So which class is the Outlander?

[Dayshadow]

Most people said it was the Knight starting off.

 

What do you think now having played the entire story? Which class do you feel is the definitive Outlander and why?

 

Knight?

Warrior?

Inquisitor?

Consular?

 

This is a force-user story so the tech guys aren't even included by default ("force rifle" LOL).

[jedimasterjac]

Knight or Warrior. Both can fit in well. The rest... Eh.

[SerraShar]

for me . DS = Sith Inquisitor . LS = Jedi consular/Sith warrior LS

[BattlebloodMage]

Most people said it was the Knight starting off.

 

What do you think now having played the entire story? Which class do you feel is the definitive Outlander and why?

 

Knight?

Warrior?

Inquisitor?

Consular?

 

This is a force-user story so the tech guys aren't even included by default ("force rifle" LOL).

 

Considered the Republic and the Empire want to destroy you regardless of whether you are a peacekeeper or an emperor. Emperor would make more sense for them to want to watch out for you. It would tie together with Darth Marr better, Sith Warrior fits the story the best. The Valk would be more likely to target an already powerful Sith. Inquisitor doesn't make sense despite being my main files due to the ghosts suddenly disappear and he becomes a weakling in the expansions.

[SerraShar]

Considered the Republic and the Empire want to destroy you regardless of whether you are a peacekeeper or an emperor. Emperor would make more sense for them to want to watch out for you. It would tie together with Darth Marr better, Sith Warrior fits the story the best. The Valk would be more likely to target an already powerful Sith. Inquisitor doesn't make sense despite being my main files due to the ghosts suddenly disappear and he becomes a weakling in the expansions.

 

He probably ate them . I mean Valk . And Sith Inquisitor isnt weakling cose she lost her ghost . The strenght of Sorc is that you can bind them . Hell , you could have an army just in case your main army turn on you . At least that's what mine would do as soon as we take the throne . You know...back up plan .

[SithKoriandr]

Considered the Republic and the Empire want to destroy you regardless of whether you are a peacekeeper or an emperor. Emperor would make more sense for them to want to watch out for you. It would tie together with Darth Marr better, Sith Warrior fits the story the best. The Valk would be more likely to target an already powerful Sith. Inquisitor doesn't make sense despite being my main files due to the ghosts suddenly disappear and he becomes a weakling in the expansions.

 

Even as a Peacekeeper, the Rep's might want you taken down, due to being another empire, with a large fleet.

 

Not to mention, the Jedi Order has been decimated, so could be plenty in the Republic that don't care about a Jedi being in charge. How often have you seen, sure, you helped us in the past as a big hero, but what have you done for us now? Oh? You mean take down Zakuul. Sounds like revenge for them imprisoning you.

 

Not to mention you've either imprisoned or killed the Republic's ex Chancellor, Saresh. Some might be greatful, others could just as easily be all "She's one of our greatest politicians/heroes!"

 

Also, there's the idea of, "If you aren't against the Republic, why didn't you rejoin us?"

 

Of course, we're kinda railroaded into not being part of the Republic/Empire.

[Aeneas_Falco]

Knight fits the story best

 

On the Imp side, Warrior

[Dayshadow]

I can understand why the inquisitor is out due to the sudden ghostlessness, but haven't really heard any compelling reasons as to WHY the knight, warrior or consular are best (or bad choices).

[Azuradin]

I've only played Knight and Warrior for now. I played Knight first and there's the ever present notion that the Knight is the closest thing Vitiate has to a nemesis with their history, going all the way back to their confrontation on the Desolator. The only times I ever really felt out of place as a Knight Outlander was during Profit and Plunder, and when I wondered where the hell Kira and Lord Scourge were. Scourge's vision about the Knight taking the Emperor's crown loosely fits with the throne, although that is hamstrung by Scourge's baffling lack of presence in the story.

