In effort to "cater to more people" EA just loses more PVP base

[DartDaya]

True.

 

Everyone says the current MMO they're playing is "dying" or will be "killed off" by new MMOs.

 

People said SWTOR would be "killed" by ESO.

.

 

Nothing could "kill" SWTOR because SWTOR "killed" itself. Which is why it went F2P in under a year and brought in the CM.

[marchesq]

This is a dying game. Best thing to do is unsub, how many chances do they get to display even a slight bit of competence. People don't like being killed by a stealther who can't be cced or knocked back and hits 10k crits on an aoe and takes a third of my health away on an uncleansable dot. Its absurd. The more groups run sins the more people will stop pvping.

 

yanno...since you put it that way. I tend to agree. I may no reup my sub.

So...what other games are there?

[ThorgrimLutgen]

I'm curious, wouldn't the last 2 suggestions make more people Queue for ranked solely to grind comms rather than to play competitively?

 

Yes, that's the idea.

 

But, if you follow those 3 rules, they will not be in the queue, unless they are in a full set of PVP gear, ie, no bolster requires a PVP set, so they will be far more competitive for 2 reasons, they will actually have proper gear and they will have invested sufficient time into playing that class, to know how the hell it works...in theory.

[ThorgrimLutgen]

Regardless that would STILL cause even MORE people to leave pvp overall. I for one know I would NOT be willing to play ****** *** arenas to get ranked gear. We should try to bring people IN, not push them away with even more restrictions. And yeah, you can totally do it in 4 days if you play non stop and don't do anything else.

 

I think ranked is endgame PVP, you clearly think it's just another format open to everyone.

 

I expect people to know how to play their class within a PVP environment, not like a PVE hero. They can learn how to play in regs whilst they acquire their PVP set.

 

If they give us at least cross faction, remove bolster and limit entry with an expertise gate, more PVPers I am certain would play ranked. In my experience, most of the people I know, don't play ranked, for the main reason of being lumbered with PVE heros.

 

I am not interested in bringing in PVErs. If a PVE player suddenly feels the urge to PVP, there is a whole queue system available to them, called regs. Here, they can get all the gear they need to be competitive within ranked, they can learn how to play properly, and if they don't find the game fun, they can go back to their flashpoints happy that they tried.

Edited April 5, 2015 by ThorgrimLutgen

[ThorgrimLutgen]

This to the T! In order to bring more players in , they need to make pvp more accessible, more fun for solo and group players, have LESS restrictions, not more, and some severe QOL upgrades.

 

We have that, it's called regs.

[Atalantia]

My personal reason not to play Ranked is the amount of FOTM classes in the Leaderboards.

I take the Leaderboards as a measure of how many of them are there, in Ranked, at least roughly - and the result I get from this is like : I don't want to play Ranked with THIS bias.

 

If I had an Hatred Assassin, then I'd probably try it. But call me stupid if you want to, but I cling to my Gunslinger main.

And I most definitively don't want to get defeated all of the time by Assassins in Regs for just gearing up. That just isn't my definition of "fun" in PvP.

 

"Fun" is currently something only a few classes can provide - and of course extremelky well coordinated teams leading to an 6:0 in Huttball.

For everyone else, there is currently just no "fun" in PvP anymore.

 

Therefore I wait. For better times.

And do PvE instead.

 

Haven't done ranked since 8v8 was removed.

Won't play FOTM entitled Arena

 

Now I level a toon through pvp from 10-50 and roll another, ya its sometimes boring standing around the fleet.

[Magira]

We have that, it's called regs.

 

This is where the solos are farmed by premades, right? Surely the right start.

[ThorgrimLutgen]

This is where the solos are farmed by premades, right? Surely the right start.

 

I run solo probably 90% of the time and have no issues with premades.

 

Sometimes the opposition has better players you know.

[Aluvi]

the last time they did something drastic, they pulled the 8v8 format.

 

And the best part was... OK wait for it...

 

They said that they had a solution to make Ranked PvP pop much more consistently, and it was going to be great. They didn't tell us what it was. We thought, FINALLY we are getting cross server!

 

The day that the patch dropped, we found out what BioWares solution for making ranked pvp pop much more consistently was.

