Galentor Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 I think that companions in their current state are simply broken. Example: my vengeance juggernaut enters a heroic quest area with Vette as healer. Vette gets jumped by half a dozen mobs, continues to heal me for crazy amounts while her HP bar barely moves. I do not even bother to take aggro off her. If this doesn't qualify as broken than i do not know what does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinapus Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 (edited) Let me put it this way, to repeat something I wrote on another thread. After playing for awhile I figured out that equipping my companion as well as or nearly as well as my character was would make the missions easier. So I'd play during the weekend and on weekdays after work I'd have crafting alts make the modifications needed for both my character and whatever companion(s) I'd use with that character so they'd have new gear as they gained levels. Took some effort but it was worth it and my companions were pretty powerful and fights I had problems with on earlier characters were easier with newer ones. This is pre-4.0. As I completed companion conversation paths I got presence bonuses and I unlocked that +100 presence bonus for completing a story with a human character. My companions got pretty powerful. In fact I started noticing that my companions had more health and their base damage/healing was higher than my character did. Pre-4.0 again. Other times, just for giggles I could send my DPS companion in to fight a group of mobs and yes, I did use the hipdip emote before initiating combat and then went on and continued whatever I was doing. Yes, pre-4.0 again. So I read the complaints people have about what companions can do now and think "I could do things like that before 4.0 was implemented" and instead of going "ZOMG! Companions OP! NERF NAOO!!" I think "Hm, they're more powerful than before, AND I don't have to spend hours crafting armoring, mods, enhancements, barrels and so on for them. Yay!" and "Hah! Die, Zinda Kent. DIE!!!" (So I found her annoying pre-4.0...) One could argue that some things need to be tweaked, but I really, really don't trust quite a few of you to give very good advice on how. Perhaps something like that white acute module could be made, or make a toggle that disables all presense bonuses for your character. Maybe even another one that does the same to the legacy datacron unlocks. Of course, even if that was implemented I suspect some of you would still have problems because other people were not using those toggles. Edited October 25, 2015 by Sinapus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crossclaytonwow Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 (edited) Nope, I am a solo player, comps are OP. I don't even need to fight, comp can do everything on its own. I should not need to disable parts of the game to get some kind of challenge. If you dont enjoy leveling, then your option is to get a lvl 60 character. I really dont understand how someone can enjoy a game when there is no risk of dying. There is no risk and reward anymore. I would see an elite and think...oooo a gold medal next to name, lets take it, bit of a challenge. Now its click on attack button for comp and sit back and watch it solo 4 elites while i go make a sandwich. There is no reason the pacing of leveling needs to change, just make it so my health bar is not at 100% all the time. Level sync is irrelevant, why try to cap player level so they dont out lvl content and everything is one hittable, but then have comps that can go chuck norris on everything anyway, even in healer stance. May as well just let players continue to out level the **** out of everything. During 12xp, it was great and you leveled at a good pace with out sacrificing difficulty. You were always at a good lvl and you had to actually use your abilities in fights. I wish they just made it like that, just with the planet story missions included like it is now, with xp paced out accordingly. I have been dismissing my comp while i level, but it comes back after every cutscene or location transition. Gets annoying continuously dismissing it and i cant seem to bind a quick key to dismiss, if anyone knows please let me know. Sending them to craft continuously is also just as annoying. Also, i liked having my comp with me, felt cool to have a partner to cruise the galaxy with, but its just no fun when they are with me now. It was never super hard before 4.0, but at least i actually needed to pay attention. Maybe they could give us a difficulty choice, like they do in Star Trek Online. Or nerf comps but have a button to make them OP again for ppl that want to walk through the game. Or other way round, give us a button, ability or purchasable item to make the comps weaker, kind of like when you could by that item to stop 12xp. Edited October 25, 2015 by crossclaytonwow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jnaathra Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 Keep in mind that some of these "wimps" also help support the game through the cartel market and subs. I'm one of these so called wimps. But if you'd like to insult people and push them away from the game, go right ahead. It more of a fact than an insult. Thats why my idea involved leaving you those easy mobs to kick around. While offering the more skilled players another tier to enjoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Divotox Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 It more of a fact than an insult. Thats why my idea involved leaving you those easy mobs to kick around. While offering the more skilled players another tier to enjoy. You had a good idea. In between the idea you decided to use the term "wimp" where you could have used casual or something less insulting. There was no need for it, except to make others feel like garbage. Also, how a person decides to spend their money and game time doesn't determine how good they are. I've raided in everquest, wild star, wow, few others. I'm done with "hardcore" content and just wish to enjoy myself without having to set up a schedule to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Altheran Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 (edited) My companions are just around level 10 at the moment, but for instance, I find the common declaration of "companions are OP" to be an overstatement. Do they wreck NPCs on their own ? Yes, definitely. But are they OP ? Not in my opinion. Why so ? Because as a DPS, when using my slightly old 192 gear, past the few firsts seconds, I'm constantly keeping the aggro over my own DPS companion, and sporadically over my tank ones. They're not obsoleting me. As long as they don't, they're not OP, in my opinion. They have lots of HP, but that's all. Still, is the content too easy as for now ? Yes. What's the problem in my opinion ? NPCs. Most NPCs are damn weak now, even when companions are not there. There was a time where a strong one had around the same levels of HP than you. Now, most will barely have half of yours. And the Endurance/HP change does not explain such loss. They have been crippled, and probably beyond shorter HP pools. Heck, I can just use two AoE and wipe a group of normal ones by myself not letting my companion the time to react. Before the update, even CZ-198 NPC withstood a third hit. Now they are like what used to be the "weak" Womp rats in the dump quest of CZ-198. So, obviously when you put crippled NPCs in front of steroided companions, the result can only be pathetic. Unless, companions have performances skyrocketing with levels, I see nothing wrong with them. And the scaling can be addressed without nerfing the companions themselves. Buff NPCs. Edited October 25, 2015 by Altheran Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baraxis Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 I think that companions in their current state are simply broken. Example: my vengeance juggernaut enters a heroic quest area with Vette as healer. Vette gets jumped by half a dozen mobs, continues to heal me for crazy amounts while her HP bar barely moves. I do not even bother to take aggro off her. If this doesn't qualify as broken than i do not know what does. I know what broken is... My commando ran heroics...10 of them...until I found out why 4X wasn't using all his skills...he didn't have a weapon equipped... And yet I still don't want to see then nerfed. Just for info's sake, I have never seen the inside of an operation, and he was never even on Ziost. So the gear he has is what ever you get on Yavin. Zero augments as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crossclaytonwow Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 My companions are just around level 10 at the moment, but for instance, I find the common declaration of "companions are OP" to be an overstatement. Do they wreck NPCs on their own ? Yes, definitely. But are they OP ? Not in my opinion. Why so ? Because as a DPS, when using my slightly old 192 gear, past the few firsts seconds, I'm constantly keeping the aggro over my own DPS companion, and sporadically over my tank ones. They're not obsoleting me. As long as they don't, they're not OP, in my opinion. They have lots of HP, but that's all. Still, is the content too easy as for now ? Yes. What's the problem in my opinion ? NPCs. Most NPCs are damn weak now, even when companions are not there. There was a time where a strong one had around the same levels of HP than you. Now, most will barely have half of yours. And the Endurance/HP change does not explain such loss. They have been crippled, and probably beyond shorter HP pools. Heck, I can just use two AoE and wipe a group of normal ones by myself not letting my companion the time to react. Before the update, even CZ-198 NPC withstood a third hit. Now they are like what used to be the "weak" Womp rats in the dump quest of CZ-198. So, obviously when you put crippled NPCs in front of steroided companions, the result can only be pathetic. Unless, companions have performances skyrocketing with levels, I see nothing wrong with them. And the scaling can be addressed without nerfing the companions themselves. Buff NPCs. Or this, What ever the case is, increase the difficulty with out sacrificing leveling pace. Dont make it grindy, just up the challenge. I played SWTOR because WoW got stupid easy and i was happy to still have an mmo that felt like i was actually playing it, not feeling like i had entered in an unlimited health cheat. Its a sad day when i see SWTOR become easier than WoW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ksen Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 Ty for this thread, Jeweledleah. Totally agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlphaHydri Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 Has anyone ever thought for one second that maybe, just maybe, it's not the companions who need nerfing, but the NPCs who need buffing? I mean, really strong NPCs vs. weak companions = dead companions really strong companions vs. weak NPCS = dead NPCs Didn't BioWare say in patch notes awhile ago that they were making all NPCs less powerful to "speed up the leveling process"? Maybe they should revert that change with how companions are now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 I would say that companions are fine just as they are. But that does create a problem for those that have huge bonuses in place and no way to effectively dismiss their companion. So IMO the fix should be that the resummon bug for companions should be fixed. When a companion is dismissed, it should remain so until summoned. That way, those folks that feel companions are far too overpowered can dismiss them without the irritation of constant respawns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sentientomega Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 I would say that companions are fine just as they are. But that does create a problem for those that have huge bonuses in place and no way to effectively dismiss their companion. So IMO the fix should be that the resummon bug for companions should be fixed. When a companion is dismissed, it should remain so until summoned. That way, those folks that feel companions are far too overpowered can dismiss them without the irritation of constant respawns. Or better yet, put them on passive; if they do nothing, they'll generate precious little threat, compared with the character who is getting involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khevar Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 So IMO the fix should be that the resummon bug for companions should be fixed. When a companion is dismissed, it should remain so until summoned. That way, those folks that feel companions are far too overpowered can dismiss them without the irritation of constant respawns. For what it's worth, I solved that by sending my companion out on crew missions. They won't auto-respawn if they're out on a crew skill mission. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maidelken Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 I would say that companions are fine just as they are. But that does create a problem for those that have huge bonuses in place and no way to effectively dismiss their companion. So IMO the fix should be that the resummon bug for companions should be fixed. When a companion is dismissed, it should remain so until summoned. That way, those folks that feel companions are far too overpowered can dismiss them without the irritation of constant respawns. Or maybe they could balance it so I can continue to play with my companions. And before you say it, no I don't have any stupid bonuses, I have three characters all below 55, no datacrons and my hugest ranked companion is Elara at influence level 14. And she still has twice my health and an attack that does over four times the damage of my biggest attack. An no, my character is not naked, he's in full modded blue commendation armour which I just updated to my level mods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinapus Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 Or maybe they could balance it so I can continue to play with my companions. And before you say it, no I don't have any stupid bonuses, I have three characters all below 55, no datacrons and my hugest ranked companion is Elara at influence level 14. And she still has twice my health and an attack that does over four times the damage of my biggest attack. An no, my character is not naked, he's in full modded blue commendation armour which I just updated to my level mods. IIRC, Influence rank 14 is a presence bonus of 700. (50 per rank, right? Rank 10 has 500 bonus...) I also checked my lvl 61 scoundrel and her rank 10 companions have about 12k more health (60k vs her 48k). That includes the presence bonuses I have in addition to influence so I'm wondering how yours can have double health. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeweledleah Posted October 25, 2015 Author Share Posted October 25, 2015 (edited) Nope, I am a solo player, comps are OP. I don't even need to fight, comp can do everything on its own. I should not need to disable parts of the game to get some kind of challenge. If you dont enjoy leveling, then your option is to get a lvl 60 character. I enjoy leveling actualy. its why I have a ton of alts. most of them already at lvl 60 and most of them were leveled before 12xp - in fact, original 8? were leveled before ANY xp buffs. i haven't even started my free 60 yet (and i originally thought it would be my test character, but now its just sitting there and maybe at some point I'll figure out what I'll do with it) I haven't even touched my lowbies though, I've been playing my main through the story and alliance quests. just have the two grindy companions left to recruit, and all H2 fortresses unlocked (though I've only done 2 on storymode. don't have as much time to play as I wish I had). and you know what? I'd rather they didn't nerf companions. creating an optional buff (or debuff) like white acute for 12 xp, but for companion power? or a legacy option where you can enable/disable buffs? I'm all for that - options are wonderful! what I don't love is nerfing them outright. yes, level sync bothers me - I'd rather it wasn't mandatory. current companion power though? makes it bearable. and I'm reading that people are soloing fortress H2? i can't do that right now. Lana is at influence 23, I picked up all of those alliance buffs and I can't get the last boss on my own just yet may need to buff her a bit more, get a few more upgrades for myself. and while I'm nowhere near amazing, I'm not a complete noob either. just because something might feel easy for you? doesn't mean its easy for everyone. and those people? are more common than people who find things too easy. IIRC, Influence rank 14 is a presence bonus of 700. (50 per rank, right? Rank 10 has 500 bonus...) I also checked my lvl 61 scoundrel and her rank 10 companions have about 12k more health (60k vs her 48k). That includes the presence bonuses I have in addition to influence so I'm wondering how yours can have double health. I'm guessing they are talking about leveling characters and/or while synced down on lower level planets. and even in those cases. I would rather they didn't implement any full scale nerfs. becasue especialy while doing those planetary weeklies is when I appreciate companion power the most. ability to do those weeklies at my own pace? like I said... makes lvl sync bearable Edited October 25, 2015 by Jeweledleah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinapus Posted October 25, 2015 Share Posted October 25, 2015 (edited) I'm guessing they are talking about leveling characters and/or while synced down on lower level planets. and even in those cases. I would rather they didn't implement any full scale nerfs. becasue especialy while doing those planetary weeklies is when I appreciate companion power the most. ability to do those weeklies at my own pace? like I said... makes lvl sync bearable Yeah, I wondered about the effects of level-sync. I've taken that scoundrel I mentioned to the lower level planets and haven't really noticed any problems even after dismissing my companion. Then again she has the stealth ability so she can sneak around opponents but when she fights she still hits pretty hard. She has 190 gear and a couple 192 pieces, maybe that translates to more power when synced downward. In some ways it's a bonus: She now gets exp when she wipes out mobs. Before if she was gathering she sometimes had to kill the mobs around a node and get only whatever junk/gear drops were available. (Though a nice orange blaster rifle dropped once while scavenging aluminium nodes in the Works. Saving that for a future vanguard run.) I guess I'll see how my new lvl 1 imperial agent fares against his foes... if I can stop reading the forums and actually start playing. Edit: Mangled a quote bracket. Edited October 25, 2015 by Sinapus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baraxis Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 IIRC, Influence rank 14 is a presence bonus of 700. (50 per rank, right? Rank 10 has 500 bonus...) I also checked my lvl 61 scoundrel and her rank 10 companions have about 12k more health (60k vs her 48k). That includes the presence bonuses I have in addition to influence so I'm wondering how yours can have double health. His info is false..... His claim that his armor is blue modded commendation armor is also false because comms just buy green mods now.