Is Ranked really end game PvP ?

[Psychana]

So, I have been PvP'ing since launch, i have seen the changes and lost alot of queuing partners along the way because of the changes to PvP in the last 2 1/2 years of SWTOR, but a question i seem to be asking myself more and more lately is : Have the dev's gone in the totally wrong direction, or is it just me ?

 

I would like some constructive replies, not just the usual forum trolls, but it seems to me that alot of "Hardcore" PvP players use the ranking they have as a measuring stick to being "the best", now the question i ask also, is this really so ?

 

I have seen many talented PvP'ers in this game, and with the advent of ranked arenas, most of them left. I asked many why ?, and nearly all the replies where the same, ranked is now 2 dimensional, 4 vs 4 is not really fun, no objectives, not enough people involved. I heard all of these answers from most of them.

 

Well, some of the game changers in regs are the guys that "ninja cap", defend the node from 3-4 other guys and CALL for aid from the team, the ball runners, the pesky fire pullers, the brave souls with marks on there heads spamming 1 million heals, the strategists, and some of the most amazing players i have ever seen are some of these "skills" rolled into one, but when it comes to Ranked, they fail.

 

It simply doesn't hold there interest that they have to be in the top tier gear, they have to pump out there "burst", infact a guy recently said to me of ranked "There is no skill, its just fast fingers, fast computer and occasionally throwing someone off a bridge". i laughed at that, as i really disagreed, i was enjoying group ranked with friends and thought it was sour grapes, but his view began to get more vindicated the longer i actually queued for ranked.

 

Then i thought, why are the players that queue, play ranked games that last less than 5 minutes each on average, just hit rotations fast, have rotations on the class's in the ranked WZ th\t they have to kill first, rewarded more than the guys that work and show "skills" with ranked comms, when really to promote PvP shouldn't the games be more inclusive, a nice length for people to play as a "team", more rewarding to the players that use team work, show a skill set, and generally work harder ?, why not reward them too ??

 

I have personally decided not to queue ranked, which is a shame, as i have been on a few servers, both sides of the Pond, and on anything but a PvP server, ranked queues can take awhile, so even one player walking away can make a difference between games happening and not, i just find regs more challenging, more tactile, like i have to think more, depending what toon i am on, and i think most "nerds" agree, we like to think and play smart.

 

Is it just me that feels the dev's are missing the point here, that people are leaving to play Wildstar, where the PvP is on a larger scale, requiring more team work and "skills" as opposed to smaller, less skilled gear/computer oriented arenas ?, and i would like to hear views on which way you would like to see PvP is SWTOR go, for example i would like to see regs become the new ranked, and ranked become regs !!, then i think we would see an explosion of PvP on all servers !!, so please, we pay our sub, we should have some input, and if the game is going in a wrong direction, lets put the brakes on, and try to make it right !!!! thanks for reading

Edited May 14, 2014 by Psychana
spelling correction opps !

[BraaxusKun]

The reason good reg players don't always do so well in ranked is because they're completely different styles, and most people have 1 or 2 years of warzone experience whereas arenas haven't been out as long. But yeah, ranked arenas do take quite a bit of teamwork and skill, but I agree they really should bring back 8v8 ranked and have that as well as arenas.

[Pistols]

End game PvP is what the individual believes it to be; but Ranked is the marketed "feature" of end game when it comes to the general definition. Not gonna get long winded here, but the PvP base has been shrinking since early 2012. Maybe not super fast, but it's very noticeable. Why? Many factors, many errors, lack of direction, etc. There is nothing this team could do to attract "more PvP" types on a large scale, it's already branded and deleted by many.

 

To me, it's about casual play with some friends, and trying to milk the last bit of fun before it completely dries out. The "hardcore" types are very few, matter of fact I think EU has more of those types atm, but I think TOR has settled into mediocrity and they're fine with it. Without cross server queue'ing, it's hard to even really measure anything, without moving toons to other servers and what not. Just laughable design, by a very laughable team.

 

Is what it is.

[JediMasterSLC]

It simply doesn't hold there interest that they have to be in the top tier gear, they have to pump out there "burst", infact a guy recently said to me of ranked "There is no skill, its just fast fingers, fast computer and occasionally throwing someone off a bridge"

 

Being able to pump out burst, move your fingers quickly, and use CDs effectively = "no skill"? Ok. You also don't need a fast computer: i have a 1.6 Ghz processor (that's ultra bad) laptop, and my performance in arenas is just fine in every map but Makeb- which many wish would just be deleted from the game.

