Highsis Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 What is the strongest PvP class at the top skill level, generally speaking? I know there won't be one answer to this questions, but nonetheless I want to hear various opinions. Let's assume all characters have the best gear and top skill levels. 1. One on One fight - no companion. 2. Survivability - how hard it is to kill the character 3. Overall PvP - which class is considered powerful in overall consensus? I remember back in early days it used to be sith assassin/marauder, but a lot of things have changed since then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ManiacDavis Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 1v1 is assassin/shadow. Anything could happen though come 3.0. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evolixe Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 And Guardians have by far the most front line survivability. Aside from that.. to answer your last question: A good player can still make anything work. A bad player still can't make anything work. Nothing changed there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teclado Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 (edited) 1. One on one fight - shadow / assassin, scoundrel / operative, guardian / jugg 2. Survivability - scoundrel / operative heals (slippery as a fish), any tank, guardian / jugg 3. Overall (dps specs only) - shadow / assassin, guardian / jugg, VG / PT 4. Burst damage - shadow / assassin, commando / merc, sentinel / marauder 5. Usefulness in Huttball - guardian / jugg, scoundrel / operative, tanks and heals 6. Best Node Guards - any stealth class, VG / PT 7. Kiting - sage / sorc, VG / PT 8. More... Edited October 22, 2014 by teclado Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highsis Posted October 22, 2014 Author Share Posted October 22, 2014 And Guardians have by far the most front line survivability. Aside from that.. to answer your last question: A good player can still make anything work. A bad player still can't make anything work. Nothing changed there. I remember playing Marauder in early SWTOR stage and I obliterated everyone while barely killed killed once in 3~4 warzones. When I played other characters, it was not the same despite putting the same effort. Good players will make anything work, but there will be a different at the top level just like any other games. Starcraft 2 can't balance races at the top 4 years after its launch! Anyway, I'm surprised to know that guardians have the best survivability given that they are melee fighters. Won't they be exposed to focus fire more often than those stealthy/covered/ranged tanks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highsis Posted October 22, 2014 Author Share Posted October 22, 2014 (edited) 1. One on one fight - shadow / assassin, scoundrel / operative, guardian / jugg 2. Survivability - scoundrel / operative heals (slippery as a fish), any tank, guardian / jugg 3. Overall (dps) - shadow / assassin, guardian / jugg, VG / PT 4. Burst damage - shadow / assassin, commando / merc, sentinel / marauder 5. Usefulness in Huttball - guardian / jugg, scoundrel / operative, tanks and heals 6. Best Node Guards - any stealth class, VG / PT 7. Kiting - sage / sorc, VG / PT 8. More... Makes me feel like Shadow/assassin being OP just like 2 years ago when I left SWTOR, if you listed those in order. "3. Overall (dps) - shadow / assassin, guardian / jugg, VG / PT" Guardian/ jugg deals more damange than PURE dps marauder? What has the world come to? Thanks for the input! Edited October 22, 2014 by Highsis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkiestj Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 3. Overall (dps) - shadow / assassin, guardian / jugg, VG / PT 4. Burst damage - shadow / assassin, commando / merc, sentinel / marauder Guardians deal more DPS than sentinels? Also, marauder bloodthirst (what is the sentinel equivalent)? Presumably extra damage from teammates attributable to bloodthirst shows up on the teammates scoreboard but it really belongs to the sentinel. I know this is burst but given that it boost all (or nearly all) of the teams DPS (HPS) for 15 seconds it seems like it is likely significant contributor to DPS in the arena settting. The longer a WZ goes (e.g. Novare Coast the ends by timer) the less significant bloodthirst's contribution to overall DPS is. DISCLAIMER: I play a guardian (and jugg) but not a sentinel/marauder. (I have a mara at 55 but don't play him enough to know the class) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Evolixe Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 I remember playing Marauder in early SWTOR stage and I obliterated everyone while barely killed killed once in 3~4 warzones. When I played other characters, it was not the same despite putting the same effort. Good players will make anything work, but there will be a different at the top level just like any other games. Starcraft 2 can't balance races at the top 4 years after its launch! Anyway, I'm surprised to know that guardians have the best survivability given that they are melee fighters. Won't they be exposed to focus fire more often than those stealthy/covered/ranged tanks? Yeah well.. marauders were just silly back then. It's much better now. You're not going to lose to any worse player because they play a "better" class. If that is what you're telling yourself then you need to level the f up. (that wasn't to you specifically, just in general) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anyakaschala Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 1. One on one fight - shadow / assassin, scoundrel / operative, guardian / jugg 2. Survivability - scoundrel / operative heals (slippery as a fish), any tank, guardian / jugg 3. Overall (dps) - shadow / assassin, guardian / jugg, VG / PT 4. Burst damage - shadow / assassin, commando / merc, sentinel / marauder 5. Usefulness in Huttball - guardian / jugg, scoundrel / operative, tanks and heals 6. Best Node Guards - any stealth class, VG / PT 7. Kiting - sage / sorc, VG / PT 8. More... point of clarity here tho, madness/balance sorcs/sages can crush decent jugg pretty easily. Also, in terms of huttball, never underestimate the ability for sorcs/sages to pull someone out of the fire or to the goal line. add that in queshball, the ability to pull some up top to the goal line, or thru the poison before the other team has a chance to stop you. Also, I'd put sages at the top or near the top in total damage, as long as they get heals, but as they can be extremely squishy, it can be problematic. they are also great node guarders if barrier is up. Gives them one of the best delaying tactics in the game with enough time for help to arrive. If it's down though, don't bother guarding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnzoForMe Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 Snipers are king. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teclado Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 (edited) Guardians deal more DPS than sentinels? This is why it's really not a great idea to make lists like that...I didn't mean to imply that. What I meant was, best overall in pvp (excluding tanks and heals, dps classes only) opposed to "best damage output". Initially, I was trying to answer OP's questions in order. When I got to #3, I realized that it's hard to compare dps vs tanks vs heals, so I was trying to speak to dps specs only ("overall" factoring in survivability, hence jugg > mara). Then I realized that there are more categories such as burst, etc., so I started making more numbers. point of clarity here tho, madness/balance sorcs/sages can crush decent jugg pretty easily. Also, in terms of huttball, never underestimate the ability for sorcs/sages to pull someone out of the fire or to the goal line. add that in queshball, the ability to pull some up top to the goal line, or thru the poison before the other team has a chance to stop you. Also, I'd put sages at the top or near the top in total damage, as long as they get heals, but as they can be extremely squishy, it can be problematic. they are also great node guarders if barrier is up. Gives them one of the best delaying tactics in the game with enough time for help to arrive. If it's down though, don't bother guarding. Agreed, on all points. Edited October 22, 2014 by teclado Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanchito Posted October 22, 2014 Share Posted October 22, 2014 ... Guardian/ jugg deals more damange than PURE dps marauder? What has the world come to? Thanks for the input! no they don't. on a dummy the mara would outdps the jugg. Juggs have awesome defensive cooldowns though, which makes them better in random compositions. Also their biggest cooldown is usable while ccd, so a jugg that messes up has one get out of jail free card. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnzoForMe Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 (edited) no they don't. on a dummy the mara would outdps the jugg. Juggs have awesome defensive cooldowns though, which makes them better in random compositions. Also their biggest cooldown is usable while ccd, so a jugg that messes up has one get out of jail free card. Tell Sanchito that if he knows what is good for him he best go run and hide Daddy's got a new .45 Edited October 23, 2014 by EnzoForMe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanchito Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 haha first time ever someone recognized where my forum tag comes from :-) one of the greatest albums of my youth, and now i feel old :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ld-Siris Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Despite what anyone says, the answer depends on you. Sure, some classes are better against others, but it depends on your play style. All classes play differently and you will do the best on the class that fits you. An example of this is the marauder and the sniper. If any class has a true anticlass, it's the marauder against a sniper. A sniper has so many tools that based on class alone a marauder won't be able to touch the sniper before the sniper brings him down. And yet marauders kill snipers all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew_Past Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 First of all, and most importantly, is that it doesn't matter. Play what you enjoy and what you have fun with. That's what I did. I have mained a Vigilance Guardian since release. Far before the spec reached the strong point it is at now. I always found ways to make it work in ranked, even when others told me it couldn't. I knew a sorc who was laughed at when he wanted to run lightning sorc in 8v8 ranked, but he built a team around him that went undefeated for a month. Secondly, over time you will find that a good player can take any class and excel over the majority of players. It comes down to knowing things outside of rotations. Positioning, target choice, CC use, CC break use, peeling, taunting, AOE pressure vs focusing targets, general situational awareness, etc. These are things that you can utilize as any class. Some classes do better in some of these areas than others, but becoming aware of even a few of these will make you a better player than the majority of people I see. Thirdly, balance will be completely different in a little over a month. There's no point investing in a powerful class when it could be completely so soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helpmewin Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 (edited) Smash jugs, pyro PT-s, madness sins and sorcs for yolo ranked. Regs - all classes and spec viable. Edited October 23, 2014 by helpmewin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elusive_Thing Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Smash jugs, pyro PT-s, madness sins and sorcs for yolo ranked. Regs - all classes and spec viable. Smash Juggies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HBCentaurion Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Smash Juggies? Single target burst + survivability I assume. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cretinus Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 (edited) What is the strongest PvP class at the top skill level, generally speaking? I know there won't be one answer to this questions, but nonetheless I want to hear various opinions. Let's assume all characters have the best gear and top skill levels. 