Krossi Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 That's mainly because I never parse these fights anymore, nor do I bother to fluff enough. Hybrid absolutely will do more dmg in P2 because of the extra fluff damage, but Lethality has better survivability. Lethality can do more than enough during Phase 2 and your other DPS should be putting out substantial numbers as well (Snipers should not have to carry there ). Long story short, both specs are fine for Council both have killed it, so what's the point? Comments like these are getting old now as the content is nerfed as well. Please. Easy to say something like that as the world first Deposer of the dread masters... We still haven't killed the dread masters yet, so we keep on optimizing. But that's no point to discuss over here. I keep playing DF, as i enjoy to play it and do enough damage. But even as a nerfed content it's hard to kill if you haven't spent any time on the pts and took a lot of raids without the best crew cause there was a DD missing. So we continue as we did prenerf and you better watch out. With that 81er Mainhand i will win the leaderboard Maybe you should do some new dummy parses to make it harder, mates Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THoK-Zeus Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 (edited) That's mainly because I never parse these fights anymore, nor do I bother to fluff enough. Hybrid absolutely will do more dmg in P2 because of the extra fluff damage, but Lethality has better survivability. Lethality can do more than enough during Phase 2 and your other DPS should be putting out substantial numbers as well (Snipers should not have to carry there ). Long story short, both specs are fine for Council both have killed it, so what's the point? Comments like these are getting old now as the content is nerfed as well. Please. I only wanted to bring an argument to my point (although as there's no one else uploading any p2 council phase logs so it's probably a bit invalid). I agree with you on the surviveability <-> damage. Even if the content is nerfed , other guilds/players are still interested in optimizing their spec/rotation/class... for these fights (we don't need to do that currently i guess ). Edited September 26, 2014 by THoK-Zeus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnickerJew Posted September 26, 2014 Author Share Posted September 26, 2014 As I've said before, I am no where near the best Sniper so PLEASE beat my parse. I should not be #1. This thread is to help guide those who would like to play this spec better as a whole and in raid scenarios. I honestly could careless about where I am in the parse ranks as long as I know I'm within the #1 of like 50~ (Crits can be a ***** so everyone gets an excuse). Regardless, goodluck on council & Lethality is more than viable for the fight! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nepthen Posted September 26, 2014 Share Posted September 26, 2014 For someone who has recently switched from Sentinel to Gunslinger (at least until 3.0), this guide is extremely helpful. I felt lost in DF (I'm fairly decent in SS) but this is great. After figuring out the translation from Sniper to GS, I'm definitely going to try out DF in an actual raid setting. Thank you for this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnickerJew Posted September 26, 2014 Author Share Posted September 26, 2014 For someone who has recently switched from Sentinel to Gunslinger (at least until 3.0), this guide is extremely helpful. I felt lost in DF (I'm fairly decent in SS) but this is great. After figuring out the translation from Sniper to GS, I'm definitely going to try out DF in an actual raid setting. Thank you for this! You're very welcome I will be sure to include a GS translation very soon to make this easier as I don't want to make a completely different thread for just Gunslingers. Really appreciate the positive feedback and I hope you enjoy playing DF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krossi Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 For someone who has recently switched from Sentinel to Gunslinger (at least until 3.0), this guide is extremely helpful. I felt lost in DF (I'm fairly decent in SS) but this is great. After figuring out the translation from Sniper to GS, I'm definitely going to try out DF in an actual raid setting. Thank you for this! DF is a very beautiful spec It's fun to play and i really enjoy it. As i joined the nightmare content i just was able to play SS and my damage was enough aswell. There are still bosses, where you need to or should play SS. So you may should learn it aswell. But DF does a very good damage at nearly any boss. SS isn't that hard anyways. But the rotation doesn't fit as good as DF rotation does. You need a filler in SS, which