Time to rethink your F2P model...

[Transcendent]

And this is the problem with the current model- cartel market based f2p doesn't really prioritize content.

 

/thread.

[Bobs_YourUncle]

just had to respond....you are wrong on all parts.....my other game is F2P, I have 12 toons, in 2 guilds, housing, mounts, over 4B in game money, access to the entire game, everything. the cash shop prices are the same for all whether you are free or subbed, free stuff weekly and events every month and if I subbed it would be even more. the grind is more so here than anywhere else i have seen..especially for F2P, its actually horrendous and overall the way F2P is treated by BW it should be treated better because FYI the game was hemorrhaging subs so badly before they implemented it it was the only way to save it and though lots of people claim subs are not going down...well just because you see people playing doesn't mean they are subs......either they rethink how they treat the players, both F2P and sub, in regards to this latest mess, this game will end up in the trash can...its happened before to others. Its been a good run but seriously, the wheels are getting a bit thin and worn.

 

Really? Whats the incentive to sub on that game, and is it any good? FYI, you can have 12+ toons, be in multiple guilds, purchase strongholds and mounts in this game too. 4 billion in in game currency? I guess the significance of that depends on the price of things in that game really... but ok I'll give you that, preferred get 300 or 350k, which was plenty for everything I wanted up to lev 39 at least... well I wasn't even preffered so I worked with 250k. As far as content goes, how much more do you want for free? You can already play every classes main story entirely......

 

Anyways... really the F2P model is so bad here? Coming from a guy who played F2P for 2 months before just now subbing, I must disagree.

 

Edit: Can you not play events here as F2P? That im not sure of, but hey, you are given so much for free, Im just flabbergasted at what the problem is really.

Edited February 4, 2015 by Bobs_YourUncle

[Bobs_YourUncle]

Interesting-- part of me wants to create a second F2P account to see what's actually correct. Knowing Bioware, though, "access" could just mean that you can browse public listings, maybe get a key to someone else's stronghold, or visit the public ones.

 

Have to check later with a friend of mine who recently subbed to see if I can get a second current-player opinion.

 

It is correct, as F2P, I was able to purchase a stronghold on Drummond kaas.

[branmakmuffin]

just had to respond....you are wrong on all parts.....my other game is F2P, [snip random made up stuff about unnamed MMO].

Then why are you here, paying for SWTOR?

[Heat-Wave]

Then why are you here, paying for SWTOR?

 

I suspect he really wants to play SWTOR, but doesn't want to have to pay for it, thus the desire to come up with reasons to not have to.

 

Heck, while we are at it, I'd love to get the sub benefits without paying, sign me up!

 

Of course, if that happened, well, you know the rest...

[lightSaberAddiCt]

Wrong. When I'm through playing the game, I'll unsubscribe and never pick it up again.

 

Sometimes all it takes to understand where other players are coming from are an open ear, an open mind, and a teeny smidge of empathy. Spend a little time talking to an F2P player or answering his/her questions, and you'll soon find out how much of the game is walled off. Imagine playing from that standpoint, with all the things you've taken for granted removed, and maybe you'll feel a little of the frustration. Maybe you'll understand, and maybe even appreciate what these players bring to the community.

 

I dont have to imagine it, because I subscribe. I chose to support the development of the game enjoy, rather then be so entitled as to expect everything for free.

[lightSaberAddiCt]

That's actually a really good idea. That gives you access to the full game beyond the two introductory planets, and the chance to get a feel for your advanced class. I'd have probably subscribed immediately without that why should I give these nickle and dimers my money feeling.

 

Yeah make it easier for the spammers, have no chat restrictions. Then they can goto fleet at lvl 1 and spam their services.

[Heat-Wave]

Yeah make it easier for the spammers, have no chat restrictions. Then they can goto fleet at lvl 1 and spam their services.

 

Free trial players wouldn't be able to use fleet chat and can only post on starter planet chat once per min or ten times per hour.

[branmakmuffin]

I suspect he really wants to play SWTOR, but doesn't want to have to pay for it, thus the desire to come up with reasons to not have to.

 

Heck, while we are at it, I'd love to get the sub benefits without paying, sign me up!

 

Of course, if that happened, well, you know the rest...

If given the choice to play the game as it is and pay $15 a month or play it as it is for $0 a month, no one would choose to pay $15. But then we get back to that "lunch" and "free" thing.

