The Consular's Rishi Visions

[SirMandokarla]

I'd like to see speculation on what the voices meant when they spoke on Rishi during the Consular's Holocron quest. Naturally, personal canon and stories are welcome.

 

Servant One: "The Hand closes. Rejuvenation begins."

Moff Pyran: "Fire on Republic vessels!"

Lt. Iresso: "You were the best I ever knew. Goodbye, Jedi."

"There is no life. There is the Force."

Aric Jorgan: "For the Republic!"

 

Clearly, Servant One is referring to the resurrection of the Emperor. Moff Pyran's line is referring to the firing of the Silencer by Lord Kallig.

What about Iresso? His death is mentioned shortly after, so perhaps these are his last words to the Barsen'thor.

"There is no life", seems the sort of thing the Emperor would say. Could this line simply be more foreshadowing of His return?

Aric's line couldn't be a simple battlecry. That would be too ordinary. Perhaps they are his last words, just as Iresso's voice is?

 

These lines hit particularly close for me because the Silencer was the most difficult decision my Inquisitor, Darth Occlus, ever had to make, and my Consular has been fighting for Occlus' redemption for most of the war. Aric's line also struck me as a last stand and, with the Fallen Empire incoming, I realized the Major would die before the Republic fell. I heard it as the last words of Havoc Squad.

[Cythereal]

I think not everything is expansion foreshadowing. My consular accepted that someday, Iresso will knowingly go to his death fighting a Sith Lord. Hardly an unexpected fate, all things considered. Perhaps the things she saw, both when meditating and when talking with the seer as she constructed her holocron will come to pass this expansion. Perhaps they will come to pass decades or centuries from now. Perhaps these possible futures won't happen at all.

[Diviciacus]

Perhaps they will come to pass decades or centuries from now. Perhaps these possible futures won't happen at all.

 

I wrote down literally everything that is said in the Consular Rishi quest since I only ever got to Rishi on a character after Bioware told us that events in SOR foreshadow KOTFE. After realizing what the Consular is doing, I went through the chat log and wrote it all down.

 

Anyway, some events seem to be concrete, and those are the things Master O'a says to you when you first meet:

 

 

-Lara Cordan forms a new Rift Alliance. Relationship to Tai Cordan is unknown, but this happens in at least 20 years from current game-time since she doesn't exist yet.

-Esh-kha neo-savants - that is, a new order of Esh-kha Force users - pop up in a century (which O'a flat says)

-Mostly darkness and dead planets. While it certainly seems obvious this refers to Vitiate and his consumption ritual, the Zakuul Empire certainly seems to operate on a Taris-bombardment-level destruction policy.

 

 

 

Some of the lines seem to be in the past, as well:

 

 

"Master Yuon is taking new apprentice?" - Satele Shan (No I don't know why this says "apprentice" instead of "padawan." That particular wording may be relevant. Is Satele secretly Sith? /tinfoilhat)

 

 

 

The events described when actually forging the holocron base also have to be concrete, or your character's judgment of them wouldn't be recorded in a holocron:

 

 

-A "half-trained" Jedi finds your holocron in the forests of Sarkhai where your apprentice (apprentice again, what's with that? oversight? Is it relevant?) takes it after the Consular's death. She seeks vengeance for the Republic's downfall. It's specifically stated this Jedi whose training is incomplete is female. I don't want to say it's obvious the "apprentice" is Nadia Grell, but given that she is Sarkhai... is this perhaps a hint that our companions think we're dead, not frozen in carbonite? Also, half-trained Jedi sounds like Nadia Grell already, but perhaps it's another character that appears in the KOTFE story we don't know about. Why would she need to find a holocron that she put there? Maybe she got mad and threw it off a cliff?

 

One lightside option to your answer for this teaches this nascent Jedi to control her anger and not succumb to the Dark Side. But it's open-ended. She becomes a great warrior, winning many victories, but she dies in battle before she can restore the Republic. The other turns the jedi into a skilled diplomat, notably saying that those she thinks are her enemy are not. Either option could be applied to Nadia, given her background and the Consular story. I did not bother escaping out of the convo to see what the DS option was, but I found it on Youtube. The holocron tells her about Rakata technology and Esh-kha armies. She makes some serious war and destroys even stars. Her name is etched into history, and eventually forgotten. No word on the effect this has on the galaxy as a whole.

 

-A Sith finds the holocron. Your soldier (not just a soldier, your soldier) sacrificed his life to kill the Sith's "great-grandsire." It's possible this ties into the quote from Lt. Iresso ("You were the best I ever knew. Goodbye."). This Sith finds his way to Tython, seeking to become strong in the Force as the Consular was. Notably, Tython is in ruins. Also, why use "sire" instead of "father"? Is Bioware trying to hide the fact that the Sith's ancestor was a woman, not a man? Is this vision talking about a descendant of Darth Lachris? How old is she, anyway? Is it possible this happens in KOTFE? Darth Lachris looks like she might be in her 30's or 40's, but that's not old enough.

 

One option for this is to allow your holocron's teaching to take root in the Sith's mind. He resists your teachings, and kills at least one person, but in the end redeems himself and "his home" - whatever that is. The Sith Empire, perhaps? Another is to refuse to talk to a Sith at all (which didn't seem very Consular to me), and he rages really hard and gets himself killed in a battle, only to be forgotten. The third option is to show him your path with all its perils, to show him enlightenment through fire. He walks your path, survives, and in the end is no longer Sith. He spreads your teachings to the galaxy.

 

-The Consular of course is pretty stacked with titles by the time you finish the game. Possible titles received in the future are: Seneschal, Hierophant of the Jal Shey, and Betrayer of Balmorra. Seneschal is a title referring to one who stewards a kingdom or estate. So what are you seneschal of? The Republic? The Jedi Order? Something else? Hierophant is a religious title which comes out of Greek (hieros "holy" + phaino "to reveal/show") - nowadays it's a fancy word for priest, but priest doesn't really cover the range of duties of a hierophant. The Jal Shey also exist in Star Wars, and they're an order similar in scope to the Voss mystics. Very grey. Very words, not deeds. (They show up in KOTOR 2, but I've never played it so I just have Wookieepedia to guide me.) To be their hierophant essentially makes the Consular at the very least one of the most insightful members, but it may be a literal title/rank like Barsen'thor. Wookieepedia states they were founded before 4,000BBY, so it's possible the Consular encounters them in KOTFE. Betrayer of Balmorra, now that's a little harder to pin down what it means. It could refer to an event in KOTFE. Does your character sacrifice Balmorra to save the galaxy? Is that why this mysterious Lara Cordan forms a New Rift Alliance?

 

Anyway, this one's conversation options are a little less revealing. The first option has your holocron name you as Barsen'thor. The second has your holocron use your actual name. The third, the Consular says that they've sought knowledge and understanding in the galaxy's darkest places, that they are more than a Jedi and for the holocron to reflect that. But Master O'a gives no premonition for these. He just says "and we're done!" Like Hell we are!

 

 

 

[typenine]

Lol i made a post on this

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=821007&highlight=kotfe+hints

 

 

Also the Voice that says "There is no life, There is the Force"

Is Vitiate's voice

It says Voice because at that point they hadn't revealed he was alive

Edited July 10, 2015 by typenine

[Katano]

Pretty sure they aren't killing off Jorgan since he is a romance option and people would lose their minds.

[SithKoriandr]

I don't think it's Darth Lacaris (sp?) as it's Zenith you use in that fight. Could he be the soldier they're talking about?

[AlrikFassbauer]

Servant One: "The Hand closes. Rejuvenation begins."

"There is no life. There is the Force."

 

Both Emperor, I'm quite sure now.

[RameiArashi]

Sire means father.

[Diviciacus]

Sire means father.

 

I'm well aware what it means. No one ever uses it unless they're George RR Martin or breeding dogs. Or both.

 

My point was the choice wasn't accidental. There's a reason the writers used sire instead of father. Perhaps I'm reading too much into it, though. Master O'a is a Bothan, and they're kind of a dog-cat-ish species. Maybe they used sire for that reason, and that reason alone?

Edited July 10, 2015 by Diviciacus

[Senrie]

Seneschal was interesting because we only know of one other person who used that title:

 

When Lord Hoth decided to take the offensive against the Sith in 1010 BBY, he gathered Jedi Lords and their bands of knights from across the galaxy, a movement that swelled until the Grand Council of the Order declared all the Jedi baronies united as the Army of Light, commanded by Lord Hoth bearing the ancient title of Seneschal.

 

Apprentice is a term used by jedi, by the way. Fairly commonly too. Jedi Apprentice, anybody?

