Kaggath Tournament - Droid Supremacy vs Undying Brotherhood

[Wolfninjajedi]

Talking about TCW, Season 2 episode 1+2

 

Ahh...well I kinda just glossed over a lot of TCW episodes(mostly cause I completely forgot bout em)...so yeah..but alright.

[Wolfninjajedi]

That's probably useful information to put on Wookieepedia... and he would have got control of almost every droid in the Galaxy if he did.

 

I wouldn't go putting speculative evidence, on already a vague character that is only mentioned.

[Canino]

Here's a question: Why would any of the Sith warriors even listen to Grievous or Ventress, considering they aren't Sith? Sure they used the dark side, but the Sith where Sidious and Dooku. Ventress was trained, but isn't a Sith. Grievous is a Kaleesh cyborg killer, a coward, and most importantly- he cannot use the force. No way would Sith respect him, or even take orders from him.

[Selenial]

Here's a question: Why would any of the Sith warriors even listen to Grievous or Ventress, considering they aren't Sith? Sure they used the dark side, but the Sith where Sidious and Dooku. Ventress was trained, but isn't a Sith. Grievous is a Kaleesh cyborg killer, a coward, and most importantly- he cannot use the force. No way would Sith respect him, or even take orders from him.

 

The Sith listened to Imperial Intelligence... Well, the lesser Sith did.

 

And besides, Ventress would be an incredibly powerful Sith in that Era, and a Sith. Only reason she wasnt a sith was the rule of 2.

 

And Grevious is powerful, even without the force. They'd respect that.

[Canino]

The Sith listened to Imperial Intelligence... Well, the lesser Sith did.

 

And besides, Ventress would be an incredibly powerful Sith in that Era, and a Sith. Only reason she wasnt a sith was the rule of 2.

 

And Grevious is powerful, even without the force. They'd respect that.

 

No they wouldn't. Sith of the resurgent Empire demanded respect from anyone who wasn't a Sith. It doesn't matter if they can use the force, or have killed Jedi. If you aren't Sith, you aren't Sith. That's it.

 

They also are noted for going renegade, and doing whatever it takes to do their own agendas. If that means killing a non-Sith, they will do it.

[Selenial]

No they wouldn't. Sith of the resurgent Empire demanded respect from anyone who wasn't a Sith. It doesn't matter if they can use the force, or have killed Jedi. If you aren't Sith, you aren't Sith. That's it.

 

They also are noted for going renegade, and doing whatever it takes to do their own agendas. If that means killing a non-Sith, they will do it.

 

Not the ones following Malgus, and those are the one's he'd have.

 

And they followed Imperial Intelligence perfectly fine when Jadus told them to.

Malgus tells them to follow Grevious, they do it.

[Beniboybling]

Then why didn't he?

G0-T0 has the ability to control droids, though it would seem he has to be within a short distance of them for this to work.

[Beniboybling]

Here's a question: Why would any of the Sith warriors even listen to Grievous or Ventress, considering they aren't Sith? Sure they used the dark side, but the Sith where Sidious and Dooku. Ventress was trained, but isn't a Sith. Grievous is a Kaleesh cyborg killer, a coward, and most importantly- he cannot use the force. No way would Sith respect him, or even take orders from him.

To quote myself:

 

Grievous is more known as a naval commander than a ground commander. The majority of battles he participates in are in space, and rarely does he touch down to lead a ground invasion. These are where his strengths lie and so he will likely be leading the Sith Navy operated by naval forces of Revan's Sith Empire. Who through their loyalty to Malgus will respect Grievous' command. Nor will he have to deal with potential insubordination that could occur on the ground. On the other hand Malgus will likely be leading the ground forces, of which his is primarily known for. And while his Sith Forces may possess some grudges and grievances concerning his betrayal, they will still respect his power and tactical ability, and be as dedicated to achieving victory as he. Disobedience would be a pointless gesture. And the Massassi warriors will obey any Sith Lord without question. Essentially both commanders will be in their element, and have the full respect of their subordinates.

