Beohbe Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 You get the point. I'm really surprised this is sinking to page 2 considering all the salt over the companion nerf. This thread proves that the amount that Bioware nerfed companions by was based on faulty data due to Biowares own incompetence. Is it the long, somewhat confusing title of the thread? Or maybe there's a lot a wet-eyed players silently swapping weapons on their companions and hoping this thread disappears, lol... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geschmonz Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 So let me get this right: You just need to equip a high level weapon to your companion, and it is going to perform better? What a ridiculous bug is that? Is Bioware ever going to doing it right? They just would have to act as if the companion would have the highest weapon available and not give players the need to really equip the best gear to a companion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 I reported this bug back when I was arguing about people calling them OP and arguing, which is one of the reasons why I was asking for parses on companions and asking which they were using for a weapon on said companion. It only ever affected weapon damage, however it did make possible those 30k, 40k, 50k hits people were seeing. To give you an idea of the effect, it is basically the same as if a player could put 2 hilts or barrels into their main hand, and have that instantly double their weapon damage stat (remember, weapon damage is only based on the hilt or barrel rating). That of course would multiply into much more of an increase in your actual skills, simply because most attacks follow a M * (weapon damage) + C formula for determining damage done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beohbe Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 So let me get this right: You just need to equip a high level weapon to your companion, and it is going to perform better? What a ridiculous bug is that? Is Bioware ever going to doing it right? They just would have to act as if the companion would have the highest weapon available and not give players the need to really equip the best gear to a companion. You could give them a weapon with an item rating of 8, and it will increase damage slightly, or you could give them a 220 weapon and increase their damage by about 40%. And apparently, before today's patch, this also effected healing. Which is what they nerfed. Because comps were performing better than they expected... Because of this bug. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beohbe Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 I reported this bug back when I was arguing about people calling them OP and arguing, which is one of the reasons why I was asking for parses on companions and asking which they were using for a weapon on said companion. It only ever affected weapon damage, however it did make possible those 30k, 40k, 50k hits people were seeing. To give you an idea of the effect, it is basically the same as if a player could put 2 hilts or barrels into their main hand, and have that instantly double their weapon damage stat (remember, weapon damage is only based on the hilt or barrel rating). That of course would multiply into much more of an increase in your actual skills, simply because most attacks follow a M * (weapon damage) + C formula for determining damage done. Ah, so it's always just been damage? Op claimed otherwise. Interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bachannal Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 How dare you! Mr. Metrics can't be wrong! This has been proven over the years! Even though I know you're being sarcastic...you'd be amazed how many companies rely on metrics for everything, but how FEW companies know when to listen to user base and understand metrics do not always equal customer satisfaction. I have worked for two rather large, well known data driven tech companies. One listened to users. The other, not so much. One had insanely high customer satisfaction rates, the other not so much...I'm sure I don't have to explain which one was which. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geschmonz Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 (edited) So here we are.. with a metric and a bug that took away the ability of thousands of solo players to play their content. What if bioware would give a shiz about the metric, fix the bug, and allow those players to play their content again? And if i say "fix the bug", i mean a hotfix for today... Edited November 18, 2015 by geschmonz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SableShrike Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 (edited) FWIW, after some active playing (finally got in after disabling BitRaider last night), my DPS set companions feel just about right. With a 186 green comm hilt, my 27 rank Kira is hitting just below me when doing level scaled stuff on Alderaan. She hits for more than me at full 65, but not a crazy high amount much more than me (like she was pre-4.0.2). I've yet to get any of the Ops ranked gear, so that seems right too. Considering that your companions all come with standard or modded gear, it's highly likely that Bioware DID balance around this stuff as a guide for their adjustments. It's more likely their testers had random drops or modded starting gear on companions than it is they had naked Cartel Market stuff. So yeah, my DPS companions feel fine with a hilt in place. Definitely not OP now, but effective. Have to do more testing on the Tank or Healing stances, but i can see Tank being better with this due to their damage/heal