ERIC: Founder Unsub'g - BW broke it's promise to casual players

[mrsrachelm]

The big promo push for KotFE was a return to story and companions were going to be made to count as the second person in order to be able to do H2+ content which is basically REQUIRED as a grind once you hit the expansion content. They got us happy, brought back a lot of players and got a lot of new subs and returning subs because this was exactly what people had been begging for. People were spreading the word and and the vast majority of us were beyond thrilled to be able to take play at our own pace, at whatever time of day or night we had available, and not have that ruined for lack of grouping or by groups simply wanting to rush through the heroics as fast as possible skipping as much as they possibly could and freaking out if you dared to want to actually listen to the "talking heads" because you enjoyed it. BW got our money in their hot little hands...instant gratification.

 

Then on Tuesday the took it away with one HUGE freaking nerf from Hades to the companions that made all that fun game play available. They went back on their promise. By a lot.

 

I unsubbed today. BW has until my remaining time to address their mistake, admit they are in error and FIX the companions by a LOT or I will not renew my sub. I dislike being lied to.

[bseefeldt]

The big promo push for KotFE was a return to story and companions were going to be made to count as the second person in order to be able to do H2+ content which is basically REQUIRED as a grind once you hit the expansion content. They got us happy, brought back a lot of players and got a lot of new subs and returning subs because this was exactly what people had been begging for. People were spreading the word and and the vast majority of us were beyond thrilled to be able to take play at our own pace, at whatever time of day or night we had available, and not have that ruined for lack of grouping or by groups simply wanting to rush through the heroics as fast as possible skipping as much as they possibly could and freaking out if you dared to want to actually listen to the "talking heads" because you enjoyed it. BW got our money in their hot little hands...instant gratification.

 

Then on Tuesday the took it away with one HUGE freaking nerf from Hades to the companions that made all that fun game play available. They went back on their promise. By a lot.

 

I unsubbed today. BW has until my remaining time to address their mistake, admit they are in error and FIX the companions by a LOT or I will not renew my sub. I dislike being lied to.

 

I did also ! for very similar reasons

[Hebruixe]

Have you actually tested the changes? Or are you just reacting to patch notes? Because it's really not as bad as people are making it out to be. The heroics are still totally soloable.

[hadoken]

I think the thing that irks me more than the actual power level of the companions now (which admittedly I haven't played enough post patch to make an accurate judgement on) is the complete lack of communication until the patch almost dropped to even bother telling anyone anything. It's been a month since launch, they can't possible expect people to assume they've been playing a broken/wrongly intended game the entire time with ZERO communication.

 

I wonder had the data mining business not shown up if they would have bothered to post anything at all prior to the patch.

[-Spc]

Have you actually tested the changes? Or are you just reacting to patch notes? Because it's really not as bad as people are making it out to be. The heroics are still totally soloable.

No they are not.

I tried with my shadow 224/220 gear, belsavis star fotress is not soloable, i used heroic moment ( all 8 abilities ) and all that i have, can't do it, so i abandoned the whole mission.

Companion i used was Nadia Grell, level 30 as a healer.

Edited November 18, 2015 by -Spc

[HarleysRule]

There's already a decently sized thread on page one for cancelling feedback. I guess special snowflakes (especially founders LOL) think what they have to say is so special, they need their own thread...

[mrsrachelm]

Have you actually tested the changes? Or are you just reacting to patch notes? Because it's really not as bad as people are making it out to be. The heroics are still totally soloable.

 

I played all last night after the patch. I started with the lowest level planets and worked my way up. Once I hit upper level planets like Belsavis etc it became a HUGE PITA. It was a grind to begin with but it was made bearable by having great healing companions. Now it's just slogging through knee-deep mud which makes the grind even more tedious than it already was. It sucked the joy right out of it completely. I actually had MORE trouble at my level of 65 than I did prior to the expansion with "normal" companions at the proper level for the planet who I could tweak stats etc.

Edited November 18, 2015 by mrsrachelm

[Krenzikai]

There's already a decently sized thread on page one for cancelling feedback. I guess special snowflakes (especially founders LOL) think what they have to say is so special, they need their own thread...