 

Then there's Warrior. They're believable leading armies, dueling the Knights of Zakuul and Vititate's childen, and apparently every force dialogue option got turned into a choke. But I think KOTET is where mine really shined for me (ignoring the irritating dissonance of Chapter 2 for Imperials.)

 

 

I remember the mission with Vowrawn on Rishi, with him discussing ambition going forward. I remember her choking Servant One. In my mind, that's when the Wrath actively stops being the weapon of another master, culminating with taking the Eternal Throne as Empress. Baras betrayed his apprentice and was struck down by her, and the Emperor makes the same mistake - though that final vengeance obviously took considerably longer to deliver.

 

I also enjoyed the twisted notion that the Wrath in KOTET killed her way through Valkorion's family, ending with him. His admonishment to the Wrath in his final moments had more of an edge to it than Knight, and so does the Wrath's unique final line to him. As the Wrath, she didn't really feel out of place in the Valkorion family theater at the end, especially being a Pureblood Warrior unleashing Dramath, the red bookends of his unnaturally long life destroying him.

 

[DARTHOSIRUS]

The knight and warrior seem the most fitting. Both have actually had contact with the emperor during class stories.

 

I feel like the knight had the closest personal relationship with the emperor pre KOTFE

It feels as if the knight was specifically written to be the nemesis of Vitiate,

and according to Lord Scourge the knight is the chosen hero destined to take down the emperor

 

The warrior also works well as you were personally chosen by the emperor to be his wrath, and probably even before the class story begins. If you play warrior it feels like you and Vitiate have a destiny together. He makes you his ally only to betray you later so the pursuing revenge twist is very satisfying and feels very personal. Also some good class specific dialogue throughout KOTFE and KOTET

[SerraShar]

I can understand why the inquisitor is out due to the sudden ghostlessness, but haven't really heard any compelling reasons as to WHY the knight, warrior or consular are best (or bad choices).

 

I think the Inquisitor fit , I mean...if you accept Valk Power (DS)..all that zapping . Only Inquisitor has Lightning . So it fit better then anyone else .

 

Not just abilities . In Rishi , the special mission for your class , it's juggested that the Inquisitor has the ambition to be the next emprore , devourer and yada yada . So yeah if anyone fit more for taking everything its the Inquisitor .

 

I personally , would say any class fit . I cant stand JK . Period . I can create my own reasons why it fit . I played Kotfe with smuggler...and made her take Valk offer out of fear after seeing lord of the sith marr get toasted .

 

My wrath is only there to finish the job . And get ride of Valk .

 

And my JC is your martyr put on this path and must do everything to save everyone .

 

Edit: Pretty much , you can make any class fit with RP reasons . If that's what you are looking for..I'm sure you can find something for yourself . But in General , those saying JK fit and all . I don't see it . I think it's up to one personal preference . I can't stand the JK..so how is that fit ? Lol

 

The main thing is that JK fough him . but JC also fough his childrens . Wrath was on a leash by Valk . And Inquisitor was hindred by the empire he made up . they all have Legitimate reasons to fit in the story . Not just JK .

Edited December 31, 2016 by SerraShar

[SithKoriandr]

The main thing is that JK fough him . but JC also fough his childrens . Wrath was on a leash by Valk . And Inquisitor was hindred by the empire he made up . they all have Legitimate reasons to fit in the story . Not just JK .

 

People seem to forget that the Emperor talked to the Consular through the Children of the Emperor. If Consular just had more snarky lines, I think people could overlook that first chapter more

[Aeneas_Falco]

I can understand why the inquisitor is out due to the sudden ghostlessness, but haven't really heard any compelling reasons as to WHY the knight, warrior or consular are best (or bad choices).

 

Knight & Warrior have the deepest personal connections to the Emperor. The Warrior was his personal bodyguard/executioner, and the Knight the Emperor's primary adversary who Scourge (the former Wrath) saw destroying the Emperor in a vision.