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maidelken Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 His info is false..... His claim that his armor is blue modded commendation armor is also false because comms just buy green mods now.... Excuse me? My mods were blue because they were bought pre-patch for that character and they were at level when I wrote that post (they now arent). I will be honest post then I havent looked too hard at the colour of the mods the vendor sells, as if you check another one of my posts I didnt even bother to update the mods in my armour because the game never challenged me. The amount of health compared to your companion scales down as you level up - so when people report at level 65 that their companion only has 15-20% more hp than you thats perfectly in line with what I had been seeing. Im going to be really interrested to see what happens when my agent gets his first companion, at level 10 im expecting her to have 300% of my characters HP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elil-hrair-rah Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 I wanted to see for myself if this was a matter of OP companions, or just all the buffs from having a bunch of high level characters. I went onto a new server, and started from scratch, no legacy, no influence, nothing. Then, I turned off all but T7's basic attack. at level he could still clear mobs on his own without any input from me, and had nearly 3 times my health right out the gate( in DPS mode). Remember, this is with a brand new character, nothing at all to boost T7's abilities. This needs to be toned down. I'm not calling for companions to be nerfed into oblivion, just balanced out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maidelken Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 I wanted to see for myself if this was a matter of OP companions, or just all the buffs from having a bunch of high level characters. I went onto a new server, and started from scratch, no legacy, no influence, nothing. Then, I turned off all but T7's basic attack. at level he could still clear mobs on his own without any input from me, and had nearly 3 times my health right out the gate( in DPS mode). Remember, this is with a brand new character, nothing at all to boost T7's abilities. This needs to be toned down. I'm not calling for companions to be nerfed into oblivion, just balanced out. Thank you. Its nice to see when people actually TRY IT they notice the same things and don't randomly have to start accusing me of lying to try and make their point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JouerTue Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 i like them. finally worth the annoying quotes. not that the game was hard when they were useless and i still one shot weak mobs...who cares? faster dailies is a good deal for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maidelken Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 faster dailies is a good deal for me. Which is fine and I dont want that taken away form people at the top end of the the game - but while you are levelling up there is literally no game to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KrazieFox Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 I so agree with this. As a new returning low level player this is a great change. They were so weak before. Same sentiment here ... it's now FUN to start at level 1 again & not take months to slowly grind my way to 20, 30, 40 ... now my characters actually have a chance to hit cap without me getting bored & leaving again! I've been here since beta & yet the furthest I ever got a character prior to 4.0 is 46 on my Shadow ... the Grind was excruciating & I kept having to far outlevel stuff to be able to comfortably play ... with the new 'Level Sync' I was horrified that my playstyle was no longer an option - I was resigned to leaving swtor permanently ... but now with the slightly better companions I don't care about Level Sync - I am now in favour of Level Sync ... because leveling is now enjoyable & FUN ... I am actually looking forward to getting my 20+ characters to 65 ... After taking 3 (2x Free, 1x bought) characters through KotFE I so WANT to level up all my Alt's across both my accounts to unlock the 'Legendary' status on ALL the servers I am on ... that's about x8 per account ... SWTOR has moved from a mediocre game that was a huge let down (we all thought it would be like KotOR) - it became a painful Grindfest ... I popped back now & again but I had all but given up on swtor as a lost cause ... With 4.0 & the Companion update I see swtor becoming one of my main mmo's (and I have a long list that I have current subs in). So, yeah ... totally AGREE with the Thread Title ... Additionally this gives players an OPTION ... if you don't like the enhanced Companions you have a CHOICE to dismiss them & simply use them for crafting ... but if you push to have them nerfed we all have to play by YOUR playstyle & grind, grind, grind ... & most probably leave again ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maidelken Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Where is anyone asking for GRIND - seriously - find me a person asking for that and ill eat my hat. People just want to have a CHALLENGE on the end of quest bosses - you know the elites who are supposed to be big and scary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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