Nico Okarr's Coat - What a disappointment

[talonmke]

Andryah,

 

And IF they subbed in order to get the promotional items, they made a cash transaction in order to receive an item that is only available by making the cash transaction by a certain date. THUS as the items availability is ONLY tied to a cash transaction, the item is not FREE.

 

And, as I already said, were it only _small_ differences and people whining about how it is not _exactly_ like the cinematic/other art depicted coat I would agree with you.

 

The thing is, its is, to all present appearances, not only NOT AT ALL like the coat in the cinematics, but it is just another color variation of an exisiting item.

 

So you are not getting 'Nico Okarr's Duster', or an item that is made to closely resemble if not be exactly representative of the Duster as depicted in game art. You are getting a 'Troublemaker's Coat' named Nico's Duster and given a tan colour palette.

 

So stop attacking these people who are disappointed just because you have recently decided to be a fannerd of BioWare/SWTOR again and feel the need to justify everything and everything they do for whatever reason you do that.

 

Admit that what they are getting is not what they were told they were getting by any reasonable person test..

Admit they ad to PAY to get it, and that the only way to get it was a cash transaction by a certain date.

Admit that it is important to them, just as whatever issues that made you quit and then come sniveling back and acting your old self were important to you.

Sorry, but we were not told we would be getting the duster model from the cinematic trailer, we were told we will be getting Nico Okarr's duster, the one that is shown in the promotional images of him and not the images from the trailer. Nowhere on these forums or on Social media has a dev stated definitively that we'll be getting the Trailer model for Nico's duster. Having the duster look like the "Troublemaker" duster is perfectly okay to me. That it isn't okay with you is another matter. Again, we were told that we were getting Nico Okarr's duster, the one from the promotional images. I'm fine with getting that duster. This whole argument over a digital item is silly at best.

[Reno_Tarshil]

If you want to think you're getting something for free when you actually have to pay for it, no one can dissuade you, apparently. Either that or you really do have the elusive $0/month subscription plan.

 

Look up non sequitor.

 

I'm getting free stuff for being a subscriber. It doesn't matter how much I pay for my subscription because that's irrelevant since I'd be paying the subscription anyways. What is relevant is whether or not I am getting free things for being a subscriber, which I am.

 

Also Also if BW wanted to market Cats as actually Dogs then to them it is so. Your example doesn't change the fact that compared to two previous expansions that this one will be free.

[branmakmuffin]

Your example doesn't change the fact that compared to two previous expansions that this one will be free.

We can do this all day. Please tell us where we can all get the $0/month subscription plan that you appear to have access to.

[Eanelinea]

http://www.swtor.com/fallen-empire/rewards?intcmp=sor_bwa-mkt-t-us-hp-203

 

Seriously, just look at the pictures provided in the marketing materials.

 

Then use this:

 

https://www.google.com/search?q=Nico+Okarr&rlz=1T4GGHP_enUS456US457&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAWoVChMIw-vLl__vxwIVwRmSCh3y9Ae5&biw=1229&bih=955

 

What is shown in the Twitter screenshot is not what is shown in any of the other pictures, most especially the pictures in their own marketing material saying what you would get.

 

Reasonable people would expect that when you say 'Do this and get this' and they have a picture of 'this', that what you actually get would be the 'this' they pictured, and it is not.

 

The chest portion is different. the collar is different, the rear is likely different because it instead appears to very match an existing asset in the game.

 

Its disingenuous of BioWare if not outright dishonest.

 

On one hand, I don't give a hoot what I get because it's free for me as a subscriber and I didn't subscribe just to get a duster (if anything the more important thing was Nico himself, which I've earned being a sub). On the other hand, even if it wasn't 100% exactly like Nico's duster, say from the trailer, I was okay with that. Trailer is completely different from actual in game items. I understand this. But if they show a picture, saying THIS is what you'll get and we are expecting at least SOMETHING very similar to that....giving us essentially a *********** ugly in the game already just a different color duster/item is two completely different things.

