The real question is: Why bother with gear?? We did all there is in game!!

[Monumenta]

I didnt gear up for 4.0 until just recently, and just on my main, I dont think I will feel the urge to do this useless grind either.

 

uprisings better be really impressive

[DarthDymond]

Not allowed to discuss it on forums.

 

BW has admitted that they haven't even finalized what the max level command rank is going to be yet. Anything coming from the 'alternative' sources is based on a pretty incomplete picture.

[DarthDymond]

Wasn't that the point of DvL- to get players to experience all the areas the game has to offer?

What percentage of players do you think are actually going for Legendary tier - the only tier that includes Ops and HM FP requirements? I'd be genuinely surprised if more than five percent, and half expect it is less than two percent.

[Tsetso]

BW has admitted that they haven't even finalized what the max level command rank is going to be yet. Anything coming from the 'alternative' sources is based on a pretty incomplete picture.

 

It doesn't matter really. I play for a couple of hours in the evenings, normally doing an operation or 2. So let's say i do all the SM operations in a week. That's all the command points i'm going to get this week, because i most definitely won't be grinding dailies, heroics and flashpoints. For the required gear for NiM to even start dropping i'm pretty sure that i have to be ~70+ rank. I really doubt that i'd be that rank by the end of the second week and farming SM ops for even a month is not going to happen. So it's a moot point. In 4.0 i am able to hop into HM and NiM ops the moment i get to 65. In 5.0 i will have to grind for months. Deal breaker for me.

[DarthDymond]

Yes, that is called MX Mode... where the existing stuff is tweaked and refreshed to appear "new enough" to allow a trickle of new players to come by and see it for low development costs... KotFE was clearly a budget deal, costing far less than 2.0 or 3.0 did to develop, so it exists to make the game not appear dead, even when it really is.

 

But I wouldn't get all excited about the new state of the game... it isn't a glowing endorsement of it...

If this Galactic Command system was the only thing coming out in 5.0, then I think you'd actually have at least a colorable argument that we were looking at maintenance mode.

 

But it's not all that's coming out - we're getting nine story chapters and the new Uprising group-able content. And over the past year we also got seventeen story chapters, Star Fortress, Eternal Championship, Odessen Proving Grounds, and Rishi Cove Arena. Now, it's a perfectly valid opinion for someone to say they don't find that content appealing or worth their subscription money, but it is legitimate content, and certainly not what maintenance mode looks like.

 

I agree 4.0 and 5.0 were probably cheaper to produce than 2.0 and/or 3.0, but they're still putting out legitimate content. Heck, from my perspective, given I rarely replay Ops or FPs after seeing them once for the story, the KOTFE model was giving me more content for my playstyle than I got in 3.0 (2.0 probably gave me a bit more just because of Oricon).

Edited October 19, 2016 by DarthDymond

[TUXs]

Wasn't that the point of DvL- to get players to experience all the areas the game has to offer?

Yes, but that was different. For DvL we did the old content grind for new gear...now we're going to do all the old content again for...err...new gear?!

[Rolodome]

A reasonable question. I have decided for myself. Bought a founfer pack for RO and going to participate in CB1. After that - who know - either RO, FF, WoW or W*

Lol, I was curious, so I looked up what RO is. Looks like a copy of TERA's character and armor design, and a hybrid of TERA and GW2's combat.

 

Which I guess is good if you like TERA and GW2. It's just funny to me how they're not even trying to make it look original. It's like the MMO market equivalent of another superhero franchise.

[Rolodome]

Yes, but that was different. For DvL we did the old content grind for new gear...now we're going to do all the old content again for...err...new gear?!

To be fair, if you're referring to GC, we are at least allowed to do the content of our choosing this time, unlike the restricted nature of DvL. And some of it will be new content.

[Tsetso]

Lol, I was curious, so I looked up what RO is. Looks like a copy of TERA's character and armor design, and a hybrid of TERA and GW2's combat.

 

Which I guess is good if you like TERA and GW2. It's just funny to me how they're not even trying to make it look original. It's like the MMO market equivalent of another superhero franchise.

 

Actually with the flying stuff it reminds me of Aion, which i loved.

[Rolodome]

Actually with the flying stuff it reminds me of Aion, which i loved.

I'm trying to remember now if TERA has flying. I tried Aion briefly. The flying was pretty fun.

[Tanitha]

If this Galactic Command system was the only thing coming out in 5.0, then I think you'd actually have at least a colorable argument that we were looking at maintenance mode.

