hybrid heal sorc + leavers = arena solo q fail

[danciak]

Lost today 6 solo q against heal hybrids sorc. 4 dps against 2 dps and 2 heals. Nice matchmaking.

Another 3 because my heal left in begining arena.

GJ Biofail. Rip solo q arenas

Edited March 2, 2014 by danciak

[alexsamma]

Lost today 6 solo q against heal hybrids sorc. 4 dps against 2 dps and 2 heals. Nice matchmaking.

Another 3 because my heal left in begining arena.

GJ Biofail. Rip solo q arenas

 

It's not just sorcs my friend, there are op and merc hybrids, alongside ap, vigi, and deception hybrid tanks.

 

P.S. while requiring 36 points in a specific tree would fix the hybrid heals it would not affect the "off-tanks," and it would also break the lt/madness sorc dps hyrbid.

[Odyseus]

also break the lt/madness sorc dps hyrbid.

 

What build? 30/16?

[Ghost_Spectre]

P.S. while requiring 36 points in a specific tree would fix the hybrid heals it would not affect the "off-tanks," and it would also break the lt/madness sorc dps hyrbid.

 

Two things need to be done, IMHO, that can fix this problem.

 

1. Give Sages/Sorcerers stances for each tree. For example: Healing (Seer/Corruption), Lightning/TK (Convection/Concentration), and Madness/Balance (Force Terror/Insight)

 

2. Require 36 points in one of 3 trees.

 

In my opinion that will take care of the problem.

[MotorCityMan]

Hybrid sin/shadow tanks, don't forget those guys. Stance dancers doing double discharge. And on and on.

[MotorCityMan]

I don't know why Bioware thought it was of utmost importance to gimp hybrid PTs so quickly without realizing other classes could be hybrids too.

 

Can't see the forest for the trees.

Edited March 3, 2014 by MotorCityMan

[danciak]

Make guard, a high left tree skill ability = problem witch hybrids tanks etc solved.

With hybrid healers i have no idea .

Edited March 3, 2014 by danciak

[Tankqull]

Hybrid sin/shadow tanks, don't forget those guys. Stance dancers doing double discharge. And on and on.

 

double discharge chas been fixed long ago.

[TonyDragonflame]

Sorcs hybrids must be fixed before Season 2 started.

[Tankqull]

Sorcs hybrids must be fixed before Season 2 started.

 

i dont see anything that needs to be fixed...

healing hybrids trade a hughe part of healing for some severly needed survival tools in arenas.

dmg hybrids lose some on the fly dmg for aswell survival tools. thats a pefect trade off for me.

 

PT/vang on the other hand have been a prime example for misconcepted hybrids, they gain severe defensive option while not giving up any dmg...

Edited March 3, 2014 by Tankqull

[IceCrowned]

hybrid sorc does need to be eliminated it is insanely op when on a 4 dps team or 3dps 1 tank team. Despite not being able to heal "as" good it usually wins the game just like hybrid PT did. Also they need to adress the madness hybrid because its going to be to op once again sorcs need to be re worked bad.

[Vaerah]

Sorcs hybrids must be fixed before Season 2 started.

 

Sure, the day they get given the BASIC survival tools everybody else get.

[Jadescythe]

i dont see anything that needs to be fixed...

healing hybrids trade a hughe part of healing for some severly needed survival tools in arenas.

dmg hybrids lose some on the fly dmg for aswell survival tools. thats a pefect trade off for me.

 

PT/vang on the other hand have been a prime example for misconcepted hybrids, they gain severe defensive option while not giving up any dmg...

 

It's not that the spec is OP as a heal spec. It's the fact that it offers a legitimate healer when the other team only has 4 DPS. Essentially, it prevents the role matchmaking from working properly. If roles are going to be matched based on number of points in a tree, then you can't have hybrids.

 

They don't fit a role. They aren't a DPS and they aren't a healer. So if they get placed in a game where there are healers on either side, they're at a disadvantage. If there are no healers, their team is at a great advantage. No matter how you slice it, there is no role for them to fit.

 

I know people don't like it, but locking key abilities to a stance or forcing 36 points into trees may be required for SOLO QUEUE RANKED. As long as hybrids are balaned from a power perspective, I don't think there is a need to remove them from the game entirely. As an example, I don't think Sorc/Sage heal hybrids are overpowered as a spec for warzones. But their lack of an identified role make games uneven one way or another when matchmaking comes into play.

