Champion mobs in operations nerfed from 20 CXP to 5 CXP with no patch note.

[Sportiva]

Sorry, I haven't grinded my through this thread, so apologies if this is redundant.

 

Everyone saw this coming, but BW is so short-sighted. I expected them to make all of the KP trash mobs "gold star" level instead of "Champion" ... at least that would have maintained CXP opportunities in other content that couldn't be so easily grinded (or is it "ground"?) ...

 

Nothing like chopping of a leg to remove a mole.

[Kromme]

Oh my the precious forum posters in here are hilarious. Oh looks like they have found their new "hot topic".

 

First its "all raiders have left this game to die because they haven't added content for them"

 

Now "everyone is going to unsub because they reduced CXP on ops mobs" Wait I thought all the raiders already left? how many times will all the raiders leave? Can you guys please get together and get your stories straightened out?

 

You guys dont like the RNG why are you so hot and bothered by a nerf in OPS when all the people who ran OPS have left, AND you yourselves have been crying for days how PVP is where you grind CXP?

 

Oh my the precious white knight forum posters in here are hilarious. Oh looks like they have found their new crusade.

First its " all the white knights must defend EA/Bioware because they haven't added any new content."

Now "all the white knights are going to persecute all of the forum posters that disagree with the CXP grind" Wait, i thought all the white knights had already persecuted the forum posters for having opinions that are different than their own. How many times will the white knights continue to persucute forum posters. Can you guys please get together and attempt to get the truth, instead of diluting the forums with your inability to separate fact from opinion.

 

You guy's don't like forum posters, heck everything they say is RNG and we white knights shall continue to defend all the nerfs in OPs especially because all of the poster have been crying for days now the PVP is where to grind CXP.

 

Seriously Fuhr.....the above is just exactly how blatantly and ludicrously stupid your posts are. The more you continue to polish your little white knight's armor, the more obvious it is that you no more care about SWTOR, because it has become more important for you to stroke your little epeener for some imaginary reward.

[Quraswren]

You really believe they will round up? They usually round down.

 

I most certainly do as it makes the CXP viable. Of course it's still not worth the money in any way but some goof is sure to buy those over priced CC market CXP boosts. A fool and their money saying still applies in todays times.

 

You mean worse than the worse times ever in 2012,2013,2014,2015, and 2016??? How many times can we have such incredible predictions from you guys?

 

When you go from millions of paying subs to a f2p model faster that any other game in history (save one other that I know of) just to save your game from dying. There is a problem and this game has never fully recovered from that no matter how much the CC makes.

 

You don't have to be psychic to see swtor is having problems to this very day.

Edited December 13, 2016 by Quraswren

[Edyn]

The fact that they've implemented a system where subscribers are capped on progression is absurd and I'm shaking my head wondering why people are suggesting that BW lower the cap rather than just remove it altogether. I have the same opinion on Reputation caps. It's disgusting that their intent is for subscribers to not only pay for a system that intentionally caps their progression to drag out subscription lengths, but that they also sell boosts to their already paying customers to reach that cap more quickly while also handicapping them by actively and continuously nerfing CXP gains off mobs. Did BW get acquired by an Asian developer and I somehow missed the press release?

[ludoviccb]

To stop people farming those, they nerfed again the payout for operations.

 

When they launched 5.0 around 20 to 30% of the CXP of a sm GF operation was from the mobs. That put a 5 bosses operation somewhere in between 3100 to 3600 CXP (depending on the operation and counting the 600 CXP from GF and the Weekly) Now, it would be more around 2500-2600 a nerf between 25 to 30% compared to 5.0 for the operation reward in 2 weeks.

 

When they launched 5.0, the CXP rewards for operations, (being about the same no mather the mode) were slightly under the fastest Uprisings, Starfighter and Unranked PvP and a lot under Ranked PvP or grinding elite and champion mobs. This made operation about the same as the slowest Uprising and Flashpoints if the group in the operation or the uprising didn't wipe.

