Cantina Socialization (repost from Beta Boards)

[Kalfear]

So guess I posted this in wrong area before so do it here! In Beta I came up with some fleshed out concepts for Cantinas and makeing them more active social hubs. It received some very good feed back so upon the suggestion I copied some of it for repost here after the forum wipes)

 

This is mostly a repost of a section of Kalfear's post here, but he had one idea that really clicked with me and I thought that it needed more attention/ its own space for discussion.

 

Originally Posted by Kalfear

 

Right now Cantinas are dull and empty and no amount of jukebox songs are going to change that. The solution to both the interaction and the dead cantinas is to give Cantinas a reason for being that draws players to them.

 

PAAZAAK, Holo Chess, that game Chewie and C3P0 played on Falcon in Episode 4. Add them into game and make it that you can only play them IN CANTINAS ONLY.

 

SWOOP RACES (ala KotOR1, NOT SWG or KotOR2 style). Again, create instances that do a timed swoop bike race and have the registration and initialization start in the cantina

 

PIT FIGHTING (ala KotOR1 and 2). In Empire space and Hutt controlled space, have cantinas host pit fighting. 1 vrs 1 (could be npc or pc really with a whole ranking system and champion for each cantina)

 

PLUS have a veiwing screen for people in the cantina to watch a swoop bike run, watch a pit fight taking place, even watch the ongoing Hutt a Ball matchs.

 

YOU COULD EVEN PUT IN BETTING ON EVENTS

 

Put these in and WHAM, your cantinas will become a hot bed of activity when players are not adventuring and its also a instant end game filler content which is never a bad thing.

 

And you could even go a step further and create special quests for special Paazaak cards and Swoop Bike Parts that keep players busy.

 

When I was playing I was really dissapointed by how empty and kind of lame the cantinas were. It was actually a moment where I lost immersion because the cantinas were so wooden. They don't feel anywhere near as bustling as the bars in Mass Effect, or the cantinas in the movies. It would be awesome if there was a reason for players to actually socialize/party in cantinas, and make them as cool as they are supposed to be. The only time in beta that the cantinas didnt feel like some empty, compulsory scenery, was when we were having End of the World dance parties as the beta servers were coming down. (everyone took off their clothing items and pulled out their lightsabers LOL)

 

In terms of implementation, I think there are some difficulties in Kalfear's suggestions. Pazaak and Pit Fighting would probably have to be instanced/some equivalent, or be another way of queueing for a special type of pvp. But making a unique minigame just in

cantina locations sounds genius.

 

Oh the Swoop race would have to total be instanced, thats why I went with KotOR1 style over SWG style (well that and lag issues, less lag in a single instance then a functioning world and when racing against the clock, you want to minimize all the lag you can) (KotOR 2 swoop races were so utterly terrible they were never a consideration).

 

Someone below you suggests multiplayer swoop and attacking/pvp but to do that you have to take it out of the cantina and have a actual physical track set up where other players could attack from.

 

Not very viable and then there is the whole "I dont wish to PVP issue" to contend with. Forced PVP kills games outright.

 

So up, single player swoop instances (KotOR1 tracks with the speed bump ups and such) where players pay a entrance fee and then race against the clock for best time of day and track.

 

The interaction comes from having a giant veiw screen in the cantina set up where other players can veiw the race and even place bets before hand (say there is a 2-3 minute waiting period between sign up and racing for bets to be placed). Also if you can only bet on winning vrs time, there can be no exploitation of the event (someone throwing the race to collect a bet on the other racer).

 

Paazaak would be a 2 person instance but thats still interaction and a reason to be there. If you have 10 games going in a cantina, thats 20 real people interacting.

Could even hold paazaak tourneyments

 

Same for the Holo Chess and that other game I dont know name of.

As for the pit fighting, I say Empire and Hutt space for immersion reasons, It doesnt really sound like a core worlds Republic space entertainment (maybe in that gang owned cantina in the Merchant district but not the cantina in the Senate)

 

Again you could have beeting when its Player vrs NPC but not fo rPlayer vrs player because of the potential for exploiting (so sad we have to think of these things when thinking up a idea).

 

When I say betting, Im talking a fixed limit so you have to seriously work at lossing a ton of credits so we not enableing the goldsellers/farmers.

 

I disagree that in game betting would increase it to a R or AO rating, but in the off chance it does, drop it, players will still place wagers between themselves on all of these activities.

I gotta admit though, these not new ideas, well the Spectator Veiw Screens parts are.

 

Someone else on the general boards suggested it after Hutt A Ball was announced and I just carried it forward for my idea on the swoop racing and pit fighting.

 

All of this stuff however is just expanded versions of what was in place for KotOR1 and 2 and added so much enviroment and atmosphere to those single player games. Dont know about anyone else but I played every single NPC I could Paazaak in KotOR and when TOR was first announced I envisioned Role Playing a jedi that strived to save Taris and had a Paazaak gambling problem and travelled the universe looking for rare Paazaak cards.

 

Honestly I just assumed all this stuff (Paazaak, Swoop, Arena fighting) would be in game because it was in both KotORs. I just expanded it for the MMORPG genre is all

 

But thanks for the props Drekos, always nice to hear someone likes your ideas and vision.

I love TOR (and to think just day before beta invite came I told a friend I think I will skip the title after all) but they need socialization and to be honest the answers (well beyond these suggestions) so obvious to me but ill keep those in my hip pocket. Who knows, I might still win a Lotto and get to make my own MMORPG and use all these idea Ive come up with over the decades heh

 

The pazaak ideas mentioned in previous posts are a cool idea. Would be awesome to have high-stakes pazaak championships every week or so... /shrugs

 

Yup, that was part of my vision with this idea

 

Well not weekly but monthly you hold mini Paazaak tourneys per planet and then once a year Bioware runs a sanctioned (with minor prizes even) server wide Paazaak Touneyment to name the Paazaak Champion of that year. Could even come with a special in game title no one else could get until they win a yearly Tourneyment.