 

Though concerning Ventress, whose to say Malgus won't make her a Sith Lord? Malgus would certainly recognise her skill and power, and see her as a cut above the Sith Warriors.

 

I believe her non-canon Sith title is Vindicaa. So behold Lord Vindicaa!

Edited August 31, 2013 by Beniboybling

[Selenial]

See post #90 - Compatibility.

 

Though concerning Ventress, whose to say Malgus won't make her a Sith Lord? Malgus would certainly recognise her skill and power, and see her as a cut above the Sith Warriors.

 

I believe her non-canon Sith title is Vindicaa. So behold Lord Vindicaa!

 

Yah, t'was Vindicaa.

[Aurbere]

That's probably useful information to put on Wookieepedia... and he would have got control of almost every droid in the Galaxy if he did.

 

Hmm...

[marcelo_sdk]

Sorry guys, just had the time to enter now. I'll read the point made until now and then I post my considerations.

[Beniboybling]

I was looking through some old Kaggaths earlier and I realized that MasterMe has disappeared. Along with a few others of the original Kaggath debaters. Sad.

He's been gone a long time. A moment of silence for our fallen brother.

[Beniboybling]

Sorry guys, just had the time to enter now. I'll read the point made until now and then I post my considerations.

No problem. I've been debating your corner as best I can, I look forward to your arguments.

 

As a general note I like the way this discussion is going. Lets keep it broad and leave scenarios for the tail end.

[Selenial]

He's been gone a long time. A moment of silence for our fallen brother.

 

It sounds like you think he's dead

 

Lol

[Aurbere]

He's been gone a long time. A moment of silence for our fallen brother.

 

...

 

There there.

 

That's all I got.

[Selenial]

...

 

There there.

 

That's all I got.

 

*Pats Beni gently on the head* It's ok 'lil fella.

 

*Whispers to Aurbere* I think we should take turns watching him, he's going to be in a bit of a Down place for a while...

[Aurbere]

*Pats Beni gently on the head* It's ok 'lil fella.

 

*Whispers to Aurbere* I think we should take turns watching him, he's going to be in a bit of a Down place for a while...

 

*Whispers back* I agree.

[Selenial]

*Whispers back* I agree.

 

Psst... I think he's trying to listen, let's keep quiet!

[marcelo_sdk]

Well, lots of things were said, I read until page 5 and already have a lot of points to make. Since you guys waited so long for my appearance, I'll not read everything and will start the debate.

 

First, this:

 

Firstly: No. This wasn't my G0-T0 one shot card.. But this just struck me.

 

Why would G0-T0 even want to go to war? His goal was to save the Republic, until he realised it impossible. He decided it was much more efficient to save the Galaxy, as any ruling body would effectively be the Republic...

 

The one reason he went against the Republic was because he didn't think their Laws were enough to ensure stability. Why the hell would he go against Malgus? He wouldn't want to ruin the Galactic Economy by going full out war, and Malgus is easily a leader who would be willing to do anything to have a stable order. That was showin the The False Emperor.

 

I guess what I'm saying is, G0-T0 would rather die than face Malgus.... Is Suicide an option?

 

If not, then Warren's already at a disadvantage, as G0-T0 would want to limit destruction and go for Malgus and Malgus alone.

 

I don't think GO-TO would give up fighting, but his tactics would already put him in a great disadvantage position, don't have to say why. His best tactic, as you said, would be a direct assault on Malgus. Well, killing Malgus on Drommund Kaas? Just to land he would need to move a sizeable force, and to get to and kill Malgus, he would need a powerful army, and I'm not exagerating. That would be enough to open a gap in DS defenses, if not to assault the capital world, to blow it's factories.

 

Really, I think this battle will be a Force vs Droids encounter. Now since the droids are being reproduced, and the sith aren't, except the UB can do something bold and unexpected, like attacking all the members of the DS leadership straight away, or capturing the factory, they'll be ridiculously outnumbered within a month. But, I'm not fully aware of the Sith "Warriors" abilities. If this situation is similar to the Clone Wars, a few good swift strikes to the DS, and they could win. Right now, I don't understand the numbers of the UB army. I believe I'll be able to make a reasonable arguament after that.

 

The droids are not reproducing in such speed, and my forces are not limited to Massassi and Sith Warriors. The Commerce Guild gives me a vast array of ground forces, organic and synthetics. And in the sky, add to Revan's Sith Navy, which is a considerable fleet, the ships produced by the aforementioned supplier. Add Lianna, and my fleet will "reproduce" a lot faster than DS with Mon Calamari.

 

That's part 1, already have somethings ready to be thrown at table.

[Aurbere]

Add Lianna, and my fleet will "reproduce" a lot faster than DS with Mon Calamari.

 

Come now, let's not get carried away.

[marcelo_sdk]

Why the Droid Supremacy will Cut you Up

 

 

 

 

The Offense

 

Terror units

 

Terror Troopers: The front line soldiers of the Droid Supremacy, the Terror Troopers have stealth, dura-steel shredding claws, and extremely advanced reflexes and agility. Stun guns too.

 

Terror Droids: Small and quick, these tiny droids like drilling into anything they can damage. They tend to swarm in order to overwhelm their opponents.

 

Terror Biodroid: Wielding huge claws and heavy armor, the most notable thing about these large droids is that they can replicate the Force powers of Force Lightning and Force Push.

 

Terror Walker: This massive droid can release Terror Droids and could only be destroyed, even by Starkiller, by pushing it into a reactor core. Its lasers, missiles, and claws make it deadly.

 

 

The Defense

 

Trade Federation Army

 

If you assumed that this army is made up of B1s, you are wrong. Instead, the Droid Supremacy has reverted to making the original foot soldiers: the OMM-Series, which is much more intelligent and independent.

 

However, that is not to say that the full extent of this army’s special forces are not used. See the link for a full list, which includes B2s, Droidekas, B3s, Scorpenek annihilator droids, and plenty of vehicles. This force is perfect for defense of multiple worlds. One army contains 218,400 droids.

 

 

The Fleet

 

Black Sun Navy

 

Possessing three types of capital ships, the Interceptor-class frigate, MC80 Liberty type Star Cruiser, and Venator-class Star Destroyer, this navy is known for its unorthodox modification and particularly its vast assortment of fighters, which can be deployed in the hundreds by ships such as the Venator-class.

 

Containing hundreds of ships, it specializes in pirating attacks, hit and runs, and communication across large areas of the galaxy. Piloted by Terror Troopers, the most advanced troopers to ever come out of the Galactic Empire, and pilot droids, it’s a force to be reckoned with.

 

Note: Xizor’s personal fleet alone had over 280 ships. A small fraction of the vast Black Sun navy that spanned the galaxy and was present above hundreds of worlds.

 

 

Planets

 

Bothawui

Bothawui is the heart of a vast intel network that can easily warn of approaching fleets and attacks. Defended by a planetary shield, it is unable to be bombarded. Possessing mineral deposits that G0-T0 will certainly exploit, it also gives revenue and supplies to the Supremacy.

 

Nar Shaddaa

With about 80 billion people ready to be exploited, Nar Shaddaa is the perfect economic center. Used by criminal organizations for thousands of years, it is a perfect place to get weapons, supplies, and anything else an underworld droid empire could want. It also possesses shipyards and a planetary shield.

 

Kamino

Kamino is not present on any star charts, making it a perfect military stronghold. In addition, the raging storms make aerial assaults precarious. Home to the Terror Troopers, any assault on the cities will be met with invisible, and lethal, force. Cloning vats breed Terror Troopers.

 

Geonosis

Because everything is underground, Geonosis looks innocent from space. However, any opposing force will be surprised at what comes pouring out if they attack. With hundreds of droid foundries, Geonosis can pump out all the Terror Droids and OOM-series droids the Supremacy could need.

