5.0 Lightning Sorcerer Guide

[DarthCognusSion]

Lightning Sorcerer Guide

 

Not much has changed in the guide overall. There were some minor rotational tweaks but nothing major. Gearing has been updated. The damage nerfs have hit Lightning ridiculously hard, but it is what it is. I hope Bioware will address it and buff it some, but I know that that most likely won't happen.

Edited February 2, 2017 by DarthCognusSion

[DarthCognusSion]

Telekinetics Sage Guide Edited February 2, 2017 by DarthCognusSion

[Nelsitokiller]

Kinda want to know why did you said Lightning Barrier is a PVP utility, from what i see from the available utilities, Sith Defiance,Empty Body or Tempest Mastery(depends on the fight) on Skillful, Suppression, Dark Resilience and Lightning Barrier on Masterful, Shapeless Spirit on Heroic, Force Mobility and Unnatural Vigor, those seem to me the only standard composition, of course you pick some others depending on the fights but still i dont see any other choice on Heroic for PVE because everything but Shapeless Spirit is all for PVP.

 

What do you personally chose?

[DarthCognusSion]

Kinda want to know why did you said Lightning Barrier is a PVP utility, from what i see from the available utilities, Sith Defiance,Empty Body or Tempest Mastery(depends on the fight) on Skillful, Suppression, Dark Resilience and Lightning Barrier on Masterful, Shapeless Spirit on Heroic, Force Mobility and Unnatural Vigor, those seem to me the only standard composition, of course you pick some others depending on the fights but still i dont see any other choice on Heroic for PVE because everything but Shapeless Spirit is all for PVP.

 

What do you personally chose?

 

I say that because in most cases in the shield isnt going to help that much compared to the other utilities. I also said that it may have some use in AoE heavy fights, but since it only does for as long as the shield lasts, it won't get that much damage off in most cases. I just don't think it will be worth taking this in most fights, simply because there will be better options.

 

As for the ones I will probably always take:

Skillful: Empty Body and Sith Defiance. tempest mastery on fights with a lot of adds to deal with such as Revanite Commanders

Masterful: Suppression, Dark Resilience, and possibly Corrupted Flesh

Heroic: Shapeless Spirit. Surging Speed and Emersion might have some specific fights where they would be useful.

Legendary: Definitely Force Mobility. The other point will probably go to Unnatural Vigor, but I still have to test out how useful Shifting Silhouette can be as a defensive cd.

[Nelsitokiller]

Alright good point, but the reflect bubble is always there, i noticed that after Static Barrier breaks you can still reflect but looks like its a chance to reflect instead of reflecting everything like when the Static Barrier still up, and the damage is actually pretty good, just did NiM Nefra and the reflect did bit over 120k.

[SenkanYamato]

Thank you for the time, effort and detail you've put into your Lightning Sorcerer guide. Much appreciated. Edited December 6, 2016 by SenkanYamato
grammar error

[verfallen]

2 things about priority list:

 

Shouldn't shock be above chain lightning assuming:

 

-Chain lightning proc isnt about to be lost/renewed (which normally means you have a tb coming, which should never be delayed)

-crushing darkness is ticking on the target

 

especially if CD is about to fall off, as it means you'll have to use a slightly less efficient lightning bolt.

 

Also, for the opener, I believe people using the DM set bonus with 2 piece UE should probably consider opening with:

 

(precast) CD->PS->Reck->affliction->TB->LF->SHOCK (CD should still have a tick left)->CL.

 

CL's "cooldown" is proc regulated, so regardless if you use it at the start or end of a cycle, its no dps difference, while using shock here is a small gain.

 

Obviously, people using the 6 piece UE set bonus want to stick to the one in the guide for the 3rd reck on Chain Lightning.

 

Its pretty minor tough, since I have little doubt DM's bonus is about to not being enough to overcome the stats dps increase on even 230 armorings.

