*RANT* **** These broken *** OP/Scoundrel Classes

[masih_ad_dajjal]

Give one of those rare good players the ability to dodge very important incoming dmg then give him knowledgeable teammates who can help him via voice and sure op is getting abused in some peoples minds...but in the long run they can be dealt with quite easily.

 

99% of QQ is from bad players that got globaled.. they are no where near as OP as the old op or smash or bubble stun sorc or even the recent hatred sin.

Edited September 25, 2015 by masih_ad_dajjal

[eGraced]

Give one of those rare good players the ability to dodge very important incoming dmg then give him knowledgeable teammates who can help him via voice and sure op is getting abused in some peoples minds...but in the long run they can be dealt with quite easily.

 

99% of QQ is from bad players that got globaled.. they are no where near as OP as the old op or smash or bubble stun sorc or even the recent hatred sin.

 

It never ceases to amaze me how many people simply cannot entertain the idea that there could be a skill problem on their end. My first thought when I get facerolled is either "ouch! I need to get better" or "how'd they do that? How can I counter/avoid it?"... but then again I know I suck at PvP but enjoy it anyway.

[masih_ad_dajjal]

It never ceases to amaze me how many people simply cannot entertain the idea that there could be a skill problem on their end. My first thought when I get facerolled is either "ouch! I need to get better" or "how'd they do that? How can I counter/avoid it?"... but then again I know I suck at PvP but enjoy it anyway.

 

Nothing better than someone who loves pvp ... Just keep up the passion and diligence to improve and you'll be scaring others soon.

[xX-Archangel-Xx]

Nothing better than someone who loves pvp ... Just keep up the passion and diligence to improve and you'll be scaring others soon.

 

depend, he needs to hutrry before all players will stop to play it

[masih_ad_dajjal]

depend, he needs to hutrry before all players will stop to play it

 

I been worried about that for almost 5 years now lol..and yes the player base has degraded a bit but there are a lot of players to play..hope the new expansions bring some more back even if for a time... even i who subbed forever has played little this year and am doing WS beta and going to do B&S.

 

Still I spent A LOT of time on this game so I'll never fully leave

[xX-Archangel-Xx]

I been worried about that for almost 5 years now lol..and yes the player base has degraded a bit but there are a lot of players to play..hope the new expansions bring some more back even if for a time... even i who subbed forever has played little this year and am doing WS beta and going to do B&S.

 

Still I spent A LOT of time on this game so I'll never fully leave

 

yes, i was talking indirectly about my server XD

Edited September 25, 2015 by xX-Archangel-Xx

[Transcendent]

My first thought when I get facerolled is either "ouch! I need to get better" or "how'd they do that? How can I counter/avoid it?"... but then again I know I suck at PvP but enjoy it anyway.

 

Those questions already elevate you well above the average player, most don't try to learn and simply ask for nerfs.

[eGraced]

Nothing better than someone who loves pvp ... Just keep up the passion and diligence to improve and you'll be scaring others soon.

 

I've mained a concealment op since early access. Still don't think I've ever genuinely scared anyone, but I guard objectives well and get some pretty good stealth caps here and there... plus let's be honest, nothing beats the feeling of chain-capping through all the doors in Voidstar in 2 minutes!

 

Regardless, there is always room to improve. Always! The day I feel like I can't get better is the day I solo queue ranked for a reality check.

[eGraced]

Those questions already elevate you well above the average player, most don't try to learn and simply ask for nerfs.

 

Thank you for that! It was also kind of my point... so many people never even consider the idea that they could possibly improve, it must be horrible FoTM OP classes or hacks...

[masih_ad_dajjal]

I've mained a concealment op since early access. Still don't think I've ever genuinely scared anyone, but I guard objectives well and get some pretty good stealth caps here and there... plus let's be honest, nothing beats the feeling of chain-capping through all the doors in Voidstar in 2 minutes!

 

Regardless, there is always room to improve. Always! The day I feel like I can't get better is the day I solo queue ranked for a reality check.

 

In a WZ or most arena I agree...that's what this post was about... Now if you talking 1v1 conceal should scare the **** out of everyone even sins.. and trust me they do.

[eGraced]

In a WZ or most arena I agree...that's what this post was about... Now if you talking 1v1 conceal should scare the **** out of everyone even sins.. and trust me they do.

 

The only 1v1 I really do is when I'm guarding a node or attempting a stealth cap... generally if they have enough time to be scared before they die, I'm going to be in trouble and hope my incoming call was seen by someone!

[Master-Nala]

I'm not sure I can agree that an extra 2k over 9s (or, ~270 extra healing per second) is "significantly more", especially considering one is instant with basically no cost and has a CD 3s shorter than it's duration and the other has a 2s cast time, a cd equal to it's duration, plus a cost. Those numbers are also closer than that, I have 0 datacrons on my Sage atm and my Op has all of them. However, editted other post for clarity.