 

If they were going to give us a recolored troublemaker duster, they shouldn't have shown us a more glamorous duster picture, making us believe it'd actually be something unique. THAT is what I'M annoyed about. I'm not going to unsub over something stupid like a duster, hell, if I stayed a sub when the game had more issues than it does now, I'm going to stay even with this duster thing.

 

I didn't even vote for the dumb Party Jawa, but it won, I got it, and I just went 'eh, free shinies' and was done with it.

[Blackbird]

I'm getting free stuff for being a subscriber. It doesn't matter how much I pay for my subscription because that's irrelevant since I'd be paying the subscription anyways. What is relevant is whether or not I am getting free things for being a subscriber, which I am.

 

Also Also if BW wanted to market Cats as actually Dogs then to them it is so. Your example doesn't change the fact that compared to two previous expansions that this one will be free.

 

So because marketing tells you it's free, you believe you aren't paying for it?

 

I'm guessing that you believe everything politicians tell you too.

[branmakmuffin]

If they were going to give us a recolored troublemaker duster, they shouldn't have shown us a more glamorous duster picture

They showed us this.

[Max_Killjoy]

"Buy this, get that free." is just a way of shill's way of saying "you still have to spend money, but the stuff is cheaper on a piece by piece basis".

 

FREE is when you walk in, and they give you something, no strings attached and no cost.

[Eanelinea]

They showed us this.

 

I know, but THAT doesn't look like the dusters we have now. It looks like a cross between a regular ugly duster and the top of an imperial uniform. And even the color in the picture you showed, is a different color then the in game picture.

 

As I said, I'm not a goober who only subbed for the shinies and nothing else. So even if the duster is butt *********** ugly or not, it makes no difference to me cause I'd have gotten it even if they told us one day before release that people who subbed since the beginning would get a duster, I'd have it cause I've been subbed for almost 4 years.

 

My point is, if they were going to give us an ugly troublemaker duster reskin, they should have just posted a picture of IT and not a concept art promotional thing making us think it'd look 100% like the picture.

[Knockerz]

Oh how cute.. a call-out post... out of context and incorrect.. but nice try

 

 

 

LOL... you mean people subscribed soley to get the duster? So.. these people are not actually playing the game then..... just subscribing to get digital fluffy bunny incentives. I guess it takes all kinds. Then again... we both know you are simply conflating for convenience here so you can go nutz in the forum and go on railing on Bioware.

 

 

 

Really.. show me where exactly they specify the details of the Duster. I'll wait.

 

But let's get pragmatic here for a moment and put down the rhetoric.... Sorry to break it too you (not really) but in MMOs ALL content is subject to change/revision at any time and in any manner. Or are you that oblivious to the unannounced changes to gear made in this game since launch???? Suck it up or move on IMO.

 

 

 

That my dear is called a promotional incentive. Do X and we will give you Y for free.

 

The subscription costs money and is not free. The Duster however, has no price tag and cannot be purchased. It is however a promotional incentive to subscribers. There IS a difference, except maybe for alleged mouth breathers who are only subscribing to collect digital perks they will likely discard shortly after release anyway... given the proliferation of chest piece already in game.

 

By the way I personally DO NOT believe anyone actually subscribed simply to get the Duster. Your entire argument and rage is specious. I can however believe some people did/do subscribe to actually get Nico and to get early access. Much more likely though... people are subscribing for the 12X XP promotion that leads up to 4.0.

 

WoW Andryah.

[branmakmuffin]

My point is, if they were going to give us an ugly troublemaker duster reskin, they should have just posted a picture of IT

That's exactly what they did post. That's what's in the link I keep posting.

Edited September 11, 2015 by branmakmuffin

[Reno_Tarshil]

We can do this all day. Please tell us where we can all get the $0/month subscription plan that you appear to have access to.