1. One on One fight - no companion. 2. Survivability - how hard it is to kill the character 3. Overall PvP - which class is considered powerful in overall consensus? I remember back in early days it used to be sith assassin/marauder, but a lot of things have changed since then. Most people will understand your question as "which class outputs the highest dmg / has biggest burst dmg / is able to onehit others" etc. That's because most people don't know anything other than producing dps in every situation. Well, this is wrong. The strongest class in PvP, the one without serious competition, the one without which you won't win is: ---- OPERATIVE HEALER ---- No other advanced class is able to get away with half the weird situations these folks are able to deal with. No other healer comes close. Not even operative healers would argue this. You can argue whether DPS sorc is better or worse than sniper, whether jugg is better or worse than vanguard etc. But when it comes to winning a match, there's no alternative. If the other team has one and yours hasn't, your team will lose. No rated team will want any other healer. Together with hybrids, they're the main reason why BW is introducing disciplines. It would have been impossible to nerf them without breaking them in PvE. But to keep them the way they are now was a slap in the face for the other healing classes and for the complete PvP balance. Edited October 23, 2014 by Cretinus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodrin Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Makes me feel like Shadow/assassin being OP just like 2 years ago when I left SWTOR, if you listed those in order. "3. Overall (dps) - shadow / assassin, guardian / jugg, VG / PT" Guardian/ jugg deals more damange than PURE dps marauder? What has the world come to? Thanks for the input! Guardian/jugg does not deal more damage than the marauder, it's just that their self heals are so ridiculously good that they are much easier to play. Nothing matches carnage mara burst right now. And madness sins are the way to go now. Good durability for a DPS class, very high sustained damage output, solid burst, and stealth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sithBracer Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Makes me feel like Shadow/assassin being OP just like 2 years ago when I left SWTOR, if you listed those in order. "3. Overall (dps) - shadow / assassin, guardian / jugg, VG / PT" Guardian/ jugg deals more damange than PURE dps marauder? What has the world come to? Thanks for the input! He just hates assassins. But yeah, madness assassins are pretty OP right now, but I would say madness sorcs are much stronger in the hands of the right player (I play both and my sorc is my first and main class). Marauders/sentinels are the #1 burst class right now, but guardians have much more survivability and immunity after leaping so they get the edge. Snipers also belong in that list, but they have problems in solo ranked arenas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew_Past Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Most people will understand your question as "which class outputs the highest dmg / has biggest burst dmg / is able to onehit others" etc. That's because most people don't know anything other than producing dps in every situation. Well, this is wrong. The strongest class in PvP, the one without serious competition, the one without which you won't win is: ---- OPERATIVE HEALER ---- No other advanced class is able to get away with half the weird situations these folks are able to deal with. No other healer comes close. Not even operative healers would argue this. You can argue whether DPS sorc is better or worse than sniper, whether jugg is better or worse than vanguard etc. But when it comes to winning a match, there's no alternative. If the other team has one and yours hasn't, your team will lose. No rated team will want any other healer. Together with hybrids, they're the main reason why BW is introducing disciplines. It would have been impossible to nerf them without breaking them in PvE. But to keep them the way they are now was a slap in the face for the other healing classes and for the complete PvP balance. While not as easy to do well with, merc heals work too. I've seen a few work well in ranked. Sure, sorc heals are hurting right now, but again, things will change in 3.0. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Volxen Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Most people will understand your question as "which class outputs the highest dmg / has biggest burst dmg / is able to onehit others" etc. That's because most people don't know anything other than producing dps in every situation. Well, this is wrong. The strongest class in PvP, the one without serious competition, the one without which you won't win is: ---- OPERATIVE HEALER ---- No other advanced class is able to get away with half the weird situations these folks are able to deal with. No other healer comes close. Not even operative healers would argue this. You can argue whether DPS sorc is better or worse than sniper, whether jugg is better or worse than vanguard etc. But when it comes to winning a match, there's no alternative. If the other team has one and yours hasn't, your team will lose. No rated team will want any other healer. Together with hybrids, they're the main reason why BW is introducing disciplines. It would have been impossible to nerf them without breaking them in PvE. But to keep them the way they are now was a slap in the face for the other healing classes and for the complete PvP balance. But that's not because operative healers are overpowered, but because the the other two healers need to be buffed up to the level of operative healers. Kind of like how DPS mercs need to be buffed up to the level of snipers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jadescythe Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 *insert opinion here* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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