 

small trick tough, dont forget, while still in PS, to refresh your affliction when your set bonus appears, to fully squeeze every bit of alacrity you can out of it.

 

Thats assuming a dummy, or mostly static boss. Don't bother if its going to fall off under a minute (due to fight mechanics), the lost GCD is probably more a dps loss than the few extra tick you gained from it.

 

 

I wouldnt sell lightning that short right now tough.

 

Yes its low on the sustained side, but it also got back its 3.0 mobility. So there are very few ops mechanic that can truly hurt the dps, as you can, with the right utility, keep your rotation going flawlessly, safe perhaps 1-2 GCD over 20 sec or so. This means the dps on the dummy should roughly be the dps on a live fight, mechanic non-withstanding.

 

Its burst too, so it can handle target switch or burst check pretty nice, as well as adds obviously. While it lost dps, in a way, I wouldn't say its in a much worse position than 4.0. I don't HM raid with it, tough, but I did see interesting things so far. You'll never beat the arsenal merc as they currently are, but I think you can still be above the required dps check. Just have to play smarter than most.

[Frenesi]

So, essentially it's the same as before, but with Project replacing one of TK Bursts if MC is present?

[DarthCognusSion]

So, essentially it's the same as before, but with Project replacing one of TK Bursts if MC is present?

 

Yeah pretty much. The only other change is that Recklessness/Force Potency works with Thundering Blast/Turbulence now. Oh and they nerfed the spec into oblivion. That too

2 things about priority list:

 

Shouldn't shock be above chain lightning assuming:

 

-Chain lightning proc isnt about to be lost/renewed (which normally means you have a tb coming, which should never be delayed)

-crushing darkness is ticking on the target

 

especially if CD is about to fall off, as it means you'll have to use a slightly less efficient lightning bolt.

 

Also, for the opener, I believe people using the DM set bonus with 2 piece UE should probably consider opening with:

 

(precast) CD->PS->Reck->affliction->TB->LF->SHOCK (CD should still have a tick left)->CL.

 

CL's "cooldown" is proc regulated, so regardless if you use it at the start or end of a cycle, its no dps difference, while using shock here is a small gain.

 

Obviously, people using the 6 piece UE set bonus want to stick to the one in the guide for the 3rd reck on Chain Lightning.

 

Its pretty minor tough, since I have little doubt DM's bonus is about to not being enough to overcome the stats dps increase on even 230 armorings.

 

small trick tough, dont forget, while still in PS, to refresh your affliction when your set bonus appears, to fully squeeze every bit of alacrity you can out of it.

 

Thats assuming a dummy, or mostly static boss. Don't bother if its going to fall off under a minute (due to fight mechanics), the lost GCD is probably more a dps loss than the few extra tick you gained from it.

 

 

I wouldnt sell lightning that short right now tough.

 

Yes its low on the sustained side, but it also got back its 3.0 mobility. So there are very few ops mechanic that can truly hurt the dps, as you can, with the right utility, keep your rotation going flawlessly, safe perhaps 1-2 GCD over 20 sec or so. This means the dps on the dummy should roughly be the dps on a live fight, mechanic non-withstanding.

 

Its burst too, so it can handle target switch or burst check pretty nice, as well as adds obviously. While it lost dps, in a way, I wouldn't say its in a much worse position than 4.0. I don't HM raid with it, tough, but I did see interesting things so far. You'll never beat the arsenal merc as they currently are, but I think you can still be above the required dps check. Just have to play smarter than most.

 

Yes you are right, Shock should be higher prio than CL except when Recklessness is being used.

 

As for using Shock in the opener if using DM set bonus, I wouldn't. CL hits harder than LF which is why in the opener, and everytime I use Recklessness I prioritize CL or LF. With that in mind, I won't then use Shock because then I would be delaying LF by 2 gcds, which I dont want to do.