 

Any force user works well as the Outlander but those two are arguably slightly better than the others, in that they go into the expansion with closer ties within the story to the main antagonist. The Knight works slightly better than the Warrior as well, in that Scourge's force vision comes to pass (sort of) if the Knight is the Outlander.

 

I'd rank the Consular above the Inquisitor, because of the Children of the Emperor plot.

 

Tier 1: Knight > Warrior

Tier 2: Consular > Inquisitor

Does Not Compute Tier: Anyone who isn't a force user

Edited January 1, 2017 by Aeneas_Falco

[OldVengeance]

People seem to forget that the Emperor talked to the Consular through the Children of the Emperor. If Consular just had more snarky lines, I think people could overlook that first chapter more

 

That was the First Son of the Emperor, not the Emperor himself. The first time the Consular hears Vitiate's voice is during the vision quest on Rishi.

[SithKoriandr]

That was the First Son of the Emperor, not the Emperor himself. The first time the Consular hears Vitiate's voice is during the vision quest on Rishi.

 

But those sides where the Emperor's voice. That's how it seemed with Kira when the Emperor spoke through her as well. First Son just seemed to be the name inwhich he used when speaking through Syo.

[OldVengeance]

But he has a different voice and he refers to himself as the First Son of the Emperor, distinct from the Emperor. Just like any of the other Children that the Consular fought. Edited January 1, 2017 by OldVengeance

[Dayshadow]

 

Edit: Pretty much , you can make any class fit with RP reasons.

 

No, you can't.

 

RP doesn't mean just make up anything you want. There are rules to the world you're RPing in. No non-force using class could ever duel Vaylin or Arcann or Valkorian or any *powerful* force user for that matter. It's completely absurd. Even in their own class stories certain choices are cannon and some are completely absurd.

 

 

Like the Agent being able to last more than 2 seconds in a fight with Jadus. Or the Bounty Hunter being able to take on Darth Tormen. In both cases there are cutscenes that demonstrate these guys are not scrubs and are just too powerful for any ordinary guy with a gun (no matter how good they are with that gun) to beat.

 

 

The idea that Valkorian can turn a non-force user into a force user rivaling actual trained force users is idiotically stupid. But even that is a misrepresentation because that's NOT what happens. Nothing actually changes in terms of their ability. They still use tech and guns. They still can't use force abilities. It's just that Valkorian can use the force and he just happens to be in them, but they don't actually utilize that power themselves (and it happens rather he starts the transfer ritual or not). It just shows how lazy (or funds deprived) Bioware is to not include a separate tech user storyline to parallel the force user storyline. They clearly give no sh-ts about tech users. Ot's ben this way since Ziost.

 

As for the inquisitor. Sorry, no ghosts pretty much kills that one. Unless you're the default light side Sith lord, Inquisitor is out of the question.

 

The Jedi fits because he literally is Vitiate's arch nemesis. Not one other class can say that. The JK's class story is about defeating the Emperor. You fight him in some form or another at the end of every chapter. He's been controlled by the Emperor and so has his spouse. Which just makes it so much harder to understand how they could pretend like there is no good way to introduce missing characters. Kira, a former Emperor child, couldn't be fit into this? Scourge who prophesied the Knight would take the emperor's throne?

 

Not just that. No Vette and Risha reunion? Or Doc and Kaliyo? Iresso and Jorgan. They really dropped the ball. That's why I think people were looking forward to with the whole idea of swapping companions. All they really were was a means to prevent you from being able to head cannon that your other 7 were OK and out there somewhere fighting the good fight. They are just a reminder that the other 7 heroes died in a ditch somewhere off screen. I wish they just gave al new companions or a completely new timeline 70-100 years after SOR. /rant

Edited January 1, 2017 by Dayshadow

[OldVengeance]

Since Ziost? They've had tech classes battle powerful Force users since vanilla.

 

The Smuggler kills three Dark Council members single handedly on Corellia in doing the Republic planetary storyline alone.

[Dayshadow]

Since Ziost? They've had tech classes battle powerful Force users since vanilla.

 

The Smuggler kills three Dark Council members single handedly on Corellia in doing the Republic planetary storyline alone.

 

That's a world arc. That doesn't count because with vanilla you still have your class story. The world arc is optional. Canonically a Jedi character would do that world arc (I think the Consular fits best). But, yeah, it's still an example of not considering tech users and writing it for a force user.

 

But the main story of a smuggler has them fighting scrub force users in the one occasion I can think of. All I recall are the 2 ditsy sith sisters near the very end who can be written off as scrubs. But you can't dismiss Tormen as a scrub, nor Jadus. The only time I recall a fighting a demonstrated decent force user is on Tatooine in which you are owned Darth Vader vs. Han Solo style in a cutscene and then when you do fight her you're fighting alongside an NPC Jedi (or the other way around if you go darkside). The only ones who have absurd non-canonical storyline fights against *powerful* force users are Agent and Bounty Hunter. And those are optional so you can still make the "canon/right" choice to not fight them.

[SerraShar]

No, you can't.

 

RP doesn't mean just make up anything you want. There are rules to the world you're RPing in.

 

Yes I can . You mean YOU CAN'T . But I certainly can . If I want my smuggler to blow Valk with a rocket Launcher and burn his beard in the process . Well I will rp that is what happen . And there is no rulez or God that will stop me from thinking that and laughing all day long .

 

As for rules , this game is limited . It's a tiny box . You need to think outside of it . If you need Logic , then fine . But really..it isn't that hard to make them fit . Unless you have a rule or allergy about no-force sensitive kicking force sensitive around .

[adormitul]

That's a world arc. That doesn't count because with vanilla you still have your class story. The world arc is optional. Canonically a Jedi character would do that world arc (I think the Consular fits best). But, yeah, it's still an example of not considering tech users and writing it for a force user.

 

But the main story of a smuggler has them fighting scrub force users in the one occasion I can think of. All I recall are the 2 ditsy sith sisters near the very end who can be written off as scrubs. But you can't dismiss Tormen as a scrub, nor Jadus. The only time I recall a fighting a demonstrated decent force user is on Tatooine in which you are owned Darth Vader vs. Han Solo style in a cutscene and then when you do fight her you're fighting alongside an NPC Jedi (or the other way around if you go darkside). The only ones who have absurd non-canonical storyline fights against *powerful* force users are Agent and Bounty Hunter. And those are optional so you can still make the "canon/right" choice to not fight them.

 

Well yes Darth Tomen and Darth Jadus are optional but do you know who is not the jedi battlemaster of the jedi order. Yes the BH kills him and to get to him he had to kill many jedi. Also in chapter 1 at the end he killed a ****** mandalorian slaughterer jedi this one has a feat of killing hundreds of mandalorians alone in one battle at the Sacking of Coruscant.

This BH in legends is the most succesful non force using jedi killer after Grevious. I will repeat this your BH is ****** legend that surpasses any other bounty hunter ever. Not even the great Bobba Fett killed that many jedi and only the even greater Jango Fett came close.

[Kaedusz]

Warrior and Knight fit the most. They are also the main characters in general. If there was Kotor 4 instead of swtor, the story would be about them. Edited January 1, 2017 by Kaedusz

[Dayshadow]

Yes I can . You mean YOU CAN'T . But I certainly can . If I want my smuggler to blow Valk with a rocket Launcher and burn his beard in the process . Well I will rp that is what happen . And there is no rulez or God that will stop me from thinking that and laughing all day long .

 

As for rules , this game is limited . It's a tiny box . You need to think outside of it . If you need Logic , then fine . But really..it isn't that hard to make them fit . Unless you have a rule or allergy about no-force sensitive kicking force sensitive around .

 

You can't either. Sheer imagination is not RPing. RPing requires the adoption of... roles. There are rules in role playing. You're not RPing Star Wars. Such a role does not exist. You're making up your own tangential universe. That's my point which you so eloquently demonstrated.

