baryonic-member Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 do itAs you can see, that patch was released nearly two weeks BEFORE official launch (29 November, 2004 - contra November 19, 2004). You are a ***** living in your imaginary reality or a real ******** troll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DThoran Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Anybody take a second to think that swtor didn't necessarily "want" to be exactly like wow, in that it has every bell & whistle option that wow has, just in different colors? I agree some options have come to be expected in mmo's, but they are not automatically fail or somehow flawed if not included. Not everyone wants a wow clone with sw paint. They have included a great number of the things that made wow a hugely successful game, but have made the choice to change or completely leave out others. Being an mmo doesn't require equality with other mmo's. It is a separate game, and should be judged as such. When I go play wow there are certain things I expect, cuz you know, it's wow, but when I play tradewars I look for and expect different things because it's, you know, tradewars. Will swtor surpass wow? Who knows only time will tell, but I do know this, it is fresh, it is new, and it certainly is NOT wow, and those are all good things in my book. The minor improvements are worth waiting on. After all I gave 7 years to wow to get it together, I can't wait a few months or a year to see what happens with swtor? For pete's sake its been like 9 days! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhysahn Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) Anybody take a second to think that swtor didn't necessarily "want" to be exactly like wow, in that it has every bell & whistle option that wow has, just in different colors? I agree some options have come to be expected in mmo's, but they are not automatically fail or somehow flawed if not included. Not everyone wants a wow clone with sw paint. They have included a great number of the things that made wow a hugely successful game, but have made the choice to change or completely leave out others. Being an mmo doesn't require equality with other mmo's. It is a separate game, and should be judged as such. When I go play wow there are certain things I expect, cuz you know, it's wow, but when I play tradewars I look for and expect different things because it's, you know, tradewars. Will swtor surpass wow? Who knows only time will tell, but I do know this, it is fresh, it is new, and it certainly is NOT wow, and those are all good things in my book. The minor improvements are worth waiting on. After all I gave 7 years to wow to get it together, I can't wait a few months or a year to see what happens with swtor? For pete's sake its been like 9 days! Completely Agree with this. Also, if I may add, consider this: If Bioware for SWTOR to have all those 'missing' features, people claim it 'needs'. Then two things can happen: - The game is released on the same date, with omly 10% really working OR - The game would be delayed by at least 5 - 6 months. Bioware chose to release it without the features. I assume they chose to first launch the core in an acceptable state. And it really is acceptable. Minor bugs aside, the game is really playable, me thinks. I agree that there's a LOT of stuff to be done for Bioware, but those will be added. With a community like this, they will have little choice eh? Fine by me. I only pray that they keep up the pace with adding new features and updates and tweaks the way Trion is doing with Rift or Turbine with LOTRO . Those games are looked down upon by the majority of the MMO community, but if you would have a look at their developmentcycles carefully, I, for one, can only express amazement. Bioware in this respect, has cut out even more work for themselves, because adding a new area means: - Adding new quest storylines - Adding the voice acting to that - Adding Class specific story lines and quests (with plot turnings etc) So if they can keep up. All I can do is bow my head in respect to Bioware. I feel like the would be able to pull it off. Whether they will or will not, is adding to a little excitement My 2 cts. Nothing more EDIT: typo Edited December 29, 2011 by Rhysahn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reecelol Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Will swtor surpass wow? literally 0 chance. not even trolling. this is my honest to god opinion. this game has 0 chance of even coming remotely close. if you believe it will i have some beachfront property in colorado id like to sell you. real cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NasherUK Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) If wow continues to decline the way it has this year, it won't be long before TOR actually overtakes it. They are loosing 100,000s of players a month at the moment. Mists of kung-fu pandas will only make it worse. They announced the figure for this quarter earlier this month and had already lost over 800k, just for this quarter Edited December 29, 2011 by NasherUK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spetsnazos Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" "Bigger Budget" SHUT UP WITH THAT CRAP! ..... most of that Budget went into the Amazing voice actors if you remove that cost then its probably had less money than WoW or any other mmo at design + wow had once again 7 years of 10,000-ish players play £10, $15, etc etc to fund their game Swtor has most of those At launch and removed the useless **** wow failed at. because MMO players really care about voice actors Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reecelol Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 because MMO players really care about voice actors how much could voice acting have cost? 90% of the npc's sound british. they could have done that with like 2 people. EH YO GOVNAH, GOT A BIT OF A WOMP RAT PROBLEEM DOWN BY THE OL PETROL STATION. jesus, if i wanted to hear that for hours on end id have watched top gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DThoran Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 literally 0 chance. not even trolling. this is my honest to god opinion. this game has 0 chance of even coming remotely close. if you believe it will i have some beachfront property in colorado id like to sell you. real cheap. And that is just it, your opinion. If you feel the game has so little to offer why are you here? I was THERE for the release of wow, and swtor has it not only beat in that regard, but crushed by a mile. To say otherwise shows either a complete lack of knowledge or a complete denial of reality, your choice. Smoothest mmo release in the history of the genre. For some people, it will never beat wow, no matter what they add to it, if it had everything wow has done perfectly over 7 years PLUS what bioware has brought to the table, all done up with a pretty bow and free to boot, some people would still prefer wow. To each their own. However, to some people, this is already better than wow in many ways, and will continue to only get better. Some people have been waiting for a great SW based mmo for years, and will play the poop outta this game and run from wow like the boring, repetitive, recycling old ideas, life sucking monster that it is... Either way, stop bashing either game and play what you love. be helpful and give bioware ideas to help make this game better or play wow. Negativity never solved anything, and they DO pay attention to the forums, unlike Blizz... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DThoran Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 As for my .2 on the voice acting, good job Bioware. You expect things from Bioware and you expect things from Blizzard. One of the things people have come to know and love if they are Bioware fans is an amazing story. The kind of adventure you can really get drawn into and feel like you are a part of. This is what Bioware does better than anyone else, and they have hit it out of the part with that part of the game. Now, does the mmo potion need a little improvement and polish? Yes. Do there need to be changes and improvements? Yes. Is it utterly broken and completely unplayable? Absolutely not. As has been said, best mmo release of all time as far as playability. If anyone remembers the NIGHTMARE the first 3-4 months, (or more) of wow were (and still is when they try to implement something new) this game is beyond the gold standard in comparison. 1. Give them time. (its been 8 days or so) 2. This is NOT and will hopefully NEVER be wow. 3. Pay or don't but stop ruining everyone else's impressions of the game, let them formulate their own, and be constructive. I find it odd that the exact same people who would complain about a game like swtor being horrible are the same people who will play minecraft and troll about how utterly awesome it is. I suspect none of you would have lasted through the early 80's playing video games... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayaleith Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Ok, but if you can compare a really old game as wow with a shiny new one that had a chance to learn from good/bad things the leader did ALL THESE YEARS and still not have the new one win by far.... well something is wrong with this picture don't you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truxcer Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 (edited) Because these are current options, you can play WoW in its current state or SWTOR in its current state. You can't play "SWTOR 7 years from now when its finally gets good" or "WoW back at realease when it had like no content omgz" so there is no point comparing them. It is very possible to release a game whitch would be better than 7 years old WoW. Actually RIFT is better game than WoW at the moment (and much better than SWTOR). Edited December 29, 2011 by truxcer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mamono Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 And that is just it, your opinion. If you feel the game has so little to offer why are you here? I was THERE for the release of wow, and swtor has it not only beat in that regard, but crushed by a mile. To say otherwise shows either a complete lack of knowledge or a complete denial of reality, your choice. Smoothest mmo release in the history of the genre. For some people, it will never beat wow, no matter what they add to it, if it had everything wow has done perfectly over 7 years PLUS what bioware has brought to the table, all done up with a pretty bow and free to boot, some people would still prefer wow. To each their own. However, to some people, this is already better than wow in many ways, and will continue to only get better. Some people have been waiting for a great SW based mmo for years, and will play the poop outta this game and run from wow like the boring, repetitive, recycling old ideas, life sucking monster that it is... Either way, stop bashing either game and play what you love. be helpful and give bioware ideas to help make this game better or play wow. Negativity never solved anything, and they DO pay attention to the forums, unlike Blizz... You say people live in denial? Look in the mirror. SWToR has had WAY longer time in production and the budget is HUGE. It is THE most expensive MMO in the whole world. And then you have comersals. WoW vanilla where only played by, and heard about by, old mmo players rom EVE, everquest, Earth & Beyond and some other old MMO games. The player mass then was tiny compered to today. WoW vanilla had a small fanbase based on Warcraft 2-3. Compered to the Star Wars fanbase, the WW fanbase is minitiny. And as for the smoothest release in history, it my have been smooth but it was not the smoothest. Rift had a smoother release. But if you did not play it, you could not know it. Thouse who did see Rift on release will say that SWToR is lacking a ton of stuff compered to Rift too. The player friendly UI and the way you control and use the environment was way more polished. And Rift had ½ the time on the table before release then SWToR. SWToR is lacking in all departments on release date. It has potential but with the huge budget they have, the production time, compered to newer MMO, this game should beat the living shutout of them, but it does not, unless one is a fanboy and would be happy with a Alfa release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Absolvus Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 how much could voice acting have cost? 90% of the npc's sound british. they could have done that with like 2 people. EH YO GOVNAH, GOT A BIT OF A WOMP RAT PROBLEEM DOWN BY THE OL PETROL STATION. jesus, if i wanted to hear that for hours on end id have watched top gear. Only on imperial side. (courtesy of original star wars movies) Also, what the hell are you on about Top Gear? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reecelol Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 And that is just it, your opinion. If you feel the game has so little to offer why are you here? I was THERE for the release of wow, and swtor has it not only beat in that regard, but crushed by a mile. To say otherwise shows either a complete lack of knowledge or a complete denial of reality, your choice. Smoothest mmo release in the history of the genre. yeah thats great. i was there for wow release too. and i have to disagree with this release being a homerun of any kind. making a game thats in worse shape/equal shape in 2011 than a game that came out in 2004 is anything but a homerun. keep drinking the koolaid though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Case_Wight Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 because it had 7 years to do research and development. A game released after it, should have an idea based on whats already done of what should be included an a next gen mmo. And yet no-one has suspended the laws of physics, opened a wormhole into a new space-time-continuum and/or changed the way software is developed. Cut out the magical thinking. SWTOR today lacks some of the polish which Blizz has been able to provide WoW. SWTOR today lacks the depth of content which WoW today has. Including these things in a new release would be impossible: software development takes a lot of time. Blizz has had it. BW hasn't. However, SWTOR has clearly learned from WoW. The class system is/will be far easier to balance than WoW's is. The voice-overs and cutscenes (for those who like it) are a massive improvement over WoW's little scrolling windows. Making every class a pet class was smart, and including storylines for each companion adds a huge amount of depth to the game. The class quests that include individual instancing is a huge improvement, and it was a request WoW players have made for years. As it stands, swtor is like WoW when it launched. Not how WoW is today. Which is the problem. Using this logic, no new MMO would ever be released, if it had to have the same level of sophistication and depth. WoW has had millions of users providing feedback for years, and huge teams of developers working on it for years. It has had three content-laden expansion pacs. It is absolutely unreasonable to expect that a new title would have the same level of depth and sophistication. BW put their time and effort into story and gameplay, which are excellent. They have delayed implementation of some features. But waiting to tweak some UIs, for example, was simply smart conservation of effort: they could have changed the AH UI or the default UI during beta, only to have the users at release complain, too. This way, they know there's an issue and are receiving lots and lots of user feedback to help them measure twice and cut once. SWTOR holds up against WoW as well as any new MMO title could. I played WoW from release untl a couple months ago...and SWTOR is much better than WoW at release, I can tell you that. Anyone who says different was not playing WoW at release. Either way, after SWTOR, I am not going back to WoW. So IMHO, SWTOR is better than WoW today, too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dymensia Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 because MMO players really care about voice actors Most TOR players do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Case_Wight Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Ok, but if you can compare a really old game as wow with a shiny new one that had a chance to learn from good/bad things the leader did ALL THESE YEARS and still not have the new one win by far.... well something is wrong with this picture don't you think? Only if Blizzard had released WoW and then sat on their hands. They haven't. They've been working on the game steadily, including improvements to its graphics, changes to the classes, adding new content. And to say that SWTOR hasn't learned from Blizz is incorrect. Many of the features included in SWTOR that make it a great game are precislely because they paid attention to Blizzard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ptwonline Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 because MMO players really care about voice actors Think of two of the most recent RPG's that people have played: Skyrim and SWTOR. Skyrim has tons of voice acting, but TBH it's terrible and doesn't really add much. It's mostly non-interactive and for the most part it's just an NPC sitting there and talking at you without even the decency of cinematic-style editing to break up the monotony. It's also the same few actors over and over and over, and the quality of the voice acting overall is weak at best. Compare that to the not just the voice acting, but the cinematic approach to the voice acted scenes that Bioware has created. Totally different, and far, far better. It immerses players into the story if the player is actually willing to let themselves be immersed. Some players don't allow themselves to be for various reasons, and so of course the voice acting and cinematics will mean little to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apax Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Because they are charging the same amount for their products and competing for customers? This bright fellow on page 1 left the correct answer to the original poster's question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Case_Wight Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 yeah thats great. i was there for wow release too. and i have to disagree with this release being a homerun of any kind. making a game thats in worse shape/equal shape in 2011 than a game that came out in 2004 is anything but a homerun. keep drinking the koolaid though. That assumes that Blizz hasn't worked on the game since then. Obviously untrue. The title may have been released in 2004, but Blizz has updated everything about it continuously. I'll take SWTOR over WoW 2011 or WoW 2004. This launch was extremely smooth, especially compared to WoW. And the VO, individual storylines and instances, make it a quantum leap beyond WoW for those who like a little RPG in their MMORPG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peroxsigh Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 I am sure this was said several times... Because Bioware wants WoW players to spend their money here. Don't even pretend for a second they don't. Even if they didn't, they had all of the knowledge Blizzard learned over that 7 years, and should have used it. I could go on and on about the missing features and everything else that people are talking about elsewhere, but that should answer your question. More Ignorance. How did they have all that knowledge? The game doesn't take two days to make. The game was already in place and in development a LONG time ago. Voice acting began in late 06 early 07, images didn't start appearing until 08. They have all the knowledge NOW. Anyone who knows anything about development should know that it's what they do FROM THIS POINT ON that matters most - but expecting that much out of the gate from a game that started development over 5 years ago is ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thundermx Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 Short Answer: People are stupid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dosma Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 OP I agree with you! However. MY EYES!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saber_Six Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 You don't compare cars built today to the Model T of 1908 just as you don't compare SWTOR to WoW of old but WoW of today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quakespeare Posted December 29, 2011 Share Posted December 29, 2011 You know, I was thinking: I might found my own brand of cars. Real fancy, too. It's easier than you think; afterall, you can't expect me to compete with modern brands that have over a century of research behind them. Instead, my brand will be in direct competition with Ford's first model from 1908. People will love it, no doubt! http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/31/Ford_T_Jon_Sullivan.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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