Discussion Topic: Bolster Changes in PvP

[SilverStarSeaker]

Amazing the crap people will come up with to defend an advantage.

 

Should also force everyone to have the exact same ping and the exact same class. Y'know so it's only about skill.

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

Since BW hasn't responded

 

The first 100 unique posters (through about page 22):

 

ilvl238 had 17 votes with 2 of them wanting even lower

ilvl240 had 13 votes

ilvl242 had 66 votes with 42 wanting even higher

 

General themes were mostly bringing back faster gear progression (pre 5.0), or making gear only matter for ranked, with a couple of folks arguing the opposite of that. Some people had more than one ilvl as acceptable in their responses. 5 people didn't have a ilvl but 3 of those said lower than current, 1 said higher than current, and one said nothing at all.

 

Hope that helps people see where at least the forum community is at.

 

Good job getting the tally, if BW is watching that will certainly help to give them a good idea which way the wind is blowing. Thanks for the effort.

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

Should also force everyone to have the exact same ping and the exact same class. Y'know so it's only about skill.

 

We should all have to take the same utilities too this way no one has the advantage of choice.

[Jedi_riches]

Because ranked is all about gear not skill?

 

Maybe you have a point, though if you thought like that about the the whole game hm ops would also need a bolster and at that point just remove gear from the game if everything got bolstered. I think believe gear should matter in all top tier content which would be ranked and hm flash points and ops anything done below that is done for fun and is supposed to be enjoyed all not just geared ones.

Edited July 15, 2017 by Jedi_riches

[KraigStarkiller]

Please give us a toggle hood option in costumes tabs!

I really like my temple guardian set but I also like my characters hair, please listen to me!

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

Maybe you have a point, though if you thought like that about the the whole game hm ops would also need a bolster and at that point just remove gear from the game if everything got bolstered. I think believe gear should matter in all top tier content which would be ranked and hm flash points and ops anything done below that is done for fun and is supposed to be enjoyed all not just geared ones.

 

I respect your opinion but please don't call any FP top tier content =]

[Alssaran]

I respect your opinion but please don't call any FP top tier content =]

 

If ranked is considered top tier content, then I would also consider HM flashpoints top tier content. Ranked doesn't require more skill to enter than hardmode flashpoints do, but some HM flashpoints do require situational awareness, rotations, positioning and class knowledge. The bonus boss in Battle of Rishi HM is still one of the more challenging encounters in the game.

 

Should also force everyone to have the exact same ping and the exact same class. Y'know so it's only about skill.

 

Your hyperbolic statements really don't do anything except make you appear like you are defending the gear gap not because it is entertaining or healthy for SWTOR's PvP, but simply because you believe the concept of "basic" fairness is ridiculous after you reached the top tier yourself.

 

It is about making an environment that has some basic fairness in PvP. Everything that shifts this balance of power should be down to player choice and skill. These things can be influenced by stims, grenades, utilities and other factors because this boils down to the player's choice to take a crew skill/utility, and the skill it requires to use it properly. However, gear doesn't factor into this. Gear has neither to do with skill, seeing that the gear grind doesn't require a "skill cap", nor does it have to do with player choice. It's simply tideous.

 

At least basic regs should offer a basic fairness for entry level players. If new players feel like they are beaten without any chance to do even a single kill, they will get bored and leave, and ranked and the PvP pops will suffer.

 

Two days ago, I had a reg game on my merc where we stomped the Republic 1,050 to 0 in hypergate. They were fighting us at pylons. The issue was that four of us (average of 242 or higher) were worth six of them (236). It would've required twelve 236 players to push out all eight of our 242-248 geared players. And even if they were highly skilled, our 248 gear made each of our average players worth slightly more than each of their upper average 236 players. That is simply boring design.

[Zhedzaban]

My 2 cents

 

Get rid of bolster all together. I've always enjoyed getting stomped and slowly building my character up to eventually competing or doing the stomping.

 

Failing that just leave it as is or lower it. Oh and reduce the UC costs or increase the UC rewards for gods sake.

[Foambreaker]

Should also force everyone to have the exact same ping and the exact same class. Y'know so it's only about skill.

 

You can always tell when someone has no reasonable discussion points, they resort to stupid extremes...

[Icykill_]

We should all have to take the same utilities too this way no one has the advantage of choice.

 

Run naked 😉 too

Edited July 17, 2017 by Icykill_

[Icykill_]

So for those who want bolster to 250 let's not forget datacrons everybody should get the same stats. Having all the datacrons vs none has to just as big difference between 246 vs 248. Also FPS should be lcapped . No grenades either I can't afford them. No premades in regs either only solo queue. No stims. No USE relics.

 

Datacrons - easy to do

FPS - technically impossible due to some people having really old PCs

Grenades - sell some stuff, do some missions, craft them 🙄

Stims - refer to Grenades

Relics - ??? Seems a bit of a dumb request as anyone can get them... care to elaborate?

 

The grind for datacrons is not even remotely compareable to the 248 gear grind. Assuming you find a group for the fleet datacron and having a guide available, you can get all the holocrons within a day or two.

.

 

You can get all the datacrons in 4.5 hours 😉... that is also taking into account the time it takes to ride the balloon on Tatts

Edited July 17, 2017 by Icykill_

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

Run naked 😉 too

 

Now you're talken! =p

Edited July 17, 2017 by WayOfTheWarriorx

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

 

You can get all the datacrons in 4.5 hours 😉... that is also taking into account the time it takes to ride the balloon on Tatts

 

That friggen ballon, I missed the jump about 5 times, took me 6 hours to get that damn holocron!

