A PvP a Day...

[TheGhostOfSlade]

I'm going to add one thought on the Foundry because I think it's relevant to issues people have had with PvP:

 

I'm a big TVTropes lurker, and one of the things the site's entries on SWTOR emphasise is the feeling of high stakes playing the Foundry, because Revan wants to wipe out 97% of the Imp population (and probably more of the Pub population than he realises). Playing the Foundry, I was excited to meet HK and Revan again (old KOTOR player here), and I thought the emotions of Revan mourning HK's passing were handled very well, but the mission never felt urgent or apocalyptic. It was just another job. Maybe that's good from a roleplaying perspective when I'm an agent, but still.

 

This is a long-running issue with Bioware. They can make your choices feel important, make you care about your companions, take you on an emotional roller-coaster... and then fumble the high-stakes endgame. And maybe their issues with injecting a sense of urgency and stakes into their PvE games is affecting their ability to produce quality PvP content. I don't know.

Edited July 16, 2016 by TheGhostOfSlade

[Greezt]

You can translate it to imp terms with Dulfy's discipline calculator.

[TheGhostOfSlade]

Thanks, that looks really useful!

[Ethern]

Positive thought of the day.

 

I'm at 40 valor.

 

Only 20 more to go and then I will be free to leave that aspect of the game behind me forever.

Yeah I only pvp to unlock the battlemaster gear. and dislike pvp for being ganged up upon and cc''ed = unfun for me.

Sometimes you can't help but feel like a mere low level NPC.

Edited July 16, 2016 by Ethern

[TheGhostOfSlade]

Well, congrats on getting that far. I'm on 25 Valor.

 

What server are you on? If you're on Red Eclipse, we could try to find a few nice folks and put a group together. Even when I lose I've never felt useless, and I think that has as much to do with the tone adopted by your own team as anything else.

[TheGhostOfSlade]

PVP Report:

 

Didn't have much time for SWTOR today, only started about 45 minutes ago. First round: Odessan. Hate that map. I'm rubbish at it, I hate node defence being a constant free-for-all, and I've never been on a decent team so I've had nobody to learn from. Steamrolled.

 

Then AHG. I felt we were a bit rubbish since at the start of each round, by the time we reached the pylon nearest our original spawn point, the Pubs were capping it as their second pylon. Equally a lot of Pubs weren't getting back to safety before the discharge, which is foolish. I just clung on for dear life and did my best, guarding, capping, swooping in to help teammates in fights, and actually putting some effort into heals after having to act as healer yesterday. Everyone with heals was healing teammates, we didn't make many calls in chat but when we did people responded, I picked up a few medals, and in the end we won comfortably. My first win on that map. But queue times were long and I don't want to launch into Alderaan story mode with not enough time to finish it, so I've logged out and might do something with another toon.

 

As I've got to grip with the basics, I'm looking for ways to improve my game, and I'm noticing that my DPS is very low. Now some of that is to do with my role (stealthy node guards aren't ever going to deal as much damage as the tanks or pure DPS duking it out in a contested zone), but I think I've only gone over 200 DPS once, so that is something I definitely need to work on.

[Ethern]

Well, congrats on getting that far. I'm on 25 Valor.

 

What server are you on? If you're on Red Eclipse, we could try to find a few nice folks and put a group together. Even when I lose I've never felt useless, and I think that has as much to do with the tone adopted by your own team as anything else.

I'm on the Ebon Hawk.

Well to be fair that depends on the situations. I'm a healer. So when enemies leave me unchecked I can contribute a lot by keeping my teammates alive and it feels great and rewarding. But when they notice me, particularly on 4vs4 maps, I get focused hard, and using all my defensive cds only delays the inevitable. You feel powerless and that's only good at diverting attention. As a player that's a horrible feeling.

 

I don't know if you have the same goal as me, but good luck in your endeavor . As long as you're having fun

[wiseread]

PVP Report:

 

Didn't have much time for SWTOR today, only started about 45 minutes ago. First round: Odessan. Hate that map. I'm rubbish at it, I hate node defence being a constant free-for-all, and I've never been on a decent team so I've had nobody to learn from. Steamrolled.