 

The nerf to the Elite CXP greatly reduced the rewards from some of the operations, such as S&V, TfB, EV, KP, EC... This also nerfed the uprising, which made Grinding in KP and PvP the best ways to get CXP, but kept operation about the same as uprising for the payout.

 

This second nerf to operation mobs make doing Heroics and Dailies in a group a better way to get CXP than operation and they would get a lot more credits too. The only thing worse in the Galactic Command for the CXP reward for the time spent than operation is doing the Story. To put operation in line with PvP, they would need to at least double the CXP from the SM ones and give something to HM and NiM so that their rewards are higher in CXP than SM.

[LordArtemis]

Well, to be fair, its not about players, its about revenue and profit. I know it sounds crazy, but a million subs with no market is nowhere near as profitable to a game (if it has passed it's breakeven point) as 250k players that spend between 50-100 dollars a month on average in the market....especially if they also sub.

 

It is possible that SWTOR is doing fairly well at this point. Based on the earnings reports I think it is fair to say it is not meeting expectations...but that does not necessarily mean it is failing. It could just be falling short of targets.

 

SWTOR has contributed to a drop in revenue for EA, that much is clear. But that statement alone does not really indicate where SWTOR stands as far as health.

 

Just my two cents on the matter. I certainly could be wrong.

Edited December 13, 2016 by LordArtemis

[Furh]

 

 

 

When you go from millions of paying subs to a f2p model faster that any other game in history (save one other that I know of) just to save your game from dying. There is a problem and this game has never fully recovered from that no matter how much the CC makes.

 

2012 called and wants their complaining topic back...I find it strange people like you stick around just to sub and predict every year SWTOR is going to die....is it really that important to you to finally be able to say "I told you so"? I mean its probably going to be another 3,4,5 years of you predicting its death are you really going to stick around for another FIVE YEARS?

[AscendingSky]

2012 called and wants their complaining topic back...I find it strange people like you stick around just to sub and predict every year SWTOR is going to die....is it really that important to you to finally be able to say "I told you so"? I mean its probably going to be another 3,4,5 years of you predicting its death are you really going to stick around for another FIVE YEARS?

 

I find it strange--but very amusing--that people like you stick around and sub for five years because for some reason you feel compelled to jump on the forums and say nasty things about anyone who disagrees with you in regards to this game.

[Furh]

I find it strange--but very amusing--that people like you stick around and sub for five years because for some reason you feel compelled to jump on the forums and say nasty things about anyone who disagrees with you in regards to this game.

 

Well technically my account has been active since 2011 and I only started posting in the forums a week ago...but hey facts rights?

[Quraswren]

2012 called and wants their complaining topic back...I find it strange people like you stick around just to sub and predict every year SWTOR is going to die....is it really that important to you to finally be able to say "I told you so"? I mean its probably going to be another 3,4,5 years of you predicting its death are you really going to stick around for another FIVE YEARS?

 

2016 called about to roll out with all new complaints to add to the ones from 2012 that still remain relevant to the game.

 

Because parts of the game are Ok while others suck. You'd do well to know the difference and thats before I get into the game having seen better times than what bw is currently presenting but as long as were talking facts. Not once have I said the game would die. But fact rights? What I think is it could be doing better with better management, design and development. What is quite possibly the strongest IP in the world and bw manages to screw that up.

 

If it does die so be it. Poor management tends to do that but in the world of business I know there are many ways to hold on to a struggling business especially when backed by a company like EA, no matter how bad bw manages things.

Edited December 13, 2016 by Quraswren

[Wayshuba]

Yep.

 

The notable change with 5.0 is they are actually making the distinction between unintended and exploit as they communicate changes. Even though that is a small change in their communications... it is an important one.

 

Knock it off, Just knock it off. Every single MMO on the market has something to grind, whether crafting mats or mobs. Because people have decided to grind mobs is NOT AN EXPLOIT.