 

Both the initial heal and the HoT heal for more. Look, I'm not saying that this is the only thing we can look at here, but Kolto Infusion is significantly better. When I say things like this I'm looking at the base values which we can compare directly. Many times folks are relating what they are seeing on the ground which can be affected by a number of things.

 

I usually look at the data from the dataminers or cheat and use Dulfy's calculator (which is based on the same info.)

 

Basically, in terms of off healing, you can throw out a 7-10k bubble (instant), which generally gives you enough time to do the rest of these other things, plus a 1600-2200 Rejuvenate (instant) plus a meager hot. In the time it took you to do that, the Op casted one KI, assuming they had a TA in the first place and it didn't get kicked, which heals for roughly the same as Rejuv.

 

This is true for Concealment (which is what the OP is probably whining about to be fair), but Lethality procs it as an instant. And again, it really, really does heal for a lot more than Rejuvenate.

 

Meanwhile, the Sorc/Sage bought their teammate 8.5k-12k extra HP, while the Op gave you ~3-3.5k. You can now spam Benevolence/(Dark Heal? Don't remember) for 5-10k up to 12 times back to back (full force, no alacrity). The Op spends 2 globals to get probes up, healing you for nothing instantly and ~2250 on the second global (which is only even that high because the first tick from probe 1 and the forced tick from probe 2 happen simultaneously, every other forced tick after is ~1500). In summary, 4 globals (6s), Sage/Sorc can give you ~18.5k HP, plus the meager hot from Rejuv for a total of roughly 20k. Op, 3 abilities, (5s) again assuming they had the resource required to even cast KI in the first place, 5.7k. At that point the Sage/Sorc can continue spamming 4k+ 1.5s cast heals, while the Op can only force KP ticks of 1500. Sage/Sorc can actually save people with off healing as a DPS, a Sco/Op can... Slightly mitigate some dot pressure?

 

You (not you in particular Nala) are comparing a stock 1988 Civic to a 2015 Aventador. The gap in terms of output is that substantial.

 

 

As I noted, I'm not saying that Sorcerer off-healing is ineffective or weaker than Operatives. It's different, better in the way most PvPers care about (burst healing), but Operatives, especially Lethality are no slouches in the off-healing department.

 

My only quarrel with your post is that the PvP forum trades in too much misinformation. I have no problem with saying that Sorcerer healing is too strong. It is, and later today, I'm quite sure they will explain how they are nerfing it back to earth. But let's be fair and acknowledge what other classes have. And Operatives have a lot. I should know, it's why I leveled 3 of them and 2 Scoundrels.

Edited September 25, 2015 by Master-Nala

[Smuglebunny]

Op/scoundrel is the 4th best class in the game at most. (maybe 5th) I dont see how you can continue to cry about them when there are 3 more dangerous classes. (my jugg seems to crush ops all the time)

 

Also, I dont seem to have a problem fighting them on any class and I play them all(not commando).

 

Ops used to have:

orbital flyby

cover that prevented them from being leaped to

stronger heals

more stuns

more damage

unlimited rolls

 

Now these things have been nerfed away and ya still cant fight one? Still cryin about ops? Still using cc break on hidden strike. For shame.

This thread shouldnt be here. Its a l2p thread.

[Blikki]

Comments in red, l2p.

Also, Maul, VS? Deception Sin complaining about Ops?

 

sin complaning about ops? why cannot they? good OP win 10 out 10 duels againts em

[Xanas]

Op/scoundrel is the 4th best class in the game at most. (maybe 5th) I dont see how you can continue to cry about them when there are 3 more dangerous classes. (my jugg seems to crush ops all the time)

 

Also, I dont seem to have a problem fighting them on any class and I play them all(not commando).

 

Ops used to have:

orbital flyby

cover that prevented them from being leaped to

stronger heals

more stuns

more damage

unlimited rolls

 

Now these things have been nerfed away and ya still cant fight one? Still cryin about ops? Still using cc break on hidden strike. For shame.

This thread shouldnt be here. Its a l2p thread.

 

If you crush ops on your jugg then you never had to fight a good one.

[Hiro_Wildfire]

so rolling and avopid damage is called skil now ? Well, i presume when i hit "e" for focused defense im a pro playing player

 

useing a short defensive cooldown that lasts 1.5 seconds to nullify a classes burst of some sort, by pre-emptively rolling before their burst hit's? Yes, I'd call that skill. Its easier to do against a casted move though, or a timed explosive.