 

They removed 8v8 from the game, in order to force everyone to do 4v4 arenas. TADAA! That was their magic solution. What an utter slap to the face of every pvp guild that had put together a solid 8v8 team. I can tell you that half of our hardcore pvp guild unsubbed that very day. Nothing so far has topped the slap in the face that that move was, and I don't even think that they realize it.

[mmmbuddah]

We have that, it's called regs.

 

Regs are by no means really that fun anymore, and people are leaving in droves, because what the guy I quoted said, is not being done.

 

I think ranked is endgame PVP, you clearly think it's just another format open to everyone.

 

I expect people to know how to play their class within a PVP environment, not like a PVE hero. They can learn how to play in regs whilst they acquire their PVP set.

 

If they give us at least cross faction, remove bolster and limit entry with an expertise gate, more PVPers I am certain would play ranked. In my experience, most of the people I know, don't play ranked, for the main reason of being lumbered with PVE heros.

 

I am not interested in bringing in PVErs. If a PVE player suddenly feels the urge to PVP, there is a whole queue system available to them, called regs. Here, they can get all the gear they need to be competitive within ranked, they can learn how to play properly, and if they don't find the game fun, they can go back to their flashpoints happy that they tried.

 

I could guarantee you right now, less would play, limiting entry with a 2018 gate would be fine, but the rest would just push people away, you do not severely limit the population when ranked is already on its deathbed. I used to be a PVEr, and now I play a ton of pvp, saying you don't want PVErs to come in is pretty much saying you don't want PvP to survive. You have to make people enthusiastic about coming over to PvP, not making it ultra restrictive and not fun.

[DethlaHadyn]

And the best part was... OK wait for it...

 

They said that they had a solution to make Ranked PvP pop much more consistently, and it was going to be great. They didn't tell us what it was. We thought, FINALLY we are getting cross server!

 

The day that the patch dropped, we found out what BioWares solution for making ranked pvp pop much more consistently was.

 

They removed 8v8 from the game, in order to force everyone to do 4v4 arenas. TADAA! That was their magic solution. What an utter slap to the face of every pvp guild that had put together a solid 8v8 team. I can tell you that half of our hardcore pvp guild unsubbed that very day. Nothing so far has topped the slap in the face that that move was, and I don't even think that they realize it.

 

 

 

 

The 2.0 era of ranked 8vs8 is legendary within the context of the class' abilities of that timeline. 8vs8 ranked wouldn't work now in the 3.0 class meta. The classes all have too many unique utilities that would override the base design of the original objective based warzones, and the developers keep complicating things on a daily basis(Hello 3.0 Huttball:D).

 

They need to develop new maps exclusive to a new 8vs8, 3.0 class meta and beyond. Additionally, they need this new series of objective based maps to augment the current battlefields we have in place. Removing anymore pvp content or placing more restrictions AND failing to add more content soon, will undoubtedly kill the game. Like...nail in the coffin...dead.

[Magira]

There really is no one else to blame for the state of PvP in this game other than the devs.

 

 

BW also, of course. Their lack of knowledge of PVP prove it since the beta. Premade vs PUG, Gear- and Level differences, all WOW copied and applied the worst.

 

But the weak participation in Rated is also largely the responsibility of the self-appointed PVP Elite.

 

These maintain the absurd idea that would Ranked prerogative of the elite and bite everything away what does not meet their demands. Instead bring as many people into Ranked in order for the rating works, they are offended and flamed.

 

Add to that the situation in the Regs, the farming of newbs by premades and no functioning Matchmaking offer no entry for newcomers.

[FerkWork]

Yes, that's the idea.

 

But, if you follow those 3 rules, they will not be in the queue, unless they are in a full set of PVP gear, ie, no bolster requires a PVP set, so they will be far more competitive for 2 reasons, they will actually have proper gear and they will have invested sufficient time into playing that class, to know how the hell it works...in theory.

 

I would on principle but only if you gained comms by winning just like the weekly and daily only count wins. As someone who does both, You should get zero comms for losing a ranked match. Thats what it is for PvE, wipe on a boss no rewards for you. (And a repair bill on top of it).

 

However, it wouldn't stop bads in full PvP gear from queuing or trolls. This also should be addressed.

Edited April 5, 2015 by FerkWork

[Magira]

 

However, it wouldn't stop bads in full PvP gear from queuing or trolls. This also should be addressed.