[Aerilas]

It's not that the spec is OP as a heal spec. It's the fact that it offers a legitimate healer when the other team only has 4 DPS. Essentially, it prevents the role matchmaking from working properly. If roles are going to be matched based on number of points in a tree, then you can't have hybrids.

 

They don't fit a role. They aren't a DPS and they aren't a healer. So if they get placed in a game where there are healers on either side, they're at a disadvantage. If there are no healers, their team is at a great advantage. No matter how you slice it, there is no role for them to fit.

 

I know people don't like it, but locking key abilities to a stance or forcing 36 points into trees may be required for SOLO QUEUE RANKED. As long as hybrids are balaned from a power perspective, I don't think there is a need to remove them from the game entirely. As an example, I don't think Sorc/Sage heal hybrids are overpowered as a spec for warzones. But their lack of an identified role make games uneven one way or another when matchmaking comes into play.

This.

 

Only 1 thing though: When you're in a game with a healer you're most definitely not at a disadvantage. Most healers could use a bit of extra help in healing. Some need alot of help. And you can still put out good damage in the hybrid heal spec.

 

Imo you're only at a disadvantage in a healer-tank game. But you only get those once while you get at least 20 4dps games for one healer-tank game. So yes, this spec needs to go.

[Raansu]

In 8v8 and grouped ranked I have no issues with hybrids, but yes in solo ranked to keep matchmaking somewhat meaningful they definitely should not be allowed. And with tank hybrids, if you're marked as dps then the tank stance/guard should just be greyed out. Outside of that I'm ok with hybrids.

[AdamLKvist]

hybrid sorc does need to be eliminated it is insanely op when on a 4 dps team or 3dps 1 tank team. Despite not being able to heal "as" good it usually wins the game just like hybrid PT did. Also they need to adress the madness hybrid because its going to be to op once again sorcs need to be re worked bad.

 

No because it will not be able to get fade out from the seer/corruption tree and as such it will not be op - it will be reliable - but not op.

 

Sure, the day they get given the BASIC survival tools everybody else get.

 

You can viably play sorcerer lightning and semi-viably play madness in 2.7 because of the fade out/egress buff in the seer tree T2 - so thats an issue already planned to be solved.

 

It's not that the spec is OP as a heal spec. It's the fact that it offers a legitimate healer when the other team only has 4 DPS. Essentially, it prevents the role matchmaking from working properly. If roles are going to be matched based on number of points in a tree, then you can't have hybrids.

 

They don't fit a role. They aren't a DPS and they aren't a healer. So if they get placed in a game where there are healers on either side, they're at a disadvantage. If there are no healers, their team is at a great advantage. No matter how you slice it, there is no role for them to fit.

 

I know people don't like it, but locking key abilities to a stance or forcing 36 points into trees may be required for SOLO QUEUE RANKED. As long as hybrids are balaned from a power perspective, I don't think there is a need to remove them from the game entirely. As an example, I don't think Sorc/Sage heal hybrids are overpowered as a spec for warzones. But their lack of an identified role make games uneven one way or another when matchmaking comes into play.

 

The healhybrid is too strong. But its also the only way to be competitive in 2.6 and solo ranked (as a sorcerer, without spending 1400 matches or exploiting queue). However after keeping a consistent 80-83% win/lose ratio on my sorcerer on TOFN I felt it was getting too easy so I've stopped queueing. It was just a matter of time before I had top rating amongst all classes. I am better than most people that play soloqueue but it would be ignorant to believe that 1/4 of a team can make sure to win 80% of its matches - I provide more of an advantage than can be considered fair.

 

(Still waiting for the day the whining noobs learn to stasis, low slash or stun force speed though - my god its been way too easy to SR TOFN)

 

Edit: I only consider the spec too strong because people are generally pretty bad. People are struggling to keep over 1k dps in arena (whilst not providing team peels nor ccs) and as such its easy mitigationable through a hybrid-heal. However facing a strong team with solid damage as a hybrid means insta-loss. The only match that's a guaranteed win provided players are equally good are the 3 dps + tank matches - you essentially get a heal+tank + 2 dps match versus a team with no way of recovering health. That's whats really broken other than player skill.

 

In the end it doesnt change the fact that in the current meta and skill-level of the game... The spec needs to go

Edited March 3, 2014 by AdamLKvist

[Vaerah]

@Above

 

Could you please share some videos?