 

As far as Lightning's state, it is in an absolutely abysmal state. It might be viable in NiM if you are full 242, but if it is that is only because NiM is very undertuned (that is a separate argument). Take it from me as someone who went 24/26 NiM in 4.0 using a Lightning Sorc. This spec now feels like crap. In 4.0 I advocated people learn this spec because if they were good enough they could make it work in NiM. I don't feel comfortable saying that now because I don't know if that statement will hold true this time. This class needs some dps buffs ASAP. It is severely hurting.

 

Yes the sustained is ****, and as far as burst goes, every other burst class can burst harder than it can. Meeting some dps checks in 4.0 was hard, and we weren't dead last and 6.75% behind the average (we were like 3.4%). I have serious doubts that a Sorc could meet those checks now. Time will tell, but Lightning (and Madness) needs dps buffs because this dps spread is horrible.

[Flusssaeure]

And DarthCognusSion strikes first with his 5.0 Guide.

 

Ok beside the nerfed to the ground part there where not so much chances to Lightning so not so much testing regarding what effect the chances have was needed compared to other classes.

 

So the only thing about the guide I am a little bit surprised is about the varying degree of details between the different parts of the guide. For example you went in great detail over the buffs and procs what triggers what, how it affects other abilities and so on, this is the part where the guide really shines. If someone has never played Lightning before you can point him to the guide so that he not only knows what to do but also why to do it and what to keep track of to see what is going wrong if something is going wrong and how to correct it.

 

The other side of the guide is the gearing section. One of the first question you got on Dulfy after publishing the 4.0 version of the guide is what relics should be used, it seems that you like to answer the same question again after you didn't mentoin relics again. Similar you mentoin that it is no longer viable to use the dread master set bonus with out explaination that dread master had advantages before. In both cases you need information from outside the guide to fully understand what is written in the guide you just update on what happens before.

 

While you can argue that both methods have advantages and disadvantages it really comes down to what is the target audience of the guide. Do you want to teach someone that just started playing the game and is trying to learn how the class works what to do? In that case the section about the buffs and procs is spot on because you start from zero and walk the reader to the steps what to do and how to do it. On the other side the gearing section requirs to much information from outside the guidefor someone starting from zero to understand what you talking about.

 

Of course if you just want to update the people that already know the class to what has changed in 5.0 the gearing section is fine because you don't need to tell the people what everyone already know. But then you can wonder why you feel the need to go over the buff and procs in the last detail because woudn't someone that already knows what the Dreadmaster bonus is and what relics to use how the procs work?

 

Personally I prefer your approach how you walk the reader through the steps of the buffs and procs much more than the gearing section, because why does someone that allready knows the stuff have the need to read a guide?

 

So I hope I didn't sound too negative because overall I like how you wrote you guide and just wanted to give some feedback what still can be improved.

 

Regarding the discussion on the state of lightning I agree with your assessment where Lightning stands right now. I really "like" our new burst. While in 5.0 I was so far only in SM OPs because of Gear status I really was disappointed with my DPS in fights with lots of target swapping. Before 5.0 if you went from Crushing Darkness to the first Thundering Blast you at least saw that you did something and where ready to move on. In 5.0 you are feeling more lke a DOT spec that is still building up it's resources and is waiting for the right window of opportuity where everything is set up only that with Lightning in 5.0 this window is not coming. Than you swap targets and then when you return to the original target you can do everything again without really seeing any pay off. In this fights I was beaten in terms of dps by players of other classes which I beat on dummy parses by 1k dps. That really seems strange.

[DarthCognusSion]

And DarthCognusSion strikes first with his 5.0 Guide.

 

Ok beside the nerfed to the ground part there where not so much chances to Lightning so not so much testing regarding what effect the chances have was needed compared to other classes.

 

So the only thing about the guide I am a little bit surprised is about the varying degree of details between the different parts of the guide. For example you went in great detail over the buffs and procs what triggers what, how it affects other abilities and so on, this is the part where the guide really shines. If someone has never played Lightning before you can point him to the guide so that he not only knows what to do but also why to do it and what to keep track of to see what is going wrong if something is going wrong and how to correct it.