 

Well, the special snowflakes who want forced grouping and demanded the nerf made scores of threads--featuring the same cast of elite godlike gamergods screaming for the nerf. It worked for them? Why's that okay and this not?

 

To the OP: I played on my tank juggernaut this morning after getting off work--my first time after the nerf. Said toon rolls in 216 gear mostly with 220 boots. I kept Lana on healing mode like before to see what would happen. So far, after the Voss and Korriban heroics the experience was pretty much the same as before the nerf. Bear in mind my gear rating and the fact Lana had 27 influence. For a 50% nerf her heals were, at least based on the visual ticks, doing about 10% of what they were before. Levelling players and those with low influence on their toons are probably getting hosed. From what I've seen DPS specced characters probably are also getting plowed by this pandering.

[mrsrachelm]

There's already a decently sized thread on page one for cancelling feedback. I guess special snowflakes (especially founders LOL) think what they have to say is so special, they need their own thread...

 

Awww, needed to get your troll-badge today did you? Glad to be of service, then.

[mrsrachelm]

Well, the special snowflakes who want forced grouping and demanded the nerf made scores of threads--featuring the same cast of elite godlike gamergods screaming for the nerf. It worked for them? Why's that okay and this not?

 

To the OP: I played on my tank juggernaut this morning after getting off work--my first time after the nerf. Said toon rolls in 216 gear mostly with 220 boots. I kept Lana on healing mode like before to see what would happen. So far, after the Voss and Korriban heroics the experience was pretty much the same as before the nerf. Bear in mind my gear rating and the fact Lana had 27 influence. For a 50% nerf her heals were, at least based on the visual ticks, doing about 10% of what they were before. Levelling players and those with low influence on their toons are probably getting hosed. From what I've seen DPS specced characters probably are also getting plowed by this pandering.

 

You are exactly right. I play DPS toons because I like them. I don't do OP's etc so I don't get all decked out in high end gear all augmented to heck. Yes, I'm getting plowed, lol. I not a super-player but I'm certainly not a total slouch either. The healing mode for the companions needed "tweaked" not gutted.

[EightSided]

Have you actually tested the changes? Or are you just reacting to patch notes? Because it's really not as bad as people are making it out to be. The heroics are still totally soloable.

 

Really? Try Star Fortress and let me know how you do...XD

 

Planetary HEROICS are still easy if you've leveled correctly. If your not 5 or 6 levels higher than the planet your on, you've done something wrong. That's just doing HEROICS and the main quest lines.

 

Its the higher end stuff that's driving people away. Players got sucked back in by all that fun and then when Bioware knee jerked like they always do, those same players are being driven away again. Now we'll get the apology post and nothing will be fixed until the next expansion. Then for a month everything will be fun again until they knee jerk nerf again. See the pattern? Its been going on since beta.

 

This game SHOULD have been WoWs rival. Instead its just a footnote due to inept handling and obvious cash grabs.

[CombatLord]

There's already a decently sized thread on page one for cancelling feedback. I guess special snowflakes (especially founders LOL) think what they have to say is so special, they need their own thread...

 

And I suppose that elitists like you feel so special that you can cry till BW listens to you and ruins the game for alot of other people, the special snowflakes goes both ways.

[PallyHk]

Well, I have a level 65 dps char with 216 gear, level 23 influence Healer comp.

 

I can barely get through the Heroic 2+ missions (I'm not talking about star fortress) which give me the stuff I need for the allience grind. I have to wait for ages between fights to get my defensive cooldowns all off the CD between them.

 

Before KOTFE, my char had 192 gear and Old Quinn healed better. I didn't even have to forcefeed him gifts. So its not me being a bad player, since I never had trouble during Shadow of Revan.

 

I'm not subbing again. I just bought the 60 days for levelling alts, but ... I can't do that now. I don't have the money to do what BW and elitist scum wants, to spluge money into cartel coins, than sell those for credits which I can buy gifts with so I can raise a healer to influence 50 just so I can do content again.