 

What is really going on is post Jnauary uprisings, nothing else is coming for the game so BW needs to make this grind as absolutely slow and tedious as possible.

 

The only thing less painful to grind, is the unsubscribe button on this mess.

[AscendingSky]

Knock it off, Just knock it off. Every single MMO on the market has something to grind, whether crafting mats or mobs. Because people have decided to grind mobs is NOT AN EXPLOIT.

 

What is really going on is post Jnauary uprisings, nothing else is coming for the game so BW needs to make this grind as absolutely slow and tedious as possible.

 

The only thing less painful to grind, is the unsubscribe button on this mess.

 

What I think speaks volumes about EAWare's level of disconnect and arrogance is the fact that they specifically designed a system where you had to grind and grind and grind to get rewards... and then they were somehow shocked when people decided to find the most efficient ways to grind possible. You know, what players of every single MMO have done pretty much since they were invented?

[Tsillah]

Well, it's not very nice of them to stealth this in.

 

I also don't get that. Why not put it in the patch notes?

 

People are going to notice and get upset anyway.

By not putting it in the patch notes BWA just adds fuel to the fire because it looks like they were being sneaky about it.

 

So how could this be seen as a good idea to omit this?

[Quraswren]

Well, it's not very nice of them to stealth this in.

 

I also don't get that. Why not put it in the patch notes?

 

People are going to notice and get upset anyway.

By not putting it in the patch notes BWA just adds fuel to the fire because it looks like they were being sneaky about it.

 

So how could this be seen as a good idea to omit this?

 

It's only a bad idea if you cared what gamers thought on the matter. bw not for one second cares or is worried about gamers at this point other than what they can sell them. Good gaming for the most part was thrown out the door so big business can move in. So missing something as important as that is the patch notes means nothing to bw.

 

If it actually did, they would have said something about it already.

[Tsillah]

It's only a bad idea if you cared what gamers thought on the matter. bw not for one second cares or is worried about gamers at this point other than what they can sell them. Good gaming for the most part was thrown out the door so big business can move in. So missing something as important as that is the patch notes means nothing to bw.

 

If it actually did, they would have said something about it already.

 

Well, they are moving fast now on making changes with 5.1 Not sure if those changes will be sufficient but it's interesting to see this happen. I still have this idea that they saw more sub cancellations than they wanted and they might worry there will be more still. From that point of view even a cynic can see that that's a reason to care about what people think. Money does talk after all.

 

It's not beneficial to BWA to omit such a thing from my point of view, but BWA have made their share of avoidable mistakes, that much is true.

[ivanhedgehog]

Its not a problem but its also not how KP was intended. Now good for you for taking advantage of the little less grindy way, but you really have no complaint if they go ahead and fix that unintended little less grindy way.

 

KP was never intended to give CXP at all. Neither were warzones of GSF. There was no cxp when they were made so the original intent was not for them to give cxp. They are both however, now supposed to give cxp. Cant wait for pvp cxp to get nerfed.

[ivanhedgehog]

Don't think they are going to like it when this is reported...you are not supposed to pass exploits on here. Or spam the same post like you did on the other thread.

 

They said that farming mobs was not an exploit, get with the times.

[Halinalle]

Cant wait for pvp cxp to get nerfed.

 

Please watch livestream next time before complaining.

 

They said that according to players pvp CXP rewards are fine so their plan is to buff everything else to around that same level.

[DanNV]

I for one am really happy they did this nerf. Maybe now we get some full runs again.

 

Thank you Bioware!

 

Ummmm... WHy would you get runs at all now? A good chunk of the CXP for running the op was from the mobs. The nerf to golds hit Ops hard, now this makes it worse. There is no point to running ops, heroics or FPs now. All that is left is farming PvP. And we all know that means a bunch of people just standing around avoiding combat and not even trying.

 

This is another stupid decision by Devs who shouldn't be working in the fame industry anywhere. Give us all a Christmas present and fire the lot on Christmas Eve.

