one type of playerbase over another is broken.

 

You mean like favoring those with fewer alts, and less play time?

 

Get rid of the Once per legacy restriction period. Keep the rest of the restrictions in place. That way a person can do all of the targets on their alts. Once per week, or once per day. But they wouldn't be forced to play one toon. This would solve the anti-alt aspect of the current conquest system.

[Tahana]

How you got this from what you quoted me writing is beyond me.

lol.. I guess it is reading between the lines, knowing the human condition and being a pessimist all rolled into one..

 

Also being a business analyst in another life might have something to do with it.

[Lhancelot]

lol.. I guess it is reading between the lines, knowing the human condition and being a pessimist all rolled into one..

 

Also being a business analyst in another life might have something to do with it.

 

Yeah I know what you mean, I was going to point out how you were being paranoid, but then I realized I think that way too it would be a tad hypocritical of me lol.

 

I don't really view guilds as competitive forces regarding conquest, not like I used to view PVP and imp versus pub matches in PVP back when there seemed to be a real hatred for the opposite faction and players on that side.

 

...so I guess I don't worry much about someone not liking me in different guilds.

[Lhancelot]

You mean like favoring those with fewer alts, and less play time?

 

 

That was an awesome counter point. rofl very nicely done.

[olagatonjedi]

Or, you could just make all FPs reward you conquest points, so none are more popular than others.

 

In fact, you could use their metrics and figure out what FPs are least popular and grant MORE conquest points for doing them!

 

Conquest could be the lubricant that makes all content worth doing on swtor. A glue to hold it all together, if you will.

Not a bad idea, as long as it still restricts total potential points per day, per legacy.

 

However, this idea would essentially remove the uniqueness of each planets specific tasks.

 

As said before, conquest is a lot more complex than people seem to understand.

 

This is an MMO we are talking about, after all.

[olagatonjedi]

You mean like favoring those with fewer alts, and less play time?

Like the casual person......umm, yeah.

 

Currently, its pretty neutral as it stands. It doesnt favor any particular playerbase significantly more than others.

[olagatonjedi]

lol.. I guess it is reading between the lines, knowing the human condition and being a pessimist all rolled into one..

 

Also being a business analyst in another life might have something to do with it.

There is truth to the original statement, btw.

[KendraP]

Just saying between the pvp changes and conquest changes there now comes a point where i literally have nothing to do in swtor. There is talk of going game hunting unless something gives.