 

But it's not all that's coming out - we're getting nine story chapters and the new Uprising group-able content. And over the past year we also got seventeen story chapters, Star Fortress, Eternal Championship, Odessen Proving Grounds, and Rishi Cove Arena. Now, it's a perfectly valid opinion for someone to say they don't find that content appealing or worth their subscription money, but it is legitimate content, and certainly not what maintenance mode looks like.

 

9 SOLO chapters, adn uprisings which are AGAIN SOLO CONTENT. Which you will be able to SOLO in current gear, if they are as difficult as SFs were (I know because I soloed at least on SF with 192/198 gear). 2 arenas? 1 arena. Rishi cove SHOULD have been released with SoR.

 

EC: not repeatable content, no incentive to repeat it, again SOLO content.

 

And what have they produced exactly that is interesting? No raids, no events, no new conquest, NO ACTUAL GROUP CONTENT. There is nothing there that is actual group content, except for the measly 2 WZs. In 2 years they have produced 2 WZs.

 

There is no point in running SFs or TEC at all. There is no fun in doing those at all. Go in with a good group, and the challenge is gone, if there was ever one. Done TEC on a badly geared operative dps, on which I am actually bad at playing. So where is the challenge, if I can do it with a toon I don't even know how to play well?

 

I agree 4.0 and 5.0 were probably cheaper to produce than 2.0 and/or 3.0, but they're still putting out legitimate content. Heck, from my perspective, given I rarely replay Ops or FPs after seeing them once for the story, the KOTFE model was giving me more content for my playstyle than I got in 3.0 (2.0 probably gave me a bit more just because of Oricon).

 

For you it might, for me it isn't. I am even bored to do KOTFE with most of my toons, and now I will have to grind content which is boring for me just to get the gear I need, instead of concentrating on ops and FPs which I like to do.

 

I love the initial class stories, even the Trooper and consular ones are much much better than the KOTFE crap, where choices DON'T matter. And we are getting what exactly with 5.0? More of the same with 9 crappy chapters, new SFs, with the old ones I got bored after playing them with 4 maras (and did it with the 4th because I was mistaken and thought DvL needed them otherwise I wouldn't have bothered), 1 sentinel and 1 sniper, and an RNG system for gearing where I will have to grind for months in order to get that gear which will allow me to even attempt Revan HM or M&B HM.

 

Where is the repeatable content? Where is new ops, new FPs, new conquest, new event? Guilds are in shambles because people are leaving by the drones, raid teams are desperately trying to find raiders because people are leaving the game. Heck now even PvPers are going to leave with this new RNG system.

 

I would have nothing against KOTFE and KOTET if there was more content. If there was more interesting content that you can repeat and do again and again for a time. Like an ops. Like some new FPs. 2 damned new WZs in 2 years is actually all the new MMO content we got.

Edited October 19, 2016 by Tanitha

[Andryah]

So really, why bother getting your rank up and gear from crates?? What for? To do KOTFE? KOTET? Old flashpoints? New Uprisigns? What for? You can do it all once for story and done! There is no incentive to go through the gearing proccess. Only to do what? NiMs which we did 3 years ago? New HMs we did 2 years ago?

 

Yes, casuals now get "best gear" in game if they grind enough of easy content, but why? What for? I dont see any point in this!!

 

To many MMO players, they have been conditioned and trained in MMOs for years to chase items. If there was no gear in this MMO, most people that want the end game challenging content would simply not play it.

 

No rewards = not going to play .....is the true motivator for many players.

 

PvP really should be about skill not gear, so I wish they would just make gear irrelevant in PvP. But then those that rely on gear over skill will rage.

 

PvE..... meh... most content can be played right out the gate with available gear separate from the coming gear boxes, so this is way exaggerated by players on the RNG thing. Set bonus are the only real thing of value behind RNG.. and honestly those are generally of limited additional power. It's not like they are making more high end challenge OPs which is where most people insist they need the edge of the best gear.

Edited October 19, 2016 by Andryah

[KnightOfTython]

So really, why bother getting your rank up and gear from crates?? What for?

 

It pretty much looks like that EA/BW says good bye to classic MMO raid motivations and introduces a Star Fortress like game play to solo and small groups.

 

If you want to grind gear fast you might will run OPs for CXP bonus but since any activity will give you CXP it doesn't really matter. In other words gear is not a requirement for raids any longer but it's a nice to have to make things easier in Uprisings.

 

The question is why EA is convinced that Uprisings will raise MMO revenue.

Obviously a big secret.

Edited October 19, 2016 by KnightOfTython

[Tanitha]

PvE..... meh... most content can be played right out the gate with available gear separate from the coming gear boxes, so this is way exaggerated by players on the RNG thing. Set bonus are the only real thing of value behind RNG.. and honestly those are generally of limited additional power. It's not like they are making more high end challenge OPs which is where most people insist they need the edge of the best gear.