 

As full madness I have survivability issues considering I constantly face 2 x shadows + vanguard or 2 x sents + shadow / other DPS stealther.

I cast some AoE damage while I run it, bubble some people... maybe even survive the first round.

 

But then the others learn that I am not sitting still and dying fast like they expect from a sorc and the next rounds they mark me with white target and I get 3 melees constantly on my face. Then it's bubble time and once it ends, my life does not last a lot.

 

No, don't ask me to rely IN ANY WAY on the so called "team" because I play on ToFN too, so you'll easily know how pointless is to even think the others will play in a vaguely decent way. My sorc is relatively new, rank 60. But in 60 ranks I have yet to EVER see anybody peeling a melee off me ONCE and guards are given to other classes.

[JaingSkiratapwns]

Lost today 6 solo q against heal hybrids sorc. 4 dps against 2 dps and 2 heals. Nice matchmaking.

Another 3 because my heal left in begining arena.

GJ Biofail. Rip solo q arenas

 

Don't blame the sorcs, if they don't hybrid they aren't very good in arenas.

 

Well, madness is OK, but a lot of people seem to not like DOT specs.

Edited March 4, 2014 by JaingSkiratapwns

[AdrianDmitruk]

I keep telling Bioware to fix the top third of the corruption tree as there is almost NOTHING between points 22-35 in that tree that is desirable for PVP. It's mostly filler.

 

So of course the survivability tools from hybrid become compelling. Our pure heal spec is so gimped that we feel we have to hybrid to compete. I put enough points into corruption that I don't break the matchmaking and still show up as a healer...but I understand why people would run 21/26/2 (or something like it) instead of 26/21/2 (what I run). I take Force management (1 point in Force Surge), they go for camouflage.

 

I'd gladly run full heals if full heals had the CC (including particularly a reasonably functional overload) necessary to escape melee and/or the ability to actually USE positioning to their team's advantage (i.e. a heal that doesn't require LOS). As it is we're balanced around relying on LOS and escape for our survivability but we can't help our team in any way while LOSing. That sets our spec up to fail in an environment where allowing even a single death of anyone on the team is almost unrecoverable. Arenas aren't as forgiving at needing to LOS to survive as warzones are.

Edited March 4, 2014 by AdrianDmitruk

[honkymonkey]

Yes, hybrids destroy the intent of matchmaking in solo Q. But so does switching stance/form/cell on any class that can guard. Eliminating these problems would require eliminating all sorts of hybrids, even on pure dps classes, it would require guard to be a top tier tank talent or make your stance "locked" upon entering the que.

 

I don't see this being resolved anytime soon.

[Odyseus]

What spec exactly is everyone talking about? The "Healer Hybrid"

[Tankqull]

What spec exactly is everyone talking about? The "Healer Hybrid"

 

sth like this or in case of scoundrels klicky

advantage is you are listetd as a dd so you are not stuck in the lousy healer que[the reason i have run those specs] in case of sorc/sages you gain a severe survival upgrade as well due to having egress and the mezz bubble wich helps alot against leapers.

Edited March 4, 2014 by Tankqull

[JouerTue]

said that i want to put my points where i want, there's no big difference in arenas between popping that cd with alacrity boost+unshakable and having a good healing burst or throwing a couple of healing trances..it's more less the same even from resource management's point of view, same if you pop an alacrity/healing done adrenal

[AlrikFassbauer]

hybrid sorc does need to be eliminated it is insanely op when on a 4 dps team or 3dps 1 tank team. Despite not being able to heal "as" good it usually wins the game just like hybrid PT did. Also they need to adress the madness hybrid because its going to be to op once again sorcs need to be re worked bad.

 

I can agree to that. In 55 unrankey yesterday we got destroyed by them two times (both times Voidstar).

However, in an unranked Arena we got matched against 3 Healing Sages (Rep vs. Rep) and we destroyed them.

(Me playing my Gunslinger all of the time.)

[Vaerah]

Don't blame the sorcs, if they don't hybrid they aren't very good in arenas.

 

Well, madness is OK, but a lot of people seem to not like DOT specs.

 

Dot spec has severe burst issues. Besides a well timed Death Field and a couple other timed stuff (usually with Wrath) you are not going to kill anyone who's decently healed.