 

The other side of the guide is the gearing section. One of the first question you got on Dulfy after publishing the 4.0 version of the guide is what relics should be used, it seems that you like to answer the same question again after you didn't mentoin relics again. Similar you mentoin that it is no longer viable to use the dread master set bonus with out explaination that dread master had advantages before. In both cases you need information from outside the guide to fully understand what is written in the guide you just update on what happens before.

 

While you can argue that both methods have advantages and disadvantages it really comes down to what is the target audience of the guide. Do you want to teach someone that just started playing the game and is trying to learn how the class works what to do? In that case the section about the buffs and procs is spot on because you start from zero and walk the reader to the steps what to do and how to do it. On the other side the gearing section requirs to much information from outside the guidefor someone starting from zero to understand what you talking about.

 

Of course if you just want to update the people that already know the class to what has changed in 5.0 the gearing section is fine because you don't need to tell the people what everyone already know. But then you can wonder why you feel the need to go over the buff and procs in the last detail because woudn't someone that already knows what the Dreadmaster bonus is and what relics to use how the procs work?

 

Personally I prefer your approach how you walk the reader through the steps of the buffs and procs much more than the gearing section, because why does someone that allready knows the stuff have the need to read a guide?

 

So I hope I didn't sound too negative because overall I like how you wrote you guide and just wanted to give some feedback what still can be improved.

 

Regarding the discussion on the state of lightning I agree with your assessment where Lightning stands right now. I really "like" our new burst. While in 5.0 I was so far only in SM OPs because of Gear status I really was disappointed with my DPS in fights with lots of target swapping. Before 5.0 if you went from Crushing Darkness to the first Thundering Blast you at least saw that you did something and where ready to move on. In 5.0 you are feeling more lke a DOT spec that is still building up it's resources and is waiting for the right window of opportuity where everything is set up only that with Lightning in 5.0 this window is not coming. Than you swap targets and then when you return to the original target you can do everything again without really seeing any pay off. In this fights I was beaten in terms of dps by players of other classes which I beat on dummy parses by 1k dps. That really seems strange.

 

As far as the DM set bonus is concerned, it hasn't been obtainable since 4.0. Therefore anyone who my comments concern know what I am talking about, and anyone who doesn't know what I am talking about my comments don't concern. At least that is how I view it.

 

The relic question I probably should have included, but I just didn't think of it. Really though, everyone should know by now that you use FR and SA. I can add it, but I don't think it really matters very much. As for why the detail? I modeled my guide after Kwerty's PT/Vanguard guides. I always enjoyed how much detail he went in to in every aspect of the guide.

[nate_river]

Thanks for this guide Sion you are the best

[JannusFex]

Thanks for the guide! Questions about the rotation from a new player:

 

Why would we want to use Thundering Blast after Recklessness in the rotation (even if they work together in 5.0)? If I am understanding correctly what Recklessness does, it grants a 60% higher crit chance, but TB already autocrits because of Crushing Darkness, right? Aren't we wasting a Recklessness charge that way? Please, help me understand what I am missing.

 

Also, if indeed Recklessness should be used before TB, am I going to loose anything if I use it before Affliction as well (i.e. Polarity Shift -> Recklessness -> Affliction -> TB)? This only because of key mapping logic convenience...

 

EDIT: Oh, and wouldn't it be better to use the second Recklessness charge with LF, since it has higher damage? EDIT: Didn't consider that a Reckless charge is consumed only with a crit, but still, why CL before LF?

Thanks!

Edited December 16, 2016 by JannusFex

[DarthCognusSion]

Thanks for the guide! Questions about the rotation from a new player:

 

Why would we want to use Thundering Blast after Recklessness in the rotation (even if they work together in 5.0)? If I am understanding correctly what Recklessness does, it grants a 60% higher crit chance, but TB already autocrits because of Crushing Darkness, right? Aren't we wasting a Recklessness charge that way? Please, help me understand what I am missing.