[ivanhedgehog]

You (or anybody else) do not 'control' how the game is played, maintained, made, or developed. Stating that the KP Op isn't worth doing after the CXP grind has been nerfed is your opinion (and if you are ftp, your opinion really doesn't matter to me at all, anyways).

 

You or anybody else, does not get to decide what something is worth to me or to anybody else. Good luck on finding a group to do that kp full run. You also dont get to tell anybody else that they have to play with you. Did your mother have to tie a porkchop to your neck to get the dog to play with you?

[Halinalle]

Ummmm... WHy would you get runs at all now? A good chunk of the CXP for running the op was from the mobs.

 

Last time EV was in GF we did full run but one of the players insisted on skipping enemies between 1st and 2nd boss. That's a lot of skipped champions...

[Quraswren]

Well, they are moving fast now on making changes with 5.1 Not sure if those changes will be sufficient but it's interesting to see this happen. I still have this idea that they saw more sub cancellations than they wanted and they might worry there will be more still.

 

I don't think it takes much to realize that that is likely the largest reason for such a response that we are getting from bw but what it doesn't mean is that they will do much. Like you said, will it be sufficient or will it be a worthless change just for bw to present "a change" to get the negativity off their backs for the holidays.

 

From that point of view even a cynic can see that that's a reason to care about what people think. Money does talk after all.

Sadly, it also makes people do crazy things as well as dig themselves in a deeper hole if what is being changes isn't done for the right reasons.

 

It's one things to tell everyone they are listening but do they really understand the gamers problems? I'm not entirely sure they do simply because this is not the first time they were told about the terrible idea RNG was but they pushed it along anyway. Now to realize, WOW, gamers don't like it all that much.

 

It's not beneficial to BWA to omit such a thing from my point of view, but BWA have made their share of avoidable mistakes, that much is true.

 

Its not in their benefit yet there it is, so it boils down to was bw so incompetent that they missed it )which brings a whole lot of issues with it) or was it done after the fact in the hopes that most would have read it yesterday and move on while the ones that read it today would be a much smaller number. Even discovering it later would cause a lesser reaction.

 

At this point bw can just not say anything (like what is happening now) and just hope it dies down.

[ivanhedgehog]

Please watch livestream next time before complaining.

 

They said that according to players pvp CXP rewards are fine so their plan is to buff everything else to around that same level.

 

they also said that grinding mobs was not an exploit, it was fine. They also said that all changes were in the patch notes.

[Tsetso]

they also said that grinding mobs was not an exploit, it was fine. They also said that all changes were in the patch notes.

 

Well, they also said that about the CSM but we know how that ended

[DanNV]

Last time EV was in GF we did full run but one of the players insisted on skipping enemies between 1st and 2nd boss. That's a lot of skipped champions...

 

Yep, and now it matters WAY less.

 

Ops are already a huge credit sink. They reward way less credits than the repair bills it takes to actually learn them and complete one. Now the CXP is cut somewhere around 50% (possible more in some like EV with lots of Champions). There is no reason to run them. You don't get gear. You can't get gear to get back into HM progression, so what's the point?

 

I expect the next 2-3 months are going to see a huge drop in active players and subs, all because BW is totally clueless. They have spent over a year making all the mistakes they made at launch that cost the a huge number of players and almost closed the game. This time, there aren't enough people left to keep it afloat while they decide what to do.

 

What BW seems to miss is that we aren't here wishing they'd fail. We're here because we like to play the game and want to see it succeed so we can continue to play. Unfortunately, what we see is BW making decisions that any halfway intelligent person can see are going to upset the player base which will lead to people getting frustrated and leaving.

 

And to the white knights, if you weren't here to see servers where less than 10 people on fleet was normal and 20 was something to celebrate you don't have a basis to talk. I was on one of those servers. It's no fun. Unfortunately, I see SWTOR heading that way again because Ben can't look back at the game's history and see where it went sideways in the past.