Listen to the hardcore players.

[luchiferchuga]

I wish I could vote this post up. Good insight.

 

I've been in "hard core" guilds, and I've been in casual guilds with people who, despite having lives outside of the game, were able to complete end game stuff in a competent manner. Guess which group was more fun to play with?

 

I was in Tindi Losi, a top end guild, a long time ago. The raid leader was a pain in the *** with everyone.. it was this kid, Devastatian, calling everyone names because "the healers plain suck". Then I grew up and left them for a guild of only ten friends wich was way more fun.

[Wiggletphyre]

tl;dr

 

So what your saying is that they should let the unemployed do there jobs?

 

If these *Hardcore* Players know so much on making a good MMO then why aren't they out there making it?

Edited December 26, 2011 by Wiggletphyre

[Fyuria]

I wish I could vote this post up. Good insight.

 

I've been in "hard core" guilds, and I've been in casual guilds with people who, despite having lives outside of the game, were able to complete end game stuff in a competent manner. Guess which group was more fun to play with?

 

Exactly. This hardcore mentality is outdated today, even if it was once relevant however things have changed and frankly that's life, nothing stays the same.

Edited December 26, 2011 by Fyuria

[Jett-Rinn]

From my experience, the so-called "hardcore" gamers are the type of people who rush through all the content that people have spent years working on, and end up constantly foaming at the mouth for the developers to churn out content at an ever increasing rate to satisfy their insane and addiction type playstyle.

 

They generally have very little appreciation for anything or anybody that doesn't fit in with their ridiculous desire to turn everything into a race to see who finishes whatever first, and IMO that goes against the core of what an MMO is about.

 

In fact, this type of player has a negative impact on every game they are involved in, they ruin communities, disrespect the hard work that goes into creating a lifelike and immersive world, and turn what should be a social and imaginative activity into just another dumb hypercompetitive environment.

 

I have time and time again and will continue to say that such people are way better off playing either FPS or competitive RTS games, because those formats specifically cater to such mindsets.

 

MMOs simply are not designed to function in that way, and when developers try to make them, it ruins the game.

 

So in reality I think the OP is completely wrong.

 

Ding ding ding

 

We have a winna!

[Maduece]

From my experience, the so-called "hardcore" gamers are the type of people who rush through all the content that people have spent years working on, and end up constantly foaming at the mouth for the developers to churn out content at an ever increasing rate to satisfy their insane and addiction type playstyle.

 

They generally have very little appreciation for anything or anybody that doesn't fit in with their ridiculous desire to turn everything into a race to see who finishes whatever first, and IMO that goes against the core of what an MMO is about.

 

In fact, this type of player has a negative impact on every game they are involved in, they ruin communities, disrespect the hard work that goes into creating a lifelike and immersive world, and turn what should be a social and imaginative activity into just another dumb hypercompetitive environment.

 

I have time and time again and will continue to say that such people are way better off playing either FPS or competitive RTS games, because those formats specifically cater to such mindsets.

 

MMOs simply are not designed to function in that way, and when developers try to make them, it ruins the game.

 

So in reality I think the OP is completely wrong.

 

This.

[kimmeh]

I'm confused? why would i envy some guy in the top end raid gear when it looks like a banana suit? (the consular end game stuff looks bad imho).

 

tell you what OP - the moment i start to look at a hardcore player and envy them to the point where i want to be them, i'll quit.

 

if it were to ever get to that, i probably wouldn't be able to afford the sub because of the divorce settlement anyhow.

 

the friends and family i have that bought the game are playing it because it's fun and it's an activity we can do together on the cheap ( compared to going to the cinema each week for example).

 

if one of us started spouting that they wanted to be like player "x" and pointed to some guy flexing in a city we'd probably take it as a prime opportunity to take said friend to the pub and try and get him laid.

[Vaestmannaeyjar]

OP is the biggest piece of **** argument I ever saw in a forum. I'm playing the game, I know what I want , and I don't care about any other people I will never play with and the opinions they have on what I should enjoy or need.

 

I have time and time again and will continue to say that such people are way better off playing either FPS or competitive RTS games, because those formats specifically cater to such mindsets.

 

Those that win do. The MMO "hardcore" are the guys too weak for starcraft and who get repeatedly stomped on in real competitive environments. So they need their epeen from someplace else and go to places where items+playtime > skills

Edited December 26, 2011 by Vaestmannaeyjar

[Vampyress]

Indeed, but since when did the casual mentality mean all you do is the same quests over and over for gear? Because that's all this game has to offer... Congratz guys, you killed pvp, pve and crafting, the community thanks you...

