RavageXX Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 (edited) Because, true to any group event with a competitive element involved, the people are too frequently divided by their desire to obtain what they want in order to win, or keep what they need in order to win. It creates enough of a divide that no matter what you do, you're still going to be making a large chunk of the community angry. How does this in any way shape or form have any bearing on the decision to not add anything meaningful to PvP? There are no new maps, no new game modes..... Are there are any plans at all for that to change? I haven't read a thing, if so. I'm not talking about balancing, that's a whole different kettle of fish... I'm talking about PvP content. I assume the OP was referring to that, as well. Edited November 1, 2015 by RavageXX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mourkoth Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 How does this in any way shape or form have any bearing on the decision to not add anything meaningful to PvP? No new maps, for one. I'm not talking about balancing, that's a whole different kettle of fish... I'm talking about PvP content. I assume the OP was referring to that, as well. Because it's entirely possible to make everyone angry with hastily designed new content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X_Vindictuz_X Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 I'd encourage to go check out the server status for European servers currently to see all the PVE servers dominating... TOFN is standard but that is quite possibly the largest PVP population the game. North America PVP servers are wastelands. People need to stop saying PVE servers are booming and PVP are dead I mean we know why but do you? It's because almost every single PVPer has xfer red because bioware refuses to come to the 21st century and do Xserver. Also pvp server is strictly for open world all pvp is instances based and has nothing to do with which server your on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaryk Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 Because it's entirely possible to make everyone angry with hastily designed new content. Then it shouldn't be hastily designed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erasimus Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 I agree that PvP should be a priority and there are probably a lot more people that play instanced PvP than most PVE'er would excpect. The PvP maps should also be much easier to create than FPs and certainly easier than OPs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lunafox Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 I don't care for pvp at all myself. If they took it out of the game completely, I wouldn't miss it. I resent the idea that if I want certain comps for my alliance, that I have to pvp for them. I resent anything that tries to make me, or incite me to do something I don't want to do. If I wanted pvp, I'd be on a pvp server. I tried that for the first 4 months of my time here and I hated the experience. I don't care to repeat it. There is nothing that the company can do to make me pvp here, it's just not going to happen. If they took all my beloved things/comps/people/pets/homes and put it behind pvp, well, I'd leave, simple as that, because I'm not going to torture myself, when the idea is to have fun. I came for the story, I stay for the story, I live for the story. When there is no story I make up my own stories. I think it's fine as it is, where pvp is a sidecar for those who'd like to do it. I have no issue with them adding a few new sidecars now and then, so long as story is the priority. Sorry to rain on your parade OP, but this is how I feel about things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RavageXX Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 Because it's entirely possible to make everyone angry with hastily designed new content. Why would it be hastily designed if it was on their radar as priority? Your whole argument makes no sense to me... Anything hastily designed is going to annoy a lot of people, regardless of it was PvP or PVE.... Do a shim shod job and people who take part in the content are going to notice.... I don't think anyone here was advocating for Bioware to slap together something in a week or 2 and throw it at us and be like "there's your new PvP content, see? We care! Now shut up and enjoy this crap." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scinald Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 I actually can't figure out why they won't add a few new PvP maps into the rotation. PvP is basically self-generating (i.e. user created) content and is very cost effective considering the resources needed to manage it. Generating story is very expensive in comparison and not sustainable without a large paying base. As to the "PvP is dead" argument, worth noting as other have that low pop PvP servers simply means that the rule sets for those servers are unappealing not that people don't enjoy PvP or enjoy the form of PvP they can get on PvE servers where they can also PvE when they don't feel like killing people in the face. Also worth noting that nobody here actually knows what "the metrics" are. At best, you know what BW has told you "the metrics" are. I do not doubt that the PvP population is smaller than the PvE population, but then again so is the "hard core" progression raider population. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheSeer Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 (edited) I think pvp should get some new stuff but no way should it be there main focus of the game. One there is a lot better PVP game out there and from what I'v seen PVP is a small part of the overall population. You say it can be done over and over again, sure but other people repeat other content. Some people do operations over and over. While other run alt after alt through the story. I for one PVP on occasion but focus mostly on doing story content. They need to take turn working on all aspect of the game but I strongly believe that more people are here for the story then pvp. So investing in PVP might not be a good idea if only a fraction of your players engage it a lot. Of course I could be wrong as i have no way of knowing how many people do what. Edited November 1, 2015 by TheSeer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ascensionthree Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 Are you new to mmos or something, OP? Most mmo players regard PvP with disdain and fear. A constantly changing environment that introduces tons and tons of new variables is something that most are not ok with. MMO devs have and always will cater to "carebears" and "dragonslayers" for most decently sized mmos. I can see a lot of them looking at your title and actually laughing out loud. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mourkoth Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 (edited) Why would it be hastily designed if it was on their radar as priority? Your whole argument makes no sense to me... Anything hastily designed is going to annoy a lot of people, regardless of it was PvP or PVE.... Do a shim shod job and people who take part in the content are going to notice.... I don't think anyone here was advocating for Bioware to slap together something in a week or 2 and throw it at us and be like "there's your new PvP content, see? We care! Now shut up and enjoy this crap." Takes more than a week to just 'slap it together'. New content can take upwards to months to 'slap together', and that's if you're not reusing enough assets to make it look dangerously similar to something from before. That's what I'm talking about - if the developers dropped what they were doing any made PvP a priority right at this very moment, we'd either receive content that we don't like at a time we want, or receive content we like but not at a time that we want. Either way, PvP still continues to suffer since it wasn't prioritized. Edited November 1, 2015 by Mourkoth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DariusCalera Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 (edited) Yup, and POT5 is the most populated server out of them all, because PvP is so much more popular than PvE content. I'm guessing that you've no real idea why that is. Most PvPers, other than the die hard gankers, really don't go out looking to kill players that are lower level than them. Open world PvP with no purpose does not appeal to very many people. As to why the PvE servers have a larger population, that is actually fairly simple. The larger the population, the more people that are going to participate in WZs and Ranked PvP. If a player wants to participate they will move to the server where they will have the shortest que times for both. TBH, if the que times on an RP server were less than 2 minutes 24 hours a day you would see the PvPers there and Rp server population would explode. Does that mean that the RP type server is the most popular? Yes, but it wouldn't be for the storylines and the RP aspect. Edited November 1, 2015 by DariusCalera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RavageXX Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 Takes more than a week to just 'slap it together'. New content can take upwards to months to 'slap together', and that's if you're not reusing enough assets to make it look dangerously similar to something from before. That's what I'm talking about - if the developers dropped what they were doing any made PvP a priority right at this very moment, we'd either receive content that we don't like at a time we want, or receive content we like but not at a time that we want. Either way, PvP still continues to suffer since it wasn't prioritized, warranting a thread like this. I think you need to re-read my post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mourkoth Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 (edited) I'm guessing that you've no real idea why that is. Most PvPers, other than the die had gankers, really don't go out looking to kill players that are lower level than them. Open world PvP with no purpose does not appeal to very many people. As to why the PvE servers have a larger population, that is actually fairly simple. The larger the population, the more people that are going to participate in WZs and Ranked PvP. If a player wants to participate they will move to the server where they will have the shortest que times for both. TBH, if the que times on an RP server were less than 2 minutes 24 hours a day you would see the PvPers there and Rp server population would explode. Does that mean that the RP type server is the most popular? Yes, but it wouldn't be for the storylines and the RP aspect. Or, perhaps...just maybe....the populations of those servers consist largely of people interested in PvE and RP? I'd need to see some solid statistics to prove that the servers you're suggesting aren't sought out for their listed purposes in the server directory. I think you need to re-read my post. I've read through it and I stand by my point, we're at a position where the entire group is already dissatisfied, and attempts at redirecting resources from PvE projects to PvP projects would require far more effort compared to maintaining the priorities as they are, for a crowd that's been in steady decline for some time now. It'd also just leave both sides of the argument angry, since one has been neglected to the point of killing two servers and the other is receiving neglect to feed the other. The PvP community won't ever truly die before the results show, but there really doesn't need to be any sudden changes to the current scope besides a subtle initiation of a few PvP projects that could both repair the currently troubled balance issues in PvP and introduce a few new things in such a way that doesn't tax the rest of the projects currently being worked on. Might take a year, but the current priorities don't need to change dramatically. Edited November 1, 2015 by Mourkoth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albertwang Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 I am frustrated that not more people queue up for ranked pvp on Ebon Hawk. Seriously? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DariusCalera Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 (edited) Or, perhaps...just maybe....the populations of those servers consist largely of people interested in PvE and RP? I'd need to see some solid statistics to prove that the servers you're suggesting aren't sought out for their listed purposes in the server directory. Since there is no cross server PvP, those most interested in it will move to the servers that have the greatest participation in it with the shortest que times. No one is going to stay on a PvP server if the que times are long. It is where players that enjoy that type of play get the most for their money. To think otherwise demostrates a lack of understanding of the PvP community. There have been numerous threads in the PvP forums about how to make getting into PvP, on all servers, a bit more user friendly with ingame tutorials on Bolster, WZs, Expertise, Gearing, and numerous other topics to get more people to particiapte with the least amount of pain involved. As it is, there is still nothing ingame to explain how bolster works or what expertise does. With a little bit more focus on the PvP side of things from the Devs, we might actually see these things so that new players aren't wrecked and to make their PvP experiance a bit more enjoyable. The end result of this would be more people PvPing, and being beneficial to their team, which would mean shorter que times. Edited November 1, 2015 by DariusCalera Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaiderMid Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 I don't pvp. Just don't find stun wars to be an enjoyable activity. More attention should be given to their pvp players. I will agree to that much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mourkoth Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 (edited) Since there is no cross server PvP, those most interested in it will move to the servers that have the greatest participation in it with the shortest que times. No one is going to stay on a PvP server if the que times are long. It is where players that enjoy that type of play get the most for their money. To think otherwise demostrates a lack of understanding of the PvP community. There have been numerous threads in the PvP forums about how to make getting into PvP, on all servers, a bit more user friendly with ingame tutorials on Bolster, WZs, Expertise, Gearing, and numerous other topics to get more people to particiapte with the least amount of pain involved. As it is, there is still nothing ingame to explain how bolster works or what expertise does. With a little bit more focus on the PvP side of things from the Devs, we might actually see these things so that new players aren't wrecked and to make their PvP experiance a bit more enjoyable. The end result of this would be more people PvPing, and being beneficial to their team, which would mean shorter que times. The PvP community has quite a bit of improving they could be doing as well, seeing as how interactions with the PvP players usually consists of "This is why you should lose" and "You suck because you lost." Edited November 1, 2015 by Mourkoth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asturias Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 No thanks. The majority of players I have talked to in game do not PVP. PVP has absolutely NO interest for me. If you like it, great!! Have a blast. However, if this game had been a PVP game to start, I would never have started playing it. My advice would be, if you want PVP, wait for Battlefront since that is basically PVP only....This game was a PVP game from the start and created some of the best new maps for battle grounds in a long, long time. MOBA games are hot right now because they are PVP oriented but you got MMOs like this game and WOW who have lost sight of that listening to PVE players and than wonder why their subscriptions are falling and the genre is dying. The only game worth any time really is Wildstar in my opinion. They give you pretty much anything these games give you. I am frustrated with SWTOR because the restrictions it has implimented on to PVP along with piss poor management of the priority of PVP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortenpro Posted November 1, 2015 Author Share Posted November 1, 2015 This game was a PVP game from the start and created some of the best new maps for battle grounds in a long, long time. MOBA games are hot right now because they are PVP oriented but you got MMOs like this game and WOW who have lost sight of that listening to PVE players and than wonder why their subscriptions are falling and the genre is dying. The only game worth any time really is Wildstar in my opinion. They give you pretty much anything these games give you. I am frustrated with SWTOR because the restrictions it has implimented on to PVP along with piss poor management of the priority of PVP. Wildstar has a lot of very good solutions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scinald Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 The PvP community has quite a bit of improving they could be doing as well, seeing as how interactions with the PvP players usually consists of "This is why you should lose" and "You suck because you lost." Yes...b/c nobody in PvE has ever been verbally abused or group kicked due to making a mistake or not knowing EXACTLY how the boss fight goes.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mourkoth Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 Yes...b/c nobody in PvE has ever been verbally abused or group kicked due to making a mistake or not knowing EXACTLY how the boss fight goes.... Not with the same unusually high frequency that can be expected from PvP, otherwise I'd be playing PvP instead of PvE. Mess up in a raid and it's just 'You alright, bro?' with only a one-in-a-year "You messed up, bro". ...in PvP it's almost consistently "I hope you enjoy being blocked, because you're a terrible person for not winning the game for us." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uruare Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 I think pacman needs more pvp focus. Clearly, NAMCO screwed up and manufactured total failure when they neglected multiplayer and PVP both in their May 22, 1980 release. Shameful, really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stradlin Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 Hell no, it´s bad enough that we have to PvP to get access to certain companions. PvP in SWTOR has always been a side activity for those that want it. Every single healthy MMO is all about offering a huge pile of different side activities for a very diverse group of people. Ultimately TOR is all about huge collection of different, often overlapping minorities doing their thing. You wanna keep it that way. " I do not care for Activity Y but recognize it as integral part of the game. I see nothing wrong in thought of it getting some attention now, since it has not gotten any in years. " Seriously, above is like bottom tier when it comes to unselfishness. Not. That.Hard. to reach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ricp Posted November 1, 2015 Share Posted November 1, 2015 If you want PVP play another MMO I guess, for me story is the driver I could care less about pvp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts