OK this is getting rather silly regarding hard mode Flashpoint GF

[psikofunkster]

game is slowly dying guys, no new content no people, most of them kids on vacations and gold spammers of course those keep the populations "light". Edited July 14, 2014 by psikofunkster

[mikebevo]

And to be honest, leveling content was always easy. I played since launch, and i never needed any help with solo missions (I did die one them few times before learning what to do (like interrupt), but I never needed extra damage output from people or overlevel the content)

It was a lot harder than it is now, no it never was hard, but a few of the class fight boss fights did require people to play smart and I helped a many knight with their final boss fight. When I finally did it (third toon I leveled) it was easy, but I had seen the fight most likely 10 times by then and it had been nerfed.

 

I leveled a sawbones first, in my first MMO. I learned to use defensive cooldowns and interupts. Only had to have help with one fight "The Lightspring" on Tatooine. Still ticks me off that I couldn't get it myself, done it since on a slinger and it was a breeze, but slinger had better gear, I had a better knowledge of how to play a MMO and they had nerfed the heck out of the mission.

[Heat-Wave]

I think most people would say their first toons was hard, mine was. I did the Jedi Consular first, back on ver 1.1. I didn't understand gear very well, or the skills and such.... Rolled as a shadow, but never used it properly...

 

Today, my new alts are rich and well geared, and usually over leveled... I also have Treek, which the game wasn't designed for either...

 

Having full presence boost helps a lot with Treek, since I have at least one of every class at max everything, that makes new alts easy. Double that since even for starter planets I pay to get HK unlocked at level 1.

 

Do you know how easy the starter planets are with a companion? . Even if the gear doesn't work right, it doesn't matter.

[psikofunkster]

Yeah for me it was, run a sentinel first couldn't finish then i started a shadow i finished, understood the game and then finish the sentinel. Edited July 14, 2014 by psikofunkster

[Kalfear]

So, you want to play with others (FP runs) but at the same time you don't want to play with others (Guild)? Confused, I am...

 

Thats simple and already answered few times over

 

I been playing these games for 2+ decades (since first MMORPG NWN on AOL 1991-97) and am sick and tired of the drama and EPEEN contests found in modern guilds of all types

 

Ive looked anyways and have found no guilds that meet my requirement or expectations

 

I will NEVER join a guild that goes to zones and and broadcasts instant invites as their standards are way to low and they only interested in numbers, not quality.

 

So to find a guild that does suit my prefferences takes time and carerful screening

 

Are you suggesting I shouldnt be allowed to play while I do that search?

 

Amazes me how you all dont quite understand what GROUP FINDER is about

[curtkram]

so did the OP roll a new tank yet?

[DarthTHC]

so did the OP roll a new tank yet?

 

I think he's still trying to figure out what we mean when we say that if DPS is easy you're doing it wrong.

[Aries_cz]

Are you suggesting I shouldnt be allowed to play while I do that search?

I never insinuated that.

Amazes me how you all dont quite understand what GROUP FINDER is about

Group Finder is about finding you a group of people appropriate for that particular content from a pool of available people. If these people are not in the pool, there is nothing any developer can do about it, because it cannot be programmed around.

[BuriDogshin]

I've had mainly good HM FP GF experiences lately, queuing with my wife on Harbinger.

 

We queued as PT tank + Sorc heals (instant Q-pop ) and generally did okay until we got a sorc "DPS" in heal spec; group didn't have enough DPS and hit the rage timer on The Vigilant. The miss-q'd Sorc dropped out, we picked up a Sniper replacement, and had no problem. That Sorc was a bit keen to pull too, must have been new: started a lot of the fights and then pulled a group of seven silvers when the tank was out of range, and died quickly as a result. He/she said "I forgot to bubble," as if that would have helped much, but let the tank pull after that.

 

We also Q'd several times as 2 DPS operatives and did fine after moderate wait for Q pop - first time we ever finished the desert biosystem on CZ in only two sandstorms (overgeared DPS ).

 

Finally we Q'd as Heal+DPS (Sages) and did fine too.

 

It may just be that queuing with another person you can talk to during the op makes a big difference -- especially when it's heal+tank, where the heal can alert the tank to agro loss and track who the DPS agro-whores are. Don't let that last term fool you, "agro-whore" is a term of affection here. When I tank FPs I love high-output DPS and steal threat from them promptly when they grab agro.

[mikebevo]

especially when it's heal+tank, where the heal can alert the tank to agro loss and track who the DPS agro-whores are. Don't let that last term fool you, "agro-whore" is a term of affection here. When I tank FPs I love high-output DPS and steal threat from them promptly when they grab agro.

You're not using target of target as a tank? Hell I use it on everything, but I can't imagine being able to tank without target of target up.

[BuriDogshin]

You're not using target of target as a tank? Hell I use it on everything, but I can't imagine being able to tank without target of target up.

 

Of course I am, I agree that you cannot tank without it. But ToT only tell me whether a DPS has taken agro from my current target. The healer can give me a more complete story.

