SaerethDL Posted October 13, 2015 Author Share Posted October 13, 2015 This is absolutely true of a lot of the "leveling" guilds (I aplogize about the classification I just don't really know how else to describe the guild you join for the XP bonus, and guild ship access, while you're leveling to speed up the process). If you do not engage at all with your members then your retention rate will always be insanely low. People definitely play this game a ton still. Guilds succeed when their members know one another and interact. I know for me the guild I am in now is fantastic. I love logging into TS and then the game just to see who is online. We've all gotten to the point where we'll just have a great time talking in TS for hours on end instead of even play the game. There've been times where we're all having a great time laughing at all of our awful jokes, and I found myself just running around my strong hold. Every Sunday we have mandatory meetings followed up by a guild event for those who can make it. We have newsletters going out weekly, and we are always hanging out in TS. There's something to be said for that kind of structure. People connect with each other that way. Bottom line, you have to be engaged to have the kind of experience in guild that most people look for whether they realize it or not. And most importantly, you have to have the leadership in place that really wants to have that guild be awesome for its members. If you're the leader, that responsibility is on you. Unless you just did it for the tag in which case it's all good. I'd say that if you're able to recruit 200 people to your guild that that is the real sign of how many people are playing this game. That would say to me "a lot". Good for your guild man, I'm glad yall are having success. My guild used to be like that... and I miss it . We used to have at least 5 people on in mumble every day, talking, shooting the **** and having a blast.. eventually people stopped coming online and nobody played the game anymore, so I had to go on another recruiting spree. This new batch doesn't want to get on mumble even though i ask them and place incentives to join. An example is today, i log on to only 6 people online, i say hey, and I don't even get a response. I always try to be active with them, like i said we have contest, giveaways, you name it, and I help lowbies when they are stuck, and answer all the questions. Like i said before, even after doing all of that, if people don't enjoy the game, and arent logging on anymore, there is nothing myself or my guild can do for people who don't want to play anymore. We have over 900 members from both of our guilds on each side, and maybe we get 5 people on each side a day. I was able to recruit 200 members yes, but those people DONT log on? so whats the point, they are trying the f2p game mode out and not enjoying it obviously.. anyone will download a free game and try it, thats how it "PADS" its numbers, and makes it look like they have a lot of people playing.. but they don't stay or contribute in any way. Out of probably 800 unique members in the past few months, only maybe 10 of them play, then here is something wrong here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaerethDL Posted October 13, 2015 Author Share Posted October 13, 2015 To just be totally honest in an attempt to help you, just doing flashpoints or any kind of content doesn't really distinguish you from the pack. Every guild does content. Give aways are fun little additives, but you have to be able to connect them to something or else you'll get the "plate licker effect". They may not be logging in to that specific character, but there's a better than average chance they are logging on somewhere in game. I'd examine your structure. Having voice comms, and urging people to use them, or set it up so that as a guild training session you walk them through setting up team speak or something could really make a difference. It sounds like you need to provide a hub for your players to actually connect. I would say that if you're in a leveling guild, you're probably fighting up stream. It's much easier to form those connections with comms when you're in a raiding guild, or really end game guild. The leveling experience is too solo minded for people to even think about really getting into the human side of the game. If you are a leveling guild, maybe you re-examine your priorities in game to include end game in some capacity? We always try to get to end game, but nobody ever stays for that long, they stop logging in man... nothing i can do to stop that. How are we suppose to be an end game guild when people only log in for 3 days.. Thats our goal though, is to get enough people to end game so we can start raiding as a guild, but we never make it. We then game first launched we didnt have a problem, voice comms where full, we were downing SOA on hardmode as a unit, it all felt good. Every last one of those players left, so I have to recruit in waves and try to find new players that want to contribute.. they stay for a while then they leave, I have to recruit again... but the difference is lately now that they are joining, logging on for a few days, then not logging on anymore... it's hard to run a guild that way when you are trying to get to know people and they don't even log on anymore.. It's getting to the point where i don't even want to recruit anymore because its all in vain... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transcendent Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 Sandbox Star Wars MMO on Frostbite 3. Do it EA. Only if DICE get to do the combat balancing for PvP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanorDM Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 (edited) Dude this game has been known as one of the biggest MMO failures of all time. According to who exactly? Is there some reward out there that SWTOR got? Some independent body that decides these things? Because I'd say that Matrix Online or Tabula Rasa would be much better examples of MMO failures. Just because the game didn't shut down doesn't mean it didn't fail. As long as the game makes a net profit, it hasn't failed. Given that EA/Bioware has at this point made well more than what they spent on it, it clearly doesn't fit into any real definition of failure. It wasn't too long after that they adopted the F2P model and cash market option so many MMO's turn to once they starting hemorrhaging subs. Or maybe they did that because the F2P model is a better model and works better in today's market. Edited October 13, 2015 by VanorDM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VarKoE Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 (edited) Dude this game has been known as one of the biggest MMO failures of all time. Just because the game didn't shut down doesn't mean it didn't fail. They spent upwards of $300 Million to develop this game and they had 1.1million subs at launch and lost about half that within the first 6 months. It wasn't too long after that they adopted the F2P model and cash market option so many MMO's turn to once they starting hemorrhaging subs. google search swtor and profitability. You will be in for a surprise. But feel free to continue to believe that if you want. Edited October 13, 2015 by VarKoE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codedrago Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 ESO broke my heart, it was HORRIBLE... horrible combat, quest uninteresting, engine pretty but ugly, bugs galore, really boring. Combat was pretty damn awesome for me, though story wise I never expected much (Bethesda was never really good at stories). But the biggest dissappointment for me is the limited freedome, in usual TES games, I could go ''Man, **** your main quest. I'm going butterfly catchign!'' and just wonder off doing my own thing. The warewolf and Vampire transformations are cool though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanorDM Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 But feel free to continue to believe that if you want. It's funny, because as someone who's been here since beta, having taken some breaks... I've been hearing how SWTOR is a failure and will be going off line any day now, since about Feb 2012... Here it is 3.5 years latter and I'm still hearing the same old thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swiftintruder Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 People said the same thing about SWG after 2 years but it ran for almost 10. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The-Kaitou-Kid Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 Dude this game has been known as one of the biggest MMO failures of all time. Just because the game didn't shut down doesn't mean it didn't fail. They spent upwards of $300 Million to develop this game and they had 1.1million subs at launch and lost about half that within the first 6 months. It wasn't too long after that they adopted the F2P model and cash market option so many MMO's turn to once they starting hemorrhaging subs. A game not doing well out of the gate doesn't make it a failure. Had TOR shut down then that initial stumble would be all there was to it and then yes, it would have been a failure. But that F2P transition that you throw out like a sign of failure more than doubled SWTOR's revenue within a year. To take it straight from the horse's mouth for a moment, EA recently mentioned SWTOR as "an example of a successful part of its F2P portfolio." Doesn't sound like a failure to me. Doesn't make it a world beater, it's not about to touch WoW or anything, but it's successful enough to justify its current development. EA probably would have shut it down otherwise, they haven't been shy about doing so to other titles in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shwarzchild Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 We always try to get to end game, but nobody ever stays for that long, they stop logging in man... nothing i can do to stop that. How are we suppose to be an end game guild when people only log in for 3 days.. Thats our goal though, is to get enough people to end game so we can start raiding as a guild, but we never make it. We then game first launched we didnt have a problem, voice comms where full, we were downing SOA on hardmode as a unit, it all felt good. Every last one of those players left, so I have to recruit in waves and try to find new players that want to contribute.. they stay for a while then they leave, I have to recruit again... but the difference is lately now that they are joining, logging on for a few days, then not logging on anymore... it's hard to run a guild that way when you are trying to get to know people and they don't even log on anymore.. It's getting to the point where i don't even want to recruit anymore because its all in vain... I would say to this that your recruiting focus is off. It sounds like you're recruiting people who are leveling in hopes they stick around to become end game players. I don't think that's an efficient way to do your recruiting. If you haven't already I'd put together a solid recruiting message post and stick it in your guild recruitment section of the server your on's forum. Then, ignore recruiting lower level people. Recruit level 60 players. I'd set goals for things. So first step is to form a raid team for pve, or a raid team for pvp. Get that going. If you're short people in on your teams, do group finder operations with the people you do have and fill in with pugs. Ask the pugs if they're guild shopping. Once you get 1 team together, start trying to form a second. Then a third. Then get to work on clearing content and publicizing it on your server's progression posts. Another way to really get going is to see if there are guild's out there that are smaller who might be interested in merging. Granted I'm not with the guild I'll be referring to in this sentence, but the message should remain the same. When my old guild from POT5 transferred over, we merged wtih another guild. And, with both guilds in one we were able to really get going on a 4 day a week event schedule that people signed up for on the guild's website. That could be another way to recruit more effectively. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HarleysRule Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 (edited) camelot unchained LOL, made by the guy that made warhammer lulz please Also the same guy that made Dark Age of Camelot...still my favorite MMO of all time. I wish they'd make it some kind of F2P model to get some life back in that game. I'll definitely check out Camelot Unchained if it ever goes live. I blame WAR on EA forcing it out the door unfinished. Edited October 13, 2015 by HarleysRule Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImmortalLowlife Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 Well...I can't speak for the raiding/endgame focused guilds, but I've got 3 characters in a guild who's recruitment message was "for players who just want the guild bonuses, otherwise we pretty much leave each other alone." 70ish members total, and there's almost always 15-20 ppl online. Personally....I hope they make a SP-RPG before they make another mmo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaerethDL Posted October 13, 2015 Author Share Posted October 13, 2015 I would say to this that your recruiting focus is off. It sounds like you're recruiting people who are leveling in hopes they stick around to become end game players. I don't think that's an efficient way to do your recruiting. If you haven't already I'd put together a solid recruiting message post and stick it in your guild recruitment section of the server your on's forum. Then, ignore recruiting lower level people. Recruit level 60 players. I'd set goals for things. So first step is to form a raid team for pve, or a raid team for pvp. Get that going. If you're short people in on your teams, do group finder operations with the people you do have and fill in with pugs. Ask the pugs if they're guild shopping. Once you get 1 team together, start trying to form a second. Then a third. Then get to work on clearing content and publicizing it on your server's progression posts. Another way to really get going is to see if there are guild's out there that are smaller who might be interested in merging. Granted I'm not with the guild I'll be referring to in this sentence, but the message should remain the same. When my old guild from POT5 transferred over, we merged wtih another guild. And, with both guilds in one we were able to really get going on a 4 day a week event schedule that people signed up for on the guild's website. That could be another way to recruit more effectively. I don't want to be just a raiding guild though, we like to do everything.. plus we need a good raid leader and my old ones left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafaman Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 Dude this game has been known as one of the biggest MMO failures of all time. Just because the game didn't shut down doesn't mean it didn't fail. They spent upwards of $300 Million to develop this game and they had 1.1million subs at launch and lost about half that within the first 6 months. It wasn't too long after that they adopted the F2P model and cash market option so many MMO's turn to once they starting hemorrhaging subs. Heh. You are wrong about that. Look it up. The perception is not the reality. The game struggled and was saved by the cash shop. More than saved actually. This game proves what a good cash shop can do. I'm not sure how I feel about that, but... there it is. And btw, the idea that going F2P is a failure, is long gone. Sub-based MMO's now plan for F2P. It makes that much money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikahrtwo Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 (edited) A game not doing well out of the gate doesn't make it a failure. Had TOR shut down then that initial stumble would be all there was to it and then yes, it would have been a failure. But that F2P transition that you throw out like a sign of failure more than doubled SWTOR's revenue within a year. To take it straight from the horse's mouth for a moment, EA recently mentioned SWTOR as "an example of a successful part of its F2P portfolio." Doesn't sound like a failure to me. Doesn't make it a world beater, it's not about to touch WoW or anything, but it's successful enough to justify its current development. EA probably would have shut it down otherwise, they haven't been shy about doing so to other titles in the past. If you like SWTOR you will sing praises to Disney who took over and is trying to revitalize SW franchise. By your measurement of success games like Vangurd were also a success. WHO - a smashing hit. Hell, Titanic was great success since it made it half way and some of the people even got to America. Edited October 13, 2015 by Mikahrtwo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psikofunkster Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 (edited) A game not doing well out of the gate doesn't make it a failure. Had TOR shut down then that initial stumble would be all there was to it and then yes, it would have been a failure. But that F2P transition that you throw out like a sign of failure more than doubled SWTOR's revenue within a year. To take it straight from the horse's mouth for a moment, EA recently mentioned SWTOR as "an example of a successful part of its F2P portfolio." Doesn't sound like a failure to me. Doesn't make it a world beater, it's not about to touch WoW or anything, but it's successful enough to justify its current development. EA probably would have shut it down otherwise, they haven't been shy about doing so to other titles in the past. One thing is success and a different one is to survive. Do you think this game is a success when the only ones getting new content were the cartel market guys? Edited October 13, 2015 by psikofunkster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shwarzchild Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 I don't want to be just a raiding guild though, we like to do everything.. plus we need a good raid leader and my old ones left. I'm sure there's a way to structure your message so you attract the type of players you're looking for. Just saying <Enter Guild Name Here> is recruiting, we have ship and bonuses whisper for more details isn't a good message. Try to narrow the focus so people undersatnd immediately what you're going for. Maybe something like : <Enter Guild Name Here> is recruiting! We are a guild of tightly knit friends who love the casual experience this game offers. Because we're casually focused we tend to do flashpoints and storymode operations for pve with the goal of entering the hard mode content and learning our classes in the best way we can. For PvP we have X day for pvp competitions from lowbie to ranked. We have guild events x days a week where we go for different achievements in game. Above all we think that playing with friends is the most satisfying experience you can get from this game so we are looking for players who want to be engaged. If we sound like a fit for you get in touch with any of the following players in game: <list contacts here> And then you can abridge it for an in game spam on fleet. And yeah that's really a rough idea that I just jotted down in an attempt to capture what you're hinting at in here. Hope it helps! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafaman Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 One thing is success and a different one is to survive. Do you think this game is a success when the only ones getting new content were the cartel market guys? So... this next xpac is all CM? Lol! Wow... Surviving means profit. Profit means success. That is how you measure it. Lol! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The-Kaitou-Kid Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 One thing is success and a different one is to survive. Sure and, from what we can tell, SWTOR falls into the former. The transition to F2P helped pull it into that category. It's not a huge success, mind you, but a success. Do you think this game is a success when the only ones getting new content were the cartel market guys? So what's happening in a week is just, what, a cartel market update? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sarfux Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 Oh look! Another thread where people's opinions are being picked apart sentence by sentence so the arguing commences and the other person tries to prove a point by needlessly nitpicking the person's words. Why do people DO THIS stuff??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psikofunkster Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 (edited) Sure and, from what we can tell, SWTOR falls into the former. The transition to F2P helped pull it into that category. It's not a huge success, mind you, but a success. So what's happening in a week is just, what, a cartel market update? Sure after only an entire year has passed already and yes a cartel market update t is happening soon, good that you are asking lol Edited October 13, 2015 by psikofunkster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikahrtwo Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 (edited) Sure and, from what we can tell, SWTOR falls into the former. The transition to F2P helped pull it into that category. It's not a huge success, mind you, but a success. So what's happening in a week is just, what, a cartel market update? SW franchise is getting hyped as a whole. EA wants to ride that hype. I dotn really mind, because they did invest some money in SWTOR and are hoping that with new direction they can turn it around. BUT, they did promise "regular content on x weeks schedule" quite a few times by now, i guess 5th-6th time is the charm? Edited October 13, 2015 by Mikahrtwo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjmck Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 Going to admit off the bat that the entire thread is tl;dr...but going by the OP, if I understand it correctly, you are basing the entire premise that swtor has failed and there needs to be a new star wars mmo all because people in your guild don't play anymore which must obviously translate into people in general aren't playing the game anymore.....Well guess it is just a week till the new xpac so more of these threads will be popping up...The game is still being played by hundreds of thousands of people, it's still making money for EA, lots of people have stopped playing so they can return when the xpac drops, lots of people have returned to level for the new xpac....not sure where you get that the game has failed and we need a new mmo...swtor is fine...play it or don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanorDM Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 One thing is success and a different one is to survive. If the game is making a profit, and adding content then yes it is a success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psikofunkster Posted October 13, 2015 Share Posted October 13, 2015 (edited) If the game is making a profit, and adding content then yes it is a success. No thats only for eas benefit on the gamer s circles it is not, the game is not relevant anymore..it subsist still? Sure we are here aren't we? Edited October 13, 2015 by psikofunkster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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