Crafting in Eternal Throne

[magicdragon-six]

Hey Guys why talking about things we could not change? They decided what they did! Why? I don`t know - I hope that's the conclusion of community meanings, posts... what ever.

Maybe we should give it a chance - lets see what will happen and complain afterwards if you don`t like ist.

Am I happy with the changes ? unshure - Will I quit the game ? shurely not.

So lets wait and see what really will become true and how it will work in the game.

 

Cheers

Darklirah

[TheCardinal]

Hey Guys why talking about things we could not change? They decided what they did! Why? I don`t know - I hope that's the conclusion of community meanings, posts... what ever.

Maybe we should give it a chance - lets see what will happen and complain afterwards if you don`t like ist.

Am I happy with the changes ? unshure - Will I quit the game ? shurely not.

So lets wait and see what really will become true and how it will work in the game.

 

Cheers

Darklirah

 

Ofc we can change it, with our wallets.

 

Some do learn from history some don't, clearly BW do not learn from history.

 

Granted beating a dead horse ain't much use and I've never used this to compare this to another game before but this time I feel I need too.

 

NGE for SWG was a good thing and a bad thing, the BAD part was, TO much change and we got notice 2 weeks ahead of time, it ended up with all my RL friends left, SoE had to pay back players who did leave for the cost of the Expansion.

 

Change TO much as in this case, and I am not only taking about crafting now, IF you been else where and read up about whats coming you know what I am taking about.

 

They are altering the core parts of the game this time, the game some of us started to play 5 years ago no longer exist apart from a now defunct story line that has no meaning in the end what so ever.

 

What they are trying to do again and what they failed before is partly force the player base to take part in Conquest that has been broken/pointless since day one it came out and as far as I know, most agree with me on that one.

 

To have mats and or schematics from from URG..... read above, pvp and or Ops, is fine as long as it's TOP tier, END game gear, then if you lack bonus on them fine, but to force the entire player base to take part in thing they have no love for won't help.

 

Look at Pirece comp, do 20 pvp to get him, altho I don't mind, avid pvp player DO mind, and I'm only so good at playing all 8 classes too.

 

PVP is PVP, it's NOT crafting.

Crafting IS a game in it self, that has NO part in Oooo I will take over planet X this week, or I will Kill XX players.

 

They do in the end what they feel like doing, but that do NOT mean the rest of us need to accept not PAY for what they belive is best for us.

 

As a side note, Last night a old guilde came along from being away for a long time and asked how this where and IF it's worth coming back.

 

The consensus from the entire guild that was online was NO.

then we talked about it, she went to forums and had a look and said, Oooo well, I'm off again with my boyfriend.

 

They are NOT coming back due to the changes that's coming.

 

Same in General chat yesterday, someone asked the same, the answer was, IF this goes live then NO do NOT sub.

 

So yeah, more and more feel this is a BAD change and we can still VOTE with the WALLET.

[Dbohrius]

Doesn't that seem a bit like a self-fulfilling prophecy, though?

 

We complain that the game is dying, then we dislike the incoming changes, then we tell people to quit/ not return to the game, so that the game might die? I mean, I'd rather not have to do conquest do craft, and the RNG aspect of galactic command put me off somewhat. But in the end, I think it's better to see the final form of 5.0 before telling people to quit.

 

But that's just me, your reason to be upset is perfectly valid, and far from me to tell you otherwise.

[Transcendent]

So ... I'm not seeing what's so different about what we're getting in crafting 5.0.

 

Is it RNG on schematics? We had that during 1.x (Columi/Rakata schematics RNG drop from ops).

Is it end-game mods learned by RE? We've had that since 1.3 introduced Black Hole gear.

Is it mats coming from Ops? We've always had that.

Is it mats coming from PvP? We had that from 1.5-1.8. (And frankly, mats were much less rare back then.)

Is it mats coming from Conquest? We've had that since 4.0

 

Can someone clue me in on what the outrage is? I don't get it.

 

5.0 crafting seems like same-old same-old, with new rating numbers on the gear.

 

Pretty much. Nothing to really complain about here, all BioWare is trying to do is improve participation in all parts of the game as well as throw the PvP players a bone on earning credits (they can sell the mats assuming not BoP). At least with 5.0 they're not rearranging all of the schematics and moving them to different professions, like they did in 4.0 ().