 

 

forgive me but against 7 ppl u do not need skills, u need luck

And the example is nvalid, in eso u have stamina if u roll like a ball, u won't run and parry so u insta die

 

Actualy its quite valid, if you roll needlessly? You blow your best DCD and gap closer, leaveing you a nice squishy target.

 

 

Despite what 99% says, at least im telling you what is op with operatives

 

No. You're giveing your opinion on what you think is OP about a class/spec that does not have a presence in the top 25 in the leaderboards.

 

 

you and a lot of ppl just say "gnegnegne sorcs top lead gnegnegne butt hurt gnegnegne nerf"

 

No need to be rude, its simply one of many examples that people rightfully use. If you don't like people backing up what they're saying with supportive evidence in some regard? I surgest you deal with it.

 

 

we are complaining about his huge burst and rolls, nerf a little bit the output damage and rework the roll, and they are ok. Without cd's my merc for example goes from 100% to 25 in 3 secs, is *********** insane. Probably you atr thinking " yes but ap pt's are even worse", yes but it beter i d o not speak bouit ap, or i get banned for good this time

 

If your merc goes to 100% hp to 25% hp in 3 seconds from an operatives burst, then thats nothing to do with the operative. It is a very fundemental lack of skill or understanding on your part, on how to mitagate damage. Gunnery commando's have this thing that absorb's around 6 tech attack's. I'd advise useing that.

 

Also, now we're complaining about the ammount of damage they do as well? Alright then...

 

 

So!

the roll is OP, the off-heal's are OP, the damage is op as well now! A stealth burst class being built towards 1v1 is unfair and operatives can stunlock people.

 

Hmm. Thats just about everything the class that can do that is Apparently Overpowered, minus a few things... Soon people might say the ammount of roots they can have is op as well! Or maybe their flashbang that can mezz up to 8 people for 8 seconds, or then root that stops you from turning.

 

Sorry if this comes across as a little snarky, but the ammount of complaints about a class that isn't overperforming is simply rediculous

[QuiveringPotato]

What's funny is that most of the people that QQ about DPS operatives (I can understand QQing about the roll in concealment, it's pretty strong, buuuut, that's the only overtuned thing atm. And possibly Lethality's offheals, but very, very few people play leth) are the same people that cried about them when they were complete poop (1.2 --- 2.7).

 

I almost want us to get the nerfbat so I can go back to playing the underdog class and still make people rage when they lose.

 

Concealment Operatives, currently, are about where Deception Assassin was in 2.0 > 2.8 or whenever they got their burst altered (maybe it was 3.0), and no one ever complained about assassins back then.

 

Yes, they're hard to fight 1v1; IF the player behind the screen is good. There are very few "good" DPS operatives, and those good ones are most likely the people who have been playing the class through all of the nerfs, the same people that still rolled bads back when concealment/lethality were absolutely the worst DPS specs for PVP.

 

I'm an "above-average" operative, but against any competent player, I'm forced to fight defensively in 1v1's and take my time in killing them. Going in balls-deep and "stunlocking" people as the OP complains about will get you killed most times if the other player is half-decent.

Edited September 25, 2015 by QuiveringPotato

[xX-Archangel-Xx]

pretending buff and nerf according to one of the most broken content in te game is silly, top sorcs are heals and i said countless time needs a nerf ( honestly dunno why got buffed last patch but bioware can surprise us every time)

[MoshhsoM]

yeah, maras are squishier.

This is why I love watching this )) http://www.twitch.tv/mosh47/v/17329736

But to be fair, mosh is top 5 rated operative/scoundrel, so he knew how to counter operative. And that guy was thrown by the 6 second cc immunity and blew a hard stun and a flash into it. Still a great duel to watch.

 

m8. 99% of the people here have never seen me stream. If they did, there wouldnt be so many ridiculous posts regarding nerfs to operatives. I can do a troll post about sorce needing buffs and one guy out of the replies will actually realize I was trolling and all the "sub-par players" will actually think its true cause they fail or dont have the skill level to know how to play their classes or play against other classes.

 

<3

Edited September 25, 2015 by MoshhsoM

[PrincessNuri]

I been worried about that for almost 5 years now lol..and yes the player base has degraded a bit but there are a lot of players to play..hope the new expansions bring some more back even if for a time... even i who subbed forever has played little this year and am doing WS beta and going to do B&S.

 

Still I spent A LOT of time on this game so I'll never fully leave

 

I will see you on B&S too!! When does it come again? I assumed december

[Iona_Var]

The real challenge with op's is their roll. It is annoying but most of the time it comes down to player skill. I've killed many a concealment operative who has opened up on me first because I was a better player. I've also had very challenging 1v1 fights against good operatives and in the end the only nerf I'd like to see operatives get is the ability to roll through acid and fire traps on huttball. That's really the only OP thing about them. Their off-heals are strong but I wouldn't call them OP.