[Jimer_Lins]

You're not your class. You're not how many credits you have. You're not the speeder you drive. You're not the contents of your inventory. You're not your f****** loot. You're the all-singing, all-dancing crap of the game world.

 

You are not special. You are not a beautiful or unique snowflake. You’re the same abstract collection of stats and levels as anyone else.

[ageNtreachery]

These players win the loot and achieve the goals that the casual, poor and part-time (these are not the same player) players drive to emulate, they ride mounts and hold titles that pull the masses on to play the game.

 

haha, what a load of crap. The only people who are aware of hardcore guilds are other hardcore guilds. The general population barely know you exist and your 'achievements' are beyond irrelevant. And the fact that you think you are the center of attention would be hilarious if it wasn't so pathetic.

[Inhalcator]

It is obvious that the devs of this game and any MMO need to listen to the hardcore players.

 

Too those players already 50 and beginning some of the endgame.

 

These players win the loot and achieve the goals that the casual, poor and part-time (these are not the same player) players drive to emulate, they ride mounts and hold titles that pull the masses on to play the game.

 

Now you are going to see ALOT of responses from players saying they DONT want this, that they dont look to players that play insanely long periods, or succeed with less time played. They will say that the game does NOT need these players.

 

They are flat out wrong

 

Without the hardcore, uber players staying here neither will the casuals and masses. They say they will but if there are no top end players playing SW:TOR then it will become a bit of a joke in the mmo world.

 

Please I beg you BW, listen to those players that are already 50, already beginning endgame operations, these people KNOW what makes an MMO succeed and what will keep them playing.

 

Ultimately KEEP THE HARDCORE/Elite PLAYING = Keeping the masses playing.

 

*edit below..

 

No, I do think we are social animals though, that like it or not we do look up to those we play with, and ultimately those we play with look up to other people they know or play with.

 

My point is if you do not keep the very highest achievers interested in the game then they will move on, the effect of keeping these people interested is keeping all those that play down the chain interested.

 

Those saying "I only care what my friends do... etc" are only reinforcing my point, without knowing it.

 

The bottom 1% "look up" to the 2% the 2% aspires to achieve the 3%'s loot and success, it is a chain effect all the way to the top.

 

There is a chain, an unbroken link to the very highest achievers in game.

 

 

Translation: herp derp epeen me smart you noob.

 

I play mmos because it is fun to play with my friends. The vocal minority, *******, epeeners will not make or break this game. You have an inflated ego over a GAME. You are not a leader. People having fun will not follow you.

[Baizak]

You're not your class. You're not how many credits you have. You're not the speeder you drive. You're not the contents of your inventory. You're not your f****** loot. You're the all-singing, all-dancing crap of the game world.

 

You are not special. You are not a beautiful or unique snowflake. You’re the same abstract collection of stats and levels as anyone else.

 

I have yet to find a life situation that a quote from fight club can not encapsulate. Bravo

[Asulynn]

76% of statistics are made up on the spot.

 

It appears to me that the general theme here is that "casual" players are simply bad, or lack the ability to be every bit as "good" at the game as the "hardcore elitists" -- Which simply is not the case at all.

 

As a 21 year old, single and jobless person, I have all the time in the world to devote to and effectively be part of that assumed "1% hardcore" base. I also happen to be a masochist for challenge and difficulty, with the patience of a brick wall having a staring contest with Gandhi.

 

With that said, they need to strike a balance between catering to one side or the other. I do not want them to cater specifically to the hardcore side, as that will just alienate those who do not have the time or willpower to devote to accomplishing things.

 

Humans are competitive by nature. We like achievements, we like being competitive, we strive to be the best at something. For the vast majority that is not video games. But it sure is nice to feel like we actually accomplished a milestone, rather than have it handed over on a silver platter. On the flip side, content that is too difficult can be a frustrating turn-off.

 

It is far easier to hold onto an already existing player base than it is to gain it. Word of mouth is the best form of advertisement. If you don't have something you can immediately jump into at the snap of a finger to play with your friends, what use is there in telling them about it?

[DontDenyRy]

OP you're not harcore/elite in any way, shape or form.

 

You're what we call a try-hard.