 

For Swoops I envisioned KotOR1 concept of each planet (assessable or veiwable from all cantinas on the planet but same track and times recorded) has a unique track of their own set in the enviroment back drop of their planet (like KotOR did) and every year (works ouut to one planet a month or something like that) that track has its grand championships where the top 50 times of the year are invited to a swoop bike toureyment where you do 5 races each and your times are combined and the best over all time wins the championship title (so consistancy rather then 1 lucky run is rewarded).

 

In fact, while I personally hate the sport myself, they could set Swoop racing up like Nascar from the monthly races and at end of a year a GRAND CHAMPION is titled with his/her own special in game title for winning.

 

Same for the pit fighting 1 on 1 pvp basically

 

All of these Ideas have instant draw to get people in the cantinas but if you think bigger, they have huge potential at building in game events that would would instantly fill allot of end game time and game play!

 

And as I said, if Bioware wanted to get really creative they could also develop multiple long quests for special swoop bike parts and special rare Paazaak cards. I will admit I think these quests should all be post lvl 50 content as those are the people that will probably engage the most in this stuff once the storyline of thewir character is over.

 

I'm pretty sure the socializing part comes into play when your trying to find another person to play against inside the cantina. Let alone you'd most likely talk to the person as your playing the game. Also these are great ideas. It would bring bodies into the cantina, especially the paazak game.

 

Exactly, back in the day (not anymore sadly) in oNWN, one of the biggest draws to PVP was the taunting (and it wasnt "U Suxor") and banter between players. But that game was turn based so you had the time. Real time robbed the genre of that amazing and fun activity.

 

Paazaak, chess, that star wars ep 4 game are all turn based so there would be banter (hopefully fun) back and forth plus the whole side bets (it will happen even if not a game mechanic) and setting up matchs.

 

Its not going to be 2 people silently staring at each other (well hopefully not)

For the swoop and pit fighting, the interaction comes AFTER the matchs when your in cantina bragging or taunting or rejoicing your victory or win or run or what ever. I doubt people will come in, have an amazing run, and leave silently. That goes against human nature.

 

I like it. And yes, the swoop racing sucked in kotor 2. was great fun in the first kotor.

 

I dont know about pazaak, i dont even think it takes that much skill, having a good deck helps i guess.

 

LOL, it really did, I hate exploits and cheats but I gotta admit I used the cheat to get past the swoop bike races in K2, only thing (beyond the unfinished content of course) I didnt like about that game.

 

I actually couldnt even do it in K2, I tried a number of times and couldnt finish the first course with out the cheat.

 

as for paazaak, deck definately helps which is why I think they need special quest lines for players to explore. They could be triggered after a certain number of games played (not won or lost, just played).

 

But as for skill, I think there is tactics to the game and not being able to esc and reload like the single player games would result in alot of losses players of the single player games didnt have.

Edited December 24, 2011 by Kalfear

[eavn]

cool

 

/5char

[LordArtemis]

I wish you could have saved some of Ravennight's input. But it was a good read, some great ideas.

[SithEmpress]

I wish they add any of these features. I never did get why game make all these cool places, but don't bother to make a reason to hang out in them.

[CosmicKat]

The worst thing they did to stifle social interaction and roleplay in TOR was to make the range of people's voices (/say and /emote ranges) literally much longer than the range of the guns those characters fire. People don't want their interactions to be broadcast across half the station, and people don't want to see others' interactions from half way across the station.

 

The second worst thing they did was to put the central hub for that interaction and roleplay literally at the center hub of a circular station, drastically compounding the first problem.

 

Had they played any of the other games out there with "social hubs" they would realize that the players who want these will seek them out and go to them no matter where they are, and those who don't want them, don't care.

[annabethchase]

Yes, it's absolutely time for the mini-games. I'd make 3.0 Rise of the Minigames and feature SSSP and Star Wars lore appropriate mini games like listed in the original post.

[chuixupu]

Quite an epic necro there.

[Gomla]

Wow.

 

A thread from launch gets to live again.

 

Do people not check dates when they reply to a thread?

[AchillesStark]

Love the idea. cantinas are absurdly sad right now

[Grimmoir]

o.0

 

Holy Freaking Thread Necro Batman!!!

 

Quick...

 

Kill it with FIRE!!

 

-Grim

 

P.S.- Are people really so bored that they have to dig up threads this old to post in, or are they just not bothering to check the date? This is a re-post of a re-post from the BETA forums!

[DonMeridius]

This is a great idea! Most of these suggestions were present in the original KotOR and I'm still surprised that these mini-games still have not been added to the game.

[filryxx]

I was just thinking about this stuff.

 

I don't even understand why they built the cantinas in the first place if you don't have the need to go there.

 

Put it in devs!!!

[Darth_Wicked]

I was just thinking about this stuff.

 

I don't even understand why they built the cantinas in the first place if you don't have the need to go there.

 

Put it in devs!!!

 

Last I checked, when the game first came out, you needed to log off in a cantina or on your ship, to get rested XP. It was far easier to do it in a cantina, if you were in any given planet, instead of returning to your ship.

 

EDIT:

 

Plus, some companion conversations can be had in cantinas, not in one's ship.

Edited September 20, 2013 by Darth_Wicked