 

I already told you what I pay a month is irrelevant, since I'm paying the same subscription fee I would normally pay to play the game unburdened with or with free subscriber bonus rewards. I don't pay a sub fee for free stuff, I pay it play the game, getting free stuff for being a subscriber is just an added bonus.

 

So because marketing tells you it's free, you believe you aren't paying for it?

 

I'm guessing that you believe everything politicians tell you too.

 

Yes I do believe if something says free, then it is free as long as I qualify to get it.

 

Also, I don't care for politics.

 

"Buy this, get that free." is just a way of shill's way of saying "you still have to spend money, but the stuff is cheaper on a piece by piece basis".

 

FREE is when you walk in, and they give you something, no strings attached and no cost.

 

It is free by your example as they are giving you a free expansion for being a subscriber like normal. Nothing extra beyond that.

[Belegnole]

If a company shows you one thing and gives you another it is considered bait and switch. It may not have been the intent, but it IS what I am seeing.

[Reno_Tarshil]

I know, but THAT doesn't look like the dusters we have now. It looks like a cross between a regular ugly duster and the top of an imperial uniform. And even the color in the picture you showed, is a different color then the in game picture.

 

As I said, I'm not a goober who only subbed for the shinies and nothing else. So even if the duster is butt *********** ugly or not, it makes no difference to me cause I'd have gotten it even if they told us one day before release that people who subbed since the beginning would get a duster, I'd have it cause I've been subbed for almost 4 years.

 

My point is, if they were going to give us an ugly troublemaker duster reskin, they should have just posted a picture of IT and not a concept art promotional thing making us think it'd look 100% like the picture.

 

http://tor-fashion.com/troublemaker/ It's the same thing, the back shoulderpads area are still there.

[Eanelinea]

http://tor-fashion.com/troublemaker/ It's the same thing, the back shoulderpads area are still there.

 

I'll keep my unfettered duster. Nico can roll around in the game's version of his stuff. I won't.

 

But still, it's just a chest piece, not really worth subbing or unsubbing for.

[branmakmuffin]

I already told you what I pay a month is irrelevant

It is entirely relevant. If you pay more than $0/month, none of the stuff you get with your sub is free, not your 500+ CC a month, and not any "be subbed as of this date" swag. They are effectively price reductions because you are getting something of value for the same price you were paying for the same thing without them, but they are not free. Again, if they were free, I could start a new F2P account and get them on that account.

Edited September 11, 2015 by branmakmuffin

[Reno_Tarshil]

It is entirely relevant. If you pay more than $0/month, none of the stuff you get with your sub is free, not your 500+ CC a month, and not any "be subbed as of this date" swag. They are effectively price reductions because you are getting something of value for the same price you were paying for the same thing without them, but they are not free. Again, if they were free, I could start a new F2P account and get them on that account.

 

It's irrelevant because it's only paying for my access to the game and forums, everything else they sprinkle on are just free fluff. And they are free because you arn't doing anything extra beyond what you would normally do when being a subscriber.

Edited September 11, 2015 by Reno_Tarshil

[DarthZeroe]

nullified Edited September 12, 2015 by DarthZeroe

[The-Kaitou-Kid]

Bran:

 

http://swtorista.com/uploads/outfitimages/troublemaker_01_854x4804150.jpg - Rear view, does not match rear-view of marketing material per the link off their main SWTOR page, top banner represented by:

 

http://cdn-www.swtor.com/sites/all/files/en/fallenempire/bothawui/screens/duster-thumb.jpg

 

So if this does turn out to be like the troublemaker set, there are some significant differences that would mean its just another copy of the same troublemaker armor, so a reasonable distinction and disappointment for those people who were subscribing _solely_ to receive the additional items.

 

Rear view of the Troublemaker set doesn't match the promotional pictures but we have no clue what the rear view of Nico's jacket looks like since the screenshot doesn't show it, so it's not a reasonable distinction. Being a reskin of the Troublemaker Duster doesn't mean it's exactly the Troublemaker Duster. Most people would consider the Subversive set a reskin of the Troublemaker set (and all the matching chestpieces the Agent can get) but they're not the same. They have several differences, including some that you couldn't tell by a lone screenshot (the way they interact with dyes). This could very well be a case of that, but we don't know.