Edited July 17, 2017 by WayOfTheWarriorx

[Icykill_]

Since BW hasn't responded

 

The first 100 unique posters (through about page 22):

 

ilvl238 had 17 votes with 2 of them wanting even lower

ilvl240 had 13 votes

ilvl242 had 66 votes with 42 wanting even higher

 

General themes were mostly bringing back faster gear progression (pre 5.0), or making gear only matter for ranked, with a couple of folks arguing the opposite of that. Some people had more than one ilvl as acceptable in their responses. 5 people didn't have a ilvl but 3 of those said lower than current, 1 said higher than current, and one said nothing at all.

 

Hope that helps people see where at least the forum community is at.

 

Those votes are because people have only responded to Biowares proposed numbers and haven't read any of the other posts on how Bolster works. They've also not thought about asking Bio to raise it more themselves because they think Biowares numbers are the only options.

 

I wonder what the votes would be if Bioware explained how Bolster really works and what would happen to the gear gaps if they raised it to 250 or above, compared to if they raised it to 242. Then asked people what lvl they would want Bolster set at.

 

I think you would see a big change in those votes. It's hard to get accurate numbers when you don't have all the information to vote.

Edited July 17, 2017 by Icykill_

[Icykill_]

That friggen ballon, I missed the jump about 5 times, took me 6 hours to get that damn holocron!

 

Also don't dance on it while you are waiting 💃🏻🕺👯

You often fall through the floor 😉

[Ottoattack]

Since BW hasn't responded

 

The first 100 unique posters (through about page 22):

 

ilvl238 had 17 votes with 2 of them wanting even lower

ilvl240 had 13 votes

ilvl242 had 66 votes with 42 wanting even higher

 

General themes were mostly bringing back faster gear progression (pre 5.0), or making gear only matter for ranked, with a couple of folks arguing the opposite of that. Some people had more than one ilvl as acceptable in their responses. 5 people didn't have a ilvl but 3 of those said lower than current, 1 said higher than current, and one said nothing at all.

 

Hope that helps people see where at least the forum community is at.

 

Thanks! And no surprise. Majority want bolster as high as possible. There is no for having it lower. I do not see any reason why it should not be 248 and I do have 248 on my main.

[NogueiraA]

Good catch - no war zone medpacs completely unfair or jerky or sandwiches

 

Stop, your way of arguing is not funny and no one will take you seriously.

 

Bolster to 250 i'll come back to play all my characters in pvp again, which means i'll play the game more, which means i'll spend more money... That's simple logic.

[stoopicus]

Those votes are because people have only responded to Biowares proposed numbers and haven't read any of the other posts on how Bolster works. They've also not thought about asking Bio to raise it more themselves because they think Biowares numbers are the only options.

 

I wonder what the votes would be if Bioware explained how Bolster really works and what would happen to the gear gaps if they raised it to 250 or above, compared to if they raised it to 242. Then asked people what lvl they would want Bolster set at.

 

I think you would see a big change in those votes. It's hard to get accurate numbers when you don't have all the information to vote.

 

Actually - more than twice as many people (66 vs 30) want it at the highest offered level, and exactly 2/3 of those people (42/66) want it even higher than they offered. Meanwhile several of the 238 or lower crowd are PvE scrubs here on some kind of bizarro world "this is why we can't have nice things" agenda, and should be completely ignored.

 

That's pretty much what I would expect.

Edited July 17, 2017 by stoopicus

[VaceDemon]

We are all meme's and need all the help we can get am I right? make gear obsolete! give us bolster up to 250 or higher so the meme's don't have to worry about playing the game to pvp. Remove augments so no one has an advantage while you're at it. Get rid of all objective based pvp maps since everyone just plays death match anyways. Put the players spawns right next to each other so the stronger team can farm the other one.

[Kalarie]

Actually - more than twice as many people (66 vs 30) want it at the highest offered level, and exactly 2/3 of those people (42/66) want it even higher than they offered. Meanwhile several of the 238 or lower crowd are PvE scrubs here on some kind of bizarro world "this is why we can't have nice things" agenda, and should be completely ignored.

 

That's pretty much what I would expect.

 

I think you are right and if you objectively take a deep breath and read the thread as if you were a BW exec who never played the game, you would come away with the impression that the vast majority want very very little to no gear gap at all. I wish I could tell you how that translates to the entire swtor pvp population, but forum threads usually have two biases, upset people, and vocal minorities.

 

Anecdotally, in game, I run into two crowds 99% of the time. People who want no gear gap, and people that don't even know what bolster is or why it matters. That leads me to believe that BW is highly likely to see no negative impact on pvp by raising bolster to the highest ilvl possible. It also happens to be a position I support, so give any comment I make that salt if you want.

[Foambreaker]

... Meanwhile several of the 238 or lower crowd are PvE scrubs here on some kind of bizarro world "this is why we can't have nice things" agenda, and should be completely ignored.

 

That's pretty much what I would expect.

 

Some minimum PvP achievement should be required to post in the PvP forums.

 

Battlemaster on the legacy would be my suggestion.

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

Some minimum PvP achievement should be required to post in the PvP forums.

 

Battlemaster on the legacy would be my suggestion.

 

Because achievements mean people know what they are talking about? heh

[Soljin]

Because achievements mean people know what they are talking about? heh

 

No but Battlemaster hikes the statistical chance a smidge...

Edited July 18, 2017 by Soljin

[WayOfTheWarriorx]

No but Battlemaster hikes the statistical chance a smidge...

 

Fair enough.

[MeNaCe-NZ]

No but Battlemaster hikes the statistical chance a smidge...

 

That would probably backfire on anyone wanting higher bolster or no stat gear at all though since many of those who do want such a change don't bother playing PVP without such a change.