 

Then AHG. I felt we were a bit rubbish since at the start of each round, by the time we reached the pylon nearest our original spawn point, the Pubs were capping it as their second pylon. Equally a lot of Pubs weren't getting back to safety before the discharge, which is foolish. I just clung on for dear life and did my best, guarding, capping, swooping in to help teammates in fights, and actually putting some effort into heals after having to act as healer yesterday. Everyone with heals was healing teammates, we didn't make many calls in chat but when we did people responded, I picked up a few medals, and in the end we won comfortably. My first win on that map. But queue times were long and I don't want to launch into Alderaan story mode with not enough time to finish it, so I've logged out and might do something with another toon.

 

As I've got to grip with the basics, I'm looking for ways to improve my game, and I'm noticing that my DPS is very low. Now some of that is to do with my role (stealthy node guards aren't ever going to deal as much damage as the tanks or pure DPS duking it out in a contested zone), but I think I've only gone over 200 DPS once, so that is something I definitely need to work on.

 

Yikes sounds like a rough start for someone new to pvp!

 

operatives generally can deal a lot of dps. And seeing as how you would like to improve, guarding a node won't help you get better at pvp. Sure if you get into where all the fighting is you might die more, but that's how you get better.

[TheGhostOfSlade]

operatives generally can deal a lot of dps. And seeing as how you would like to improve, guarding a node won't help you get better at pvp. Sure if you get into where all the fighting is you might die more, but that's how you get better.

 

Agreed. When I started PvP I started trying to guard nodes because it was a logical starting point for a stealth class. Now I seem to either end up on competent teams who expect me to node guard, or on utterly terrible teams who cap and run or don't cap at all so I end up having to node guard to have any hope of us holding our own on the scoreboard. Bit of a catch-22. The good news is that I regularly pick up the medals for large amounts of damage in a single hit. I can do damage, I just don't get opportunities too often. And sometimes when I find myself in the middle of a free-for-all I find it hard to track targets and see what's going on and I panic a little. I'll get there, I'm sure.

 

Well to be fair that depends on the situations. I'm a healer. So when enemies leave me unchecked I can contribute a lot by keeping my teammates alive and it feels great and rewarding. But when they notice me, particularly on 4vs4 maps, I get focused hard, and using all my defensive cds only delays the inevitable. You feel powerless and that's only good at diverting attention. As a player that's a horrible feeling.

 

Speaking of...

 

After my report yesterday I logged back in as my DvL Consular, who was still on Tython. Decided to spec her as a Balance Sage (because Shadow would be my go-to, and I already have a Shadow, two Sins and an Op) to challenge myself. So not a pure mage/healer type but dangerously close for someone who likes ranged/melee hybrid rogues. I went with Balance partly because I liked the look of the first unique ability, Force In Balance, which is an AOE drain-health-and-heal-self power. Figured it might be useful in PvP. I dunno how I'm gonna cope in PvP without stealth, and I'm not even sure what I should be doing as a Balance Sage (I mean, I'm DPS not a healer, but how squishy am I? Should I be leading the charge in a big attack or acting as support since I have some ranged abilities and one friendly heal?) Any tips welcome, I'm sure some people here have played DPS Sage/Sorc at some point.

 

I don't know if you have the same goal as me, but good luck in your endeavor . As long as you're having fun

 

Well it's certainly one of my goals. The fun is the most important part.

 

Oh, and if anyone has any tips for "playing Odessan with a team that doesn't communicate", please share. It doesn't make me too optimistic for PvPing with my Sage since all my worst, most uncommunicative teammates have been Pubs.

[TheGhostOfSlade]

PvP Report (Part 1):

 

Logged on as my level 13 sage, took the Intro To Warzones mission and the Daily (which was just complete one), got a 4v4 arena. Didn't do too well personally, died first time on my team in both rounds, but we won and my DPS was 229. The XP from the match raised me to level 14, and from Intro To WZ and Daily I got up to 16, plus the implants and packages Intro To WZ gives as mission rewards.

 

Then Odessan. Not awful. We lost, but people were making an effort to co-ordinate. I tried to act as support for our Mara, Jugg and Mando, focusing on ranged damage and heals. Ranked second-highest out of our team, got a few MVP votes, medals for heals and damage (11 medals total), think I did OK in terms of heals. DPS was 414.5. Which is my best in any match in any class.

Edited July 17, 2016 by TheGhostOfSlade

[TheGhostOfSlade]

Part 2:

 

Civil War. Pub on Pub. Ops Leader is a Mando who seems to know what she's doing. But we have no healers or stealthers. I sprint to grass (enemy have attacked mid and grass and capped snow from the outset), help clear. Teammates cap and run. So I get stuck on node guard. Mando tells me to hide out of LoS. I do but get stunlocked by a Scoundrel from stealth. Lose the node. Mando reclaims it, gives out to me politely for not hiding. I tell her I was but have no stealth detect (diplomatically not adding "Hint, hint") and she swaps with me (Mandos have stealth detect, right?). She holds grass, I go to mid, cap it once. It's a free-for-all constantly switching sides. I focus on heals (and ranged damage where necessary). Get focused and die a few times but it's only one Sentinel who has the sense to focus me for healing so it's not too bad. It's close but we win. DPS below 200 but heals through the roof.

 

Voidstar. Ops leader is silent throughout. We have a Shadow who takes control and gives out orders with me chiming in where I can. We have a healer who doesn't heal, one Scoundrel who does her best with stealth and stealth detects but is clearly inexperienced, and nobody but me and the Shadow are using CCs. I end up using AOE attacks as stealth detects. Healing like hell. Curbstomped. DPS around 120 but heals even higher than Civil War.

 

So basically my intro to PvPing with a Sage is being made focus on things that aren't my discipline's strengths

 

EDIT: Part Three

 

Odessan. I'm slowly learning that one of my big problems with this map is not having a blind clue what's going on half the time. Nobody calls incoming and you can't even begin to see one node from another. We won but I don't think I did much.

 

Spent some time crafting a better offhand focus, then back to PvP.

 

4v4. This was nice. Good heals, around 500 DPS, and we won 2-0.

 

Huttball. Lost 3-1. I got focused by a Mara who spent a lot of time trying to **** me up. Despite (or perhaps because of) this, I got good heals, a bunch of damage medals, and OVER SIX HUNDRED DPS. The only calls in chat were people criticising a Scoundrel who messed up and let a goal in. Which made me fairly annoyed since he was trying to deal with a Sin and a Jugg who tag-teamed their way to a score. He should never have been left to deal with it alone. I force-ran to him but got focused by my old friend the Mara and by the time I'd force-waved him off the edge of the level it was too late (although I did get a little bit of satisfaction from kicking him to the curb).

 

I actually switched to defence at that point, and managed to kill my first ball-carrier, but before I could do anything with the ball, time ran out.

 

So a defeat, but I think I did OK personally.

 

Odessan again. Curbstomp. I just ran around trying to heal and not die. Got some medals for heavy damage but saw so little action and got focused so thoroughly by the Imps (no pure healer in our team, so I did most of the heavy lifting there) that my DPS was 52.3.

Edited July 17, 2016 by TheGhostOfSlade

[legbamel]

I have to say, this thread (though I'm only halfway through reading it!) has been a fantastic place for someone like me who is just coming to PvP after four-plus years of PvE. The DvL event did this for me, at least. In seeking to get something more than my butt handed to me I wandered into this thread and have found a wealth of info and inspiration.

 

Even my mediocre skills have improved massively just from reading the tips and tricks you folks have all provided here. As a bonus, I'm glad to discover I'm not the only one who can have a great time in a warzone even when we lose. I wanted to post and thank all the people posting here and express my hope that you keep going. [returns to lurker mode]

Edited July 18, 2016 by legbamel

[TheGhostOfSlade]

I'm beginning to sound like a broken record here, but if you're on Red Eclipse and want to group/queue with another late PvP adopter... Edited July 17, 2016 by TheGhostOfSlade

[TheGhostOfSlade]

Interest in this thread appears to be waning, so this may be my last post. Spent the past day building a Guardian, my first tank. Went with Focus as my discipline. Did Voidstar, got creamed. Our healer ignored me. Healed me once: right after the WZ ended but before the scoreboard popped up. Did a tactical flashpoint with my guild, did fairly OK, had fun, learned how to tank a bit better. Did Novarre Coast. I personally got creamed but we won and I picked up a couple of damage medals so yay. Pub healers in PvP seem really bad at healing tho.

[Cox_The_Beast]

Interest in this thread appears to be waning, so this may be my last post. Spent the past day building a Guardian, my first tank. Went with Focus as my discipline. Did Voidstar, got creamed. Our healer ignored me. Healed me once: right after the WZ ended but before the scoreboard popped up. Did a tactical flashpoint with my guild, did fairly OK, had fun, learned how to tank a bit better. Did Novarre Coast. I personally got creamed but we won and I picked up a couple of damage medals so yay. Pub healers in PvP seem really bad at healing tho.

 

I may be reading this wrong, but Focus is not a tanking discipline. It's a DPS one. And Guardian doesn't equal Tank.

 

As such, don't be surprised that the healer treated you like any other DPS, prioritizing others. That's to be expected. If you really want to tank, you need to switch to Defence. And gear up accordingly. It is possible to skank-tank as Vigilance too, but tbh I never tryed it so I can't comment on that.

[Banderal]

COX!!! How you doing?

 

And yeah man, if you want tank, be a MAN and take the tank discipline. Guardian tank rocks, btw. Personally, in my opinion, because the defensive stats are so crappy for tanks in general, and the guardian CDs are very much "in your face-stand-there-and-take-it type" defenses - so it's nice to be able to do that. Plus guardian leap is a GOD SEND to find that pesky healer you are trying to protect who is scampering around trying to kite and you lose track of them. Not that that ever happens to me of course.

[TheGhostOfSlade]

I may be reading this wrong, but Focus is not a tanking discipline. It's a DPS one. And Guardian doesn't equal Tank.

 

As such, don't be surprised that the healer treated you like any other DPS, prioritizing others. That's to be expected. If you really want to tank, you need to switch to Defence. And gear up accordingly. It is possible to skank-tank as Vigilance too, but tbh I never tryed it so I can't comment on that.

 

I know I picked a DPS discipline. I did that partly for some of the unique abilities (the better version of Force Leap for one) and partly because I'm a chicken. But equally, over 50% of my active abilities (the Guardian ones) are tanking, and the Voidstar round did not have a pure tank on Pub side. I was the only person on my team with taunts, never mind the guard ability, and obviously I was using my taunts to draw aggro off the node-cappers. When it came to the Flashpoint, I was recruited by guildmates who'd put together a team of 2 DPS and a Heal and couldn't find a tank but figured I would do, precisely for that reason. When paired with a healer, I was fine and did fairly well. My team in Novarre had a Vanguard who was specced as a tank, so no complaints from me there about the healer's actions.

 

Lowbie Pub teams on Red Eclipse seem to have the following frequency of types:

1) Shadow, Scoundrel, Sentinel

2) Gunslinger, Sage

3) Commando

4) Guardian

5) Vanguard

 

Because of that, if I ended up with a teammate who (like me currently) could even semi-tank, I'd be happy to see it.

 

And yeah man, if you want tank, be a MAN and take the tank discipline.

 

Is this a good time to mention that I, as Eowyn would put it, am no man?

 

But seriously, I'm thinking of respeccing as a pure tank. Based on my experiences yesterday and what you guys are saying, I can see a threefold flaw in playing a DPS Guardian.

 

1) Design by Bioware: I may be sub-specialising in DPS but my Advanced Class remains a tank with tanking abilities. I'm nether pure DPS or pure tank and seem to have ended up with the weaknesses of both. I'm a glass cannon, basically. More on this in a minute.

 

2) Demographic trends: I'm not a pure tank but there are so few people choosing tank subclasses that I end up tanking. May as well embrace it.

 

3) Over-literal teammates: I'm not a tank. Healers should focus on pure tanks first. But in a match where we have no pure tanks and I'm having to taunt and draw aggro, surely it would be a good idea not to treat me as a pure DPS player? As a lowbie Guardian (can't speak for higher levels), I have a 2-second stun, one poor CC that slows enemies, no stealth, no heals, no ranged CC... In short, none of the things DPS classes can use to escape a fight that becomes too tough, mitigate damage within a tough fight, or force the other player/s into fighting on your terms (by, say, using ranged CC to hurt enemies before they reach you, or using a knockback followed by a ranged CC to gain some breathing space). Once I'm in a fight, I'm in it. And let me tell you, from what I've seen so far (I tried again this morning), when the Imps spot a Guardian without a nearby healer they all pile on. My Guardian PvP experience so far has basically been respawn-die-respawn-die-rinse-repeat. Which isn't fun.

 

Don't get me wrong. I haven't a clue what I'm doing. I'm probably making some really stupid mistakes. But I do think that on a team of people with heals (literally everyone else on my Voidstar team was a Shadow, Sage, Mando or Scoundrel), the one player with no heals shouldn't be ignored and left to die all the time.

