Guildships COST 50 MILLION CREDITS!?

[Grayseven]

That's a pretty hostile reply... and an inaccurate one at that.

 

It's not very difficult for a modestly sized, moderately active guild to acquire 50 million credits, if that's what they set their minds to do.

 

It's a matter of prioritization. Do they want the guild ship, or don't they? If they want the guild ship, the path is pretty simple. There have been a lot of posts that talk about the ability for 1 player to very easily and with little time investment get a million credits a week. Let's say your modest guild has 10 players who want a guild ship badly enough to do that.

 

That's 10 mil a week. In 5 weeks, you have your 50 million. And, believe me, that 1 mil a week is low-balled. People who know how to earn credits can, again without life-shattering effort, pull 10-20 million each week.

 

Now if you had started doing that back when guild ships were announced - in March of this year - and used only half the weeks to fundraise for it, you would have around 100 million. The feature was announced about 19 weeks ago. 10 weeks * 10 million = 100 million.

 

If you procrastinated or didn't realize the ships would require a modest commitment from the guild and thus need to start now, you can have your ship by the end of August, just a couple weeks after they go live.

 

If your modestly sized, moderately active guild doesn't want a guild ship badly enough to put in minimal to modest effort, then they don't want it badly enough to complain about the effort required to get it, do they?

 

You are failing to realize one very important thing:

 

What happens to the GTN when everyone stops buying in order to save credits for a GS at the same time they are flooding the GTN with items and undercutting each other to try to make what few sales are available?

 

This isn't going to happen in a vacuum. There will be affects to the GTN as people try to do exactly what you suggest. And the credits to buy something ARE finite depending solely on what players are doing to earn them. Someone, somewhere is going to have to be "creating" credits in order for them to be available. Creating credits requires playing the game, doing dailies and the like.

 

You folks need to open your eyes to the big picture. Do you realize how huge of a credit sink this is going to be? Once the GS are purchased and those billions of credits are no longer on the market, what then?

 

And yes, it may be harsh, but that is because ignorance has to be bulldozed to realize it is ignorant. Saying the same thing over and over again about "earning" or "deserving" continues to push forth an attitude that this game is something that needs to be "worked at".

 

Work is not fun. Otherwise, we'd all be happily going to jobs we loved every day and not worrying one bit about retirement since we'd be having so much fun working.

 

In reality, work sucks. I don't play this game to work, I play to have fun and it isn't fun to spend all of my limited game time trying to earn credits doing boring repetitive things.

 

If they would make it fun to actually earn the GS instead of credits, I'd be all for it. If they had special FPs or OPs I could run daily for two months to earn it that would be awesome. I wouldn't have to base my entire game time around trying to earn credits for my guild.

 

Ultimately, anything added to a game has to able to positively answer the question "Is this fun?" because if the answer is no, it doesn't belong in a game.

[Grayseven]

To do a quick check on my memory(my experience totally disagrees with yours), I ran Ilum. Took 15 minutes, and netted 110k. Granted Ilum is one of the most if not the most efficient daily zone, but some of the others are comparable. At a full 5 hour run, I think you're well into the territory of doing the really slow dailies(though 424k seems incredibly low).

 

 

 

 

Well the point wasn't that dailies were the only(or most efficient or most fun option), so much as that 50 million is actually relatively achievable even for small groups of casual players.

 

I agree with you that other forms of currency should be options for contribution, although I imagine all hell would break loose were we to attach a credit conversion value to warzone commendations(not that forum outrage bothers me though).

 

 

What makes 20 million the price to you though?

 

I did these about two months ago. I did every daily and here are the numbers:

 

 

Ilum: Ilum was the first end game daily hub and it is also the most lucrative as far as credits and time involved. Not counting the Heroic 2+ (which can be easily soloed by a geared 55), there are 5 dailies that will return 53825 Cr in total. There is no reputation attached to Ilum.

 

Black Hole: Found on Corellia, this level 50 hub is also fast but the credit payout is much lower than Ilum. Not counting the Heroic 4+ (which, while difficult and time consuming for some classes, can also be soloed) there are 5 dailies that return 39896 Cr. There is no reputation associated with this hub. There is also a Weekly for this hub.

 

Belsavis: There are two daily hubs associated with Belsavis. The first is a world hub that spans the planetary level range. This is the first set of dailies you will be able run and can help if you find yourself under level heading into Corellia. It has a Heroic 2+ that can be soloed with little difficulty and 9 additional daily quests. They are, unfortunately, also more time consuming than they are worth and will return a total of 73905 Cr for completion.

