Bioware, remove the PvP from the quest to get M1-4X.

[branmakmuffin]

Anyway, BioWare has said that getting Pierce/4X MIGHT gate future PVP-gated companions. In other words, anything that may be behind them in the chain will ALSO require PVP. The further content you'll miss, if any, will only be PVP content.

If that is how it works out to be, I for one am totally fine with that.

[Duedroth]

If that is how it works out to be, I for one am totally fine with that.

 

The language Musco used makes it fairly clear that either nothing will be gated or only PVP related alerts will be in the Pierce/4X quest line. If it turns out to be something else, and not either of those 2 things, then I'll also be upset because BW will have misled many people.

[Eldrenath]

Way to completely misunderstand a post.

 

Anyway, BioWare has said that getting Pierce/4X MIGHT gate future PVP-gated companions. In other words, anything that may be behind them in the chain will ALSO require PVP. The further content you'll miss, if any, will only be PVP content.

 

QFT!!!

 

People are constantly complaining that if they DON'T do the PvP, they might miss out on future content. But Eric specifically said that they might miss out on PvP content, which is exactly the content they don't want to do!

 

...

 

Will I need to PvP for future Companions / Will I need to unlock Companions like Pierce to access future Companions?

The answer to your question is maybe. We are open to the possibility of future PvP related Companions/Mission content which could require the completion of M1-4X/Pierce's Missions. That said, we would not likely have PvE related content require it.

 

 

-eric

 

I mean, it's right there! They might miss out on "future PvP related companions/Mission content". So all of these people are forcing themselves to do PvP--which they claim to hate--all to make sure that they are prepared to do the next round of PvP related content should Bioware choose to add it.

[Jadescythe]

Way to completely misunderstand a post.

 

Anyway, BioWare has said that getting Pierce/4X MIGHT gate future PVP-gated companions. In other words, anything that may be behind them in the chain will ALSO require PVP. The further content you'll miss, if any, will only be PVP content.

 

That's not my understanding of what they said at all. There may be companions gated by PvE activities in the future that are blocked by not doing this PvP quest. But they would never block you from doing something like chapter 10 or a flashpoint by having to PvP first. As to whether there will be further PvP requirements for companions, that will be determined by how this one is received.

 

Essentially they don't view companions as part of PvE, so putting them behind a PvP wall is fine in BW's book.

[Eldrenath]

That's not my understanding of what they said at all. There may be companions gated by PvE activities in the future that are blocked by not doing this PvP quest.

 

With respect, I think you have misunderstood what they said. Read the quote above your post from Eric Musco--he said that future PvP content might be gated behind not getting 4X or Pierce. So they're gating PvP behind PvP, not PvE behid PvP.

[Roalmo]

With respect, I think you have misunderstood what they said. Read the quote above your post from Eric Musco--he said that future PvP content might be gated behind not getting 4X or Pierce. So they're gating PvP behind PvP, not PvE behid PvP.

 

So before this expansion what Companions/Missions have been solely gated by PvP content?

[Jadescythe]

So before this expansion what Companions/Missions have been solely gated by PvP content?

 

Before this expansion, when were companions obtained in any way other than playing the single player story? Which one was gated behind an event? Games evolve, companions are not what they once were.

[Jadescythe]

With respect, I think you have misunderstood what they said. Read the quote above your post from Eric Musco--he said that future PvP content might be gated behind not getting 4X or Pierce. So they're gating PvP behind PvP, not PvE behid PvP.

 

You may be right, but he is discussing two different issues in his reply and it's not easy to attribute what he is saying to one particular piece. The overall theme of what I read was that your completion or not of the PvP quests would not prohibit you from participating in future PvE content.

 

Re-reading I'm leaning toward agreeing with your assertion, however.

[Rabenschwinge]

Anyway, BioWare has said that getting Pierce/4X MIGHT gate future PVP-gated companions. In other words, anything that may be behind them in the chain will ALSO require PVP. The further content you'll miss, if any, will only be PVP content.

 

I am not a PvPer. I tried this mission with my main and gave up on it when the counter hit 10... eight lost, one won. And if I lost eight matches, that means my team mates did as well, who were certainly not happy about my presence there.

 

I don't have a problem with a companion that makes PvP players (and troopers) distinguish themselves per se. The only thing I am concerned about is the exact formulation in the Bioware post. If there will be more companions that require you to recruit your PvP companion it is very likely not a PvE companion. Meaning, it might be a Galactic Starfighter companion as well.

 

I do Galactic Starfighter on occasion and it is an important facet of the game to fulfil my personal conquest goals. I don't do traditional PvP. If there was a Galactic Starfighter companion that requires me to traditional PvP to even get the alert that would seriously annoy me. But I have a feeling that Bioware is not inclined to make a difference there.

Edited November 30, 2015 by Rabenschwinge

[Katahn]

QFT!!!

 

People are constantly complaining that if they DON'T do the PvP, they might miss out on future content. But Eric specifically said that they might miss out on PvP content, which is exactly the content they don't want to do!

 

 

 

I mean, it's right there! They might miss out on "future PvP related companions/Mission content". So all of these people are forcing themselves to do PvP--which they claim to hate--all to make sure that they are prepared to do the next round of PvP related content should Bioware choose to add it.

 

What Musco said in your quote block was...

 

Quote: Originally Posted by EricMusco View Post

 

 

...

 

Will I need to PvP for future Companions / Will I need to unlock Companions like Pierce to access future Companions?

The answer to your question is maybe. We are open to the possibility of future PvP related Companions/Mission content which could require the completion of M1-4X/Pierce's Missions. That said, we would not likely have PvE related content require it.

 

 

-eric

 

"Not likely" is not synonymous with "never will". Furthermore there's no way to get rid of the quest or alert without completing it.

 

I'll slog through the PvP requirement, a little at a time. No I won't get gear. Yes I will be sub-par as a result. Kindly direct complaints to the dev team. I'd be quite content to be able to refuse this mission, clear the alert, and not have future content blocked off from me. I have plenty of companions, missing out on Pierce (or 4X) will hardly be game-ending for me.

 

However I don't want a quest slot permanently taken up and I don't want to have to learn to live with a forever-blinking alliance alert icon.

[Lord_Sleepy]

So I'm just going to post this in case it helps clarify anything. I'm not sure if you know all this already or not, and if you do, I mean no offense by it. There may be others who don't know.

 

In warzones, the MOST IMPORTANT stat is Expertise. This is more important than Endurance, Mastery, Power, or anything else. It governs how damage you deal to other players, take from other players, mitigate from other players, reduce from other players, and how heals given and received in warzones scales with your other stats.

 

Expertise caps at 2018. When entering a WZ, you want to get as close to that number as possible.

 

There are two ways to do this:

 

1. PVP gear. The "starter" PVP gear is rating 204, has set bonuses, and can be obtained in the combat training section of the fleet in exchange for warzone commendations. When you get it you'll see your Expertise is at 1936. You'll need to get 2 crystals, both with +41 Expertise, one for your main hand and one for your offhand. 2018-1936=82. 41+41=82. That means the crystals are the difference.

 

2. Bolster. Bolster is a (admittedly faulty) system unique to SWTOR that attempts to bridge the gap between players wearing Expertise gear and those without. It grants Expertise but with a limitation. It won't grant Expertise to gear beyond a certain level (currently green 190) and it won't let you mix/match PVP and PVE gear (with some advanced-user only exceptions). This means that because you'll actually be penalized for putting a +41 Expertise cyrstal into a PvE main or offhand slot, Bolster caps out at 1936 instead of 2018. Hopefully this will be fixed since it wasn't this way in 3.0 but we haven't heard.

 

TL;DR. There are 2 ways to get 1936-2018 Expertise, which should be the goal when entering a warzone. 1. PVP gear, obtained via WZ comms. 2. Green rating 190 or lower PVE gear using the Bolster system.

 

This was helpful, thanks, so, another question, do augments affect bolster?

[AlCorazon]

This was helpful, thanks, so, another question, do augments affect bolster?

 

Augments do not affect bolster, you can have full 208 augments.

[Deyjarl]

The language Musco used makes it fairly clear that either nothing will be gated or only PVP related alerts will be in the Pierce/4X quest line. If it turns out to be something else, and not either of those 2 things, then I'll also be upset because BW will have misled many people.

 

You'll be upset because of an answer that isn't meant to be definitive. #facepalm

[ekwalizer]

Then you say "it's a matter of choice, you don't have to do pvp if don't want to". Well, a companion is all about PvE, some people love that companion. Why the hell Bioware put a pvp aspect on it? Both are unhappy with this.

 

Because of the way the "alert" system works, this is a false argument for people to make against not wanting to PvP for a companion. You must PvP for 4X of Pierce (unless you previously had them as companions). Otherwise that alert is never completed and no further alerts will come from that alert giver. That means that every potential companion from that contact is gated behind the PvP gate as well.

 

I like PvP, I have been a "PvPer" since the game launched. I, however, disagree 100% with gating companions behind PvP. Companions are not used in PvP, have nothing to do with PvP and should not be linked to PvP.