 

Well, they say you get what you pay for . KOTFE is free, and now I am worse off than I was in Shadow of Revan.

Hey BW, just take KOTFE away from me. Put my char at level 60, 192 gear, give me my Old companions back as they were before KOTFE, and I'll be performing better than I do at 5 levels higher. LOL

 

 

 

Best thing at all? With daily 3 hours of play, I am not even sure I can be called a casual!

[SPAMBAM]

Why has there been no further response to the posts on these forums, which have been pouring in over the last several hours?

 

PLAYERS (LIKE ME) ARE UTTERLY PEEVED AT WHAT YOU HAVE DONE!

 

Read this and, like me, shake your head in disbelief.

 

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

 

"One of the things that we felt was really important with Knights of the Fallen Empire was to make it a love letter to all of you, our players. It is your passion and support over the years that has allowed us to go on this incredible journey together.

 

"This year is a big year for Star Wars, and we are truly excited to be a part of it. Our aim is to deliver the best Star Wars RPG experience possible.

 

"...If we hit that bar then we have achieved our mission. Our hearts, our souls, and our love of Star Wars have been poured into this expansion. We hope to see you in Knights of the Fallen Empire, and we believe that this is the story you have been looking for, in a galaxy far, far away.

 

May the Force Be With You."

 

Bruce Maclean

Senior Producer

Edited November 18, 2015 by SPAMBAM

[Neglience]

And I suppose that elitists like you feel so special that you can cry till BW listens to you and ruins the game for alot of other people, the special snowflakes goes both ways.

 

The "please do not nerf companions minority" did cry as loud if not louder than the other "minority". BW clearly does make decisions on forum discussions. A lot of players checked KOTFE for 1-2 weeks and then left, for whatever reasons.

 

And i disagree that KOTFE brought back a lot of players/new players. Server status is pretty much the same as before KOTFE. TORstatus also shows a player decline across the board.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Neglience

[Velgar]

I played all last night after the patch. I started with the lowest level planets and worked my way up. Once I hit upper level planets like Belsavis etc it became a HUGE PITA. It was a grind to begin with but it was made bearable by having great healing companions. Now it's just slogging through knee-deep mud which makes the grind even more tedious than it already was. It sucked the joy right out of it completely. I actually had MORE trouble at my level of 65 than I did prior to the expansion with "normal" companions at the proper level for the planet who I could tweak stats etc.

 

This, so much this. Merc BH in 208/216 with lvl 31 Lana, and this is my experience too. Turned things into a tedious slog for a dps character. Given the number of crates needed to get to lvl 20 alliance base, just not fun. The people crowing over this who seem to have all the time and resources to max themselves out sound just like all those on the wow forums saying things were great and telling people to quit complaining and the complainers were just a minority, then sub numbers came out, lost almost half their subs in a year. Guess they were not a minority after all. Likely will be the same here. Telling people they suck and to L2P while calling them cry babies, carebears etc will not keep them subbed, less subs=less resources=less new content. Need to remember that when they are telling people to unsub and leave the game.

[Jedi_riches]

Why has there been no further response to the posts on these forums, which have been pouring in over the last several hours?

 

PLAYERS (LIKE ME) ARE UTTERLY PEEVED AT WHAT YOU HAVE DONE!

 

Read this and, like me, shake your head in disbelief.

 

Well to be fair its like the middle of the night in America.

[Pavijan]

Heroic star Fortresses are not required for Alliance grind.

You can do only the planetary heroics and not set a foot in SF, and you will gain crates and increase your companion influence by that.

 

Also, the only bit of "story" you can get with them are those 6 generic companions that you get by doing them, and if you really want those you can find that ONE player to group with you for each of them.

No it's not hard to find that one player for SF. Finding more than 3 players for anything is hard to find, finding one isn't.

After you get them you don't need to do a single one.

 

Also, REAL casual player doesn't care about some arbitrary grind to get his companion to 50 influence, or Star fortresses or Operations. He just wants to see the story and have fun. Now he can do both.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Pavijan

[Kallaes]

Have you actually tested the changes? Or are you just reacting to patch notes? Because it's really not as bad as people are making it out to be. The heroics are still totally soloable.