 

Mon Calamari

Perfect for manufacturing ships for the Black Sun Fleet, Mon Calamari specializes in MC80 Liberty type Star Cruisers, and can undoubtedly replicate any other type of vessels it requires in its shipyards second only to few.

 

 

Supplier

 

The Exchange

 

The Exchange specializes in weapons trafficking, smuggling, and slave trading. This provides the firepower, manual labor, and credits the Droid Supremacy needs to function. It is a powerful economic force that is no stranger to extortion and will do whatever it takes to get the supplies the empire needs. Stealth technology included.

 

Support forces the Exchange can/should be able to provide are: bounty hunters. Thugs. Assassin droids. Gand. Ubese. Duros. Stealthed ships. Smuggler ships. Slaves. Pilots. Gamorreans. Etc.

 

 

Leaders

 

G0-T0

As seen at the end of his travels with the Exile

 

Special Abilities:

 

Human Mask

I know this has been outlawed in the past and likely will be again. But, if G0-T0 is acting as head of state, it would be entirely probable that he would use a human hologram as a way to protect himself. Thus, while his enemies hunt down a human, G0-T0’s droid body goes undetected.

 

Decoys

The Sentry Droid Mark 1 is identical to G0-T0. Even if his opponents discover that G0-T0 is a droid, he will undoubtedly mass produce the sentry droids to act as decoys, potentially placing one on each ship, flooding the streets of Nar Shaddaa with them, etc. The possibilities are endless as he has these exact replica clones to count on. Finding the real G0-T0 will be almost impossible.

 

Stealth

G0-T0’s frame is equipped with a stealth generator. Even if his opponents can track down the real droid G0-T0’s location, finding and destroying him will be exceedingly difficult if he is hidden with stealth.

 

Economics

G0-T0 is known for his ability to finance just about anything. His superbrain allows him to quickly manipulate the economy to generate funds which will them fuel his empire.

 

Superbrain Leadership

G0-T0 has led not only a galaxy-wide and feared criminal gang, but also controlled his droid army. With his ability to calculate pretty much every single outcome, he is the perfect leader for an army of droids and will ensure that all variables are taken into account. He also “often suspects his opponents of cheating” meaning that he will expect trickery and espionage.

 

 

Guri

As seen during her time with the Black Sun

 

Special Abilities:

 

Infiltration

Assuming that the opposing team believes that the Droid Supremacy is completely made of droids, Guri’s human-like appearance will allow her to pass as a member of almost any other empire. All she needs is a new uniform.

 

Loyalty

Guri is fiercely loyal to her master, who is now considered to be G0-T0. She will defend him and the Supremacy at all costs and the thought of defection will never cross her computerized mind.

 

Cold Heartedness

Guri will do whatever she needs to accomplish an objective. She has no qualms about killing anyone and everyone as long as the job gets done. She does not hesitate or consider compromise or defeat.

 

Assassination

Guri is an assassin droid for a reason. Super fast, strong, and able to take a beating, Guri is able to battle through most situations and come out unharmed. Skilled with her fists and blasters, she’s a quick and powerful fighter.

 

Advisor

Guri was Xizor’s advisor and actually ran many of the day to day operations of the Black Sun. This advice and ability to run an empire furthers the economic stability of the Droid Supremacy. With two superbrains as the leaders of this empire, the odds are in their favor.

 

 

PROXY

As seen after Starkiller's Death

 

Special Abilities:

 

Loyalty

PROXY is a droid by nature, and fiercely loyal to whoever he calls master. As leader of the Supremacy, G0-T0 is now the being that PROXY will serve at all costs, and even give his life for.

 

Holograms

PROXY can replicate the appearance of any humanoid life form, making him perfect for infiltration, impersonation, and assassination. He could easily kill an enemy officer and then take their place, biding his time until he can strike from within.