 

To the OP just do this:

1. Queue for PvP

2. Zone in and TURN OFF your chat window.

3. Don't fight, don't go for objectives. Just die a lot but keep running in.

4. Get to 20, obtain your companion.

 

I mean seriously, if you don't plan to PvP I wouldn't worry about what the PvP community thinks of you.

 

And yes, I am advocating that PvEers "troll' PvP matches by not participating in any meaningful way. This gate is one of the more ridiculous features I have seen in 2 decades of MMO gaming. One sure fire way to get something fixed is for the PvPers to gripe about it.

[Pherdnut]

As a PVPer (who was away from the game for a few months), I for one heartily approve of this development until I max m1-4x out, at which point, I plan on a 100% flip-flop on the issue.

 

The quest should probably have an alternative inf-gaining mechanism though. Like maybe 10 war supplies instead of the usual 5 or something to encourage people to try without massively punishing people who definitely don't ever want to PVP at all and shouldn't.

 

I fear wins-only would lead to horribad players looking to get lucky and get carried through like 200 match attempts just to get M1 though.

[lightSaberAddiCt]

And here, just like I said. You don't and won't ever understand. It's not about it being "required". It's the principle: Locking story content behind PvP is not the way to make me play PvP (Insulting me isn't the way either, FYI)..

 

It is not story content, it is a OPTIONAL alliance comp. If he had some overall impact on the story (ie: lana) then I would agree with you. But they have every right to try and get people to try pvp. And please dont lump all of us PVE players together, I happen, on rare occasion, to like pvp.

[MDChen]

Because of the way the "alert" system works, this is a false argument for people to make against not wanting to PvP for a companion. You must PvP for 4X of Pierce (unless you previously had them as companions). Otherwise that alert is never completed and no further alerts will come from that alert giver. That means that every potential companion from that contact is gated behind the PvP gate as well.

 

I like PvP, I have been a "PvPer" since the game launched. I, however, disagree 100% with gating companions behind PvP. Companions are not used in PvP, have nothing to do with PvP and should not be linked to PvP.

 

To the OP just do this:

1. Queue for PvP

2. Zone in and TURN OFF your chat window.

3. Don't fight, don't go for objectives. Just die a lot but keep running in.

4. Get to 20, obtain your companion.

 

I mean seriously, if you don't plan to PvP I wouldn't worry about what the PvP community thinks of you.

 

And yes, I am advocating that PvEers "troll' PvP matches by not participating in any meaningful way. This gate is one of the more ridiculous features I have seen in 2 decades of MMO gaming. One sure fire way to get something fixed is for the PvPers to gripe about it.

 

Problem with PvP is the vocal minority attitudes can be just as toxic as those PvE raiders.

 

I do what you said just once as I never like PvP even though I have participated in world PvP before with my ex-guild. (felt committed to the guild and go with the event though I don't enjoy it) So decided to just try join WZ enough times to get my favored companion and planning to just sit through everything reading a book for the whole match or whatever the PvPers call it, and there is this fellow who keep whining about me in the chat window about how I am wasting a slot and pulling his team down or whatsoever.

 

I try to ignore him and the chat windows and just read my book, but even long after the match had finished and hours later when I am on the fleet this same fellow is still on the general chat on how I sux and drag the whole team down causing them to lose a match or something. And start ridiculed on my non-PvP gears and claiming how I am worst than noobie to enter WZ without any PvP gears. Apparently what happen in WZ don't stay in WZ

 

Seriously they should never try to mix PvP and PvE.

Edited April 10, 2016 by MDChen

[Feble]

It's not so much removing PvP that is needed than offering an alternative.

Don't try to bull**** me in saying your character can't participate in the war effort if he doesn't PvP.

Qyzen offers two options to get him: World Bosses (So, group content) and Jaganath preys on Hoth (Solo).

Why doesn't Forex/Pierce offer the same?

And don't try to tell me I don't need them, because if you do, you are more than likely a PvP player, thus you don't think like I do and I won't waste my time explain to you why a "PvE reward" (It's not, it's story content) should not be locked behind PvP requirement only.

 

I agree here- KoTFE is story telling and should not have quests locked behind PvP- a balance is needed- two options. I am horrible at PvP and rather do 20 flashpoints instead any day. Even if it was completing 1, 2 or 3 warzone with PvE quest line would seem to make it a bit more realistic for me. But 20 warzones is a bit too much for those who do not PvP.

[Suzsi]

It should be noted that the Trooper does not have to PVP to get Fourex back. Just go talk to the guy and you get him without any PVP. It automatically finishes the quest.

[kirorx]

In that case all PvE stuff should be bought with PvP tokens

 

All planets and chapter related content from KOTFE should also be purcashable with PvP tokens

 

If a PvEer wants to use a PvPers Bathroom because he associates himself as a PvPer then by goly he can.