[Dayshadow]

Well yes Darth Tomen and Darth Jadus are optional but do you know who is not the jedi battlemaster of the jedi order. Yes the BH kills him and to get to him he had to kill many jedi. Also in chapter 1 at the end he killed a ****** mandalorian slaughterer jedi this one has a feat of killing hundreds of mandalorians alone in one battle at the Sacking of Coruscant.

This BH in legends is the most succesful non force using jedi killer after Grevious. I will repeat this your BH is ****** legend that surpasses any other bounty hunter ever. Not even the great Bobba Fett killed that many jedi and only the even greater Jango Fett came close.

 

There is no evidence that Jun Seros is a badarse (that profanity filter). He may have been in this youth. But you never see him fight prior. A title doesn't make him powerful. Ask that Master Jango easily killed in Ep2. Battlemaster means he is a trainer and has skills. The skills don't equate to actual power in the force. I'm not saying he was a weakling scrub necessarily, but he wasn't on Jadus or Tormen's level. Tormen could have just force choked the BH to death or snap his neck with a thought, disarmed him or picked him up and threw him against a wall so hard he splats. And there is nothing that the BH can do to protect himself from such attacks. No matter how good he is he's just a guy with a gun.

 

It's probably easy to kill a hundred mind addled Mandos... spread out over a hundred fights. The first mistake is assuming he took on 100 at once. Or that the average mando lives up to the reputation. However, Kellian Jarro turned out to be a one trick pony. Without his mind dulling powers to nullify opponents he wasn't so tough and it's obvious because as soon as the force persuade fails his padawan panics and he tries to talk you into just leaving because even he knows he ain't sh-t without it. You're the best Bh/mando in the galaxy vs. what can be surmised to be an average Jedi fighter who happens to excel at force persuasion (which you are immune to).

 

As I said before, all the others besides Jadus and Tormen (that I can recall) can be explained away as not being the cream of the crop. Whenever the conversation of techs killing Jedi comes up everyone always wants to generalize the topic. That's why I explicitly stated *powerful* force users, not any ole Jedi. And I specifically point out the fact that in the case of Jadus and Tormen you see how powerful they are prior to any possible fight. It's not based on unfounded presumptions that they are powerful. You actually see what they can do for yourself. Jadus could just vanish and kill the agent without him ever seeing it coming. He just used the technique against your companion right before the fight starts. But when you actually start fighting he's like "I'm too powerful. It's not fair. I should hold back." LOL.

Edited January 2, 2017 by Dayshadow

[NRieh]

You can't either. Sheer imagination is not RPing. RPing requires the adoption of... roles. There are rules in role playing. You're not RPing Star Wars. Such a role does not exist. You're making up your own tangential universe. That's my point which you so eloquently demonstrated.

 

Technically, RP always happen 'inside the head', but I'm on your side about the non-forceusers. Ziost & Revan were already bad but tolerable. Smuggler KotFE? It's horrible. I've always thought that I'm able to headcanon throught anything, and god knows I'm still trying. My attempts are the only thing standing between playing and deleting my account for good. Yesterday night I got to 'Whispers in the dark'. It's been....well, you know how it's been.

 

The only way to make sense of it is to accept that it does not have any sense at all. Zero. If the intention was to make character&player feel 200% ****ed and confused - then it worked. I guess. But I hate this 'expansion', as much as I used to love the original class & even most of the planetary story. They had almost made me feel like a 'normal' person, with some stretchess and ****** fights here and there, but no 'special chosenone' BS.

 

Now I've lost it all, along with my stealth&CC-based gameplay. Forced to be the *********** Commander-not-Shepard, dragged into scripted melee combat sequences all the time, solo-DDing through the thick bosses with the plot immunity as a SB scoundrel.

 

Can you imagine Mass Effect 3 plot being attuned for the bioticShep only? That's what they had done to 4\8 SWTOR classes.

Edited January 2, 2017 by NRieh