 

Section X: The second Belsavis daily hub, this level 50 hub is less time consuming than some but the credit return is sub-par. Including the easily soloed Area 2+ this area returns 58196 Cr. There is also a Heroic 4 that absolutely requires 4 people to complete and is needed for the available Weekly quest. There is a reputation for this hub which can add credits to the total once you reach maximum reputation here.

 

Makeb: This planet is a level 55 daily hub and once you've completed the story line you will find the dailies available on a mission terminal. None of these dailies is short and the payout of 63900 Cr for doing them is sub par for the effort involved. However, there is a reputation faction and a Weekly separate from the dailies that does pay out reasonably well for the effot at 106602 Cr. Also on this planet you will find GSI dailies which are obtainable once you have reached a certain stage of the Seeker Droid/Macrobinocular mission series and you can run both the Makeb weekly, the dailies and the GSI dailies all at once for a decent some of credits for the time involved.

 

CZ-198: This level 55 hub has a weekly that involves running a pair of flashpoints, a reputation faction and a lead in quest with decent rewards. The 4 solo dailes will return 36666 Cr and can easily be done in 15 minutes or so making them the fastest of the dailies.

 

Oricon: This is the latest of the daily hubs and can be difficult unless your gearing is above average for end game. The Heroic 2+ is extremely difficult to solo and it's far better to grab a buddy for this one. There is a Weekly and a reputation faction here as well. Not counting the Heroic 2+, you will earn 54400 Cr for the 4 dailies which are reasonably quick.

 

 

This does not count the vendor trash you'll get running the missions.

[Kissakias]

that wasn't directed at you but....okay.

 

Also, it's good that you'd rather have a good career and family life. I had no idea that the two were incompatible. one day, when your kids ask you, tears all in their eyes why daddy wasn't cool enough to have a guildship, you can tell them it's all their fault.

 

HAHAAHHAAH, nice one

[XiamaraSimi]

Translation: "What!?! We have to actually -work- to get something? How dare you!!!!/ragequit"

 

The amount of entitlement and lack of wanting to actually do something to get something in people just kills me..

 

Small wonder just my city alone is full of people sitting around who think having a kid every year or two is their "job" the government -has- to pay them for... let alone our entire country... (yes here in america, entire generations of families use exploiting the welfare system as their "jobs")

Edited July 25, 2014 by XiamaraSimi

[DarthTHC]

You are failing to realize one very important thing:

 

What happens to the GTN when everyone stops buying in order to save credits for a GS at the same time they are flooding the GTN with items and undercutting each other to try to make what few sales are available?

 

The million a week figure is running dailies, I believe, not using GTN so that's irrelevant.

 

This isn't going to happen in a vacuum. There will be affects to the GTN as people try to do exactly what you suggest. And the credits to buy something ARE finite depending solely on what players are doing to earn them. Someone, somewhere is going to have to be "creating" credits in order for them to be available. Creating credits requires playing the game, doing dailies and the like.

 

You folks need to open your eyes to the big picture. Do you realize how huge of a credit sink this is going to be? Once the GS are purchased and those billions of credits are no longer on the market, what then?

 

Yes, that's going to be interesting to see. I guess the answer depends on how guilds go about gathering the funds for guild ships. If many go the "grind dailies" route, they're creating more credits that will just get destroyed, leaving the cash available in the economy just about where it is now. However, if most leverage GTN, some interesting things might happen.

 

I am currently of the belief that most guilds that do not already have the 50 mil will grind dailies or S&V or a combination thereof, creating more credits, and nothing will change much. I guess we'll see though.

 

And yes, it may be harsh, but that is because ignorance has to be bulldozed to realize it is ignorant. Saying the same thing over and over again about "earning" or "deserving" continues to push forth an attitude that this game is something that needs to be "worked at".

 

Work is not fun. Otherwise, we'd all be happily going to jobs we loved every day and not worrying one bit about retirement since we'd be having so much fun working.

 

In reality, work sucks. I don't play this game to work, I play to have fun and it isn't fun to spend all of my limited game time trying to earn credits doing boring repetitive things.

 

If you don't view a guild ship as fun enough to be worth the effort to obtain it, then don't complain that you don't want to put forth the effort to obtain it. Regardless what you're doing in the game, you're putting forth some amount of effort, right? It's not like you're sitting there, unmoving and unthinking, while the game "services" you.