 

That is going to depend a lot on character and legacy. I'm a casual player. I will occasionally PUG a tactical but it is rare. I won't PUG hard mode or ops because I don't want to be a burden on the other people in the group. I don't have most of the datacrons but do have all class story completed and had the original companions story lines completed prior to 4.0.

 

I ran the heroics for Ord Mantell, Coruscant, and Repulbic side Nar Shaddaa and Correllia last night with a gunslinger and Senya at about level 27 influence set for heals. What I found was that they were tedious. They were not hard or challenging. The most notable change was that, prior to the patch, if I took a damage spike Senya could heal me back up and now she can't. If I wanted to, I could take a chance slipping between two groups because, if I aggro'd them both, I could deal with it. Now, because Senya can't heal the spike damage, I can't risk getting aggro on a second group.

 

A new player without any legacy perks or money bag character that can fund them who is then stuck with a low influence companion? Wouldn't want to be that player.

Edited November 18, 2015 by Kallaes

[SteveTheCynic]

You are exactly right. I play DPS toons because I like them. I don't do OP's etc so I don't get all decked out in high end gear all augmented to heck. Yes, I'm getting plowed, lol. I not a super-player but I'm certainly not a total slouch either. The healing mode for the companions needed "tweaked" not gutted.

I have 208/216/220 gear. I have never set foot in even one Operation. What are you doing with your various data crystals? Why aren't you spending them at the vendors on Fleet to buy 208+ gear? And augmenting gear doesn't require Ops either. My gear isn't *all* augmented, but it isn't all unaugmented either. (The augs I have are the ones I can easily make, 208.)

[SteveTheCynic]

Well, I have a level 65 dps char with 216 gear, level 23 influence Healer comp.

 

I can barely get through the Heroic 2+ missions (I'm not talking about star fortress) which give me the stuff I need for the allience grind. I have to wait for ages between fights to get my defensive cooldowns all off the CD between them.

If you can't get through planetary H2+ missions with 216 gear, well, quite frankly, you suck.

 

Unless you mean just the very highest-level ones. (I haven't tried the Pub Corellia ones yet.) You should be able to sleepwalk through e.g. the Ord Mantell and Coruscant ones with that kind of gear.

[ryoutou]

I was one of the first 50s when we were playing builds that had no chapter 3, so I always thought the founder title was a little funny

 

Anyway, I have that title and have been subbed a lot of the time from launch till now, CE holder blah blah blah.

 

I'm perfectly happy to stay subscribed. I think the OP companions should have been caught in testing, but hey. The result of this adjustment just isn't all that awful - the companions are still far stronger than they have been in the past. The content is still pretty easy. True, soloing heroic SF with no buffs on a new 65 is pretty tough, but if I can manage it anyone can. And its easy to either use the buff, grab a friend or any number of things to mitigate.

Edited November 18, 2015 by ryoutou

[SGMRock]

I don't get why Bioware team on this game has to always knee jerk reaction to everything. They need to learn how to gradually tweak play balance. I see all kinds of threads about people saying they can still complete all the stuff and don't see much difference but most of them are either dps that play classes like Jug/Guardian or VG/PT type dps with lost of cooldowns and heavy armor. I have seem guys that play more squishy DPS saying they can't do it anymore. I have not seen one healer say they could still do them with a DPS companion.

 

I did a Star Fortress H2 yesterday and did it ok with my Guardian DPS using a level 50 companion on tank for some and then healer for the end part. I had to use the buffs from the start of it as well , not sure I could do it without those anymore so how will ppl get that achievement? Glad I got it already. I used all the 4 special buffs as well. I used Heroic Moment a few times also. It required some skill but totally doable. Definitely more tedious which is not good considering what a grind the alliance system is. Now I wonder if I did that same thing with say a Sage DPS or Sage healer could I stay alive? I have not leveled or geared min yet. I have my scoundrel healer though that is 216 set bonus geared so I will have to try that today.