 

Combat Modules

PROXY can utilize the fighting styles of at least nine force users and three non-force users. This makes him an extremely deadly opponent, as he can transform into the likes of Obi-wan, Darth Maul, or even Anakin Skywalker and replicate their fighting styles perfectly.

 

Force Powers

PROXY is skilled in the use of telekinesis using equipment attached to his body such as repulsors and tractor beams. He is able to push, pull, and even throw a lightsaber.

 

Duplication

PROXY was the most advanced and deadly being in a line of PROXY Droids. However, PROXY could be duplicated by creating these lesser droids that would still possess his shape shifting ability. These droids would be perfect for infiltration or simply to cause panic during a battle when the enemy thinks it’s firing on its own troops.

 

 

HK-01

As seen at the start of the Great Droid Revolution

 

Special Abilities:

 

Droid Rebellion

HK-01 has created a Great Droid Revolution before. His efforts caused droids across the galaxy to rebel, turning battle droids, protocol droids, astromechs, and every droid in between against their masters. Entire worlds were taken over in this droid uprising. With the aid of the Droid Supremacy, HK-01 will have no trouble making all of the opposing team’s droids turn against their biological masters.

 

Self Defense

He is a hunter-killer droid. He’s got a few tricks up his sleeve, including assassin programming.

 

Strategies

 

Objective-based

G0-T0 and his droid allies are ruthless. They will not let anything, including morals, get in the way of victory. The Droid Supremacy is well equipped to go for a “cutting off the head” strategy. With stealth tech, smuggling vessels, stealthed infantry, two assassins, an intelligence network, and defecting droid allies, the Droid Supremacy can easily set up a strike team scenario, if not an assassination.

 

War

The Droid Supremacy is more than capable of waging war. With plenty of credits, resources, and some of the best production facilities the galaxy has ever seen, it can easily supply itself with whatever reinforcements it may need. Having defensible locations and an entire droid army committed to defense, the Droid Supremacy can withstand attacks on its worlds.

 

Evasive Maneuvers

The Droid Supremacy is more than capable of winning a Kaggath, even if it is hopelessly outmatched. With G0-T0’s stealth and decoys (that could be placed all over the galaxy), hunting him down becomes nearly impossible. Meanwhile, the forces G0-T0 needs, his assassins and a few stealth units, will track down and kill the enemy’s leader.

 

 

Tl;dr

 

The Droid Supremacy will cut you up because:

 

Its head of state is practically impossible to find. Its offensive force includes stealthed troops and force-using droids. Its defensive force is well coordinated and adaptive. Its fleet is powerful in both firepower and number. Between Kamino, Geonosis, and Mon Calamari, production of forces is incredible. The economy cannot fail under the guidance of two supercomputers. Its supplier is able to provide anything it needs, from weapons to manual labor to metals and underworld goods. It has two elite assassins who are able to infiltrate virtually anywhere. None of the leaders would even consider defecting. And HK-01 will ensure that every single droid in your empire defects to the Droid Supremacy.

 

I will make faction-specific arguments ASAP. This is just a summary of what my forces can do. Opponents, read up!

 

This was totally supposed to be on the first page.... oops.

 

Why you are totally wrong

 

The Offense

 

Now, you assume that my forces are limited to Massassi and Sith Warriors - which are, by themselves, a considerable force - which is not the case. Just a quick remind on what my supplier can provide me with:

 

Gossam Commandos: They were males of the Gossam species and wore heavy armor. Their primary weapon was a heavy repeating blaster rifle. For secondary armarment, they used a heavy shoulder-mounted cannon that took two Gossams to work—one to fire and one to reload.

 

A-DSD Advanced dwarf spider droid: The A-DSD advanced dwarf spider droid was a more heavily armed and armored version of the DSD1 dwarf spider droid and the heavy dwarf spider droid, capable of operating in complete darkness. It was built for tough combat on uneven terrain, and was therefore equipped with multiple weapons systems. These included dual target-seeking missiles which could fire once the targeting systems had a lock-on. The A-DSD had plated front legs, the plates being large enough to protect it from any forward attack. On top of the droid's frame was a powerful cannon that shot high-energy bolts with explosive power and tremendous range of destruction.