strike. Edited November 18, 2015 by SableShrike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tobero Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 I think I used this bug, too. Unintentionally and without noticing. I gave my comp a modded lightsaber, leveled to 50 and could solo the exarch with practically 100% health at all times - even after a full hit of impaling strikes. Of course I initially thought nerfing the comps is not that bad a idea but seeing it in light of this bug it's a different matter alltogether. Unfortunately I can't verify it because my launcher insists on reinstalling THE WHOLE FREAKING GAME after yesterdays messed up patching. Thanks a lot for ruining not one but two whole days of paid sub. But I guess this is off topic now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Ah, so it's always just been damage? Op claimed otherwise. Interesting. Yes, just weapon damage on the main hand from what I remember, but I was also having issues with Force/Tech power being zeroed out on the character sheet because of no offhand... you know the old offhand inspection bug looked like it was leaking through to your own companion's character sheet. So it's possible it could have been, but I can't say I seen anything that would indicate hilt/barrel changes impacted healing such that couldn't be explained by minor stat changes or RNG. But it definitely impacted their damage dealt, with a 216 hilt, Kira came close to exceeding what I could do in 208 gear, I really had to push myself to keep up with her. With the green hilt Kira originally came with, I easily do twice the dps she did even though I was in the same 208 gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PallyHk Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Well, I have a level 65 dps char with 216 gear, level 23 influence Healer comp. I can barely get through the Heroic 2+ missions (I'm not talking about star fortress) which give me the stuff I need for the allience grind. I have to wait for ages between fights to get my defensive cooldowns all off the CD between them. Before KOTFE, my char had 192 gear and Old Quinn healed better. I didn't even have to forcefeed him gifts. So its not me being a bad player, since I never had trouble during Shadow of Revan. I'm not subbing again. I just bought the 60 days for levelling alts, but ... I can't do that now. I don't have the money to do what BW and elitist scum wants, to spluge money into cartel coins, than sell those for credits which I can buy gifts with so I can raise a healer to influence 50 just so I can do content again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorrdan Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 So if i give a customized weapon to KIRA i would be able to solo heroics 2+ again? she is rank 8. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sunyavadin Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 I figured this was going to be why the nerf was so drastic. All my comps were geared with 192 mod gear before 4.0 and most of them kept that gear (With a couple of exceptions who cannot use those weapon types any more, like Jorgan losing his assault cannon, and Jaesa losing the ability to use 1h sabers) - as a result I, and most other players I've been playing with for a few years, who had our companions geared up from when companion gear MATTERED, had insanely powerful companions under 4.0... I suspect whatever generic gear the devs spawn in for testers was similarly modded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zenislav Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 I dont really post on forums but dam they need to see this. If weapons affected both dmg and healing pre fix patch than nerf to companions was way to big indeed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarleysRule Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 (edited) This is why I didn't care about missing out on early access...because it was just really open beta, and **** like this would happen. Unfortunately, they didn't get it fixed before "official" release, and have now alienated players that thought the game was simpleton easy first, and now not only took away easy mode (which always causes rage), apparently made it unnecessarily hard. Most of us probably saw this coming, but it's still hilarious and maddening at the same time. Edited November 18, 2015 by HarleysRule Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zenislav Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 REAL IMPORTANT Did some minor testing on Tythoon as lvl 65 and something is real messed up. Even more than i thought it would be. Will show screenshots below but first to write stats and 3 diferent weapons. Testing: 1: Orange weapon - no mods inside, fresh from collections - Companion DMG: 125 - 148 / Blast DMG: 728 - 794 2: Orange weapon - lvl 26 blue barrel, power rating 80 - Companion DMG: 140 - 176 / Blast DMG: 979 - 1258 3: Orange weapon - lvl 48 green barrel, power rating 122 - Companion DMG: 135 - 166 / Blast DMG: 1341 - 1928 As you can see barrels or should I say weapon dmg does change companions dmg. It also changes their skill dmg by quite a lot without needing to dismiss and re summon them! As i mentioned above something is really messed up with companion weapons and how they influence dmg. It also influenced healing pre fix patch. So nerfing companions while they were buged was worst possible thing to do! Screenshots: 1: http://s29.postimg.org/nlfh3addz/Prvi.jpg 2: http://s17.postimg.org/79q23imnz/Drugi.jpg 3: http://s21.postimg.org/5z7z72s47/Treci.