AlienEyeTX Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Not necessarily theres a chance they could make the player database function with a new or upgraded engine. Like i said it would be worth it to start over knowing it increased the overall longevity of the game If it got to the point they needed to revamp the whole thing, they'd just make a new game while nursing this one. Like what EQ did... except the first one never went away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etheric Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 (edited) If its the current version of the Hero engine your enquiring about the Repopulation is using it. You can go check it out there. Edited September 26, 2013 by Etheric spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 The engine, performance issues and limitations have been in place now since the game launched in Dec of 2011. By now I expect most players have learned to roll with it's limitations. The concern is the ability to add features to the game that the playerbase may find desirable. This engine has problems that are likely unique to its single build, and this complicates matters. I would speculate that Bioware wishes to do many of the things the community desires. I think that in some cases it is not an easy task due to engine limitations. I think the current dev team has enough ingenuity and talent on tap to eventually overcome these shortcomings, or improve engine performance in such a way as to allow those improvements to be implemented. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmjarec Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 If it got to the point they needed to revamp the whole thing, they'd just make a new game while nursing this one. Like what EQ did... except the first one never went away. First off they already need a new engine they are incapable of adding any new features or technology and second with the fiasco swtor caused nobody will ever fund bioware to do a second If another star wars mmo comes out it will be from a diff company hopefully it is better. I dont see the point in making a mmo and then developing the engine to function primarily on solo content Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkerus Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 First off they already need a new engine they are incapable of adding any new features or technology and second with the fiasco swtor caused nobody will ever fund bioware to do a second If another star wars mmo comes out it will be from a diff company hopefully it is better. I dont see the point in making a mmo and then developing the engine to function primarily on solo content Oh they can't add new features or technology? I don't think you know what those terms mean. Exactly what do you know about this engine? Please detail what you know about their internal version, I would love to hear it. Its an engine. As long as they build it, it can do it. I don't think you understand how an engine works. The only limitation is what they want to put into it and a lot of sweat and hard work (and of course you have to pay people). This is not to be confused with the ridiculous premise of the OP that they "start over". That's not how these things work and like many other have said, if you knew anything about game engines you wouldn't even bring it up. As for new features, I could have sworn an entire free roam space feature was in the works. But I don't know...maybe it was just a rumor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 It's morning, west coast time, September 26. Did the engine get replaced yet? Is it too late yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Covaltage Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 It's morning, west coast time, September 26. Did the engine get replaced yet? Is it too late yet? We aren't that lucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkerus Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 It's morning, west coast time, September 26. Did the engine get replaced yet? Is it too late yet? They're replacing it with a version of frostbite cry engine 7. Its going to be the greatest game ever made...again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOHboy Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 It's morning, west coast time, September 26. Did the engine get replaced yet? Is it too late yet? For some reason, spaceballs suddenly popped into my head with that statement...which resulted in this: when will then be now...soon™ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmjarec Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Oh they can't add new features or technology? I don't think you know what those terms mean. Exactly what do you know about this engine? Please detail what you know about their internal version, I would love to hear it. Its an engine. As long as they build it, it can do it. I don't think you understand how an engine works. The only limitation is what they want to put into it and a lot of sweat and hard work (and of course you have to pay people). This is not to be confused with the ridiculous premise of the OP that they "start over". That's not how these things work and like many other have said, if you knew anything about game engines you wouldn't even bring it up. As for new features, I could have sworn an entire free roam space feature was in the works. But I don't know...maybe it was just a rumor. Actually i do. They have already stated they cant add technology direct x which is a tecjnology and also that they cant do massive which is a feature Maybee you need to look up the definitions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brittaany_Banks Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 How is this kid able to present a better Nar Shadaa using Cryengine3? Seriously, ***? Get your act together! Someone at bioware just needs to pull the plug and quickly switch engines. Sure you have to pay the cryengine license, but you will at least have a steady stream of students who can easily adapt SWToR into the next generation. It is either that or watch this game slowly die. Nothing more to be said as the evidence is there, we are down to 4 servers with decent pops! The current engine is a joke and anyone who says otherwise is a fool, this game has been out for 2 years and the only thing that keeps me and others coming back is the star wars name. The problem is that at this point the IP is being bastardized by a complete lack of self respect on the part of the current dev team. Please take the time to seriously accept that the engine is a farce and that a relaunch of the game under a newer engine is the only way out of the current mess. (The real joke is on the trolls who defend this game on the forum, because ultimately I take solace in knowing Disney will eventually find that the quality of this product is garbage and will give one of their own studios the license.) Here is a summary of the problem: C/P from PvP petition.. credit goes to Xorcist Name: Xorcist on Sep 25, 2013 Comments: Was on POT5. Was a subscriber until August 27th 2013. No longer playing SWTOR, and have not logged in for close to two months now. Don't plan on logging in anytime soon. Reasons for leaving after supporting the SWTOR project since October 2008: Death by a thousand paper cuts. One of the very last straws was learning that nothing changed when Revan's gear was supposed to be changed to appear more like the classic Revan that we know with better textures+costume design, and not a poorly rendered Inquisitor rip off. The other last straw was the Collectors Edition Vendor did not receive the attention it was promised since the servers went live. The Cartel Market received all the attention and it was clear that BioWare did not give a flying **** about their loyal subscribers and constant stream of posts battering the company for putting the Cartel Market first for many many many months. BioWare defaulted on the agreement that we the consumer would purchase the Collectors Edition and they would regularly supply the vendor with goodies. As we know that it is possible to do so because BioWare has shown us they can by example of the Cartel Market and it's regular updates. They have chosen rather to treat their loyal customers like third class citizens. That of course is unacceptable, and subject to persecution. They charge extra real money to monthly paying Subscribers for things like the barber shop features, emotes, special holiday offerings rather than through in game quests, and one time use color dyes at approximately $20 per unit. Not to mention luring individuals to purchase insane quantities of gambling packs for a chance to get that very rare and special item or dye. Costing a single individual approximately $150 in packs perhaps more depending on the person. BioWare depends on the Cartel Market to carry them on but the Cartel Market is just a life support system keeping the patient (SWTOR) alive however, in a comatose state. This is no way to live. The game engine can not support large quantities of players at once in the same area, The game engine does not like to be touched or modified in any way. Gordon Walton needed the Hero engine because it would get the work done faster and therefore meet tight deadlines. Unfortunately the engine was not ready nor was it tested. Now what is in place running the SWTOR game is something I can only describe as a Frankenstein game engine. Bugs on top of bugs that seem never ending. No server transfer capability. It seems as though features that should be able to be added relatively quickly within reason take an eternity to see the light of day. That coupled with a very basic and stone age style of character creation for a 2011 MMO is extremely sad. The options available to create your character are mostly variations of each other with a very slight difference between them. There is no thought or creativity to the designs that were created for the various different colored humans (species). The options available to change the head, complexion, hair etc.. are 99% ugly and undesirable choices. There was so much that could've been done with this and they decided to leave it as basic and void of creative design as possible. The worlds are super basic in design. The rocks and rock formations look atrocious. The geographical details in the environments are incredibly basic using a cut and paste type of design. Nothing truly separates one world from the other in geographical design. Textures are beyond amateurish and nowhere near professional quality. Landscapes are all unimaginative and in no way inspire awe on any part of any world. Sound music/ambiance/effects quality is not Star Wars worthy. It does not put the player in the environment or make them feel like they are truly in a Star Wars universe. ALL Character animations are static and basic right through to all species and classes. They appear as though, again, an amateur designed them. Colors/light/shade on the worlds and the environment are again amateurishly done. There is no light and shade to speak of. We are given a light source that is not there. Imaginatively created light sources. "Light" sabers do not emit a strong enough source of light and is very square in nature when pressed near a wall. Badly designed light source all around. Areas are again atrociously shaded as though an amateur did the work. The Costume designer(s) should be fired as they obviously do not know what belongs in a Star Wars universe and what does not. I am certain they have never seen the movies or had any contact with any related material concerning Star Wars. Appalling and embarrassing should cover the costume designs in SWTOR from launch to present. Jawa's for example, do not appear nor sound like Jawa's are supposed to in SWTOR. Cantina designs are ridiculous and boring. Music is unappealing and quite honestly stupid sounding, even for a sci-fi fantasy surrounding. With so many disappointments and flaws that have gone live I don't think anyone at that studio has what it takes to create memorable Star Wars experience in an MMO. The teams that created the Force Unleashed series did it right. They were a very talented bunch when it came to design and execution. All of the mentioned above Needs to be addressed to create a positive and memorable long lasting Star Wars MMORPG. Doing so by hiring new designers who know how to design a living breathing Star Wars universe, and also re-designing the game engine from the bottom up is what is expected by a loyal subscriber of this game. In addition to not being taken advantage of and be shown that Subscribers continued business is truly important and not to be taken lightly as it has been since the launch of the Free to Play model. A one time appreciation gift is insulting to a loyal Subscriber. What about next month and the month after that? EVERYTHING... I've seen and experienced through this hollow journey has shown me that BioWare Austin doesn't care about it's customers past whatever they can rip from their pockets and take advantage of them for a virtual piece of candy. Their greed has no bounds or shame. They have become so truly disgusting as a game studio it sickens my stomach just thinking about it. /rant Changing engines ain't like dusting crops boy. It is not as easy as applying a fresh new coat of paint to a room in your house. I am no developer and do not understand the type of technical prowess that goes into applying a new engine to an already existing game but I am going to assume it is a long, expensive, and exhaustive process. How many MMO developers have you seen completely change the engine of their game? I have seen developers speed up, and slow down the engine but never change it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 It is purely a guess, but I would guess that the folks that actually built the engine are not the folks currently working for Bioware. If that is the case they have to learn as they go.... ...would explain a few of the bugs that have cropped up here and there. Just speculation naturally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captpickles Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Ok I was wrong, trololol uprated to 9.5 ... 150 posts... omg... sheeple it was a joke ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkerus Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Actually i do. They have already stated they cant add technology direct x which is a tecjnology and also that they cant do massive which is a feature Maybee you need to look up the definitions Limitations on one area do not mean the entire subject area is DOA. My car can't handle 20 inch tires but that doesn't mean I can't upgrade the turbo. I don't know why I try to talk with people who don't actually understand the technology. You are as bad as the OP, troll or not. If you think the space project isn't a new feature you can't be helped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldRepJedi Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 It will happen one way or another because in 1 year the license is up and Disney will want to see the same revenue as Activision from a Star Wars licensed IP that they own. This game lost all credibility the day the Dr.'s walked out on Bioware and EA.. they knew they had involuntarily given birth to a deformed monster.. the only fix is to nuke the current iteration and start fresh. The sad part is when they do this all the people who spent $$$ on cartel items will be so angry, yet EA has done this time and time again in other games. The writing is on the wall Perhaps you didn't hear that EA already secured the rights to all Star Wars PC/console games for the next 5 years. This includes SWTOR. They can farm out but EA already has it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malckiah Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 lol....just lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmjarec Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Limitations on one area do not mean the entire subject area is DOA. My car can't handle 20 inch tires but that doesn't mean I can't upgrade the turbo. I don't know why I try to talk with people who don't actually understand the technology. You are as bad as the OP, troll or not. If you think the space project isn't a new feature you can't be helped. I completely understand it based on what they said they cant upgrade which is everything. They are already maxed graphics as well as players on screen. If u knew what you were talkig about ud knowdirect x lets you impliment all sorts of gfx enhancements and such and if they cant impliment that the They cant impliment new gfx. These things have been asked for since beta tjey said it was engine limitations what more do you need. I habe plenty of evidence based off their actions. You sit here and wail oh but they can well if they could habe they would have whats stopping them its been a year plus how long does it take They acknowledge its not possible so unless you know something the coders dont about their own engine then please provide them a resume and then some proof I have made models, skinned them, designed levels and lighting in a month with unreal engine which is commonly used and easily done in mmorpgs so by the simple act of knowing what its limitations are and them stating what their own limitations are im pretty sure your just full of crap until you can prove me and the devs wrong If i can do it in a month going to school fulltime why cant they do it in a year with their eingine. Obviously theirs is crap compared to unreal and its old tech so by the magic of logic i can see this engine is crap based off their words and actions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldRepJedi Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Dude its copy and paste not hard at all Telling yourself and others that is just spreading lies and half truths.. please do humanity a favor and go live under a rock where you belong. You really don't know anything about program development do you? It's not copy and paste. Everything would need to be re-written under the base code of the engine. There is so much that is involved in software development, (even for the relatively simple programs) that it boggles the mind. So much coding has to happen. Bioware had started development long before they even leaked that there was going to be a SWTOR MMO. So you should just stick to the things you know about and obviously game development is not one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hazed Posted September 26, 2013 Author Share Posted September 26, 2013 (edited) Changing engines ain't like dusting crops boy. It is not as easy as applying a fresh new coat of paint to a room in your house. I am no developer and do not understand the type of technical prowess that goes into applying a new engine to an already existing game but I am going to assume it is a long, expensive, and exhaustive process. How many MMO developers have you seen completely change the engine of their game? I have seen developers speed up, and slow down the engine but never change it. EQ 1 did an engine overhaul during luclin (extended its lifespan till current day) WoW updated their engine multiple times (extended t lifespan till current day) those are the most successful mmo's to date and both have upgraded their engine.. partly because of necessity and age, and partly because it just makes sense. I do not know where half of you got your education from, but apparently you fail grasp even the most rudimentary of concepts. Interns can do the work in ~ 6 months.. This will not only improve the game but bolster the economy as well. What I keep seeing is people who are scared they will lose everything if this happens. Guess what though? your already going to lose everything in the near future.. If you do not know EA's track record with games then I feel sorry for you. Again educate yourselves Edited September 26, 2013 by Hazed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaNuls Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Apparently it don't take much to develop a quality environment as demonstrated by the student's video. Just sayin' you can't say "oh this can't be done" when clearly it can, if they use the proper engine. I am sorry not to sound rude and such but.. did you ask this kid how long it took to make this work? How long did the models take? How long did creating the abilities and balancing them take if they are balanced? How many hours did he as one person take to develop just this part? People who post about changing engines in an existing game, website or software basically have no concept of game software or web development or the costs involved with it. Fine if BW switches the engine how long are you willing to go without content updates and just receiving minor bug fixes while the development team works on porting to a new engine? Then when they release the engine the update will be huge not to mention the bugs that will exist that people will complain about. Just an example was EQNext was announced over 2 years ago and still has yet to reach beta stage because they thew out the engine and started from scratch which took an additional 14 months so far. The bottom line is A) No matter what a gaming company does there will be those who constantly complain B) There will never be a game perfect for everyone C) If you are that unhappy with the game go play something else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yestreen Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 It is already too late. It was already too late when the game launched last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ikinai Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 (edited) EQ 1 did an engine overhaul during luclin (extended its lifespan till current day) WoW updated their engine multiple times (extended t lifespan till current day) those are the most successful mmo's to date and both have upgraded their engine.. partly because of necessity and age, and partly because it just makes sense. I do not know where half of you got your education from, but apparently you fail grasp even the most rudimentary of concepts. Interns can do the work in ~ 6 months.. This will not only improve the game but bolster the economy as well. What I keep seeing is people who are scared they will lose everything if this happens. Guess what though? your already going to lose everything in the near future.. If you do not know EA's track record with games then I feel sorry for you. Again educate yourselves Upgrading is not the same as changing the engine. I have a degree in 3D animation programming. I've written 3D renderers and graphics engines. Currently I train these so called interns who could do this work in 6 months. Let me tell ya, you've got about a 40% success rate on any intern. Most are about as good of a worker as a box of rocks. In fact the box of rocks would be more productive. Edited September 26, 2013 by ikinai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captpickles Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 It's morning, west coast time, September 26. Did the engine get replaced yet? Is it too late yet? +1 /5char Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOHboy Posted September 26, 2013 Share Posted September 26, 2013 Upgrading is not the same as changing the engine. I have a degree in 3D animation programming. I've written 3D renderers and graphics engines. Currently I train these so called interns who could do this work in 6 months. Let me tell ya, you've got about a 40% success rate on any intern. Most are about as good of a worker as a box of rocks. In fact the box of rocks would be more productive. Hey, box of rocks is an epic box of paper weights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hazed Posted September 26, 2013 Author Share Posted September 26, 2013 Upgrading is not the same as changing the engine. I have a degree in 3D animation programming. I've written 3D renderers and graphics engines. Currently I train these so called interns who could do this work in 6 months. Let me tell ya, you've got about a 40% success rate on any intern. Most are about as good of a worker as a box of rocks. In fact the box of rocks would be more productive. 40% success rate is better than what the last group did. seriously you just confirmed what I have been saying, it is not hard.. just hire a buttload of interns and see who comes up with the best project. Hell I am sure they can open source the code and get a better product out than what they have now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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