[Cox_The_Beast]

I know I picked a DPS discipline. I did that partly for some of the unique abilities (the better version of Force Leap for one) and partly because I'm a chicken. But equally, over 50% of my active abilities (the Guardian ones) are tanking, and the Voidstar round did not have a pure tank on Pub side. I was the only person on my team with taunts, never mind the guard ability, and obviously I was using my taunts to draw aggro off the node-cappers. When it came to the Flashpoint, I was recruited by guildmates who'd put together a team of 2 DPS and a Heal and couldn't find a tank but figured I would do, precisely for that reason. When paired with a healer, I was fine and did fairly well. My team in Novarre had a Vanguard who was specced as a tank, so no complaints from me there about the healer's actions.

 

[...]

 

Because of that, if I ended up with a teammate who (like me currently) could even semi-tank, I'd be happy to see it.

 

[...]

 

But seriously, I'm thinking of respeccing as a pure tank. Based on my experiences yesterday and what you guys are saying, I can see a threefold flaw in playing a DPS Guardian.

 

1) Design by Bioware: I may be sub-specialising in DPS but my Advanced Class remains a tank with tanking abilities. I'm nether pure DPS or pure tank and seem to have ended up with the weaknesses of both. I'm a glass cannon, basically. More on this in a minute.

 

2) Demographic trends: I'm not a pure tank but there are so few people choosing tank subclasses that I end up tanking. May as well embrace it.

 

3) Over-literal teammates: I'm not a tank. Healers should focus on pure tanks first. But in a match where we have no pure tanks and I'm having to taunt and draw aggro, surely it would be a good idea not to treat me as a pure DPS player? As a lowbie Guardian (can't speak for higher levels), I have a 2-second stun, one poor CC that slows enemies, no stealth, no heals, no ranged CC... In short, none of the things DPS classes can use to escape a fight that becomes too tough, mitigate damage within a tough fight, or force the other player/s into fighting on your terms (by, say, using ranged CC to hurt enemies before they reach you, or using a knockback followed by a ranged CC to gain some breathing space). Once I'm in a fight, I'm in it. And let me tell you, from what I've seen so far (I tried again this morning), when the Imps spot a Guardian without a nearby healer they all pile on. My Guardian PvP experience so far has basically been respawn-die-respawn-die-rinse-repeat. Which isn't fun.

 

Don't get me wrong. I haven't a clue what I'm doing. I'm probably making some really stupid mistakes. But I do think that on a team of people with heals (literally everyone else on my Voidstar team was a Shadow, Sage, Mando or Scoundrel), the one player with no heals shouldn't be ignored and left to die all the time.

 

Nice to see a response to my query. I can understand why you'd think of it that way better, now. Btw, I wasn't criticizing you personally, I hope that much is clear. I like to think of this thread as a place where to teach others who may be reading, so I do like to be as blunt as I can be as to not leave doubts in regard of what I want to say...

 

That said, in my experience having one Taunt - Masstaunt only works the same way a Tank speeced character of the same class does in PvP, so I don't count that as a taunt while DPS speeced - is not even close to being enough to call one a Tank. As a result, especially at low level, you do end up being frail. Like, a lot.

At higher levels it's mitigated - partially - by the fact you get a lot of tools to kill your opponents fast. But even then, in PvE I wouldn't Tank as a DPS speeced and geared character above lvl 30, tbh.

 

As a side note, I'd like to say something on how to maximize your utility in WZs. It doesn't matter wether there are other Tanks or Tank-able classes in your team, you should always use your Taunts.

Not only they add to your medals, which doesn't hurt, but they also reduce the damage your opponents inflict on other targets than yourself. Which as a DPS means you won't have to hold the line for it to work. You could, say, jump among 4-5 enemies, throw a Masstaunt - and maybe a mass-Mezz, while at it, why not? - and jump away to keep DPSing another more threatening target. And you would still be doing your job at 100%.

Basically, if you have Taunts, you ought to use them. A good way to do it is to time them so that you can use them right after they come after CD. If you don't, you're pretty much forsaking half your PvP tools. Which is never a good idea.

 

That said, in PvP Guardian suffers a lot before lvl 40, especially as DPS spec or if you don't have a Healer in your team. Before that, as a Tank you have no tools for survival save damage reductions, which can only help so much. As DPS, not even those.

However, that changes once you get access to Focused Defence, and becomes even better when you get Saber Reflect. Both of those you get regardless of your Discipline. At that point, once you get the hang of it, you can pretty much solo other DPS, especially if they rely on DoTs. Sometimes, if they're not particularly good, even two at a time. I saw it happen.