 

If you don't care to redirect some of your effort to obtain the ship, that's your choice, and nothing to complain about.

 

If they would make it fun to actually earn the GS instead of credits, I'd be all for it. If they had special FPs or OPs I could run daily for two months to earn it that would be awesome. I wouldn't have to base my entire game time around trying to earn credits for my guild.

 

Ultimately, anything added to a game has to able to positively answer the question "Is this fun?" because if the answer is no, it doesn't belong in a game.

 

That can be challenging, because given the vast breadth of playstyles in an MMO, you can't make any one thing fun for everyone. Some people love PvP and hate PvE and RP. Others love doing flashpoints but hate PvP. Some dig crafting. You're asking for the impossible - making something "fun" for everyone.

[Vandicus]

I did these about two months ago. I did every daily and here are the numbers:

 

 

Ilum: Ilum was the first end game daily hub and it is also the most lucrative as far as credits and time involved. Not counting the Heroic 2+ (which can be easily soloed by a geared 55), there are 5 dailies that will return 53825 Cr in total. There is no reputation attached to Ilum.

 

Black Hole: Found on Corellia, this level 50 hub is also fast but the credit payout is much lower than Ilum. Not counting the Heroic 4+ (which, while difficult and time consuming for some classes, can also be soloed) there are 5 dailies that return 39896 Cr. There is no reputation associated with this hub. There is also a Weekly for this hub.

 

Belsavis: There are two daily hubs associated with Belsavis. The first is a world hub that spans the planetary level range. This is the first set of dailies you will be able run and can help if you find yourself under level heading into Corellia. It has a Heroic 2+ that can be soloed with little difficulty and 9 additional daily quests. They are, unfortunately, also more time consuming than they are worth and will return a total of 73905 Cr for completion.

 

Section X: The second Belsavis daily hub, this level 50 hub is less time consuming than some but the credit return is sub-par. Including the easily soloed Area 2+ this area returns 58196 Cr. There is also a Heroic 4 that absolutely requires 4 people to complete and is needed for the available Weekly quest. There is a reputation for this hub which can add credits to the total once you reach maximum reputation here.

 

Makeb: This planet is a level 55 daily hub and once you've completed the story line you will find the dailies available on a mission terminal. None of these dailies is short and the payout of 63900 Cr for doing them is sub par for the effort involved. However, there is a reputation faction and a Weekly separate from the dailies that does pay out reasonably well for the effot at 106602 Cr. Also on this planet you will find GSI dailies which are obtainable once you have reached a certain stage of the Seeker Droid/Macrobinocular mission series and you can run both the Makeb weekly, the dailies and the GSI dailies all at once for a decent some of credits for the time involved.

 

CZ-198: This level 55 hub has a weekly that involves running a pair of flashpoints, a reputation faction and a lead in quest with decent rewards. The 4 solo dailes will return 36666 Cr and can easily be done in 15 minutes or so making them the fastest of the dailies.

 

Oricon: This is the latest of the daily hubs and can be difficult unless your gearing is above average for end game. The Heroic 2+ is extremely difficult to solo and it's far better to grab a buddy for this one. There is a Weekly and a reputation faction here as well. Not counting the Heroic 2+, you will earn 54400 Cr for the 4 dailies which are reasonably quick.

 

 

This does not count the vendor trash you'll get running the missions.

 

 

I should note I measured the difference in credits from when I started to when I ended. Clearly the vendor trash adds up to quite a bit.

 

A quick skim shows your Oricon guide missed the "bonus" dailies which are actually really quick to do and significantly increase credits earned.

 

Most estimates I've seen on the forums(including ones made today) posit around 100k per 20 minutes of dailies(which is pretty close to my experience). Even using a conservative estimate of 100k per 30 minutes, a guild flagship represents about 250 donated man hours.

 

Using that metric and considering possible alternative earnings I'd be happy to discuss how reasonable a 250-hour cost is, but I think the metrics you provide are too far off from the norm to be a reasonable standard to measure required time commitments.

[Infernixx]

If they'd given a CM alternative cost in CCs, people would have complained. Since they didn't give that alternative, people complained.

 

If they'd tied Guild Ship costs into the game in the form of tokens won from HMs, OPs, WZs, Tacticals and dailies....people would complained about being forced into content that they don't like or risk falling behind in the grind for a Guild Ship. The fact that they didn't provide this particular path to a Guild Ship resulted in people complaining that they're broke, but they do content all the time, which makes no sense unless they have zero impulse control and they never contribute to their guilds.