 

Also, if indeed Recklessness should be used before TB, am I going to loose anything if I use it before Affliction as well (i.e. Polarity Shift -> Recklessness -> Affliction -> TB)? This only because of key mapping logic convenience...

 

EDIT: Oh, and wouldn't it be better to use the second Recklessness charge with LF, since it has higher damage? EDIT: Didn't consider that a Reckless charge is consumed only with a crit, but still, why CL before LF?

Thanks!

 

With 4.0, Bioware introduced something that has been dubbed Super Crit. Basically any crit chance that is over 100% gets converted into critical multiplier. Therefore, when you use Recklessness on Thundering Blast, you have 100% to crit because of Affliction + 60% to crit from Recklessness + ~40% crit chance from your crit rating. This gives Thundering Blast 100% crit chance over the 100% limit, and that 100% gets converted into an increase in your crit damage.

 

You can indeed use Recklessness before Affliction. It will not make a difference overall. Assuming your are maximizing your APM, using it before or just after Affliction won't be more than 1 second of difference.

 

I use it on Chain Lightning because it does more damage than Lightning Flash does, therefore with only 2 Recklessness charges, due to the set bonus I am currently using, Chain Lightning takes priority for Recklessness.

[JannusFex]

Thanks for the reply!

 

I didn't know about the existence of super critical - this is great to know! As I said, I am new - started in September and this is my first MMO . Is this the only reason we should be aiming for 40% critical chance?

 

For me LF does more damage than CL, but this is probably because I am still not max lvl and I am missing a talent effect or something (or do you mean because CL is AOE?). So, I would guess LF is higher in the priority system than CL only because it procs CD?

 

Aaand, one final question I noticed you removed Force Speed from the opening rotation, explaining that it doesn't add to the DPS, but only puts LB at the end of the gcd. It is difficult for me to understand this. Does this mean we won't loose DPS if we use non-proc LB during the rotation? Or we should just rely on procs from being hit? Or, since now Shock is in the rotation, we won't need as many LB fillers?

[DarthCognusSion]

Thanks for the reply!

 

I didn't know about the existence of super critical - this is great to know! As I said, I am new - started in September and this is my first MMO . Is this the only reason we should be aiming for 40% critical chance?

 

For me LF does more damage than CL, but this is probably because I am still not max lvl and I am missing a talent effect or something (or do you mean because CL is AOE?). So, I would guess LF is higher in the priority system than CL only because it procs CD?

 

Aaand, one final question I noticed you removed Force Speed from the opening rotation, explaining that it doesn't add to the DPS, but only puts LB at the end of the gcd. It is difficult for me to understand this. Does this mean we won't loose DPS if we use non-proc LB during the rotation? Or we should just rely on procs from being hit? Or, since now Shock is in the rotation, we won't need as many LB fillers?

 

If you look at this parse, you can see under estimator that CL does more damage on average than does LF. If you are using the current set bonus, which you will be once you get to max level bc you dont have the old Dread Master (which is no longer obtainable), then you will have 3 charges for Recklessness anyway so you can use them on TB, CL, and LF so it doesn't matter as much.

 

LF is higher on the priority system bc once you have the proc for the instant CL, it is low priority bc so long as you use it before it procs again, it doesnt matter when you use it. LF on the other hand has a longer cooldown so it is prioritized higher in addition to the fact that it procs Crushing Darkness.

 

The reason I removed Force Speed from the opener is that we no longer use a LB to buffer TB and CL since Recklessness now works on TB. With regards to its usage in the rotation, it doesn't add dps in most cases. Whether LB is used at the beginning (with proc) or the end of the gcd (without proc), it is still 1 gcd. However, if using it at the beginning of a gcd will make LB do damage under say a relic proc or the 2-piece set bonus, then it is a dps gain. Now that FS is back to a 20s cooldown, you can use it more freely. In high mobility fights, I would suggest not using it all the time unless you know you won't use it in the next 20s. We do use less LBs now that Shock is used under Crushing Darkness, but considering that you are still using Shock only once every 12-15s depending on alacrity, LB will still be used a lot, just a little bit less.