 

It is you and your Ilk that give the true hardcore a bad name.

 

Now please find some other way to get recognition.

[Fyuria]

You're not your class. You're not how many credits you have. You're not the speeder you drive. You're not the contents of your inventory. You're not your f****** loot. You're the all-singing, all-dancing crap of the game world.

 

You are not special. You are not a beautiful or unique snowflake. You’re the same abstract collection of stats and levels as anyone else.

 

A little more colourful quote then I would of used but well said.

Edited December 26, 2011 by Fyuria

[Proto]

This is completely wrong.

 

In a financial perspective it is extremely wrong to cater to only 1% of your game population.

 

Wall Street doesn't agree.

[Jett-Rinn]

So Bioware lets review.

 

The vast majority disagrees with the OP.

 

We are your 99%.

Just remember that

Edited December 26, 2011 by Jett-Rinn

[Jett-Rinn]

Wall Street doesn't agree.

 

Get back to us in five years on how that worked out

[Shippior]

Didn't read through all the 11 pages of posts so what I say might have already been said.

 

I consider myself not really hardcore, I have quite a difficult study and have to work next to it to be able to pay the bills. I consider myself quite skilled though. That is why at the end of Cataclysm with the last 2 patches (Lich King Citadel and that stupid tournament ground) I simply didn't enjoy it anymore as it was way too easy. I don't mind spending hours, multiple times a week, if available trying to tune down the strategy for a boss. So instead of giving MORE content for level 50. FIX the current content atm to make sure it is interesting. I mean why keep playing if you get all the loot of the new operation on Day 1?

Edited December 26, 2011 by Shippior

[Stifor]

It is obvious that the devs of this game and any MMO need to listen to the hardcore players.

 

Too those players already 50 and beginning some of the endgame.

 

These players win the loot and achieve the goals that the casual, poor and part-time (these are not the same player) players drive to emulate, they ride mounts and hold titles that pull the masses on to play the game.

 

Now you are going to see ALOT of responses from players saying they DONT want this, that they dont look to players that play insanely long periods, or succeed with less time played. They will say that the game does NOT need these players.

 

They are flat out wrong

 

Without the hardcore, uber players staying here neither will the casuals and masses. They say they will but if there are no top end players playing SW:TOR then it will become a bit of a joke in the mmo world.

 

Please I beg you BW, listen to those players that are already 50, already beginning endgame operations, these people KNOW what makes an MMO succeed and what will keep them playing.

 

Ultimately KEEP THE HARDCORE/Elite PLAYING = Keeping the masses playing.

 

*edit below..

 

No, I do think we are social animals though, that like it or not we do look up to those we play with, and ultimately those we play with look up to other people they know or play with.

 

My point is if you do not keep the very highest achievers interested in the game then they will move on, the effect of keeping these people interested is keeping all those that play down the chain interested.

 

Those saying "I only care what my friends do... etc" are only reinforcing my point, without knowing it.

 

The bottom 1% "look up" to the 2% the 2% aspires to achieve the 3%'s loot and success, it is a chain effect all the way to the top.

 

There is a chain, an unbroken link to the very highest achievers in game.

 

So listen to you because you have no job and rushed to 50 playing 16 hours a day no thanks!

[Bleddyn]

I don't know if I am a hardcore gamer or not... I play every day, sometimes for many hours. In past games I have always capped my mains pretty quick, and do large raids 3 - 4 times a week.

 

Although I think the OP would consider me casual because I work to make money and don't think food comes from yelling "is it ready?" at Mom, I also believe that a majority of gamers would consider that fairly hardcore.

 

The reason I say this is to show that I feel I am fully qualified to say that the OP seriously needs to look in the mirror and see the average person that is there.

Edited December 26, 2011 by Bleddyn

[carnac_fett]

Is this a joke thread?

[Jxspyder]

And good to see the Casuals getting blamed for anything and everything other players do not understand because its obviously their fault.

Blame Casuals!

Blame Casuals!

 

It seems everything's gone wrong

Since the Casuals came along

 

Blame Casuals!

Blame Casuals!

 

They're not even real gamers anyway!

[Varlak]

 

Please I beg you BW, listen to those players that are already 50, already beginning endgame operations, these people KNOW what makes an MMO succeed and what will keep them playing.

[/color]

 

So you claim that 1% of the player population know whats the other 99% of the community want to see in a game ?

[kalzlix]

Hard core after 6 days? oh dear