Joesixxpack Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 Carebear LOL! I'd like to call you dirty words but can't since it's now true. p.s. - Says the guy on the #1 PVE server.... So yeah... sort of take that. p.p.s. - BW PLS MERGE OUR *********** PVP SERVERS THIS PVE SERVER **** SUCKS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlienEyeTX Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 I know, my only concern is if they had asked first instead of going oh hey look there's a player with a big target on their back. It just seems like common courtesy has been completely thrown out the window nowadays. No, no, no. What you're suggesting is how a duel works. That's a different type of PvP. When you are flagged, it should be assumed that you are open to engaging in combat with other players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beattlebilly Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 Or, in some cases, while fighting mobs you can auto-attack the next target, but the next target is a nearby player who is flagged. THIS is what happens...people get lazy and don't pay attention to their target and THEY attack, causing the fight to begin with. IDK that it can always be chalked up to lazy and/or not paying attention, I've auto-targeted enemy players that were behind me and just barely in my 30m range while I was fighting melee mobs that were right in front of me. I've auto-targeted stealthed players behind me while fighting mobs in front of me. Sometimes the auto-targeting is If we're on a PvE server and we aren't flagged, why should it default to targeting players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DomiSotto Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 (edited) Great manifesto, Domi. Here's the other side of the coin: Grow a pair and fight players. Love, A Scare Bear. In most cases, the ganker is a burst stealth player with a lot of cc at his disposal, meaning that if he is an aggressor, he has an advantage over any PvE player who is likely playing a sustained DPS AC, in PvE gear and has no dueling practice, and does not have the utilities set up to overcome the ccs. The opening burst of the ganker combined with the Utilities emphasizing the cc use will immediately put an attacked player at a disadvantage, and that disadvantage is even higher if the attacked player had already used up CDs and DCDs while fighting the mobs and had some health lost. If you factor in the idiotic companion system that does not turn the companion off when a player is in a PvP mode, or the propensity of the gankers to force the uneven odds by jumping a single player by a group. It is not about lacking courage, it is about not being dumb and allowing someone to stack odds in their favor and win a fight before it even begins. I would very much like to gain dueling experience. I would trade it for allowing someone to buff up their kill count, that's fine with me. But I will not flag myself willy-nilly until the companions are out of the equation and when flagging myself practically guarantees a gang-rape. Edited February 12, 2016 by DomiSotto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toragn Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 Hi, PvP is PvP, if you say you accept it (by being yellow) you are (and should be!) fair game. That said I still sometimes encounter people who tries to get me to PvP when I don't want to by getting close to me in a fight and hoping I will use AoE (if they are flagged this will flag you too because it's counted as an attack). What I normally do is putting companion on passive and only use ST-skills until I can move on. More fun is to pretend doing it, use the NPC you are fighting to build up focus (i main Sith jugg). And then slowly kill the mob with standard-attack. The griefer will lose concentration while whatching you and not succeed in the griefing. Then BAM you kill the npc and hurt the griefer with a good AoE-skill (this flags you) and give him/her hell. I promise you they will always be unprepared for this, and in PvP every GCD counts. Worst case you die, best case you win and get the warm and fuzzy feeling of revenge:)) Regards /T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlrikFassbauer Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 (edited) In most cases, the ganker is a burst stealth player with a lot of cc at his disposal, The opening burst of the ganker combined with the Utilities emphasizing the cc use will immediately put an attacked player at a disadvantage, and that disadvantage is even higher if the attacked player had already used up CDs and DCDs while fighting the mobs and had some health lost. Very much this. Why are Gankers almost exclusively using overpowered classes ? Why are using Gankers almost exclusively the 2 most powerful duelling classes, Assassin + Operative ? Because they don't want the other side to have the tiniest chance against them ! Ganking is in my opinion nothing but an Sadist's Play. They play with other players like a cat plays with a mouse. Edited February 12, 2016 by AlrikFassbauer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aeneas_Falco Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 (edited) I tested this on SL from curiosity to see if the claims were true or not. Didn't happen. Myth busted as far as I'm concerned. That used to be an issue that has since been fixed. A couple years ago it was possible to get someone to deflag by stepping into one of their AOE abilities. I had it happen to me once on Tatoine (not in Outlaw's Den) while leveling a character. This was back before level sync, and some stealthed max level tool stepped into one of my AOEs while my unflagged lowbie was doing a class or world mission, the AOE flagged me, and he then attacked, That said, there are still exploits used to get a person to unintentionally flag themselves. One way is to be flagged for PVP and stand on top of a quest objective. An unflagged person is trying to complete the quest and unintentionally clicks on the flagged player clipping the quest objective, triggering an attack that flags the person doing the quest for PVP. Edited February 12, 2016 by Aeneas_Falco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrelballz Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 Very much this. Why are Gankers almost exclusively using overpowered classes ? Why are using Gankers almost exclusively the 2 most powerful duelling classes, Assassin + Operative ? Because they don't want the other side to have the tiniest chance against them ! Ganking is in my opinion nothing but an Sadist's Play. They play with other players like a cat plays with a mouse. I agree and that's why when I play my sniper if I'm in a pvp area and I see any stealth classes attacking