 

If it does turn out to have that same thing on the back, I'd be a bit disappointed myself as that's one of the worst things about those dusters in my opinion.

 

http://tor-fashion.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/MTroublemakerBack.png - another view of the back. Again, while there are similarities there are some significant differences.

 

From the marketing materials page:

 

http://cdn-www.swtor.com/sites/all/files/en/fallenempire/bothawui/screens/hero-thumb.jpg - Save the file, make it larger to make out the details. Cheat portion is different than:

 

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/COe7bl1W8AEOSiJ.jpg:large - Twitter image of the Nico Duster just released.

 

But this image is very much like the troublemaker coat

 

http://tor-fashion.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/MTroublemakerClose.png

 

Now, this one is different as there seems to be a difference between the two (at least in that specific one, as somebody else mentioned they updated that promotional picture) but that's a minor detail changed between the release of the promotional art and the actual ingame item. Thus the update on the promotional image that was posted a page back.

 

What they are showing the players in the marketing material in which they are eliciting a purchase is different than what is being provided from the purchase so far as we can tell from what has been provided.

 

The point being while it is _similar_ its an obvious cheapo/quick reskin job and that is disappointing to people who see that this was used as an inducement to get them to purchase and then et not something new and more unique but instead a reskin of existing asset.

 

This is where I heavily disagree. See, from what we have it could very well be exactly as the promotional art made it appear. Even the bit with the chest, as mentioned, had the art updated (and, for the record, it was updated by July 8th at the latest, which is well before the deadline to get the jacket anyway). Even if it wasn't, though, it's clearly shown to be close and while you may argue that those promo images promised a new and more unique armor, they didn't. It was clear from those pictures that it was meant as a Troublemaker reskin, and all of the major features of the jacket that were in those promotional pictures (a trench coat with a popped collar and the armoring looking stuff on the shoulders and upper back) are there. At the end of the day you were promised Nico's Duster. You're getting Nico's Duster, and it will look at worst very close to the promotional images, if not dead on.

 

Again, I don't blame people for being disappointed that it's a reskin. I'm not (at least not by much, the jacket from the old cinematic would have been cool to have too), but I can certainly understand why you would be. But I definitely take issue with claiming you're not "getting what you paid for" when you are, assuming you subscribed solely for Nico's Duster of course. Would be totally different if they changed the jacket entirely, made it a regular jacket instead of a trenchcoat, changed the popped collar to something like a lot of the upper level smuggler jackets with the wacky... thing, I don't even know what those are supposed to be. But that's clearly not the case. There are two possible differences, minor ones at that, one of which was updated within 2 weeks of the announcement and the other we don't know for sure until they release it. Either way, you're getting what you paid for.

[EnkiduNineEight]

They showed us this.

 

And that does not match this:

 

http://swtorista.com/uploads/outfitimages/troublemaker_01_854x4804150.jpg

 

or this:

 

http://tor-fashion.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/MTroublemakerBack.png

 

There are similarities but there are also significant differences.

 

Again, I personally could care less because I don't like the dusters and already have them anyway because I am an idiot whale/completionist so have 100% for all the cartel stuff excepting that gosh darned regulator title.

 

But its not what was being advertised. The back doesn't match, the front from the earlier picture on the same page of marketing material (( http://www.swtor.com/fallen-empire/rewards?intcmp=sor_bwa-mkt-t-us-hp-203, specifically http://cdn-www.swtor.com/sites/all/files/en/fallenempire/bothawui/screens/hero-thumb.jpg )) doesn't match.. etc.

 

But the twitter picture matches the troublemaker set.

 

So, you're not getting Nico Okarr's Duster, you're getting the Troublemaker's jacket in beige with a little name tag sewn in the back that has Troublemaker’s lined through and 'Nico's' written over it in a childish hand in black marker.