 

I'm not a fan of the 50mil price tag. My own guild is sitting on around 35mil, so we've got to get another 15mil in the next month, to say nothing of the costs for upgrades for the Guild Ship. It's going to be a never-ending project of upgrading, requiring an obscene amount of credits over a very long length of time. And I'm okay with that. My guild is worth that kind of effort. I like my guild. I like my guildies. And we're going to have a great Guild Ship because we're all putting into it.

[Projawa]

It's entirely possible that they will nerf the cost down the line.

Concerns about there not being enough guilds for conquests/competitions seem valid.

 

50 million bucks is fine. I respect BW for making something that you need to work/save to obtain, in a team setting since making this a collective effort will make it an easier process and helps build guild cohesion.

I just hope that for 50 million bucks, these ships better be WORTH IT.

Edited July 25, 2014 by Projawa

[Kissakias]

Pretty much.

 

If they wanted to do this right, EA/BW would have tied Guild ships into content...

 

Say, for example, being able to turn in the vendor tokens from KDY, the Gree event, and the like for a GS token. Add in token purchasable with commendations. Heck, make the tokens purchasable through credits as well as CC if you wanted.

 

You could cap the weekly amount of tokens an individual account could receive to prevent guilds with 400 characters over 40 accounts from having a guild ship in one mad 24 hour rush.

 

In this way, players would be earning Guild Ships simply by doing what they've always done. PvP guilds could still get a GS by using PvP comms instead of the weak credit rewards from PvP. Everyone wins and no one has to do anything beyond what they would normally be doing.

 

But no, instead they put this huge number up that the 1 percenters of SWTOR think is too small but the majority who don't have unlimited time to waste playing games thinks is too large...

 

Someday, I hope, an MMO is created by people who have a clue as to what they are doing...because it is painfully obvious that this one sure as heck isn't one....

 

They want to reward the dedicated players (logical), but you dont need to spend 50m only you to have it, its a guild ship and all guild members will put their fee for it, so that makes the larger guilds to make their members to pay lesser for it, that guilds that are with far lesser members, their member's fee will be larger. simple

Not all must have the Guild Ships ate 1st 2-3 weeks, or ever.

 

And by saying dedicated players i dont mean the hardcore players, but the players that spend their small time only in this game.

Im not a hard core player and i can affort 1 mill or 2 for it, since my guild has 25 - 50 members.

Edited July 25, 2014 by Kissakias

[Grayseven]

That can be challenging, because given the vast breadth of playstyles in an MMO, you can't make any one thing fun for everyone. Some people love PvP and hate PvE and RP. Others love doing flashpoints but hate PvP. Some dig crafting. You're asking for the impossible - making something "fun" for everyone.

 

Hence my earlier suggestion to make earning a guild ship fun for everyone by allowing the purchase of GS tokens with the tokens and commendations available throughout the game when you do what you find fun.

 

50 million credits is the lazy route. It's also the route that will cause guild drama that EA/BW will stay out of because that is the position they have always taken on "guild problems".

 

It wouldn't take that much more effort to make earning a guildship as easy as doing what you have always done except that instead of buying more WZ stims or that extra piece of Verpine gear for your 5th companion or using your latest KDY token to get that really cool mount you'd spend it on a GS token you could then send to your guild leader and once your guild gets the needed amount of tokens you get a guild ship.

 

I suppose I could start sending my Guild Leader all of the trash and green loot I get through my daily actions but I'm sure she'd not appreciate it after a while if all of us start sending her vendor trash...

[OddballEasyEight]

If they would make it fun to actually earn the GS instead of credits, I'd be all for it. If they had special FPs or OPs I could run daily for two months to earn it that would be awesome. I wouldn't have to base my entire game time around trying to earn credits for my guild.

 

Huh... that's interesting... so you're saying you wouldn't mind doing the same "special" FP/OP daily for two months to "earn" the Guild Ship.

But you DO mind running a whole bunch of different FP's/OP's/Dailies for two months to earn enough credits to buy a Guild Ship.

 

In other words, you are just against the fact that it costs credits. You're not against putting up the effort to get one, you just don't like the small step of actually buying it after doing all the work.

 

It kinda feels like if you went up to your boss at work and said "hey boss, I'd really like to have an xbox one, so if I work overtime this entire week, could you just give me one instead of paying me so I can buy one?"