 

I am a bit annoyed though that in the developers blog they put this http://www.swtor.com/info/news/blog/20151020-0 :

The Star Fortress comes in two difficulty modes, Solo and Heroic.

 

The Solo difficulty mode for every planet's Star Fortress is available when players complete Knights of the Fallen Empire Chapter IX, as soon as they pick up the “Battle for the Stars” Mission. This mode is intended for a solo player and their Companion.

The Heroic difficulty mode for a given planet's Star Fortress is unlocked by completing the planetary resistance Mission arc for that planet. This mode is intended for groups of 2 players (with their respective Companions). That being said, it is possible for a solo player to complete Heroic mode, provided that player has a high-rank Companion, and has built Influence with their Alliance specialists (as this unlocks access to various usable objects within the Heroic mode that provide powerful buffs and additional abilities).

 

So far I can't dispute this but maybe someone with some squishy dps and a level 50 influence companion can. Either way they went too far on this nerf they should have done it in smaller steps, re-evaluate and then tweak again ect....

[mrsrachelm]

I have 208/216/220 gear. I have never set foot in even one Operation. What are you doing with your various data crystals? Why aren't you spending them at the vendors on Fleet to buy 208+ gear? And augmenting gear doesn't require Ops either. My gear isn't *all* augmented, but it isn't all unaugmented either. (The augs I have are the ones I can easily make, 208.)

 

I'm in 208 gear mainly on my two Alliance leveled toons. Not even doing this grind on my other alts....sheesh. Which, as a side note, pisses me off because I really LIKE some of them but the grind...good gawd...the grind.

 

But I am in 208's. But you know that getting into 220's which is the gear I'd actually need to not be quite so squishy isn't even gonna happen unless I want to grind OP's and I do not have the time or the guild for that. The crystals needed to purchase that gear only come from the Hard Mode FP's and OP's. So....as a casual...I R Screwed.

Edited November 18, 2015 by mrsrachelm

[Khiriath]

Heroic star Fortresses are not required for Alliance grind.

You can do only the planetary heroics and not set a foot in SF, and you will gain crates and increase your companion influence by that.

 

Also, the only bit of "story" you can get with them are those 6 generic companions that you get by doing them, and if you really want those you can find that ONE player to group with you for each of them.

No it's not hard to find that one player for SF. Finding more than 3 players for anything is hard to find, finding one isn't.

After you get them you don't need to do a single one.

 

Also, REAL casual player doesn't care about some arbitrary grind to get his companion to 50 influence, or Star fortresses or Operations. He just wants to see the story and have fun. Now he can do both.

 

Star Fortress[Heroic 2]

Eric wrote:

Absolutely! It certainly may be a bit more challenging than before but you can complete them. The intent is that you can complete any [Heroic 2] with your Companion counting as one of the two. If you find this isn't true for any Heroics tomorrow, let us know.

-eric

 

The word any there is pretty definitive and inclusive. So what you are seeing are those who can't do it lodging the requested complaint. Personally I think they should all put in tickets to customer service as well, and if they are too introverted even call customer service and make a formal complaint. There is an explicit promise there that many felt has not been upheld.

 

I cleared the Star Fortress H2 last night, first thing I did when I came online to see how bad it was, using the criteria for the <One For All> achievement, and had a parser running. I welcome you to look through the logs. At no time did Lana's(Rank 21) Heals per second break 1000, while as a DPS spec Advanced Prototype Powertech I was hitting upward of 500 heals per second. I know they wanted the average player to be better than a comp. I get that. The average player easily puts out 5k HPS, and knows well enough not to stand in circles of impending doom and get toasted.

 

I'm not a casual player by any stretch of the imagination, I openly admit that, I've run with some of best raiding guilds in the game, and I put out currently 7.2k DPS on a Dummy and 5.5-7.9k actual in Raid boss fights(depending on the boss). I'm running in 216-224 gear, all set bonus and optimized. I don't see how a casual player is really supposed to do this.

 

Yeah I like a challenge but this is ridiculous.