 

As others have posted, I think the game is worth paying for, so I pay for it. If I didn't think it was worth paying for but I still enjoyed playing it a bit, I'd play as Preferred and put up with the restrictions. My choice. In fact, when I played LotRO regularly, I was Premium (their equivalent of Preferred) because I find the game playable enough under those restrictions. Right now, I would not find TOR playable under Preferred restrictions.

 

In any event, if someone can afford a high-speed internet connection and a computer capable of playing TOR, they can afford to subscribe. All they have to do is give up 3 Starbucks drinks a month and, boom, the subscription is paid for. It's simply a matter of priorities.

[Gronkagin]

F2P needs MORE restrictions, not less. They pay NOTHING, leech off of guild XP bonus' and contribute NOTHING. Screw 'em.

 

Oh, and least we not forget are used by credit farmers!!!

 

This. So THIS.....You get what you pay for. Kiddies, if you want to sub, try helping your parents out around the house, not once, but every day. Do the dishes, mow the lawn, shovel the snow, be nice, instead of a moody grumpy teenager. I'd pay my kids subs if they did those things. Get straight A's and ask your parents to get you a sub. They keep paying for it as long as you perform. Really not that hard.

 

Oh, and if you're 30 and living in your parent's basement...quit playing the game and go out and get a job, and your own place! Then you can come back to the game. And we will welcome your sucessful adult self, and salute you!

[asinthe]

I agree that F2P could use a reworking as it does seem to be too punishing and doesn't maximize incentivizing the subscription aspect. But, that's not the only issue. What's keeping subscribers (like myself since pre-release) still subscribing?

 

I love MMOs. Love them like a sickness. I'm the person who will make a favorite MMO a second full-time job. I am the person who will spend hours upon hours researching my class, reverse engineering formulas to better mix/max...if I love the game. I will forgo eating and sleeping to raid with an Australian guild so I can still go to work the next day and not miss out on gaming. But only if I truly love the game and all it has to offer.

 

Do I do this with SWTOR? No. Do I still pay my sub? Yes. Do I know why I still pay? Uh, I might have an addictive personality that gravitates to fictional online worlds.

 

I treat SWTOR as a single player RPG that happens to have other people in the world, sometimes. I did this even before launch. I was one of those people who had a guild registered 2 years before the game launched...and I just don't care enough to put the effort into endgame which is really not like me - in other games endgame is where it's at for me.

 

Point is, not only do I think there needs to be more incentives for F2P people to sub, more importantly there needs to be more incentives for those who subscribe to continue to do so.

[Isnogut]

Just playing devils advocate:

First of all I am a subscriber. I am making this because I meet F2P players and feel bad for them and do not think they will stick for ever.

 

It has been a while since this game has gone f2p. I think it is about time you guys went back and reassessed your F2P model. there is only minor changes I think would help not only the players (free and sub) but BW/EA too...

 

1. Up the amount of credits or put no cap on F2P credits. if you take out the cap, cancel out the escrow item from cartel market, this could help F2P players to stay and help the people who are sub or preferred. Most items that subscribers sell are for more than 250k or 300k. armors, decorations, etc. so it is hindering the subs from selling items to a larger player base. Also, F2P players cannot even buy a garage to the stronghold. Players can easily make 100k in less than an hour and have nothing worth while to buy.

You know, that is exactly the idea behind it. If people want to have ingame currency, they should buy the possibilty. After all F2P doesn't mean charity, and BioWare has to get an income. It is common in F2P MMO's to set such restriction.

And keep in mind, those cuttoffs have to hurt the player to make him buy the stuff.

 

2. Trading. Why stop a F2P player from trading and allow them to mail? that's just dumb in my opinion. There is more worth while things to entice people to sub.

This also has a simple reason. It is to ensure no goldfarmer can spam and sell ingame currency.

 

F2P players sometimes do spend a few bucks on CM here and there. But not if you cannot even keep them in the game long enough to want to. I am sure there could be 1 or 2 more minor changes to F2P benefits that would not even hurt BW/EA from TRYING TO FORCE people into subbing. Change the benefits here and there and it could help the whole game and the community in the long wrong, especially with all the problems on the forums as of late.

 

PLASE KEEP THIS CONSTRUCTIVE.

To be frankly those are only assumptions. There is a good reason SWTOR is the most successfull F2P MMO around. Simple said, because people buy stuff. The subscription model in here makes just a little fraction of BioWares income. The bigest ppart are the F2P users, who are willing to pay. And SWTOR is making it easy to want customers to buy stuff from the Cartel Market.

 

From my point of view, the only effective working F2P model is found in SWTOR. But sure, it could be impoved.