Edited September 11, 2015 by EnkiduNineEight

[Reno_Tarshil]

And that does not match this:

 

http://swtorista.com/uploads/outfitimages/troublemaker_01_854x4804150.jpg

 

or this:

 

http://tor-fashion.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/MTroublemakerBack.png

 

There are similarities but there are also significant differences.

 

Again, I personally could care less because I don't like the dusters and already have them anyway because I am an idiot whale/completionist so have 100% for all the cartel stuff excepting that gosh darned regulator title.

 

But its not what was being advertised. The back doesn't match, the front from the earlier picture on the same page of marketing material (( http://www.swtor.com/fallen-empire/rewards?intcmp=sor_bwa-mkt-t-us-hp-203, specifically http://cdn-www.swtor.com/sites/all/files/en/fallenempire/bothawui/screens/hero-thumb.jpg )) doesn't match.. etc.

 

But the twitter picture matches the troublemaker set.

 

So, you're not getting Nico Okarr's Duster, you're getting the Troublemaker's jacket in beige with a little name tag sewn in the back that has Troublemaker’s lined through and 'Nico's' written over it in a childish hand in black marker.

 

They do match, you're just having trouble seeing it because the troublemaker set is all black.

[EnkiduNineEight]

Wrong

[branmakmuffin]

It's irrelevant because it's only paying for my access to the game and forums, everything else they sprinkle on are just free fluff.

First, the entire game is "fluff." Second, part of what you get for your sub fee during the relevant time period includes the Nico swag. You don't have the option to not get it. It's a price reduction given in (virtual) goods. We can establish a value of Nico's duster. What does a Troublemaker coat go for? 1 million creds? Goods from the CC seem to sell for roughly 1000 creds per CC. So using that formula (inaccurate though it may be), Nico's duster is worth 1000 CC, which is about $10. So that means during the month we subscribed to get Nico's duster, the price of our sub was reduced by $10. But just like we don't have the option to say during the "buy one, get one free" sale to say "Just give me the free one," we didn't have the option to say "OK, keep the duster and knock $10 off my sub fee for the month."

 

Of course we can debate the actual numbers all day (and some will say Nico's duster is worth nothing at all as far as they are concerned), but that is the way the concept works.

 

And that does not match this:

 

http://swtorista.com/uploads/outfitimages/troublemaker_01_854x4804150.jpg

 

or this:

 

http://tor-fashion.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/MTroublemakerBack.png

I think you need new glasses or something. Nico's coat and the Troublemaker duster are pretty much the same. Just a different color.

 

But its not what was being advertised.

Right, this is what is being advertised. What exactly is the issue?

Edited September 11, 2015 by branmakmuffin

[EnkiduNineEight]

I just had to say it fun being on one side of an argument with Bran and on the opposite side with him as well, in the same thread. This happens too frequently.

 

I'm 100% behind your analysis re: the discussion with Reno on whether this is a 'free' item or not.

[branmakmuffin]

I just had to say it fun being on one side of an argument with Bran and on the opposite side with him as well, in the same thread. This happens too frequently.

You owe me an extra 5 pounds for the enhanced argument experience.

[The-Kaitou-Kid]

But its not what was being advertised. The back doesn't match, the front from the earlier picture on the same page of marketing material (( http://www.swtor.com/fallen-empire/rewards?intcmp=sor_bwa-mkt-t-us-hp-203, specifically http://cdn-www.swtor.com/sites/all/files/en/fallenempire/bothawui/screens/hero-thumb.jpg )) doesn't match.. etc.

 

Recap time: The chest in the promotional art was updated within two weeks to match the ingame chest we've now seen a picture of so that matches. Finally, could you show me where you got the picture of the back of Nico's Duster because, again, I could have swore the screenshot only showed the front. I must have missed the one that showed the back.

Edited September 11, 2015 by The-Kaitou-Kid