Focused Defence heals you while you take damage, and only if you take damage. Which means, that if you're fighting an opponent and dropping, but you pop it and your opponent keeps attacking, chances are you'll heal more than he damages you. Most of the times it's like that, and you can go to almost 0% to 100% in a matter of seconds.

Saber Reflect, on the other hand, reflects the damage your opponents direct to you back to them. It's especially useful against Sages/Sorcs, as all of their damage save for DoTs can be reflected, but there are also other situations where it can add to your DPS and bring down an opponent fast. Also, while it's active you won't take damage from those attacks, so...

 

I don't know at which level you are, but I hope this sheds some light in terms of why you have such a hard time surviving in PvP without a pocket Healer. I do have a lot of characters at 65, including a Focus and a Defence Guardian, so if you have any questions, feel free to ask.

 

COX!!! How you doing?

 

[...]

 

 

Eh, I've been off the game for about half a year or so. I returned to wheat some thirst I had for Star Wars and found an event running which I had not heard of, so I decided I'll stick around at least for a couple months. And have a look at KotFE in its entirety, while I'm at it.

 

That said, I'm fine, I guess.

Edited July 19, 2016 by Cox_The_Beast

[Greezt]

You cannot truly tank as a DPS spec. Vigilance guardians are capable of slight tanking by swapping to sorseu form after leaping, but that's very situational. Focus guardians are too squishy to do this, and in any case they need their form for passives. In any case, if you want to tank there is no reason not to respec to tank. You get an extra stun, an extra DCD and so much more passive mitigation...

[TheGhostOfSlade]

I'm not gonna quote because you put so much info in that (thanks!)

 

Suffice it to say that I don't take any of this personally, I want to learn and I can't learn without knowing where I'm going wrong!

 

What you're saying confirms a lot of my suspicions about Guardians as a class. I simply can't hold my own, particularly against a group. I'm only level 20 and therefore am lacking all the good abilities you mentioned. It feels incredibly frustrating though, because I do end up feeling completely underpowered: I was doing better by level 16 with my Sage than I am at 20 with my Guardian. And there are so many experienced players playing lowbie pvp at the moment due to DvL that a Guardian without a pocket healer is immediately spotted and recognised for the sitting duck it is.

 

So yeah, any tips are appreciated. I guess I should respec as Defence anyway?

[Ruhun]

I'm not gonna quote because you put so much info in that (thanks!)

 

Suffice it to say that I don't take any of this personally, I want to learn and I can't learn without knowing where I'm going wrong!

 

What you're saying confirms a lot of my suspicions about Guardians as a class. I simply can't hold my own, particularly against a group. I'm only level 20 and therefore am lacking all the good abilities you mentioned. It feels incredibly frustrating though, because I do end up feeling completely underpowered: I was doing better by level 16 with my Sage than I am at 20 with my Guardian. And there are so many experienced players playing lowbie pvp at the moment due to DvL that a Guardian without a pocket healer is immediately spotted and recognised for the sitting duck it is.

 

So yeah, any tips are appreciated. I guess I should respec as Defence anyway?

 

Melee dps suffers greatly until we get a few gap closers.

You're going to feel weak against ranged for a long time, and most classes don't hit their stride until they hit level 40 - 45.

Just keep grinding through lowbies for coms and creds, and you should be set by the time you hit 65 and would have learned a thing or two.

Edited July 19, 2016 by Ruhun

[TheGhostOfSlade]

OK, I'll try to stick with it. The upside is I have a Sage guildmate who wants to start PvPing and is talking about teaming up with me. I assume we'll have to queue sync, guessing you can't queue as a group unless you have the full 4/8.

 

I do have a (second) Trooper who is still on Ord Mantell. Might go Vanguard Shield Specialist with her and get the full tanking experience

[Ruhun]

OK, I'll try to stick with it. The upside is I have a Sage guildmate who wants to start PvPing and is talking about teaming up with me. I assume we'll have to queue sync, guessing you can't queue as a group unless you have the full 4/8.

 

I do have a (second) Trooper who is still on Ord Mantell. Might go Vanguard Shield Specialist with her and get the full tanking experience

 

You can queue in incomplete groups. If someone else wants to queue with you all you need to do is join his group.

[TheGhostOfSlade]

Awesome! So is that what people mean when they say "partial premades"?

[Ruhun]

Awesome! So is that what people mean when they say "partial premades"?

 

I guess so.