 

In fact we should not have levels anymore because its offensive to low levels.

 

Since some people dont want to be forced to do story content, all companions should be given to all players upon player creation.

 

When you create a new character they should just ask you what level you would to start as, then you can just start there.

 

Maybe, just have one type of token for all content, or better yet no tokens...just give everyone all the exact same gear, same unlocks, same levels and same amount of credits...you know, so its fair for everyone.

 

Or

Just play the game and have fun

Edited May 11, 2016 by kirorx

[DieAlteHexe]

So this guy -> http://i.imgur.com/Lc4JlUn.png

 

He had 57k HP I don't know how...

His total damage was 157k, he wasn't guarding West or East, he was going to mid.

He died 13 times.

 

Gladly this match my team had only 2 pve players and we managed to carry them.

This will get worse today with everybody getting access to the xpac.

 

Necro thread but THIS post is precisely why I don't PvP anymore.

 

I fully and totally realise that I suck at PvP. So why inflict myself on PvPers? Now, I realise that the opposing side would LOVE for me to PvP but...no. And my side really doesn't need a dork like me buggering things up and taking up a slot that someone who had even the tiniest bit of ability could be in.

 

That said, I'm not best pleased about M1-4X being only obtainable (save for the trooper) via PvP but I can live without him. It's not worth it.

[Yomitako]

Necro thread but THIS post is precisely why I don't PvP anymore.

 

I fully and totally realise that I suck at PvP. So why inflict myself on PvPers? Now, I realise that the opposing side would LOVE for me to PvP but...no. And my side really doesn't need a dork like me buggering things up and taking up a slot that someone who had even the tiniest bit of ability could be in.

 

That said, I'm not best pleased about M1-4X being only obtainable (save for the trooper) via PvP but I can live without him. It's not worth it.

 

Would the other side be worried about your not being geared for PVP? Or would they be worried about the non-PVP geared players trying to recruit Lt. Pierce, who also carries the same requirements as M1-4X? It's not as one sided as other players would have you believe.

[DieAlteHexe]

Would the other side be worried about your not being geared for PVP? Or would they be worried about the non-PVP geared players trying to recruit Lt. Pierce, who also carries the same requirements as M1-4X? It's not as one sided as other players would have you believe.

 

The other side wouldn't be "worried" at all. They'd be positively gleeful that a prat like me was there as fodder.

 

My side would be facepalming about what a waste of space I was.

[Lularapio]

Its crystal clear they made Pierce and forex gated because pvp needs fodder to appease their audience.

 

The problem is, I am not going to serve as sacrificial lamb for others because the devs want me to. I am not going to waste my time gearing to perform better for content that I am not interested to do, so no, you can keep them.

[Rabenschwinge]

Well, I don't need each and every companion and I am perfectly fine with this companion being a privilege of pvpers (and guys so bloody ignorant that the run in there and get their team irradicated 20 times).

 

What really gets me on the fence regarding all this is the discrepancy between PvE and PvP gear.

 

It's a bit counter intuitive that your gear suddenly ceases to work as you're used to as soon as you enter a warzone. I my main character is an infiltration shadow. I may not be a PvPer and I certainly far from the level of an actual PvPer, I am not stupid, either. I know my skills, I know my character. I am used to soloing team content where I am vastly outnumbered and it's really more a matter of using your crowd control effects efficiently. I've been in PvP situations in open world conflicts (during Ilum events, Rhakgoul event or back when Oricon when it was new) before and won more often than I lost. Some skills do not behave exactly like the way I am used to but that's ok.

 

Of course the people you meet in open world conflicts are rarely serious PvPers, but only jerks who like to harass PvEers and catch a blood nose whenever they meet a PvEer who actually knows what he's doing.

 

I didn't really know what to do, so I thought, let's just listen thoroughly to the briefing, stick with the healer, protect them and see what the other damage dealers are doing. If anyone issues a command I follow it to my best ability.

 

But in a war zone suddenly nothing works. I got an isolated healer and he really got caught in all my stuns and slows but even then he healed a lot faster than I could possible deal damage. The healer temporarily even ignored my attacks, was probably chatting with his team. My hardest attacks hardly had only a fraction of the effect I was expecting. So, I read in the forums that I need to strip down to 190 gear or so and that was the point where I said: No. Not gonna happen. If M1-4X wants to stand around on Coruscant and shout instead of joining my alliance, so be it. Particularly not after being so grossly humiliated and being the reason for being numerous of team wipes.

Edited May 11, 2016 by Rabenschwinge