anyone who is minding their own business and farming or killing npcs I always lend a helping hand. By the time they see they are getting hit like a truck its too late, my entrench is up and they are at less than half their health and the other person just helps me finish them off. Cowards deserve to be taken out maliciously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joesixxpack Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 I agree and that's why when I play my sniper if I'm in a pvp area and I see any stealth classes attacking anyone who is minding their own business and farming or killing npcs I always lend a helping hand. By the time they see they are getting hit like a truck its too late, my entrench is up and they are at less than half their health and the other person just helps me finish them off. Cowards deserve to be taken out maliciously. Don't forget to deploy your pet on their face a few times after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aerockyul Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 I got very angry the first time this happened to me, when I was newish and didn't know what flagging was or why I was suddenly being attacked for no reason. It took some in-game help and advice from the forum posters to figure out what I could do to avoid it happening again, and it has not happened again. The only time I get flagged anymore is if I'm in a world boss group and someone in the group did not turn off their flag and I heal them (directly, AOE, or roaming mend has done it). That part was seemingly out of my control, but someone mentioned that you can see who is flagged before engaging so even in this case you can avoid flagging yourself in a group setting. I also avoid Outlaw's Den and have never done the Gree event, and just accept I don't really need HK that much. I find it distasteful enough to be ganked that I simply remove myself from instances where it could happen. If you find the feeling mutual, just educate yourself or get help from others (many posters in this thread have given good suggestions to avoid the flag, or at least getting rid of the flag if you somehow acquire it) and it should never happen to you again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DomiSotto Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 (edited) Ganking is in my opinion nothing but an Sadist's Play. They play with other players like a cat plays with a mouse. I honestly don't care who they are, and why they turned out the way they did. I don't feel anything when someone calls me a coward, a bad, a retard, a moron, a weakling or even a f***g moron. What I care about is providing accurate information about flagging for PvP on a PvE server. The OP was baited and is trying to lash out by stubbornly appealing to the rules that do not support his/her position, the rules support the ganker. There is that vague feeling that what happened was unfair in its essence. I feel that knowledge dissemination is a better way to deal with the conflict than arguing and shaming. Edited February 12, 2016 by DomiSotto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squirrelballz Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 Don't forget to deploy your pet on their face a few times after. LOL I make my companion dance while I go in and out of cover simulating a t-bagging like action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OranoQuanteras Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 One thing you can do if you get flagged: 1. Click on the Galactic Starfighter icon next to your minimap. 2. Start the tutorial. 3. Quit out of the tutorial. It should immediately remove your PvP flag without having to wait. Thank you for posting this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joesixxpack Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 LOL I make my companion dance while I go in and out of cover simulating a t-bagging like action. Noice. If you have the push ups emote that one works good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DawnAskham Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 (edited) IDK that it can always be chalked up to lazy and/or not paying attention, I've auto-targeted enemy players that were behind me and just barely in my 30m range while I was fighting melee mobs that were right in front of me. I've auto-targeted stealthed players behind me while fighting mobs in front of me. Sometimes the auto-targeting is If we're on a PvE server and we aren't flagged, why should it default to targeting players? It shouldn't. And the solution should be to implement a manual flagging system like WoW's, where on PVE servers, a players must manually toggle their flag to "ON" before being able to engage in any PVP activities. In those systems, it is not possible to auto flag in any way - nor take any actions which might be considered PVP. Oh and no auto flagging system in any game has ever been perfect. Every single one including SWTOR has had bugs where under certain conditions, players could be force flagged. WoW spent years making tweaks and changes to remove all forced flagging situations, and yet even at the end of the last expansion (Mists), there were ways for stealth classes to auto flag certain classes using certain aoe. So while I haven't seen any exploits in SWTOR for forced flagging in quite a while, I would not rule out that some strange combinations of actions in specific situations could still exist, and I certainly wouldn't rule out future changes introducing bugs which could be exploited to allow for forced flagging. Edited February 12, 2016 by DawnAskham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lightSaberAddiCt Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 Yeah that's cool when you are a healer, you respond to a "need heals for H4" only to end flagged for PvP because you healed one of the group members who happens to be a PvPer and then you are fresh meat for the whole time you are trying to complete the heroic. That's so cool, right? That is your fault. I always check team members pvp flag. Not the games fault, or thempeople that may jump you. You didnt pay attention, healed a flagged player and got flagged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pagy Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 (edited) Very much this. Why are Gankers almost exclusively using overpowered classes ? Why are using Gankers almost exclusively the 2 most powerful duelling classes, Assassin + Operative ? Because they don't want the other side to have the tiniest chance against them !or maybe they have stealth? Ganking is in my opinion nothing but an Sadist's Play. They play with other players like a cat plays with a mouse.its a video game. if i play CoD and start shooting everyone, that doesnt make me a war hero or a mass murderer. If i play monopoly and bancrupt my sister, that doesnt make me a heartless real estate tycoon. these are games and they have objectives in them. "ganking" is a misnomer. its just a word used by people to whine about losing. you either 1) plan on a pvp server and acknowledge the fact you are flagged for pvp and therefore give consent to tbe attacked or 2) play on a pve server and choose when and where to flag yourself. just because some people like to kill other players, that doesnt make them especially evil. they are simply playing a game. if you dont like the game's objectives, there are many tools and alternatives for you to avoid it. Edited February 12, 2016 by Pagy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joesixxpack Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 (edited) ...And the solution should be to implement a manual flagging system like WoW's, where on PVE servers, a players must manually toggle their flag to "ON" before being able to engage in any PVP activities. In those systems, it is not possible to auto flag in any way - nor take any actions which might be considered PVP. Agreed. Personally I only want to play on PVP servers but get why this is a lame issue. Dear BW, you don't mind using ideas from WoW and other games, and 4 years has been long enough waiting for this one. Facts: >If people want to be flagged, they will have 0 problem or inconvenience from manual toggle only. >If people don't want to be flagged, they have 0 interest in flag options other than a plain, manual toggle. inb4 some people might have a problem with this. Who? Turds hunting PVEers on PVE servers? They're not people so don't count. Edited February 12, 2016 by Joesixxpack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DomiSotto Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 It is precisely because it is logical and straightforward to handle it this way, that it catches the players off-guard that it is not so. The easiest way to turn off a PvP flag is not by clicking the same toggle that turns that flag on your portrait. It is by going into a warzone or opening a GSF tutorial. That's absurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aries_cz Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 It is precisely because it is logical and straightforward to handle it this way, that it catches the players off-guard that it is not so. The easiest way to turn off a PvP flag is not by clicking the same toggle that turns that flag on your portrait. It is by going into a warzone or opening a GSF tutorial. That's absurd. Actually, clicking on the toggle while you have a flag active tells you exactly what you need to do (remain in safe area for a bit). Having it turn on and off at moments notice is just a recipe for abuse. It is perfectly logical. Entering GSF or WZ is a way around the rules, and slight abuse of the system, but so minor that BW does not consider it as a priority to fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aries_cz Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 A>If people want to be flagged, they will have 0 problem or inconvenience from manual toggle only. >If people don't want to be flagged, they have 0 interest in flag options other than a plain, manual toggle. Which is how it works now. Getting a flag unless you want it is not that easy. That some people found creative ways around it by exploiting players lack of attention is another problem. Most common methods of "tricking" someone into PvP are Healing a flagged player - logical, as it would make any PvP unfair if you could heal someone without fear of reprisal (could be reworked so that it would not work at all if you were not flagged, but you could still prebuff someone with HoTs, I suppose)Standing in AoEs and hoping the attacking player will fail to notice you and click you, or has auto target on. Both are easily fixed by having people pay attnetion and turning off an option that is best turned off anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aries_cz Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 OP, the problem is clearly on your head in this case. You were flagged, which means you have given consent to be attacked. Attackers have no way of knowing if you want to fight or not, and by being flagged, you were loudly proclaiming to the world "I want to PvP" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quraswren Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 OP, the problem is clearly on your head in this case. You were flagged, which means you have given consent to be attacked. Attackers have no way of knowing if you want to fight or not, and by being flagged, you were loudly proclaiming to the world "I want to PvP" Thats exactly right. Instead of hanging around in the tunnels, he should have left, got rid of the flag and came back. If you don't want to PVP. Don't hang around a "contested" type area with it on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DomiSotto Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 (edited) Actually, clicking on the toggle while you have a flag active tells you exactly what you need to do (remain in safe area for a bit). Having it turn on and off at moments notice is just a recipe for abuse. It is perfectly logical. Entering GSF or WZ is a way around the rules, and slight abuse of the system, but so minor that BW does not consider it as a priority to fix. Having a person to wait for that long in a safe zone is unreasonable. The strongholds facilitate getting to the safe zone, and returning back to where you were. However, it takes 10 seconds to flag for PvP when entering a wrong area, it takes one click on a flagged player. But it takes moving and waiting for 5 minutes to unflag. That's a huge discrepancy in how easy it is to express consent to PvP and how much efforts it takes to withdraw this consent. Edited February 12, 2016 by DomiSotto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aries_cz Posted February 12, 2016 Share Posted February 12, 2016 Having a person to wait for that long in a safe zone is unreasonable. The strongholds facilitate getting to the safe zone, and returning back to where you were. However, it takes 10 seconds to flag for PvP when entering a wrong area, it takes one click on a flagged player. But it takes moving and waiting for 5 minutes to unflag. That's a huge discrepancy in how easy it is to express consent to PvP and how much efforts it takes to withdraw this consent. It doesn't take one click on a player. You actually need to do something to the said player. Also, you are given huge warning text you are entering hostile territory, and more than enough time to turn around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts