BLC vs. LLC

[pianomanhooper]

I know this has been brought up a plethora of times.. and I've looked around also. But I do want to raise the question again of what is better.. right now on my flash fire i have max dmg capacitor and frequency capacitor. I have both LLC and BLC to the t4 tier.. Im just waiting to see what come of this before i pop 15k req into either of the T5

 

with the frequency capacitor and LLC-- the RPM is up t0 221RPM does that beat out BLC at all?

[Lytewraith]

at long range above 2500 m yes but from 100-1500 no think of it like a shot gun for the burst and the laser cannon more like a rifle the supper close range if you can hang out that cloe from 500-1500 is where the burst cannon truly the most powerfull wepon in gsf but once you reach 2000m -4000 m the lasers's are better because the accuracy rate it is the age old question of gsf but it really depends on your play style and how close you fly to your target's

personaly I don't have a computer or internet connection stable enough to run them on a regular basis

because I can not maintain 500m-1500m range butif you can id say go with burst but if you can not id say go with the other lasers and use a crit build to make up the difrence the consentratied fire co pilot abilty coupled with the crit on the wep's make for some very effective damage and it chews them up just as fast as burst at short range but at the cost of a co pilot abilty to get close to the same damage output but it comes down to how closeu can stay to your target and the acc buff works well on the burst too just incase some don't know

[MrWoolie]

On a flashfire, BLC is still superior in my opinion.

 

Reason 1: BLC has a higher damage output in close ranged combat, and hits harder per shot. It is also the only cannon capable of hitting an enemy consistently <500m. Overall, this means that BLC would be better around satellite or obstacles fighting.

 

Reason 2: BLC drains less power per second, and has a lesser tracking penalty. This allows more of its shots to land compared to LLC, which suffers from a higher tracking penalty. (You won't always have your target dead center)

 

The downside to BLC is that the cannon practically under performs beyond that range. While LLC is more consistent starting from 4km, to 500m.

 

In comparison, it seems that BLC is better for flashfire, because you can get within its most effectively range easily with afterburners.

 

However, you should not use frequency capacitor with BLC. I did the calculations once, and concluded that the only time it would be worth it is to take it along with the speed increase from the damage overcharge system while it is active. Otherwise, the 15% increase is no better than 10% straight up damage increase, except it will end up costing more energy.

 

On my Flashfire I use the BLC with damage capacitor, and normally manage to be at the top of the leadership boards, often by a long shot.

 

But don't let me throw you off, if you find that you are better with LLC, use that.

[Armonddd]

Largely agree with the previous posters. I think burst cannons are more fun, and they're certainly much better in any situation where the target isn't dead center. They're also much, much stronger when dogfighting around a satellite, because they can best take advantage of the short windows of opportunity there.

 

However, you should not use frequency capacitor with BLC. I did the calculations once, and concluded that the only time it would be worth it is to take it along with the speed increase from the damage overcharge system while it is active. Otherwise, the 15% increase is no better than 10% straight up damage increase, except it will end up costing more energy.

 

I'd like to see those calculations, because tooltip DPS is much higher with frequency capacitor.

[MrWoolie]

 

I'd like to see those calculations, because tooltip DPS is much higher with frequency capacitor.

 

Of course, 15% speed increase is much better than 10% yes?

 

But that is only the base of it. Statistically, such a small increase does not actually make you kill your enemies faster by a significant margin. I currently can't find the calculations I wrote, but to give you the gist of it.

 

Damage cap have no downsides. Frequency cap drains power more quickly.

 

A 10% consistent increase is not as valuable in regular shots. Do to the fact that in the end you will over damage the targets health pool. Same with frequency capacitor. (Critical)

 

Comparing to the hull and shields of other ships, what put damage on top was that 10% damage applies to the first shot and beyond. 15% faster shooting may increase the dps, however it only starts to count after the first.

In order for Frequency Cap to out dps Damage Cap, it needs to essentially fire 3 shots+ mathmatically, and only if it continues to shoot at a target none stop for the following x number of shots. (I forgot, sorry)

 

Most ships cannot survive 3+ direct shots from ether Cap with BLC anyways.

 

Two other thing to note is that the offtime between shots is around .6 to .8 seconds, so 15% less isn't as much as you would think. Also, Damage Cap makes the occasional crit do a lot more damage as well.

 

Overall, Damage Cap is better suited for the style of BLC anyways, since it is focused on hitting as much per shot as possible.

 

Sorry I don't have what I wrote with me right now. If I find it or redo them later, I will post it here. I am currently in a bit of a hurry.

[pianomanhooper]

Hey thanks for the reply. I have both freq and dang capacitors maxed I have just been indifferent on what to use both my blasters are at t4 and I have enough req to go blc/dmg or llc/freq capacitor and wanted to get a consensus on what's better

[Verain]

Use burst laser cannons with damage capacitor. It's the best in all situations you will be in. Edited February 27, 2014 by Verain

[Zoom_VI]

Use burst laser cannons with damage capacitor. It's the best in all situations you will be in.

 

Have fun dealing with a minelayer with BLC.....

[MrWoolie]

Have fun dealing with a minelayer with BLC.....

 

Who cares? Even if you do blow up the mines one at a time with BLC, the sucker is just going to sudden drop 2 more when you get close.

 

This argument can be applied to a lot of other cannons.

[Zoom_VI]

Who cares? Even if you do blow up the mines one at a time with BLC, the sucker is just going to sudden drop 2 more when you get close.

That was my point

 

This argument can be applied to a lot of other cannons.

No but other weaponry can be used efficiently from farther away meaning the attacking ship will have longer time to shoot any dropped mines before they hit them.

Edited February 27, 2014 by Zoom_VI

[MrWoolie]

That was my point

 

 

No but other weaponry can be used efficiently from farther away meaning the attacking ship will have longer time to shoot any dropped mines before they hit them.

 

Your first point makes your second invalid, since the minelayer would drop two more mines in close range anyways, and two is all it takes to kill a scout.

 

I think you meant that the fire rate of BLC makes it a poor choice against mines. The range is still 4km, mines explode in one shot. The only difference is that a cannon such as rapids would be more effective due to a faster fire rate.

[Armonddd]

Your first point makes your second invalid, since the minelayer would drop two more mines in close range anyways, and two is all it takes to kill a scout.

 

I think you meant that the fire rate of BLC makes it a poor choice against mines. The range is still 4km, mines explode in one shot. The only difference is that a cannon such as rapids would be more effective due to a faster fire rate.

 

You are herpin pretty bad. Zoom's original post was pretty heavily laced with sarcasm, because he knows that burst cannons are the worst for dealing with minelayers. Zoom is saying that other weapons are significantly better at dealing with minelayers and dronecarriers with seekers (in my experience, quads are best). Also, it's really helpful to think of BLC as having a maximum range of 2 km, because beyond that their accuracy takes a nosedive.

[Verain]

Have fun dealing with a minelayer with BLC.....

 

Trying to solo Razorwires, and god forbid actually trying to snipe their mines, is certainly awful. But that's because a Type 2 scout isn't really meant to do that.

 

If you DO want to do that, however, burst laser cannon is essentially the same as light laser cannon. Both have the same max range, and at that max range, both can one shot a mine. Also note that at max range both are within meters of triggering the mine. Burst lasers and light lasers have the exact same range.

 

Meanwhile, should you be able to actually target the minelayer and hit him, you'll appreciate the burst laser cannon much more.

 

No but other weaponry can be used efficiently from farther away meaning the attacking ship will have longer time to shoot any dropped mines before they hit them.

 

Quad lasers specifically have this ability. But they aren't something OP is considering- and more importantly, if you are selecting your layout based on how to deal with a Razorwire, why not pick a ship actually better able to fight a Razorwire? Also note that the normal issue with mines isn't range, it's line of sight. Quads don't make you good against minelayers, light lasers and burst lasers have the same range, both one shot a mine, and burst lasers are much better should you actually be attacking the ship.

 

One of the reasons burst lasers are a superior option compared to the others versus bombers has nothing to do with trying to snipe mines (that the minelayer will trigger on your face if he's smart anyway), and everything to do with burst laser cannon having a much higher dps and damage per shot versus a minelayer (it really wins versus everyone, but all bombers have 10% damage reduction built in, which burst laser cannon ignores entirely, and if they went with damage reduction armor, which many do for survivability versus enemy mines, then it ignores that too).

 

Also, it's really helpful to think of BLC as having a maximum range of 2 km, because beyond that their accuracy takes a nosedive.

 

I think the better model is to think of it as a thrown dagger beyond 800m, losing lots of power with every meter traveled. But even at its max range it can solo a mine.

[MrWoolie]

Trying to solo Razorwires, and god forbid actually trying to snipe their mines, is certainly awful. But that's because a Type 2 scout isn't really meant to do that.

 

If you DO want to do that, however, burst laser cannon is essentially the same as light laser cannon. Both have the same max range, and at that max range, both can one shot a mine. Also note that at max range both are within meters of triggering the mine. Burst lasers and light lasers have the exact same range.

 

Meanwhile, should you be able to actually target the minelayer and hit him, you'll appreciate the burst laser cannon much more.

 

 

 

Quad lasers specifically have this ability. But they aren't something OP is considering- and more importantly, if you are selecting your layout based on how to deal with a Razorwire, why not pick a ship actually better able to fight a Razorwire? Also note that the normal issue with mines isn't range, it's line of sight. Quads don't make you good against minelayers, light lasers and burst lasers have the same range, both one shot a mine, and burst lasers are much better should you actually be attacking the ship.

 

One of the reasons burst lasers are a superior option compared to the others versus bombers has nothing to do with trying to snipe mines (that the minelayer will trigger on your face if he's smart anyway), and everything to do with burst laser cannon having a much higher dps and damage per shot versus a minelayer (it really wins versus everyone, but all bombers have 10% damage reduction built in, which burst laser cannon ignores entirely, and if they went with damage reduction armor, which many do for survivability versus enemy mines, then it ignores that too).

 

 

 

I think the better model is to think of it as a thrown dagger beyond 800m, losing lots of power with every meter traveled. But even at its max range it can solo a mine.

 

Thanks for clearing up my points. I think my post was too short and Armondd misunderstood it.

[Armonddd]

Quad lasers specifically have this ability. But they aren't something OP is considering- and more importantly, if you are selecting your layout based on how to deal with a Razorwire, why not pick a ship actually better able to fight a Razorwire?

 

I think the idea is that if you can handle a Razorwire, you can handle pretty much anything else.