[Deewe]

Hey folks,

 

As we discussed yesterday on the livestream, one of the goals of crafting is that it will be a mechanism where someone can gear up an alt, catch up to their friends, or even gear an off-spec. With the launch of Eternal Throne you will find that there is a new grade of materials and higher level items which can be learned from your Crafting Trainer. For endgame crafting, the intent is that you will be able to craft items which are within 2 item rating of the best gear in that tier, but without a set bonus. The exception to this rule is tier 1, where you will be able to craft items equivalent to the best item rating in that tier. All of the gear that you craft in this matter will be static, meaning that you cannot move mods. However, crafters will also be able to craft mods of those same item levels.

 

If that is confusing let me give you some examples using made up numbers from Fallen Empire:

Tier 1 – 216 with set bonus

Tier 2 – 220 with set bonus

Tier 3 – 224 with set bonus

 

You would be able to craft at the following ratings:

Tier 1 – 216 without a set bonus

Tier 2 – 218 without a set bonus

Tier 3 – 222 without a set bonus

 

Let’s talk about how you get access to craft these items.

Gear: You will earn the schematics to craft gear from their respective Command Crates. Ex: You will get schematics to craft tier 1 gear inside of tier 1 Command Crates. These schematics will require materials earned from Conquests in order to craft them.

Mods: You will earn the schematics to craft mods through either reverse engineering the mod, PvP, or looting the schematic from an Operation boss. These schematics will require materials earned from Operations or PvP in order to craft them.

 

This is a summary of how crafting relates to gearing in Eternal Throne. Let me know if you have any questions.

 

-eric

So trying get a clear picture here.

 

GEAR

1. Top tier 2 & 3 gear is only obtainable from Command Crates
   
2. Crafted gear does not gives set bonuses
   
3. Mods can't be removed from crafted gear
   
4. Crafting recipe for gear drops from Command Crates
   

 

MODS

1. Mats for Crafting gear is only obtainable from Conquest
   
2. Crafting Mods recipe drops only from Operation Bosses, PvP and reverse engineering them
   
3. Mats for Crafting Mods only obtainable from Operation (bosses?) and PvP
   

 

Assumptions:

1. Gear is BOP
   
2. Crafting recipe are BOP
   
3. Mats for crafting gear (vs mods) are only directly obtainable from Operation (bosses?) and PvP
   
4. Crafting mats aren't BOP
   
5. Mods are slot restricted
   
6. Set bonues are tied to the armoring mod
   
7. Mods can still be transferred to alts through the Legacy gear
   

 

Impact:

• Reduce even more the chance to get a looked after gear piece to complete a set, as crafting recipe can fill a drop slot instead of a set piece
  
• Crafted gear isn't as good as direct gear drops, as not only it does not have the set bonuses but also tier 2 & 3, stats are lower than direct drops AND we can't remove the mods.
  
• Crafting requires requires to do OPS and PvP but mats (TBC) could be traded from other players
  
• Specific gear for look can't be transferred to ALTS
  

 

Consequences:

Makes crafting interesting but not that much, as without set bonuses the appeal will fade off really fast.

Crafting mats prices, if tradable on the GTN, might goo to the roof, large conquest guilds being again advantaged.

Non crafters won't be happy to keep getting useless crafting recipes.

• If they can trade them they will soon enough be worthless
  
• If they can't trade them they will be useless
  

Crafters won't be happy to be obliged to do specific content to get mats, especially if they are not tradeable.

 

Sorry to sound negative but looks like a bad scenario here.

RNG is getting worse and look like you are enforcing crafters to do content they don't want to. Top of that F2P and proffered players are kept out of the loop. Also we don't know about transferring gear for the look to ALTS, which would be a major drawback too.

 

Looks like this system needs quite a few mitigation on reducing the RNG, improving the crafted gear and attenuating the ways to get crafting components. Not to forget this system does not encourage (yet?) to playing ALTS.

Edited October 30, 2016 by Deewe

[mad_freeman]

Musco and "dev team" how about you just announce closing of game date? All this changing you make can't be explained. neither it's casualing game neither making it hardcore. GRINDING never was casual or hardcore and on TOP grinding 4 years old content is total bs. I'm sure you see it your self and just consuming as much money as you can get. So do us favor and give date for closing servers

[Inexistt]

These changes only make sense if you assume that EA has ordered BW to kill the game in order to make room for another one.

[Nebdar]

Is there lvl 10 Crafting materials coming with increase to crew lvl skill cap to 600?

[DarkSaberMaster]

I'm just here to watch the world burn.

[HaploBartow]

I was here long before there even WAS crafting in this game, we had long talks about BW adding crafting in the first place back in what 2009/2010.

 

There's been crafting in SWTOR since the beta.

[EviI_Ewok]

Who cares what they do to crafting as long as slicing lockbox missions are still profitable. Just multi box lots of accounts doing that and then buy whatever you want on the auction house.

[DarkChadmeister]

Question I have is will these crafting recipes be BoE, BoL or BoP?

 

Will the crafting recipes dropped in crates take in consideration of the crafting skills that characters has?

 

I sincerely hope these recipes will be sell-able on the GTN as this will make it much easier for crafters to utilize this catch up mechanic without having to needlessly grind out some absurd level and not have to hope the RNG crates give you what is needed.

[Krazhez]

So trying get a clear picture here.

 

Consequences:

Makes crafting interesting but not that much as without set bonuses the appeal will fade off really fast.

Crafting mats prices, if tradable on the GTN, might goo to the roof, large conquest guilds being again advantaged.

Non crafters won't be happy to keep getting useless crafting recipes.

 

Crafted stuff never had set bonus, no change.

They are adding more ways to get crafting mats than there are now, including pvp. Endgame mats used to only come from ops, and for most of 3.0 they weren't allowed to be listed on the gtn.

You can hit your conquest goal most of the weeks fairly easy with heroics, your guild does not need to make the top 10 to get rewarded with conquest materials.

Crew skills have been dropping useless schematics forever.

 

If you're worried about crafting, google it, or wait til you see the changes live.

Edited October 29, 2016 by Krazhez

[Soul_of_Flames]

For people complaining about having to do other content, such as PvP, for crafting.... I don't understand your concern.

 

This is something that is necessary for the game's economy. Just because you're a crafter that needs mats that come from PvP doesn't necessarily mean YOU have to PvP to get them.

 

A PvPer can do PvP, get the mats, then sell them on the GTN. Then you, as a crafter, buy them and make your stuff.

 

How is that any different from how it currently is? Dark Matters drop from ops and you can get them from that vendor for an absurd amount of radiant crystals. But I get the majority of mine by buying other people's stock on the GTN.

 

The game needs overflow between the internal communities. It's healthy for the economy. IE, to do one thing, you need to get things from other otherwise unrelated content. This allows people involved with the unrelated content to obtain items that are of value to you and allows the game's credits to circulate between players involved in different aspects of the game.

[IanArgent]

Having played an MMO with a much more complicated internal economy than this one, I've always kind of viewed the ease by which even a dabbler in crafting can self-supply without engaging game mechanics or other players to be somewhat ... bland. As long as the drop rate for the high-end mats is reasonable enough to allow a robust trade in them on the GTN, I don't care whether I did the op/PvP or someone else did and I sold it. The rub there is "reasonable drop rate." This hasn't been the case in the past for DMCs and up; the supply doesn't keep up with the desires for adventuring crafters to self-supply, much less give enough overage to supply the GTN; at least not based on GTN pricing for both the mats and the finished product.

[Icykill_]

So not only do we get our gear jacked with by RNG, now you're RNGing the crafting side too?!

 

You've got to be kidding me.

 

I called this when they first announced RNG...

[Kheld]

I quit LOTRO when they made LI's too grindy.

 

I will quit this game too & drop my 4 year sub if they turn it into some RNG grindfest.

[TheCardinal]

Having played an MMO with a much more complicated internal economy than this one, I've always kind of viewed the ease by which even a dabbler in crafting can self-supply without engaging game mechanics or other players to be somewhat ... bland. As long as the drop rate for the high-end mats is reasonable enough to allow a robust trade in them on the GTN, I don't care whether I did the op/PvP or someone else did and I sold it. The rub there is "reasonable drop rate." This hasn't been the case in the past for DMCs and up; the supply doesn't keep up with the desires for adventuring crafters to self-supply, much less give enough overage to supply the GTN; at least not based on GTN pricing for both the mats and the finished product.

 

SWG was one, there you really needed combat char to get items to craft.

 

altho that in the end was the best the game had to offer, back then it did work.

 

Screw us over with crafting and Crystals and like many know from reading elsewhere, I have little hope this time.

[mdahm]

I would like to pick up this question:

Also, what about the Crystal of Nightmare Fury, will it require the mats from Operations/PvP, or something else?

 

Anything known about this yet?