[JJLXL]

Suggestion: How about a 7 day trial account with zero restrictions. After the 7 days, you go F2P with zero restrictions until level 10. At lvl 10 you are hit with "Preferred" restrictions. You stay this way until level 20, where you are now at full F2P restrictions until you spend $5, or sub.

[Bachannal]

I guess the people ************ about F2P restrictions here have never played DCUO, or AoC, or any of the other restrictive F2P models there are for other MMO's that do exactly the same kind of nickel and diming. Access to DLC/Expacks? Not without a sub. Vanity gear? Not without spending money on whatever equivalent to CC's there are in the game. XP boosts? Pay for 'em. Access to dungeons/content? Yep - pony up some more cash OR SUB.

 

That is the whole flipping point of having both systems!!!! In the software world (outside of gaming) we call this FREEMIUM MODEL. A lot of enterprise software allows "freemium' use too - and guess what, they are riddled with what is known as "PAY WALLS". There are pay walls put in place specifically to restrict you just enough to be annoying - SO THAT YOU PAY FOR THE CONTENT.

 

Is it a great model? No - but it works, and it works well. Why on Earth would any slightly intelligent business offer up the cash cow for free to any ol' person who wants access to it? that makes ZERO business sense whatsoever.

 

And yes..i fully agree the pay walls are awful. I *once* let my sub lapse, just because I forgot to transfer funds between accounts on time. When I saw the pay walls in this game I was just like "oh hell no - let me fix my subscription!"

 

We get it...a lot of you are cheap. A lot of you can't budget for crap. A lot of you are just entitled folks who seem to think that everything should be given away - you probably also think every child in the classroom is a "unique and special little snowflake" and they all deserve to feel like winners to boot. Newsflash - NO. Just NO. To all of that whingey crap.

 

Free to Play does not = Carte Blanche to play just like a sub

 

It would negate the entire reason for subscriptions, and that makes no sense.

[Bachannal]

You could also think of this as the equivalent of your grocery store giving out free samples of cheese or something. If they let you come back over and over and over again, getting more and more samples, it would defeat the purpose. The idea is to give you a *taste* of something, just enough to whet the appetite, and then you better well pay up my son.

 

Sure - the person handing out the free samples might say "we can give you a coupon to try it for less than normal price the 1st time", but in the end, just like in the F2P model, no one is just giving you the whole product for free. Otherwise, what would be the point in subbing?

 

Pandora jams commercials into your playlists if you don't pay. So does Rdio and Spotify. Why? Same reasons.

 

In fact, you can literally think of ANY PRODUCT that offers either a free version or a restricted version and they all have a variety of irritating restrictions - again - so you say "screw these restrictions, I want the full deal!" . The people that go back and forth trying to decide if it's right for them are NOT who the business are targeting and most businesses could care less about as a potential revenue stream. The business is targeting folks who will enjoy what they experience *just enough* to want to sub *or* DISLIKE the experience so much, that they want to sub to see how much better it is sans restriction. After all - if you sub for only a single month, you can probably suss out whether or not you want to renew the sub or you can live with the F2P restrictions.

[BaronV]

not every 1 can afford, or is old enough to pay for a game. that is why I think they made F2P in most mmos these days. bigger player base the better off the company is.

 

If they cant afford to pay, then they dont need to play. Simple.

[BaronV]

I dont have to imagine it, because I subscribe. I chose to support the development of the game enjoy, rather then be so entitled as to expect everything for free.

 

+1 to that. well said mate!

[Kurkina]

This has been said in a round-about way, here it is succinctly:

 

The F2P experience is a Single Player Experience. You get all the stories/solo content for free. Show me another single player game of this scope that that is 100% free.

 

The restrictions exist to motivate those who want the multi-player experience to either subscribe or buy CC to unlock various multiplayer aspects of the game. Lifting those restrictions does will encourage people not to pay, which will not help the game in the long run.

[LordArtemis]

The F2P system, as it is set up, hinders substantial game growth. The game itself, as it is set up, hinders substantial game growth IMO. Increasing the appeal of F2P or Preferred would do little to nothing to increase the amount of people that play the game.

 

The people that want to play this game despite it's weaknesses are playing the game. Those that do not care for it's weaknesses are not. Unless they experience some kind of miracle incident where they suddenly begin to truly understand their playerbase, I find it highly unlikely they will do anything in the short term to substantially increase the overall appeal of the game.