delays the rest by about ~1 second. But it's still strong enough if you play lower apm and leave that filler But if you are able to play DF well, you can easily play 80% of the content without any problems Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KYR_Pwnstar Posted September 30, 2014 Share Posted September 30, 2014 It's all fun and games until cull doesn't proc your takedown on a 3.9k parse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HBCentaurion Posted September 30, 2014 Share Posted September 30, 2014 (edited) I've been hitting the dummy with the Raid Rotation that you posted, and it feels much smoother than my previous rotation with Ambush. The only issue I'm having is that Laze + Snipe really really screws up my energy. Even if I do Covered Escape (or Rifleshot) the following two times, I end up in a downward energy spiral. With the 1 million HP dummy I run out of energy completely towards the end (I have the 4 set bonus and about 300 critical rating). I'm also kinda curious as to what DPS I should be aiming at with 180 gear? Doing the Raid Rotation on a 1 million HP dummy with the Armour Debuff, I hoover around 3.5-3.6k DPS. Is that good or bad? Edited September 30, 2014 by HBCentaurion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnickerJew Posted September 30, 2014 Author Share Posted September 30, 2014 It's all fun and games until cull doesn't proc your takedown on a 3.9k parse Another great point. Takedown should be 100% GUARANTEED and this is a travesty that it actually has a chance to not proc. I've been hitting the dummy with the Raid Rotation that you posted, and it feels much smoother than my previous rotation with Ambush. The only issue I'm having is that Laze + Snipe really really screws up my energy. Even if I do Covered Escape (or Rifleshot) the following two times, I end up in a downward energy spiral. With the 1 million HP dummy I run out of energy completely towards the end (I have the 4 set bonus and about 300 critical rating). I'm also kinda curious as to what DPS I should be aiming at with 180 gear? Doing the Raid Rotation on a 1 million HP dummy with the Armour Debuff, I hoover around 3.5-3.6k DPS. Is that good or bad? My video doesn't really give the rotation its justice. This rotation is solely based upon crits with Cull. If you get a boat load of crits while Culling you'll have more than enough energy to resume using high energy moves (like EP & LT+Snipe), but if you aren't getting crits then your parse will die quickly if you aren't using Rifle shot. It's quite annoying trying to get a very very high parse when you're BiS because you're using as many high energy abilities as possible praying you get crits to make up for the energy loss. Long story short, I usually end up completing 1/4 parses I do as Lethality now a days. Unfortunately I do not know what the good & average parses are for being in 180 gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Fuzzle Posted October 1, 2014 Share Posted October 1, 2014 (edited) Alrighty, finally got around to testing out some of the things in your guide. First off, good call on the Ambush use. I've gotten within 10 dps of my best (lucky) parse using Ambush when I got complete garbage for crits at certain times during the rotation and had to space out my Covered Escapes. Even with 2 less Explosive Probes than ideal, it kept up. Next, on the subject of Snipe, I think there are a couple things that are interesting. Where you have your Lazed Snipe in the cycle (right after Cull) definitely helps control the energy it uses much better than using it after a Series of Shots. However where you use it in the initial rotation I think leads to energy problems in a reliable manner. Using the Lazed Snipe after the 5th Cull not the 3rd allows for some energy recovery right off the bat and leads to less failed parses. Then after the 7th Cull, you can pop Explosive Probe + Adrenaline Probe fairly reliably. After Target Acquired comes off cooldown for use with another Explosive Probe, you can then put Lazed Snipe in the next Cull cycle. This seems to keep me from burning through energy way too fast and actually lets me complete 3/4 parses. So for reliability and sustainability purposes overall I think the rotation should start off as: CG > CD > WB + Adrenal > Cull > EP + TA > TD > SoS > Cull > TD DoTs > WB > Cull > GCD > TD > SS > Cull > TD + LT DoTs > WB > Cull > Snipe > TD > SoS > Cull > TD DoTs > WB > Cull > EP + AP > TD > SoS > Cull > TD DoTs > WB > Cull > GCD > TD > SoS > Cull > TD DoTs > WB > Cull > TD > SoS > GCD > Cull > TD and then switch to: DoTs > WB > Cull > EP + TA > TD > SoS > Cull > TD + LT DoTs > WB > Cull > Snipe > TD > SoS > Cull > TD DoTs > WB > Cull > EP + AP > TD > SoS > Cull > TD DoTs > WB > Cull > GCD > TD > SoS > Cull > TD DoTs > WB > Cull > TD > GCD > SS > Cull > TD DoTs > WB > Cull > TD > SoS > GCD > Cull > TD You've had a lot of experience with this, but thought I'd throw my two cents in there. Excellent guide with some great ideas in here. Edited October 1, 2014 by Mr_Fuzzle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnickerJew Posted October 1, 2014 Author Share Posted October 1, 2014 Very interesting. I've never really moved abilities around like LT+Snipe. I will see how better that is on energy, but theoretically you can move LT+Snipe where ever you want in the rotation as it should never fall under Target Aquired or your Adrenal. Pretty much where ever you have extra energy you can use this ability, but I've just thrown in there out of burst for an opener. I would personally want to make sure I have Laze Target off CD going into sub 10% on the dummy though as its a guaranteed crit. Besides that, very valid point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnickerJew Posted October 11, 2014 Author Share Posted October 11, 2014 Just want to let everyone know that I plan on updating this guide as soon and detailed as humanly possible. I am very hopeful for Snipers/Slingers in the coming 3.0 Update, but I will be focusing on Lethality/DF only unfortunately. Here's to Snipers not being bottom of the dummy parsing barrel anymore? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shyroman Posted October 11, 2014 Share Posted October 11, 2014 I'm hopeful as well, if not being near the top, I'm hoping for at least near the middle of the pack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnickerJew Posted October 11, 2014 Author Share Posted October 11, 2014 I'm hopeful as well, if not being near the top, I'm hoping for at least near the middle of the pack. I think being within 200~ DPS of the top parsing class/spec isn't too much to ask personally, but we will see where everyone lands after loads and loads of testing. WTB SoS or Cull while moving <3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shyroman Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 I think being within 200~ DPS of the top parsing class/spec isn't too much to ask personally, but we will see where everyone lands after loads and loads of testing. WTB SoS or Cull while moving <3 SoS while moving would do wonders for mobility with all specs, that would be great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TACeMossie Posted October 12, 2014 Share Posted October 12, 2014 SoS while moving would do wonders for mobility with all specs, that would be great. I doubt you'll get SoS due to it requiring cover, though Cull makes sense. It will probably be: Cull Super Orbital [Engineering's obvious replacement of normal orbital] Series of Shots replacement ability that marksman will most likely be getting that will most likely not have a cover requirement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tripnyc Posted November 2, 2014 Share Posted November 2, 2014 Thanks for this helpful thread! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sebonedrum Posted November 24, 2014 Share Posted November 24, 2014 My video doesn't really give the rotation its justice. This rotation is solely based upon crits with Cull. If you get a boat load of crits while Culling you'll have more than enough energy to resume using high energy moves (like EP & LT+Snipe), but if you aren't getting crits then your parse will die quickly if you aren't using Rifle shot. It's quite annoying trying to get a very very high parse when you're BiS because you're using as many high energy abilities as possible praying you get crits to make up for the energy loss. Long story short, I usually end up completing 1/4 parses I do as Lethality now a days. Unfortunately I do not know what the good & average parses are for being in 180 gear. This! i used to dummy parse this way: precast OS+A dots -> WB -> Adrenal+CULL -> TA+EP -> TD -> SoS -> CULL -> TD dots -> WB -> CULL -> roll -> TD -> SoS -> CULL -> TD dots -> WB -> CULL -> AP+EP -> TD -> SoS -> CULL -> TD dots -> LT-> WB -> CULL -> TD ->Snipe -> SoS -> CULL -> TD dots -> WB ->CULL -> roll -> TD -> SoS -> CULL -> TD dots -> WB ->CULL -> TD -> SoS -> roll -> CULL -> TD Repeat i was able to get decent parses (not magical or super high, but decent) and many times i've ended up aborting them cause of freaking cull crits, even at the very beginning. reading your opener i was wondering that the LT+snipe -> TD -> SoS combo it's quite deadly and if you're not getting crits by the fist 2 culls your pretty much screwd up imo, unless RS ofc i know everything is gonna change in about 2 weeks but do you think it's better to go straight till the end, knowing you gonna rage pretty hard, or just abort it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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