Will there be a new or altered schematic for it? Or is the plan to delete these crystals completely? (If so, it would be great to know sooon, so we have time to use up our current crystals.)

[mefager]

what about augmentations? will there be mk-10 or it will stay at mk-9?

[Zasszz]

Let’s talk about how you get access to craft these items.

Gear: You will earn the schematics to craft gear from their respective Command Crates. Ex: You will get schematics to craft tier 1 gear inside of tier 1 Command Crates. These schematics will require materials earned from Conquests in order to craft them.

Mods: You will earn the schematics to craft mods through either reverse engineering the mod, PvP, or looting the schematic from an Operation boss. These schematics will require materials earned from Operations or PvP in order to craft them.

This means players without access to conquests due to lack of players doing them will be forced to massively farm flashpoints or even must do PVP to get materials or spend ALOT on the GTN. The unlikely alternative is that the conquest crates offer a boatload of materials for this huge load of individual and forced farming of things we dont like in many cases.

 

Or, since conquest is a group activity in many cases, players will seek other players more often than currently on some half-dead servers to gain materials if they dont have the credits to buy from the GTN which will be very pricy considering the amount of work involved in obtaining the materials (of unknown amount).

 

The perception is that this is just another in a long line of middle fingers to the community. The reality is that since the devs refuse to engage with the community until there's a huge uproar they give that perception strong credence.

Edited October 30, 2016 by Zasszz

[AussieAlan]

LOL, so I can get set bonus gear and never do an op, but in order to make non set bonus gear I have to do ops, or buy them for obscene amounts, and by the time you get the mats from ops odds are you will get a set bonus gear before you have enough mats.

[IanArgent]

LOL, so I can get set bonus gear and never do an op, but in order to make non set bonus gear I have to do ops, or buy them for obscene amounts, and by the time you get the mats from ops odds are you will get a set bonus gear before you have enough mats.

 

Without an idea of the supply side of the equation, we have no idea what the mats will go for. If they're as available as the current DMCs, XISs, and SRMs, yeah, might be worth freaking out about. If they turn up the spigot, maybe not so much.

[Deewe]

Crafted stuff never had set bonus, no change.

They are adding more ways to get crafting mats than there are now, including pvp.

Endgame mats used to only come from ops, and for most of 3.0 they weren't allowed to be listed on the gtn.

You can hit your conquest goal most of the weeks fairly easy with heroics, your guild does not need to make the top 10 to get rewarded with conquest materials.

Crew skills have been dropping useless schematics forever.

 

If you're worried about crafting, google it, or wait til you see the changes live.

A good take indeed. Thanks for the highlights.

 

On a pure crafting basis comparison the new system looks better, on paper, than the current one.

Now taking into consideration the major core design changes ie: RNG in the drops vs crystals, it isn't

 

Reason being:

1. It does not makes crafting that interesting
   
2. It does not mitigates the RNG issue
   
3. It further lower the pieces drop rates as player can get crafting recipe instead of gear pieces
   
4. Looks like F2P and Preferred won't have OP passes nor access to purple top gear unlock, contrary to now.
   

[Khevar]

A good take indeed. Thanks for the highlights.

 

On a pure crafting basis comparison the new system looks better, on paper, than the current one.

Now taking into consideration the major core design changes ie: RNG in the drops vs crystals, it isn't

 

Reason being:

1. It does not makes crafting that interesting
   
2. It does not mitigates the RNG issue
   
3. It further lower the pieces drop rates as player can get crafting recipe instead of gear pieces
   
4. Looks like F2P and Preferred won't have OP passes nor access to purple top gear unlock, contrary to now.
   

I have a few comments.

 

1. Neither does it make it less interesting. It's pretty much the same, IMO.

2. This is true.

3. This assumes drops are either gear OR schematic. What makes you think this will be the case?

4. This is true.

 

I still believe that Eric's post didn't cover the basic gearing (e.g. 228 rating, perhaps?) which would probably be simply done with schematics learned at the trainer, using mats obtaining through crew skills.

 

Which leaves the end game gear. The Tier 1 gear in 5.0 definitely falls prey to RNG. I feel that this is offset by the Tier 2 and Tier 3 gear being more readily available to learn schematics. Also, exotic mats dropping from both operations and PvP have the potential of making them more plentiful (hearkens back to the 1.6 days).

 

Complaints about regular RNG gearing I can understand. But I feel that the CRAFTING changes in 5.0 are neither better nor worse than what we've had previously.