Edited July 10, 2015 by Senrie

[Cedia]

See, this conversation has me most worried about KotFE. Felix is my favorite romance by far, but I don't think he'll make the cut because a lot of people think he's "boring". He is my Consular's rock, her right-hand man. Without him she'll be lost for quite awhile, Barsenthor or not. (I married a soldier, so that may have something to do with it. )

[BrianDavion]

I'm well aware what it means. No one ever uses it unless they're George RR Martin or breeding dogs. Or both.

 

My point was the choice wasn't accidental. There's a reason the writers used sire instead of father. Perhaps I'm reading too much into it, though. Master O'a is a Bothan, and they're kind of a dog-cat-ish species. Maybe they used sire for that reason, and that reason alone?

 

Sire is also much more formal. thus they may have simply used it for that reason. feeling it worked better with the general feel of what was happening

[Cythereal]

See, this conversation has me most worried about KotFE. Felix is my favorite romance by far, but I don't think he'll make the cut because a lot of people think he's "boring". He is my Consular's rock, her right-hand man. Without him she'll be lost for quite awhile, Barsenthor or not. (I married a soldier, so that may have something to do with it. )

 

I think it's most likely going to be that if and when Bioware calls an end to TOR, Iresso's epilogue will state that his end came in battle against a Sith Lord.

 

Or if it is expansion foreshadowing, I suspect resurrection of some form would be involved. Wouldn't be the first time a supposedly dead character in TOR is brought back with cybernetics or the Force.

[MayhemofChaonus]

Pretty sure they aren't killing off Jorgan since he is a romance option and people would lose their minds.

 

lol too cute. BW doesn't give a f*ck about killing off romance options. They have already hinted at most if not all of the current romancables NOT returning in KOTFE (possibly because they're dead)

 

Seneschal was interesting because we only know of one other person who used that title:

 

 

 

Apprentice is a term used by jedi, by the way. Fairly commonly too. Jedi Apprentice, anybody?

 

yes yes, but what does that title mean is the real question...

Edited August 22, 2015 by MayhemofChaonus

[MayhemofChaonus]

Edit^ Edited August 22, 2015 by MayhemofChaonus

[Diviciacus]

lol too cute. BW doesn't give a f*ck about killing off romance options. They have already hinted at most if not all of the current romancables NOT returning in KOTFE (possibly because they're dead)

 

 

 

yes yes, but what does that title mean is the real question...

 

If you had read the post I wrote a month and a half ago in this thread, I gave a definition for seneschal:

 

Seneschal is a title referring to one who stewards a kingdom or estate.

 

The only question in regards to it is of what does the Consular become seneschal?

 

I cannot answer the first part of your post in detail due to information control restrictions in effect on the official forums, but suffice it to say... you are wrong.

Edited August 23, 2015 by Diviciacus

[Excise]

What about Iresso? His death is mentioned shortly after, so perhaps these are his last words to the Barsen'thor.

 

I missed that part. Where does it say Iresso also dies?

[SithKoriandr]

I missed that part. Where does it say Iresso also dies?

 

Something along the lines of "Your soldier dies"

[RameiArashi]

They've said your romanced companions will know if you cheated on them. They cant do that if they're dead.

[MayhemofChaonus]

If you had read the post I wrote a month and a half ago in this thread, I gave a definition for seneschal:

 

 

 

The only question in regards to it is of what does the Consular become seneschal?

 

I cannot answer the first part of your post in detail due to information control restrictions in effect on the official forums, but suffice it to say... you are wrong.

 

Well I just found out that we may not be getting all of our companions back in KOTET...who's wrong now?

[MandelynRain]

They actually said all companions would eventually be back but they want to reintroduce them better than this last season.

[Limariko]

They actually said all companions would eventually be back but they want to reintroduce them better than this last season.

 

It's still that 'eventually' that has many of us wondering how long it's going to be. Could it be after the Fallen Empire's wrapped up or longer still? But that's derailing the thread, so back to topic.

 

It's questionable whether the reference to soldier means Iresso specifically as Master O'a did say the Consular could experience Force visions that could relate to events ranging from soon to who knows how long from now. While the vision goodbye from Iresso could be him about to head off to his final fight, it could also be his goodbye from the Consular and him reluctantly separating due to some other events. And the soldier who dies to the Sith could be someone else that the Consular hasn't met yet.

 

So it could swing either way that it's referencing Iresso's death or something else altogether. That's part of the fun of trying to interpret Force visions as they tend to be more trippy than specific the further down time one considers.