[Cordorian]

in a way team ranked between two skilled teams requires even more coordination than old 8v8 ranked did.

Not making a fuzz about it, but very good player from Pot5 got out classed by a Tofn team (also very good players) on the PTS, not on measured of individual skill, but mostly because the tofn team had the better strategy and better coordination. When it comes to mirco objectives like getting your CCs and switches right, or stopping the tank from switching guard, seperating the target, managing resolve, using cleanses, cc breakers and DCDs in general, I dare say group ranked arenas might even take more skill than old 8v8 ranked, which quite a lot of times were a more coordinated zerg fest or turtle fortress, with rare moments of individual brilliance to break the tie (amongst equally skilled teams).

 

I guess the OP meant yolo ranked, but yolo ranked is not to be taken completely seriously. In a way it is pug matches with hopefully geared team mates, that hopefully have some understanding of the game, against other pugs, for better rewards than normals and ratings for e-peens.

BW could just as well introduce rated yolo wz, wouldnt make much a difference.

 

And yeah, i would absolutely love to see 8v8 ranked back, but it is probably too late for that, sadly. Since I agree with the OP, that playing objectives ultimately is more satisfying.

[ZooMzy]

The coordination and skill requirement increase is actually something that would benefit 8v8s.

 

Personally, I still think 4v4s are the perfect stepping stone to 8v8s, now that the skilled players have developed a more detailed stance in how to kill something. Often times, I found ranked 8v8, while intense, to be flat line because of how rarely people died. With arenas, I have seen a huge increase in player skill capability, where teams have developed strong methods of seperating players from their teammates and using LoS to really prevent turtle matches, something that would make 8v8 a hell of a lot more intense and fun.

 

But yeah, I feel as if the devs have gone in the complete opposite direction with PvP in this game as well. However, I also think that has more to do with the lousy player base overall, as egotistical casuals make the worst PvPers, and the game becomes poop if you have to cater to them as a majority.

[Domatron]

The coordination and skill requirement increase is actually something that would benefit 8v8s.

 

Personally, I still think 4v4s are the perfect stepping stone to 8v8s, now that the skilled players have developed a more detailed stance in how to kill something. Often times, I found ranked 8v8, while intense, to be flat line because of how rarely people died. With arenas, I have seen a huge increase in player skill capability, where teams have developed strong methods of seperating players from their teammates and using LoS to really prevent turtle matches, something that would make 8v8 a hell of a lot more intense and fun.

 

But yeah, I feel as if the devs have gone in the complete opposite direction with PvP in this game as well. However, I also think that has more to do with the lousy player base overall, as egotistical casuals make the worst PvPers, and the game becomes poop if you have to cater to them as a majority.

 

I agree with this.

I seriously doubt there would be things like the old zero cap Hypergates now that arena strats have refined players kill tactics.

[EzioMessi]

Honestly, endgame is whatever you want it to be. But only in an ideal game environment. One that offers multiple game types in multiple areas and competitiveness levels.

 

Unfortunately, this game is far from an ideal environment. We have multiple gametypes, but only one of them is Ranked explicitly on skill, Arenas. Warzones don't have a rating. OWPvP doesn't exist.

 

If both of the above existed, Ranked 8v8 and a lively OWPvP scene, then the community would have choices to judge who is best at what. But atm, we only have one skill-based gametype to judge with.

[foxmob]

Yes it is.

[Aristore]

For me, ranked, both group and solo, is infinitely more exciting than any wz I've ever played. Imo it's the purest determinant of a player's grasp of all the finer details of the game. Don't get me wrong I don't think they should have taken 8v8 ranked away, it seemed like a needless waste of already developed content, but arenas are always going to be the most exciting and most challenging part of swtor.

 

The part you claim not to like about arenas, their duration, is exactly the reason I love them so much. Warzones are just so long and boring.

[-Messiah]

Sorry your post is too long to read...

 

I don't believe rating means anything.

 

All the good team players know who each other are and can say who's the best by playing games.

 

Word of mouth basically and if you don't play 4s then you're a regstar lol (unless you're wakalord and win the 1v1 comp)