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tobero Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 REAL IMPORTANT Did some minor testing on Tythoon as lvl 65 and something is real messed up. Even more than i thought it would be. Will show screenshots below but first to write stats and 3 diferent weapons. Testing: 1: Orange weapon - no mods inside, fresh from collections - Companion DMG: 125 - 148 / Blast DMG: 728 - 794 2: Orange weapon - lvl 26 blue barrel, power rating 80 - Companion DMG: 140 - 176 / Blast DMG: 979 - 1258 3: Orange weapon - lvl 48 green barrel, power rating 122 - Companion DMG: 135 - 166 / Blast DMG: 1341 - 1928 As you can see barrels or should I say weapon dmg does change companions dmg. It also changes their skill dmg by quite a lot without needing to dismiss and re summon them! As i mentioned above something is really messed up with companion weapons and how they influence dmg. It also influenced healing pre fix patch. So nerfing companions while they were buged was worst possible thing to do! Screenshots: 1: http://s29.postimg.org/nlfh3addz/Prvi.jpg 2: http://s17.postimg.org/79q23imnz/Drugi.jpg 3: http://s21.postimg.org/5z7z72s47/Treci.jpg Did you check if it really changes the damage your comp actually deals? Could be they just forgot to update the tool tip. On second thought... that is giving them too much credit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zenislav Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Did you check if it really changes the damage your comp actually deals? Could be they just forgot to update the tool tip. On second thought... that is giving them too much credit Hm true mate. Just checked and looks like tooltip bug. He did same dmg regardless of weapon. Guess i was to hasty with assumption. But need to test it in lvl 65 zone when I am not synced to planet lvl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 (edited) Hm true mate. Just checked and looks like tooltip bug. He did same dmg regardless of weapon. Guess i was to hasty with assumption. But need to test it in lvl 65 zone when I am not synced to planet lvl. Try a flashpoint, CZ labs has a nice easy group of trash at the start you can test on. You won't be level synced and mobs have a decent chunk of hp compared to elsewhere. It's also easy to walk out, reset instance, and repeat. PS. should add, testing it in a level syncing area is pointless, their stats are capped just like yours is. Edited November 18, 2015 by Draqsko Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdreanKael Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Ok just checked something with Kira on my guardian. In a level synced state (level synced to 62 on yavin 4) Re-summoning her with a CUSTOM dual saber with NO HILT, NO MODS, NO CRYSTAL her dmg is 1648-1666 with 2017 bonus dmg. Bonus healing is 1438. With a Custom dualsaber with a 178 HILT, 178 Mods and a +41 power crystal, and re-summoning her her dmg is 1648-1666 with 2017 bonus dmg and bonus healing is 1438. Now I noticed that when summoning her her stats are lower just before my buffs apply to her. In a non level synced area (my strong hold) with the Custom dual saber without mods her dmg is 1964 to 1982 with 2342 bonus dmg. Now upon initial summoning in a level synced area (same place yavin 4 level synced to 62) with a non modded custom dual saber or the modded custom dual saber, her stats are weird. Her dmg is 1934-2107 with 1901 bonus dmg and only 1306 bonus healing. Re-summoning her after changing weapons does nothing to the dmg or healing but when my buffs are applied to her her stats revert to the 1648-1666 dmg with 2017 bonus dmg and 1438 bonus healing. Something is bad wrong in the companion department, and the devs need to look into this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AetherShanty Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 *gives Theron 216 mainhand blaster* Ohhh, so it does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agradas Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Would you describe this problem in the bug report section, please? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draqsko Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Would you describe this problem in the bug report section, please? People submitted tickets about this bug weeks ago when 4.0 was in early access. It was literally discovered 2 or 3 days after 4.0. Pretty sure they are aware of the bug and have been. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-JE-BLAZAR- Posted November 18, 2015 Author Share Posted November 18, 2015 Bumping again because this is impotant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beohbe Posted November 18, 2015 Share Posted November 18, 2015 Would you describe this problem in the bug report section, please? Hmm, it seems this thread has been moved to bug reports. So now there's no need! I would love to see an official response to this bug. Now that I know of it, will Bioware be considering banning me for exploiting? I have no intention of removing Yavin weapons from my comps, cluttering up my already full bank inv, simply because they can't even code the game the way they intended to. I realize their policy of not openly discussing exploitable bugs, and it makes sense to me, but this rivals 2 other bugs I can think of in the past that Bioware started taking action on after they became public knowledge. How exactly would they go about determining who equipped a weapon on their comp that has stats knowing it would give them an advantage? Will this just be silently swept under the rug and quietly hotfixed? Without an admission on their part that it had an effect on the recent companion nerf? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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