KendraP Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 This is kind of wrong, Jugg tank in the short term can actually outburst Jugg DPS right now, especially Vengeance. Crushing Blow can hit 25k, which isn't as hard as Furious Strike which can see 30k+, but they also get a proc'd Retaliation which is off the GCD and can crit for around 12k itself, that's 37k damage in 1 GCD, more than your typical Ambush from a Sniper. The difference is Jugg tank doesn't have nearly as much sustained especially with the nerf to the Chilling Scream damage, so if you can play around Crushing Blows... except, there's no cast for Crushing Blow or indication its coming, so its not really something you can play around. I love my Jugg but I can admit Crushing Blow is ridiculously powerful right now. And without guardian slash you may as well just tell all the skanks to go play sin. Or pt since they have more unmitigatable damage anyway. Also riposte isn't an aoe and I thought that's what we were getting hung up on. If by in the short term you mean one GCD sure. Since vigi is the only dps spec I bother with I admit a certain degree of ignorance, but I highly doubt a burst window is one gcd. Also after that one GCD say a mara (heck even a focus guardian) is probably doing another big attack while I'm doing not nearly as much. Because I seriously doubt a burst window is one DCD. Since I do play with friends who play dps. What I can say with 100% accuracy is that, assuming I can get few enough deaths for a comparable uptime, I do more dps on my vigi than my tank. The issue is uptime because I die a lot more. (See my character has come to equal focus. Focus is not something vigi handles well). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadecounty Posted February 22, 2018 Share Posted February 22, 2018 (edited) And without guardian slash you may as well just tell all the skanks to go play sin. Or pt since they have more unmitigatable damage anyway. Also riposte isn't an aoe and I thought that's what we were getting hung up on. If by in the short term you mean one GCD sure. Since vigi is the only dps spec I bother with I admit a certain degree of ignorance, but I highly doubt a burst window is one gcd. Also after that one GCD say a mara (heck even a focus guardian) is probably doing another big attack while I'm doing not nearly as much. Because I seriously doubt a burst window is one DCD. Since I do play with friends who play dps. What I can say with 100% accuracy is that, assuming I can get few enough deaths for a comparable uptime, I do more dps on my vigi than my tank. The issue is uptime because I die a lot more. (See my character has come to equal focus. Focus is not something vigi handles well). A burst window varies but anywhere from 1 to 3 GCD's (1 if you're timing burst with another DPS and a tank on a ranked team or something). That said, you also have Vicious Throw on leap proc which most skanks will take and Scream which hits really hard as a tank now as well (Jugg tank Scream actually hits harder than Vengeance except it isn't auto crit). Ravage too, Jugg tank Ravage hits harder than Vengeance version. The reason Jugg tank will fall behind in sustained is they don't have dots to maintain uptime if the opponent kites well, and they have periods in their rotation with nothing better to use than Vicious Slash which sucks. Edited February 22, 2018 by wadecounty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
merovejec Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 So skank tanks arent the problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peiper-kgr-gd Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 remove this **** shank-tank from swtor only tanks in tank gear should be tanking remove this **** offguard from all other classes and swtor will be fine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeneas_Falco Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 Just remove the tank tclasses from PVP. Everyone should be playing a Mara , Merc , Op or Sniper by now anyhow. This game going to end before they fix the other classes sol let’s not waste anymore time on it The damage potential of skank tanks is every bit as OP as Merc and Sniper defenses or Ruthless Aggressor. That Merc and Sniper defenses and RA need to be nerfed as well isn't an argument for keeping skank tanks as they are. Tanks should excel at support but not damage and DPS should excel at damage output but lack a tank's survivability. That currently is not the case. You have skanks that function just as well as a good DPS and some DPS specs that shrug off damage like tanks. The problem with SWTOR PVP currently isn't that there is one spec that is a jack-of-all-trades, it is that there are several. That needs to change across the board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MackPol Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 So skank tanks arent the problem? Merc did more dmg then the tank .. seems dd classes can do more. Not sure what is the excuse for the Maras ? Other tank did much less. Seems to me there is a skill disparity here. Also how often do you see that happen ? I mean the aoe dmg potential is there, especially for Pt but they trade much survivalability for that. Seriously who would you rather tunnel Mara, Merc or Pt tank ? Just if they tone down dmg potential of tanks and won’t adjust dd cal added survivalability we may end up with horribly boring matches, not only in regs but also in ranked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KendraP Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 Ok I'll bite again. This is from a match of mine last night. https://m.imgur.com/a/5uG4D I was 7th in damage. 4 healers, so that leaves 5 dps I beat. 3 form my team, 2 imps. Of the 3 from my team, 2 were node guarding and one was being carried (the dps sage, he was being totally farmed). I assume at least one of the imps was guarding their node too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadecounty Posted February 24, 2018 Share Posted February 24, 2018 Ok I'll bite again. This is from a match of mine last night. https://m.imgur.com/a/5uG4D I was 7th in damage. 4 healers, so that leaves 5 dps I beat. 3 form my team, 2 imps. Of the 3 from my team, 2 were node guarding and one was being carried (the dps sage, he was being totally farmed). I assume at least one of the imps was guarding their node too. I think the cases where tanks are doing extreme DPS are usually PT's because of AOE potential, Jugg tanks still do great damage though. If there were sustained fights at mid that's typically where a Jugg tank will begin to fall behind because he has no dot spread and his AOE isn't as easily applied as PT's or sins. The scenario people complain about with Jugg tanks isn't related to regs, but arenas where a common comp is 2 Jugg tanks in DPS gear, a 3rd bursty DPS (arsenal merc/sniper usually) and healer, each Jugg guards a DPS or healer, they time CC on the opposing tank, then pick an unguarded target and unload. 2 Crushing Blows + Retaliation + Heatseeker or Ambush = at least 80k damage in most cases. You can do this about once every 45 seconds because of cooldowns on your CC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MackPol Posted February 25, 2018 Share Posted February 25, 2018 (edited) Out of over two hundred TR games this season I have never ever lost to 2 tanks... being 2 PT or 2 Juggs, havent even seen it that often. They cant win any serious game, dont do enough damage. Unless there is like 1 or 2 good teams doing that on some server ? Edited February 25, 2018 by MackPol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquor Posted February 26, 2018 Share Posted February 26, 2018 Out of over two hundred TR games this season I have never ever lost to 2 tanks... being 2 PT or 2 Juggs, havent even seen it that often. They cant win any serious game, dont do enough damage. Unless there is like 1 or 2 good teams doing that on some server ? Ikr Threads like the op are mostly troll posts because they don't understand mechanics, their class abilities nor how to counter tanks using dps mods, enhancements and utilities. Most of the threads like this are from bads that could use some assistance in the L2P area. But that just ruffles their feathers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Husqvarna Posted February 26, 2018 Share Posted February 26, 2018 People posting screenshots of 1-2 end game statistics and making it seem like that's evidence of something ... Why would any tank not gear towards DPS in the current state of PvP mitigation? There is zero reason. If they hamper their DPS and continue to not make defense relevant in PvP, which I can almost guarantee they'll do, its just going to be more of a Merc, Mara, Sniper show. Skank Tank isn't the problem, its been around for years. All of PvP is imbalanced, we have to live with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KendraP Posted February 26, 2018 Share Posted February 26, 2018 Doing ranked right now, i have yet to see these mysterious dual skank teams. hmm odd night maybe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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