 

What they will do is continue to throw little tidbits at current players to keep them playing, and slowly grow the playerbase over time. The F2P system, IMO, will make no difference either way.

 

It was obviously designed to save the game from closure, which is likely where it was headed and deservedly so back then. It has already served it's purpose IMO.

Edited February 6, 2015 by LordArtemis

[branmakmuffin]

not every 1 can afford, or is old enough to pay for a game. that is why I think they made F2P in most mmos these days. bigger player base the better off the company is.

They did not make F2P for people who cannot afford to play, they made it to attract people who could try the game risk-free and hopefully decide the like they game enough to subscribe.

 

And anyone who can afford a high-speed internet connection and a computer powerful enough to play the game can afford to subscribe. It's a matter of priorities (skip 3 Starbucks drinks a month and the subscription fee is covered). I don't say everyone who plays should feel compelled to subscribe (contrary to the way some seem to feel), I'm saying they could if they really wanted to. Clearly they don't want to.

Edited February 6, 2015 by branmakmuffin

[lightSaberAddiCt]

Free trial players wouldn't be able to use fleet chat and can only post on starter planet chat once per min or ten times per hour.

 

With the r3strictions in place now. What he was discussing was having no restrictions until lvl 20.

[Sorwen]

You could also think of this as the equivalent of your grocery store giving out free samples of cheese or something. If they let you come back over and over and over again, getting more and more samples, it would defeat the purpose. The idea is to give you a *taste* of something, just enough to whet the appetite, and then you better well pay up my son.

 

Sure - the person handing out the free samples might say "we can give you a coupon to try it for less than normal price the 1st time", but in the end, just like in the F2P model, no one is just giving you the whole product for free. Otherwise, what would be the point in subbing?

 

Pandora jams commercials into your playlists if you don't pay. So does Rdio and Spotify. Why? Same reasons.

 

In fact, you can literally think of ANY PRODUCT that offers either a free version or a restricted version and they all have a variety of irritating restrictions - again - so you say "screw these restrictions, I want the full deal!" . The people that go back and forth trying to decide if it's right for them are NOT who the business are targeting and most businesses could care less about as a potential revenue stream. The business is targeting folks who will enjoy what they experience *just enough* to want to sub *or* DISLIKE the experience so much, that they want to sub to see how much better it is sans restriction. After all - if you sub for only a single month, you can probably suss out whether or not you want to renew the sub or you can live with the F2P restrictions.

Right now this grocery store is charging you to use shopping carts, bags, containers for your food, and has the littlest stock of food for any store wanting to sell you food. If they didn't let me shop with a lightsaber I would be long gone.

[fordpre]

You people are forgetting the most important thing. Player numbers only count when its paying players. F2P is there to nudge people into paying. It costs real money to keep the servers going and even more to continue to develop the game. The game also needs to make EA money otherwise they will just cancel it. I don't find the F2P restrictions to be particularly bad. You can play all of the solo content for free. Compare this to LOTRO for example where you get the epic quest line and everything else has to be bought with packs? Even if it bugs you that armour sets dont match you can farm a set of matching armour. You dont have to use a helm if it bothers you that much.

 

Ultimately people who are not paying are being subsidised by paying players. They should be thankful of all the solo content for free.

 

To answer the original poster the restrictions you noted are to avoid F2P accounts being used for gold selling. Personally I'm fully in favour of this approach!

Edited February 10, 2015 by fordpre

[SelinaH]

You people are forgetting the most important thing. Player numbers only count when its paying players. F2P is there to nudge people into paying. It costs real money to keep the servers going and even more to continue to develop the game.

While there is some truth to this, the other (ostensible) benefit of having free players around - whether or not they ever pay - is to contribute to the critical mass of activity, making the game appear more inviting by making it easier to find other people for flashpoints, PvP or other group content.

 

TOR's policy of gating certain content for F2Pers limits their contribution in this regard. While I'm not advocating for any loosening of free play restrictions, I do wonder whether such concessions would affect group finder or warzone queue times in any appreciable manner.

[Sikknasty]

Like i said when i made this, i am a subscriber so do not wrongfully judge...

 

But off the top of my head i can name 2 mmos that are 100% free better than this. 1, Tera and 2, ESO. Both survive off of cash shop (just like swtor bringing in tons of cash from that alone) and sub base which doesnt unlock restrictions but give damn good bonuses to subscribe.

 

I also didnt say wipe em out. Just something like credit limit because it will allow them to buy more off gtn and also upgrade strongholds...

Edited February 10, 2015 by Sikknasty