 

Try and go in a NiM ops or M&B HM with 216 crystal non-optimized gear, and then tell me if set bonus and gear doesn't make a difference. [if someone is willing to take you there on that gear.]

[CorellianWannabe]

Well, I did not get a full set of 224 gear by playing SOLO heroics. I got it by spending time learning my rotation, banging at a dummy for hours to get it right. Playing a boss and wiping on it for weeks, until we get all the tactics right to kill it. In order to get the top tier gear it takes:

 

1. Knowledge of your class and spec, from your powers, to rotation, to what to do when your rotation gets screwed.

2. Dedication to your teammates, cooperation with your teammates.

3. Tactics and positioning in an op, and being able to adapt when things don't go as planned.

4. Listening to your ops lead/officers, since they usually have studied the tactics and most times, have done that same ops a lot and killed the boss.

5. Patience.

6. And being able to dedicate a few hours per week, usually in the evening to play ops.

 

And lastly, and very important, being able to have fun even when wiping 15 times in a row.

 

Now, playing heroics and doing solo stuff, like KOTFE chapters don't even come close to what it takes to do ops. if you want that top tier gear then you should work for it, and not get it by doing SOLO stuff, for which you don't even need it. I soloed heroics whilst leveling my PT with green gear which I did not change until I got to level 65 and did not change from L25-30.

 

If with crystal comms, 208 gear you cannot solo heroics, I don't know what to say...

 

You realize this is a game, right? You talk as if it's akin to Olympic athletes training.

 

You obviously don't need the gear either, if you can kill loot pinatas and be geared in 2 hours. There are no new raids and haven't been for years, if you can't manage to beat the bosses by now without wiping 15 times I don't know what to say- maybe your group didn't follow your little bullet points 1-4?

 

It's funny how whenever raiders are told their carrots could be earned any way other than raiding they froth about how raid gear is only for raids. Actually now the best gear is for pvp as well- I guess raiders can slum for 'welfare epics' and froth about that as well? Why does it matter if you can't get that last piece to drop and the solo player had better luck? Are you going to see that character on the fleet and those feelings of envy will swell up inside?

[Tanitha]

You realize this is a game, right? You talk as if it's akin to Olympic athletes training.

 

You obviously don't need the gear either, if you can kill loot pinatas and be geared in 2 hours. There are no new raids and haven't been for years, if you can't manage to beat the bosses by now without wiping 15 times I don't know what to say- maybe your group didn't follow your little bullet points 1-4?

 

Try beating Master and Blaster HM or Revan HM. It takes a full team and hours of wiping before getting those bosses down. It takes a lot of team coordination and team effort to get everything right. You may need to adjust your tactics on the fly because whatever a guide tells you or whatever you see in a video, might need refining for your ops team.

 

It's funny how whenever raiders are told their carrots could be earned any way other than raiding they froth about how raid gear is only for raids. Actually now the best gear is for pvp as well- I guess raiders can slum for 'welfare epics' and froth about that as well? Why does it matter if you can't get that last piece to drop and the solo player had better luck? Are you going to see that character on the fleet and those feelings of envy will swell up inside?

 

Really, so I will have to endure weeks of GCX and NEVER GET THAT LAST SET PIECE IN NEED to play end-game content?

 

For all I care BW can give a full set of gear to everyone. Just don't let this RNG thing go, and PREVENT ME from playing what I like to play most: OPS and PVP, because I WILL BE MISSING THAT FINAL SET PIECE that depending on class CAN make a difference between killing a boss and wiping. And what when my teammmates can't get ONE WHOLE SET because the RNG is bad for them too? MONTHS OF TRYING to get ONE FRIGGING PIECE OF GEAR YOU NEED? Instead of saying" "Okay, this week we'll do S&V HM and get X his relic, Y his MH, D his implant" and solving the gear problem.

 

And frankly, I don't get why people who play SOLO want ops gear. WHAT FOR? When most of them go in groups for heroics just to make more money? What you want the gear for? But as I said, LET BW give a set of gear to everyone, it's not like they will play ops or anything. But don't make me wait for months to get that final set of set bonus, because RNG is bad, or my friends can't gear their alts and play,a nd so we will not have one class on another to play ops.

 

And instead of coming with this idiotic system of how to milk the fly, and make us play the same old content again and again, WHY not get something new? Something that will be of replay value and not more of the same crap KOTFE is?

[KnightOfTython]

Why bother with gear?

 

Good question.

 

You basically get nothing for nightmare mode because you need tons of CXP as high level.

Edited October 20, 2016 by KnightOfTython

[Wayshuba]

You are talking about having a raid ready toon? That is not a problem there. I was talking about having someone who already knows how to play and who wants to do harder content, giving him/her all the loot form the ops, so they can easily move into harder content. It takes a guild and/or a team to do that. And everyone in the team, agrees to do it. So let's say you are a good healer, but low on gear. With the right gear you would be able to move to NiM content, Revan HM for excample. So if I am on the same raid team and have my gear, I will gladly come for an ops to help you get the gear you need so we can move to the more difficult content. gearing a toon in two hours is when teams/guilds do it, not for someone who pugs on fleet.

 

Ops teams rotate loot so everyone can get geared easily and without conflict. If a new member comes in, they will most times do a couple of ops to help that person get the gear s/he needs, so they can move to more difficult content.

 

Quoted for truth. Our guild recently did just this over the last two weeks for three of our newer members so they could quickly catch up to those of us well geared and do harder content that the guild typically does. With this new system, that is completely out the window.

 

At this point I swear that the peeps at BW either don't play this game or only play it solo. They seem to have no idea what "MMO" even means.

 

Come to think of it, this is what makes Command Crates a terrible idea overall. This is going to royally mess up common raiding practices and severely unbalance PvP as it will now be based on who did their grind and how lucky they got with RNG. This whole thing is completely against the play flow that those two types of players use.

 

So BW, given the above example, please tell us how this will work. We have to wait for three new peeps to grind 25-30 command levels and hopefully get some good RNG so they can join with their team mates for a harder raid? Have you guys even thought this through? More so, even if you make it so we get a token with a specific piece of gear, we still have to help new members grind 14 CxP levels minimum. As it is, we can almost fully gear a new member in two nights. One night we run EV and KP SM, then usually S&V another night. Now, we have to make sure they stick around for everyone in the raid to have grinded 14 levels minimum?

 

Oh, and I can't wait to hear the flak you are going to get on the RNG in Level 70 PvP which is going to become lopsided as all business depending on how lucky people have become in their RNG and how many levels they grind through in CxP. Someone in Level 70 PvP in 244 gear is going to demolish someone in 228 gear.

 

Overall, the more you think about this the more you realize it is going to completely mess up the dynamics of the game when it comes to raiding and PvP.

Edited October 20, 2016 by Wayshuba

[Wayshuba]

Wanted to make this post separate to respond to the OP:

 

RPG comes with a certain structure that has been around since D&D was invented. Do something and get a reward. It is less about the stats of the gear itself and more about following the element of the RPG genre.

[CorellianWannabe]

Wanted to make this post separate to respond to the OP:

 

RPG comes with a certain structure that has been around since D&D was invented. Do something and get a reward. It is less about the stats of the gear itself and more about following the element of the RPG genre.

 

And if you outwit the Dungeon Master you should get rewarded, but in MMOs you get banned for 'exploiting' the developers' incompetence.

[Poshible]

I haven't done Arcann yet, still waiting. No new gear needed for.

 

Just have to say this really made me laugh

[micmitja]

Nobody mind if casuals get gear it makes easier for guild that don't have to run useless content for them if they decide to do, thats not an issue let them have it better for group oriented guilds.

 

The issue is there wasn't made any new group oriented content in past 2y and it seems it wont be for another one or when ever. SF have finish got all ach for them including decos and what ever it offered solo. EC also same only missing 15m run maybe some day. Thats all solo content as far as i am concern. The awesome chapters have finish on 21 chars most of them up to 13 finish only on few got 34 total, 28 65 i guess can forget about them with next expansion.

 

So when was the last time we got any OPS, FP, Daily area, World Boss, event. Wz got 2 maps yay that most of ppl hate.

And i heard that 60% of ppl still haven't done all the content that even they can do in few months top depend on how much time they invest in to geme, then what. And next year they will say what oh y we still got 40% ppl that haven't done everything so far so lets recycle again.

 

So that mean it should absolve them of not making any in past 2 y and who know when they will if they will.

 

We have already lost tons of good and great players for group stuff and they keep on leaving so whats the point of gearing everyone if there wont be any left for group stuff.

 

Just wondering

Edited October 20, 2016 by micmitja

[Rion_Starkiller]

I agree with OP. Get geared for what? Everything is bolstered.

 

We need to know if Master/NiM level difficulty will also be bolstered. And what besides Uprisings and KotFE/KotET content will even have Master difficulty? Old Nightmare Ops?

Edited October 20, 2016 by Rion_Starkiller