NooB DPS Vanguard looking for tips.

[Lordgimpet]

Well not really a noob in general just its my latest 55,

Ok just hit 55 and I am rolling in a hybrid 8/22/16 build a friend advised me.

However apart from the build they could not advise on anything else as they have never played the class

 

So toying about and looking a the build I have come up with this priority.

Gut > Inc Round > Pulse Cannon > High Impact Bolt > Stockstrike > Ion Pulse > Shoulder Cannon > Hammer Shot.

other than this I just seem to be randomly hitting stuff, but watching out for. Ion Pulse to refresh Stockstrike to refresh HiB.

My issue is I virtually run out of Energy so fast. so I came here for help

So is my priority assumption wrong, how I use it or both?

If so what's the solution or where is the best place to go for info other than asking here?

 

cheers guys.

[Zoom_VI]

your hybrid is running plasma cell but going deep in the tactics tree, your energy is going to suck. And your priorities are terrible.

 

For starters go for a 36pt build in either tree, don't mess with hybrids if you are not proficient in the full trees.

 

Pulse cannon won't be used if you are assault. In tactics you use it only after you have three stacks of pulse generator which are generated by ion pulse, fire pulse, and explosive surge(don't use this ES its terrible)

[Lordgimpet]

Noted, Though I tried focusing on either tree while levelling, eventually staying full assault from 40-55

Wanted to try something a little different, and was told what its what the cool kids were doing, just could not find any

rotation info to back it up.

Edited October 24, 2013 by Lordgimpet

[gorstram]

Noted, Though I tried focusing on either tree while levelling, eventually staying full assault from 40-55

Wanted to try something a little different, and was told what its what the cool kids were doing, just could not find any

rotation info to back it up.

 

They killed the hybrid spec after 2.4. Your options are going 36 into tactics or assault. I find that tactics has a better feel during PvE play, with a ferocious pulse cannon after it has been buffed by the center piece of the tactics tree, "Pulse generator." Assault is a really movement friendly spec, but it's talents are more geared towards slowing targets and survival which is great for pvp. Tactics is currently edging out Assault in PvE parsing, and both specs do well in PvP, with Assault giving more tools for survival.

 

So depending on your style of play, I would say: PvE; go Tactics. PvP; go Assault; or if you're in a cleave team, go tactics for the sheer burst.

[OlosBC]

Hybrid isn't totally dead, it just doesn't blow the other specs out of the water anymore. Would a been dead with 2.4, but the hib buff saved it a bit.

 

Currently I like to run full assault(pyro) for single target fights (most of which in this tier have a bunch of movement) and 2/22/22 hybrid for aoe fights. I prefer 2/22/22 over 8/22/16 for the surge on hib and because that build favors a bit more crit(mine is a bit high currently).

[paowee]

I've been playing around with this Hybrid build

 

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#801hMhZrsrMobRMZfhMrzo.3

 

Contrary to what the guy above said i don't have that serious of an energy problem. Just a little practice and you can get used to keeping Gut up and use Ion Pulse to reset HiB every 6 seconds. And free stocktrick is always nice. Once i get 3 stacks of Pulse Generator i hit Gut and then use Pulse cannon. Still practicing with it and working to gear up my Vanguard DPS. he is currently only sitting with 2700 Power and using a Cunning barrel haha. And artifact implants/earpc.

 

The DPS of Hybrid is pretty strong... check out these 16-man Hard Mode parses by a Hybrid Vanguard.

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=691926

Edited October 29, 2013 by paowee

[OlosBC]

Yea, heat/ammo management in hybrid is super easy now that IR/IM and PC/FT are cheaper.

 

Now if I could just stop having to heal in our guild ops, I'd behaving fun with all the aoe in this ops tier.

[Keypek]

Don't listen to some of this. Hybrid is very much viable and in most boss fights better than any 36 spec. I would go the 2/22/22 route though. You obviously go plasma cell and you absolutely use pulse cannon on CD. Key to hybrid is ammo management which isn't as hard as it used to be. And is more on a priority system than a set rotation. PC is always used on CD regardless of stacks (this isn't quite as strict as previous hybrid because of easier ammo management... some times I'll slip in an IP to get that third stack if I have plenty of ammo and multiple targets but generally use on CD regardless). Keep gut up 100% and don't overlap. Use SS when it's free or a quicker HiB proc is needed. Fill with IP. Use IR whenever you can on mobs that will take a while to kill but don't worry about it on trash or quick fights or if ammo is low. And absolutely number 1 rule is don't go below full ammo regen unless you intend on blowing recharge cells in a burn phase or what not.

 

BW keeps chipping away on the hybrid and they came close to making 36 tactics better. For which I'd greatly welcome because I'd rather run it anyway since the ammo management in that spec could be handled by a monkey. But both 36 tactics and 36 assault are still coming in below hybrid in most fights. Tactics is close though so it is certainly viable for anything if you don't want to mess with the hassle of hybrid. Average dummy parses on tactics I'll get 3000-3100 and hybrid will be 3100-3200.

 

Obviously this is all subjective as dummy parses aren't an end all rating. Some bosses (like grob'throk for instance) I switch to tactics because of the longer HTL, better damage mitigation for all the raid wide stuff, and better add management with PC itself killin the three adds usually.

[T-Assassin]

I run 8-8-30, NEVER use SS, and have pretty good results. In 72's, 78OH. NO set bonus

 

11 #1 VG parses in HM FP's and SM OP's. Just started running OP's again, SnV and DF for the first time, and posted very respectable numbers (mostly top 5) in my first time in the zones. EVERY zone has been a PuG, as I am currently guildless.

 

Hybrid will parse > 36 in almost all instances. I just prefer the 10m play style of 8-8-30. Full 36 parses a bit higher than 8-8-30 on a dummy, but in an actual FP/OP scenario you will never be able to just sit and perform flawless rotations. Again, my 8-8-30 is simple, reliable, consistent DPS. The only real management you need to be concerned with is IR DoT uptime. Other than that, it is a fluid IP-HS-IP filler between HiB's. I can maintain mobility, swap targets, etc. without losing any DPS.

 

Only Azurlight and Stryvah (both PT's) outperform me in FP's.

 

And once I find a guild that suits me, and can parse some HM OP's, I'll be top 5 there as well. 8-8-30.

 

But, play what you like, what you are comfortable with. I have FUN and parse like a boss.

 

EDIT: I might be tempted to go 2/22/22 for OPs with AOE...i.e. C-tor's excellent DF/DP parses.

Edited October 30, 2013 by T-Assassin

[Keypek]

I run 8-8-30, NEVER use SS, and have pretty good results. In 72's, 78OH.

 

11 #1 VG parses in HM FP's and SM OP's. Just started running OP's again, SnV and DF for the first time, and posted very respectable numbers (mostly top 5) in my first time in the zones. EVERY zone has been a PuG, as I am currently guildless.

 

Hybrid will parse > 36 in almost all instances. I just prefer the 10m play style of 8-8-30. Full 36 parses a bit higher than 8-8-30 on a dummy, but in an actual FP/OP scenario you will never be able to just sit and perform flawless rotations. Again, my 8-8-30 is simple, reliable, consistent DPS. The only real management you need to be concerned with is IR DoT uptime. Other than that, it is a fluid IP-HS-IP filler between HiB's. I can maintain mobility, swap targets, etc. without losing any DPS.

 

Only Azurlight and Stryvah (both PT's) outperform me in FP's.

 

And once I find a guild that suits me, and can parse some HM OP's, I'll be top 5 there as well. 8-8-30.

 

But, play what you like, what you are comfortable with. I have FUN and parse like a boss.

 

Yeah I've played with this spec a few times now. Haven't tried it in progression raiding yet as I don't want to bring a new spec into that until I've had a chance to mess with it more. Thing I hated most about it was it's lack of variety. I'm planning on trying it out though on single target boss fights once I get a chance. It's going to be so behind in fightst that have a lot of aoe opportunities though compared to hybrid or tactics. But single target I'd guess it'd be an awesome burn spec especially once below 30%.

[OlosBC]

I run 8-8-30, NEVER use SS, and have pretty good results. In 72's, 78OH. NO set bonus

 

11 #1 VG parses in HM FP's and SM OP's. Just started running OP's again, SnV and DF for the first time, and posted very respectable numbers (mostly top 5) in my first time in the zones. EVERY zone has been a PuG, as I am currently guildless.

 

Hybrid will parse > 36 in almost all instances. I just prefer the 10m play style of 8-8-30. Full 36 parses a bit higher than 8-8-30 on a dummy, but in an actual FP/OP scenario you will never be able to just sit and perform flawless rotations. Again, my 8-8-30 is simple, reliable, consistent DPS. The only real management you need to be concerned with is IR DoT uptime. Other than that, it is a fluid IP-HS-IP filler between HiB's. I can maintain mobility, swap targets, etc. without losing any DPS.

 

Only Azurlight and Stryvah (both PT's) outperform me in FP's.

 

And once I find a guild that suits me, and can parse some HM OP's, I'll be top 5 there as well. 8-8-30.

 

But, play what you like, what you are comfortable with. I have FUN and parse like a boss.

 

EDIT: I might be tempted to go 2/22/22 for OPs with AOE...i.e. C-tor's excellent DF/DP parses.

 

If you posted some actual numbers it might mean something, but since so few actually upload logs for FPs and SM ops, it doesn't really mean anything. Need to have a decent sample size to use this as definitive proof of anything.

[T-Assassin]

If you posted some actual numbers it might mean something, but since so few actually upload logs for FPs and SM ops, it doesn't really mean anything. Need to have a decent sample size to use this as definitive proof of anything.

 

My numbers are posted on Torparse. You too lazy to have a look? Should I post every boss parse here? Doesn't seem like a very good use of time, since they are all a few clicks away.

 

Is it my fault "so few actually upload logs for FPs and SM ops"? IDK how/where you get that "solid" evidence.

 

SM OPs and HM FP's...again, all PuG'd, as I am not guilded. If I were to run HM, nothing would change, other than I might spec hybrid for AOE fights. And I can guarantee my numbers would be competitive. i.e. top 5 (in 72's)

 

And if I'm not mistaken, he didn't specify HM or SM, FP or OP.

 

Dude asked for opinions/advice and I gave it...AND provided a good base of evidence.

 

But, since you're healing OPs, he should probably listen to your expertise.

 

If I need some healing tips, I'll be sure to look you up.

[unluckyperson]

They killed the hybrid spec after 2.4. Your options are going 36 into tactics or assault. I find that tactics has a better feel during PvE play, with a ferocious pulse cannon after it has been buffed by the center piece of the tactics tree, "Pulse generator." Assault is a really movement friendly spec, but it's talents are more geared towards slowing targets and survival which is great for pvp. Tactics is currently edging out Assault in PvE parsing, and both specs do well in PvP, with Assault giving more tools for survival.

 

So depending on your style of play, I would say: PvE; go Tactics. PvP; go Assault; or if you're in a cleave team, go tactics for the sheer burst.

 

I don't know if this statement is necessarily true, I know for a fact that on my server people are still running hybrid specs, as evidenced by this thread.

 

2/22/22 is the top parse right now at a little above 3400. The other variation I've been seeing people run is 8/22/16 for that extra elemental damage.

 

I don't know how it compares to your parses or your server's parses but at least it seems viable to me.

 

On the other hand I would like to know why you say that Assault has better defenses in PvP than Tactics, most people believe the opposite.

[OlosBC]

My numbers are posted on Torparse. You too lazy to have a look? Should I post every boss parse here? Doesn't seem like a very good use of time, since they are all a few clicks away.

 

Is it my fault "so few actually upload logs for FPs and SM ops"? IDK how/where you get that "solid" evidence.

 

SM OPs and HM FP's...again, all PuG'd, as I am not guilded. If I were to run HM, nothing would change, other than I might spec hybrid for AOE fights. And I can guarantee my numbers would be competitive. i.e. top 5 (in 72's)

 

And if I'm not mistaken, he didn't specify HM or SM, FP or OP.

 

Dude asked for opinions/advice and I gave it...AND provided a good base of evidence.

 

But, since you're healing OPs, he should probably listen to your expertise.

 

If I need some healing tips, I'll be sure to look you up.

 

I generally post on my phone, so yea, torparse is a ***** to navigate through.

 

And obviously, since I heal a 16HM DF once or twice a week, I'm surely nor running my PT in DP or alt runs/pugs. Oh wait.

 

You know what assuming does. It makes an *** out of you and umption.

[T-Assassin]

I don't know if this statement is necessarily true, I know for a fact that on my server people are still running hybrid specs, as evidenced by this thread.

 

2/22/22 is the top parse right now at a little above 3400. The other variation I've been seeing people run is 8/22/16 for that extra elemental damage.

 

I don't know how it compares to your parses or your server's parses but at least it seems viable to me.

 

On the other hand I would like to know why you say that Assault has better defenses in PvP than Tactics, most people believe the opposite.

 

2/22/22 is the TOP parsing spec right now, in any case...AOE, Dummy, and Single TGT. There is no debate, other than if you (not you, personally) cannot parse high with the spec, you're doing it wrong, or do not know how to manage the heat/rotation.

 

Some, like myself, just prefer a different play style. But, I know better than to say 8-8-30, or any variant or full spec will parse > hybrid.

 

Finally, Assault has some nice DR/DC with Adrenaline Fueled and Degauss, but it's hard to beat Shock Absorbers 60% DR potential. Especially, with Smash/Sweep being so prevalent.

[banehammer]

2/22/22 is the TOP parsing spec right now, in any case...AOE, Dummy, and Single TGT. There is no debate, other than if you (not you, personally) cannot parse high with the spec, you're doing it wrong, or do not know how to manage the heat/rotation.

 

Some, like myself, just prefer a different play style. But, I know better than to say 8-8-30, or any variant or full spec will parse > hybrid.

 

Finally, Assault has some nice DR/DC with Adrenaline Fueled and Degauss, but it's hard to beat Shock Absorbers 60% DR potential. Especially, with Smash/Sweep being so prevalent.

 

Hang on a minute... I thought 2.4 made the hybrid spec redundant with the buffs to fire pulse etc?

Can someone clarify?

Also, if you're feeling generous, please post a link to the 2/22/22 hybrid 'highest dps' build. I think I have the build right but would like to confirm.

THANKS!

Edited November 1, 2013 by banehammer

[T-Assassin]

Hang on a minute... I thought 2.4 made the hybrid spec redundant with the buffs to fire pulse etc?

Can someone clarify?

Also, if you're feeling generous, please post a link to the 2/22/22 hybrid 'highest dps' build. I think I have the build right but would like to confirm.

THANKS!

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=658277

 

You're welcome.

Edited November 1, 2013 by T-Assassin

[banehammer]

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=658277

 

You're welcome.

 

Holy sh*t. The vanguard holy grail. Thanks ;D

Edited November 1, 2013 by banehammer

[unluckyperson]

2/22/22 is the TOP parsing spec right now, in any case...AOE, Dummy, and Single TGT. There is no debate, other than if you (not you, personally) cannot parse high with the spec, you're doing it wrong, or do not know how to manage the heat/rotation.

 

Some, like myself, just prefer a different play style. But, I know better than to say 8-8-30, or any variant or full spec will parse > hybrid.

 

Finally, Assault has some nice DR/DC with Adrenaline Fueled and Degauss, but it's hard to beat Shock Absorbers 60% DR potential. Especially, with Smash/Sweep being so prevalent.

 

 

I can play the hybrid specs, and I do play tactics every now and again, but I don't like to play the hybrid much personally. However my statement was more of a rebuttal to someone saying that 2.4 brought the death of the hybrid vanguard/powertech builds. I'm also not crazy enough though to say that because something performs well on a dummy it will yield results in ops. I do however believe that it gives an indicator on a relative relationship. For example if you parse on spec A and produce 200 dps more than spec B, I think that in an ops boss fight that you'll get somewhere from 0-200 more dps in spec A vs spec B. However because of situations or things even this may not necessarily be true.

 

I would however argue that what you end up parsing is somewhat dependent on gear. I could never produce much more (difference was about 100 dps) in the hybrid specs when I first tested them against a dummy, however I was running old pre-2.0 crit/surge gear.

 

As a rebuttal to the last bit, I'd argue personally that Tactics has better damage mitigation compared to assault because of 2 reasons:

Power Armor (straight 2% damage reduction)

Reflexive Shield (20% chance to get a shield that absorbs damage and reduces CD on Reactive Shield).

[OlosBC]

Assault does get a bit of a boost going from dummy to boss, because it has a bit more kinetic damage (50% ish vs tactics/hybrid at 30%ish), and is thus boosted by armor debuff more. Also assault has the execute, which is really only a 3% buff over the course of a fight, but that's 3% more than tactics/hybrid get. Assault also deals with movement extremely well, with all attacks but rocket punch being 10m and no crucial channels/casts. However tactics and hybrid have some of the best aloe in the game, which is definitely not insignificant this tier.

 

Full tactics is definitely the tankiest of the bunch, with the better energy shield and aoe damage reduction, though only hybrid really has the points to spend on the 2% DR in tactics tree. Also, full tactics is the only one that can really go to tank stance without completely gimping DPS. Assault's cool downs ate probably the best for when accidentally pulling the boss (don't be shy about using them!!!)

 

 

Personally, I like playing hybrid. I like the combination of assault play style and tactics aoe. I've just never been a fan of tactics' fairly set rotation. I do switch to pyro for some fights with constant movement, but probably going to be doing that only for council from here out(raptus kite tank)

[T-Assassin]

I can play the hybrid specs, and I do play tactics every now and again, but I don't like to play the hybrid much personally. However my statement was more of a rebuttal to someone saying that 2.4 brought the death of the hybrid vanguard/powertech builds. I'm also not crazy enough though to say that because something performs well on a dummy it will yield results in ops. I do however believe that it gives an indicator on a relative relationship. For example if you parse on spec A and produce 200 dps more than spec B, I think that in an ops boss fight that you'll get somewhere from 0-200 more dps in spec A vs spec B. However because of situations or things even this may not necessarily be true.

 

I would however argue that what you end up parsing is somewhat dependent on gear. I could never produce much more (difference was about 100 dps) in the hybrid specs when I first tested them against a dummy, however I was running old pre-2.0 crit/surge gear.

 

As a rebuttal to the last bit, I'd argue personally that Tactics has better damage mitigation compared to assault because of 2 reasons:

Power Armor (straight 2% damage reduction)

Reflexive Shield (20% chance to get a shield that absorbs damage and reduces CD on Reactive Shield).

 

I agree with everything you've said, in both this post and the one above. I was just adding my $.02.

 

As far as hybrid or tactics, I guess I'm just stuck in my ways... I love the boring 8-8-30, fully mobile spec. I've been running it pre 2.0, honestly. Once I switched from Merc/PT to VG/Assault.

 

Overall, hybrid will parse higher on average, and has better overall defenses. I just believe it is a bit more difficult to manage properly, thus I find more success in my build. Again, I'm a Regstar, PuG'r. My role in OPs changes every time. So the flexibility really fits me, as well as my expertise in the spec. I do believe I push the most out of it, as my parses usually show.

 

All things equal, skill, groups, etc. Hybrid > Tactics > Assault in 2.4.

 

But, I have no equals (j/k)

Edited November 1, 2013 by T-Assassin