Edited July 14, 2014 by BuriDogshin

[mikebevo]

Of course I am, I agree that you cannot tank without it. But ToT only tell me whether a DPS has taken agro from my current target. The healer can give me a more complete story.

 

well your healer may be able to, when I heal HMFPs I just watch health bars and make sure I'm not standing in fire. Beyond that I am just trying to kill the weaks and strongs the dps are ignoring with their gold fever.

[BuriDogshin]

[When healing HM FPS, when the health bars look good ...] Beyond that I am just trying to kill the weaks and strongs the dps are ignoring with their gold fever.

LOL. Yeah, on some of my DPS, clearing trash mobs can be frustrating because they die too fast for me to get into my rotation. On my Sorc/Sage in heal spec, however, I consider using Force Storm/Quake on the weak mobs to be preventative medicine. I'll stun a lone gold for the same reason.

Edited July 14, 2014 by BuriDogshin

[TalantM]

Sure Tal

 

Oh can you please show me in the User End Agreement where joining a guild is mandatory to experience any portion of game?

 

Ill wait

 

I have been hearing the "join a guild" excuse for 2+ decades now

Its a terrible excuse forged of limited understanding

 

Now if I said I want to form a premade group that will only play with each other

Then joining a guild to find such a thing would make sense

 

But since thread is about GROUP FINDER Flashpoints (IE: Finding a group you dont normally play with)

 

The whole join a guild nonsense is just that

short sighted and very arrogant nonsense

 

Joining a guild is NOT a mandatory aspect of MMORPGs and NO CONTENT IN GAME is restricted to guilds only.

 

And for the record I was in a guild.

They all left for different guilds and then different games while I was gone awaiting shoulder surgery

I have not found a new one that meets my tastes yet since being back

But thats got nothing to do with topic of thread.

Did I say it was mandatory? Point to me exactly where I said that.

 

No, i didn't ssy that. What I said was join a guild. Not as an excuse. As actual advice to attempt to HELP you (and others) mitigate a common problem. (I was also speaking in a general sense, not directly at you, because it's a problem not restricted to you) Tanks don't need to que and risk derps, if they're any good they can spend 2 seconds in guild chat and have the dps/healers they need to do whatever they want. So, because you are not in control of the general playerbase and so not capable of affecting the changes that might make tanks more willing to que, it's on you to make sure you have access to tanks. Now, i did specifically mention that you can also just try to get on good terms with various tanks so they're on your friends lists and would be happy to do flashpoints with you upon request as well, but guilds can provide you with essentially the same opportunity without requiring you to get on good terms with each tank individually, because if you're on good terms with other members of the guild (tanks or otherwise), they'll invite you when they do runs and you'll likely have more opportunities to get on good terms with the tanks in your guild.

 

You also seeem to have a misconception about how guilds work. I'm in a guild, and by no means is it "form premades that only play with eachother." I play with lots of different members who I may or may not talk to much and it's rarely just the same premade that did it yesterday. What it is, is a group of competent, not necessarily stellar, players that are generally cool to be around because otherwist they wouldn't have gotten a ginvite. We even pick up dps (and sometimes heals) from outside the guild for the GF run fairly frequently, but we already have the tank and healer and have a majority in the party comp so we can boot derps and get competent dps. It's nothing but a win for everyone involved in out guild, and the guild (excluding the raid group) is a loose association of competent players who like to have access to the other roles when they que so they aren't dealing with idiots that get the group wiped.

Edited July 15, 2014 by TalantM

[TheBBP]

I have to agree with so many people in here. I only tank for guild fun, I won't queue as a tank. There are so many ADHD GOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOGO DPS types out there that it makes it a virtual hell for tanks.

 

It is not fun.

[TheUnNamedHero]

I have to agree with so many people in here. I only tank for guild fun, I won't queue as a tank. There are so many ADHD GOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOGO DPS types out there that it makes it a virtual hell for tanks.

 

It is not fun.

 

Which sadly leaves us with only the "dur. I did this before [wipe]" or the "never did this before, but oh well [wipe]" tanks. A bad healer I can deal with. Vote to kick, summon Treek. Bad tanks make me want to swear off content that I have to pug.

[TheBBP]

Which sadly leaves us with only the "dur. I did this before [wipe]" or the "never did this before, but oh well [wipe]" tanks. A bad healer I can deal with. Vote to kick, summon Treek. Bad tanks make me want to swear off content that I have to pug.

 

I didn't mean to sound elitist and clearly not all DPS are as described. The bad just happens enough to make me only want to tank guild fun.

[TX_Angel]

I have to agree with so many people in here. I only tank for guild fun, I won't queue as a tank. There are so many ADHD GOGOGOGOGOGOGOGOGO DPS types out there that it makes it a virtual hell for tanks.

 

It is not fun.

 

Then you are playing with the wrong DPS. Most of my toons are DPS, and I tend to follow the tank's lead (unless he/she is new and asks for help on something I know well).

 

You won't have to ask me twice to let you do all the pulling, dying costs money.

[thewitchdoctor]

You also seeem to have a misconception about how guilds work.