[Grayseven]

I should note I measured the difference in credits from when I started to when I ended. Clearly the vendor trash adds up to quite a bit.

 

A quick skim shows your Oricon guide missed the "bonus" dailies which are actually really quick to do and significantly increase credits earned.

 

Most estimates I've seen on the forums(including ones made today) posit around 100k per 20 minutes of dailies(which is pretty close to my experience). Even using a conservative estimate of 100k per 30 minutes, a guild flagship represents about 250 donated man hours.

 

Using that metric and considering possible alternative earnings I'd be happy to discuss how reasonable a 250-hour cost is, but I think the metrics you provide are too far off from the norm to be a reasonable standard to measure required time commitments.

 

Vendor trash can add up to an extra daily at each zone.

 

The Oricon "bonus dailes" take place in the Heroic area which I did not include because this was designed for a solo player.

 

You can posit that 100k over 20 minutes all you like, but show me your work. If you can make 100k in 20 minutes of dailies...great...but prove it.

 

I physically did the work. I did it with an averaged geared toon. I timed each one. I have the data from my own work and I can tell you that the numbers I have are what you get paid for the dailies. Since loot is random, it's impossible to put down an "average" without a large sample size.

[OddballEasyEight]

I suppose I could start sending my Guild Leader all of the trash and green loot I get through my daily actions but I'm sure she'd not appreciate it after a while if all of us start sending her vendor trash...

 

Or... you could vendor the trash and send her the cash?

 

I mean, it takes less than a minute to do so...

[OddballEasyEight]

Vendor trash can add up to an extra daily at each zone.

 

The Oricon "bonus dailes" take place in the Heroic area which I did not include because this was designed for a solo player.

 

You can posit that 100k over 20 minutes all you like, but show me your work. If you can make 100k in 20 minutes of dailies...great...but prove it.

 

I physically did the work. I did it with an averaged geared toon. I timed each one. I have the data from my own work and I can tell you that the numbers I have are what you get paid for the dailies. Since loot is random, it's impossible to put down an "average" without a large sample size.

 

Yesterday I emptied my smugglers inventory and sent all her cash to an alt. Then I ran CZ-198 dailies.

Only the dailies, not the weekly or the flashpoints.

I didn't vendor the mats I collected, only the items and trash.

End of the run: 58.900+ credits. Total time, way less than 20 minutes.

[Khevar]

Is two months wait a reasonable expectation for a major portion of a new content release? I don't think so.

Why the heck not?? Why must it be immediately? Is your guild not going to last?

 

You can always get a guild stronghold in the short term, while saving up for the flashship long-term.

[Vandicus]

Vendor trash can add up to an extra daily at each zone.

 

The Oricon "bonus dailes" take place in the Heroic area which I did not include because this was designed for a solo player.

 

You can posit that 100k over 20 minutes all you like, but show me your work. If you can make 100k in 20 minutes of dailies...great...but prove it.

 

I physically did the work. I did it with an averaged geared toon. I timed each one. I have the data from my own work and I can tell you that the numbers I have are what you get paid for the dailies. Since loot is random, it's impossible to put down an "average" without a large sample size.

 

I just literally timed my Ilum run as I mentioned earlier. 110k(actually 111k and change) in 15 minutes. My experience is that Ilum usually returns around 100k, and never lower than 90k for a run(ignoring the heroic).

[DarthTHC]

Is two months wait a reasonable expectation for a major portion of a new content release? I don't think so.

 

Some of us paid attention to the announcement back in March and started saving back in March. For us, it's not a two month wait, but rather will happen instantly, the moment our guild leader logs in after downloading the patch. We've been saving for 19 weeks - over 4 months.

 

Those of you who didn't pay attention to the announcement back in March or tend to procrastinate, yeah, two months isn't too bad.

[Infernixx]

Some of us paid attention to the announcement back in March and started saving back in March. For us, it's not a two month wait, but rather will happen instantly, the moment our guild leader logs in after downloading the patch. We've been saving for 19 weeks - over 4 months.

 

Those of you who didn't pay attention to the announcement back in March or tend to procrastinate, yeah, two months isn't too bad.

 

Is two months a reasonable amount of time to put into gaining something? Certainly, considering that once it's earned, it's there to stay.

 

Off topic, I'm intensely curious about the 'personal' Conquest system that they referenced yesterday.

[Vandicus]

Is two months a reasonable amount of time to put into gaining something? Certainly, considering that once it's earned, it's there to stay.