 

Speaking of the Devil come the elitists crawled out of their holes.

[FerkWork]

Speaking of the Devil come the elitists crawled out of their holes.

Bads= not ready for endgame PvP, those who don't care at all about others and only care about the rewards.

Hardly. You missed the context of my post. His/Her system proposed would have put a incentive on just queuing just for the comms regardless of whether the person was ready for ranked endgame PvP. I could queue all day lose and still get comms while screwing over others ELO just by because I have PvP gear on. Do you want an experience like that? I hope not.

[Magira]

Bads= not ready for endgame PvP.

 

What makes you think that this simplified mode is endgame PVP? Nope, this is ideal for beginners, simple gameplay, no worry about objectives. Warzones are so "thanks" Premade glut virtually unplayable for Beginners.

[FerkWork]

What makes you think that this simplified mode is endgame PVP? Nope, this is ideal for beginners, simple gameplay, no worry about objectives. Warzones are so "thanks" Premade glut virtually unplayable for Beginners.

 

Because it can only be done at level cap and it's called Ranked? As in you get a rating for it?

I don't know what to say as you like to distort and take what others said out of context because you are extremely upset about "premades". Most are just people queuing with friends and are average at best. I have been in pug groups that have throughly trashed teams consisting of at least half a PvP guild. SWTOR population isn't high enough to support separate queues as most people don't and have no desire to PvP in this game just like some don't play PvE regardless of scary "premades" (And no I always solo queue for regs)

 

/shrugs

Edited April 5, 2015 by FerkWork

[Magira]

Because it can only be done at level cap and it's called Ranked?

 

Our concept of Ranked differ very widely. For me, it just means that there is a ranking according to which aligns the team composition. "Bad" players with "bad", "good" with "good". So it is thought by Bioware and does not work because the player base is too small. You want to downsize further, I will aggrandize them. Is the difference as far as recognizable?

 

Premades is another story, but in any case Rated solo is the only game mode for us PUGs alone. There must be no obstacles.

Edited April 5, 2015 by Magira

[AlrikFassbauer]

What makes you think that this simplified mode is endgame PVP? Nope, this is ideal for beginners, simple gameplay, no worry about objectives. Warzones are so "thanks" Premade glut virtually unplayable for Beginners.

 

Interesting point of view.

 

Arena = PvP for Beginners

Objective based PvP = PvP for advanced playrs due to so much more focus on coordination, situational awareness etc. ...

[tookmynames]

Necessary steps for the survival of PVP here:

 

For solo Rated:

 

- Opening for FTP players

- Any Gear is raised to the maximum level

- Mechanisms to prevent queue Syncing

- 8vs8 solo Warzones

 

For Group Rated:

 

- Opening for FTP players

- Any Gear is raised to the maximum level

- Mechanisms to prevent Win Trading

- 8vs8 Group Warzones

 

For regs:

 

- Full Opening for FTP players

- Any Gear is raised to the maximum level

- Separate queus for solo players and groups

- Mechanisms to prevent queue Syncing

- Opt-out for Arena, Huttball or Warzones

- Hot join mode as in GW2

 

AND: Cross Server or Mega Server as Basis

 

I like this, more of this.

[MidichIorian]

It's like that in most (every) game these days. I guess their goal is to make PvP so casual that people will lose interest fast and move on to the next release. Once people have paid for the game they simply don't give a **** anymore. Granted that it doesnt apply to swtor, in the current f2p state, but I've always felt like they stopped caring within the first year and are just keeping it going out of pride. Copies were sold, they had millions of subs the first 6 months so everything was probably paid for by then.

 

Also, from a community perspective it's important to have "an elite". It might not interest the most casual players but it's a thing many in the middle to upper skill layer appreciate and gather around. A perfect example would be Halo. Bungie threw away the best console multiplayer to date when they switched things up in Reach and 343 just made it ten times worse with Halo 4. No one gave a **** anymore because it became so casual and gimmicky. There needs to be an established structure where the hoi polloi is separated from the good players and the BS is kept at a minimum. If not you just might aswell play a custom game without scoreboard. There's simply no value in winning games when they are lobsided, both from a skill or equipment POV.

Edited April 6, 2015 by MidichIorian