 

This is probably the number one question I would ask many of the 'don't group/solo-only' crowd, if I knew I'd get an honest answer.

 

'Where did you get these weird notions of what being in a guild is like?'

 

Some of the comments you see around here lead me to believe that some guilds demand tithes, if not firstborn children in sacrifice!

[WillCaedes]

As a tank, I shall maintain my right to choose when and where I queue as a tank. For nearly two years I queued into HM FPs and pugged multiple raids as a tank. NEVER again.

 

Why?

 

 

Stupidity.

DPS believing they are tanks.

Sorc Healers thinking "Static Bubble" is actually a heal.

DPS being idiots.

DPS running ahead and pulling an extra group.

Healers going AFK.

Healers not being geared properly.

DPS not being geared properly.

DPS not knowing which stims are meant for their class.

Bioware not rewarding my patience with those people enough.

Bioware giving me alarcity and accuracy mods on my starting raid gear.

Bioware confusing newbie tanks by giving them ****, improperly stated base FP/raid gear.

Bioware forcing me to sit through 45 minutes of cutscene everytime I'm "Lucky" enough to get Black Talon.

DPS not spacebarring on Black Talon HM. (Don't use the "Never seen it before Line, its HM for christsake.)

Healers not spacebarring on Black Talon HM. (See above).

Being told by DPS (who have run ahead, pulled multiple groups etc) how to do my job as a tank, when I've been tanking longer than they've been playing most likely.

 

 

So yeah.... I'd say fix it, but I doubt its possible. Those are the reasons I typically refrain from entering group finder queue these days as a tank.

[Jeweledleah]

As a tank, I shall maintain my right to choose when and where I queue as a tank. For nearly two years I queued into HM FPs and pugged multiple raids as a tank. NEVER again.

 

Why?

 

 

Stupidity.

DPS believing they are tanks.

Sorc Healers thinking "Static Bubble" is actually a heal.

DPS being idiots.

DPS running ahead and pulling an extra group.

Healers going AFK.

Healers not being geared properly.

DPS not being geared properly.

DPS not knowing which stims are meant for their class.

Bioware not rewarding my patience with those people enough.

Bioware giving me alarcity and accuracy mods on my starting raid gear.

Bioware confusing newbie tanks by giving them ****, improperly stated base FP/raid gear.

Bioware forcing me to sit through 45 minutes of cutscene everytime I'm "Lucky" enough to get Black Talon.

DPS not spacebarring on Black Talon HM. (Don't use the "Never seen it before Line, its HM for christsake.)

Healers not spacebarring on Black Talon HM. (See above).

Being told by DPS (who have run ahead, pulled multiple groups etc) how to do my job as a tank, when I've been tanking longer than they've been playing most likely.

 

 

So yeah.... I'd say fix it, but I doubt its possible. Those are the reasons I typically refrain from entering group finder queue these days as a tank.

 

ummm... static bubble is a heal. as in... it prevents you from taking a certain amount of damage, effectively increasing your health. its not the only heal, naturally, but its one of the more effective abilities sorc healers have. I have seen it prevent as much damage as crit heal from dark infusion, except dark infusion has a long cast and doesn't always crit.

 

don't underestimate the awesome of sorc bubbles. on a priority of sorc healing - they are at the top, followed by resurgence and innervate. in that order.

 

as for spacebar? umm... relax and consider how many things could be worse? its only a few extra minutes (and yes I spacebar, but I don't have a problem with people who don't - becasue its such a minor thing. I'd rather take someone who doesn't spacebar but is otherwise a team player, versus gogogo spacebar heroes that make my life a living hell)

[slafko]

It's not because tanking is hard... It's actually the easiest role if you think about it... in competent group.

Followed by heals. DPS is actually the most difficult role to play correctly.

Stop trollin' pls.

[AshlaBoga]

Stop trollin' pls.

 

Well in an Operation a lot of the challenge is the dps check, NiM Dread Guard pre both nerfs was the biggest dps check ever in SWTOR, and even after the first nerf it was still a decent dps check compared to some of the other NiM content.

 

I'm sure if you made a list of the NiM EC/TFB/S&V/DF/DP dps and heal checks there'd be more dps ones.

[Jeweledleah]

Stop trollin' pls.

 

I actualy agree with them. at least from personal experience, I'd rather heal an operation, or tank it - then dps it. especially on hardmode/nightmare. you have to worry about interrupts, switching targets, switching positions, start dps, stop dps, make sure your output is high, while not standing in crap and not dpsing past the point you should. there is a LOT to worry about as a dps in harder end game content. meanwhile, for all the pressure I have on me as a healer - its nowhere NEAR that much - again from personal experience. tanks come close in complexity. its probably give or take, depending on a fight.

[slafko]

I have nothing against promoting tanking, just stating that it would be unfair to certain classes.

Those classes can either live with the fact that the tank is getting a bigger end reward or use the hour-long queue times waiting for a tank to meditate on the Force. I don't know about you but I'd rather get a faster GF pop and do the flashpoint in a timely manner even if it means getting less loot than a tank than stare at the ceiling for hours on end only to get the pop when I go poop.