 

Off topic, I'm intensely curious about the 'personal' Conquest system that they referenced yesterday.

 

I'm hoping for some crazy new take on faction war scores that doesn't destroy faction population balance. I've always liked the idea, implementation just seems to be tricky.

[Icestar]

Why the heck not?? Why must it be immediately? Is your guild not going to last?

 

You can always get a guild stronghold in the short term, while saving up for the flashship long-term.

 

Loyal guildmembers might stay two months in a guild without a guildship.

 

I think that many players will jump ship from guilds that can´t afford a guildship and straight into guilds that already have one.

[Grayseven]

Huh... that's interesting... so you're saying you wouldn't mind doing the same "special" FP/OP daily for two months to "earn" the Guild Ship.

But you DO mind running a whole bunch of different FP's/OP's/Dailies for two months to earn enough credits to buy a Guild Ship.

 

In other words, you are just against the fact that it costs credits. You're not against putting up the effort to get one, you just don't like the small step of actually buying it after doing all the work.

 

It kinda feels like if you went up to your boss at work and said "hey boss, I'd really like to have an xbox one, so if I work overtime this entire week, could you just give me one instead of paying me so I can buy one?"

 

I suppose if you ignored everything I've said up to this point and read what you wanted to into what I wrote, then yeah, you could look at it that way...

 

The "effort" should be fun. It shouldn't be "go earn credits" because there just isn't any fun in that. Sure, while I am having fun, I'm earning credits but not at nearly the rate required for an equal share in a 50 million credit purchase.

 

When I'm out "having fun" in game, I might earn 30k credits in a couple of hours of game time. I might make 200k credits a week just "having fun".

 

A guild with 40 players "having fun" at my rate of credit earning would earn 8 million credits a week. If all those credits were turned over to the guild, that would allow the purchase of a guild ship in a little over 6 weeks.

 

Of course, on the weeks I get to raid I get paid more and on the weeks where I don't get to play more than an hour or two all week I get paid much less. And when I put my mind and all my effort in to it, I can earn 10 million credits in a few days of game time.

 

The token system removes the "risk" for players and guilds. A player doesn't have to wonder if the guild is going to boot him the moment they get their GS, or wonder if their investment is actually worth it. Those tokens aren't worth anything else so they may as well get used. And by doing whatever it is that I enjoy doing I can be earning those tokens.

 

Of course, it removes what promises to be the "Mother of all Credit Sinks" but when should new content be devoted to being a massive credit sink anyway? You want a good credit sink, take some of the stuff you make for the CM and make it purchasable for credits...it'll work a lot better.

[Drox]

It's a good thing the people complaining don't play STO. Only spending 50 million on a starbase would have been nice, instead it was a constant resource dump. Not just credits but items and currency you needed for other things which would make 50mil overall seem like childs play. Also the whole "We're a small guild" stuff isn't a good excuse, I've been in small guilds that can keep up with large guilds. You just have to be willing to put in the time and effort for something you want instead of messing around with your playtime and complaining.

[Xakthul]

Loyal guildmembers might stay two months in a guild without a guildship.

 

I think that many players will jump ship from guilds that can´t afford a guildship and straight into guilds that already have one.

 

Without some kind of coordination, guildships are nothing more than glorified side-rooms. If people are planning to just jump ship, then they shouldn't plan on ever grouping in with the people actually utilizing the guild ship.

[Infernixx]

Loyal guildmembers might stay two months in a guild without a guildship.

 

I think that many players will jump ship from guilds that can´t afford a guildship and straight into guilds that already have one.

 

Depends entirely on the guild. Ours is a very closely knit group. We're not in a guild to farm HM OPs or PVP or anything. We just like each others' company and happen to do that other stuff so that we have something to do with each other in the game.

 

I feel bad for guilds that have members that are so mercenary that they lose members due to not having a Guild convenience.

[Icestar]

Depends entirely on the guild. Ours is a very closely knit group.

 

It does depend on the guild, that is why I said loyal guildmembers might stay.

 

Anyway, time will tell but I suspect that many will join guilds that already have a ship. Guildship seems to add another dimension to the gameplay and most of us want to get all aspects of the game.

 

I feel bad for guilds that have members that are so mercenary that they lose members due to not having a Guild convenience.

 

Well, that is what the guilds get when they recruit players on the base of getting extra level exp. Now guilds can say they got extra leveling exp AND a guildship, that is more attractive dont you say?

Edited July 25, 2014 by Icestar