Edited December 16, 2016 by DarthCognusSion

[JannusFex]

Thanks again. This is all very helpful and detailed.

 

The reason I didn't get the last bit was that I didn't really understand the gcd mechanics (i.e. since the LB cooldown is less than the gcd. it doesn't make a big difference if it is procced or not). It's just that in the thick of battle it seems as if I am casting faster because of cd-refreshing procs, but I don't take into account that there is waiting time due to gcd anyway.

Edited December 16, 2016 by JannusFex

[EtaKoshka]

Thank you very much for this. Has been a while since playing Sorcerer. It will be very helpful for me

[Ottoattack]

Thank you OP for the guide.

 

I mostly PvP and not sure what purpose does lighting sorc accomplish? Sustained damage is terrible, burst is mediocre, aoe is weak and if there is a sorc healer (almost always the case) the utility is sub par. Only thing going for this spec in survivability. And even that is eclipsed by other classes that can deal substantial better damage.

 

This spec needs either a major buff to sustained damage or burst damage.

[DarthCognusSion]

Thank you OP for the guide.

 

I mostly PvP and not sure what purpose does lighting sorc accomplish? Sustained damage is terrible, burst is mediocre, aoe is weak and if there is a sorc healer (almost always the case) the utility is sub par. Only thing going for this spec in survivability. And even that is eclipsed by other classes that can deal substantial better damage.

 

This spec needs either a major buff to sustained damage or burst damage.

 

When it comes to PvP, I really am not the best. As far as regs go, Lightning can actually put out some decent damage and pressure because people often stupidly ignore you. As far as ranked goes, the instant focus will almost always be on you, at least from my experience. Like I said though, I am not very good at PvP and only really starting playing ranked because of CXP grindfest. I found much better success as corruption in Ranked, but I don't really have kiting tactics and such down. I am not sure how people who mained Sorc dps, mostly Madness I think, in Ranked previously are doing with it now.

 

I do agree though that Sorc dps needs a huge buff. I think Lightning needs some minor buffs, while Madness needs some major ones.

Edited January 2, 2017 by DarthCognusSion

[Aeellron]

All of the crate drops I've gotten so far are Force Master gear with Lethal 50A mods. I don't see how you can get to Bants power level with only 84 power on the mods. Which mod should be used for lightning sorc? Edited January 3, 2017 by Aeellron
Spelling

[DarthCognusSion]

All of the crate drops I've gotten so far are Force Master gear with Lethal 50A mods. I don't see how you can get to Bants power level with only 84 power on the mods. Which mod should be used for lightning sorc?

 

I can't say for sure on power, but I trust Bant on his numbers. As for mods, always unlettered mods. The only gear that actually does have unlettered mods is the purple artifact gear and the gold legendary gear. All the other gear you get is pretty much trash.

[Aeellron]

Thanks for your response. This makes perfect sense. At least while doing the grind you can pull the mods and enhancements. I just wanted to make sure I was only pulling the right ones.

[Flusssaeure]

Hello DarthCognusSion,

 

Just dropped in to point out that you mentoined in the comments to your Guide on Dulfy, that you send Dulfy a Telekinetic version of your Guide but that one is by now not published on the page or mentoined in the class master list as received for editing may be published soon. So you probably might want to check with Dulfy if she really received your Telekinetic guide.

[DarthCognusSion]

Hello DarthCognusSion,

 

Just dropped in to point out that you mentoined in the comments to your Guide on Dulfy, that you send Dulfy a Telekinetic version of your Guide but that one is by now not published on the page or mentoined in the class master list as received for editing may be published soon. So you probably might want to check with Dulfy if she really received your Telekinetic guide.

 

Just a mixup. I contacted Dulfy, and it should be up soon