 

DSD1 dwarf spider droid: Its main weapon was a long central blaster cannon mounted on its dome that was both capable of firing rapid-fire anti-personal rounds, or slower-rate high-intensity blasts that could destroy light vehicles. The adjustable legs made it capable of getting better elevation for the blaster cannon. It's legs were designed to be able to walk straight up and down walls and narrow cliffsides.

 

Heavy homing spider droid: The Heavy homing spider droid was a successor to the OG-9 Homing spider droid. nlike the OG-9, it featured twin heavy gatling-style laser cannons, which could cripple artillery and other vehicles. A single, anti-infantry laser sat atop it, as to protect itself from the enemy's smaller units of war.

 

OG-9 homing spider droid: it was effective against both ground-based and airborne targets and was designed to transport a large and devastating weapon throughout the battlefield. The homing spider could cover wide areas of the battlefield with its four all-terrain legs. Because of its great height and extendable hydraulics, the walker could position its homing laser above its fellow droids at enemy targets or move to higher ground to blast at air vehicles. The homing spider could walk along the bottom of seabeds, fully submerged in water, as well as scale steep cliffs. The spider walker's chief weapon was a laser emplacement mounted atop the droid's round body. This circular dish fired a precision homing laser that could be maintained until the drone's internal power supply was finished. This sustained firepower allowed the homing spider to weaken shields, destroy armored vehicles and scythe down troop formations. An antipersonnel cannon below the walker's round body could be used for close-quarters combat, while a retractable ion cannon could be added to disable starships or other powerful vehicles. There were also weapon mounts that allowed other armaments to be fixed to the droid. Sensor equipment fitted into the homing spider, enabled it to target and keep track of moving enemy targets.

 

The Defense

 

Well, my point was fairly made on this subject. As you say your army is not just made of B1s, mine is clearly not made only of Sith and Massassi.

 

The Fleet

 

Revan's Sith Navy surpassed vastly in numbers the Black Sun navy. After finding the Star Forge, the ships were greatly improved. I know I'll not be able to use the Star Forge, but the ships it already made are mine. Suffice to say, this part of my ofrces are enough to crush the Black Sun. If it isn't, add the ships that my supplier will give me. Add Lianna shipyards, and my reposition will be considerably faster than DS. Just a reminder of the ships I command:

 

Interdictor-class cruisers

Centurion-class battlecruisers

Derriphan-class battleships

Recusant-class light destroyer

 

Not to say the fighters, bombers and cruisers, you can check that on the links.

 

I'll not elongate more and counteract all the points as the post would be extremely long. In a future post I'll add some other points.

 

Flaws I'm seeing with the UB:

 

No Sustainability

 

Looking at the DS and UB planets, it's pretty obvious who has the better production. But look further and the UB, in fact, has no productivity whatsoever. Lianna has next to no shipyards. They're small and hardly noteworthy. None of the planets have valuable resources. The supplier can provide credits, but there's nothing to spend them on. The troops are all biological with no way to replenish them. The UB cannot make anything other than ships, and even then production on Lianna isn't exactly stellar. It makes fighters, not much else.

 

The Fleet

 

Revan's Sith Navy used ships with no shields and turbolasers that couldn't aim. Not even joking, check out the

Derriphan-class battleship. Obviously they have better ships as well, like the Interdictor-class cruisers. But the greatest disadvantage about this fleet is that is has less-than-amazing fighters. These guys. No shields. Two laser cannons. Weak hull. And those are the only fighter it has. In comparison, the Black Sun Navy of the DS has Starviper attack platforms and fighters that rival X-wings and Y-wings (see Supa Fighter).

 

Compatibility

 

I'm not sure how well Grievous will do in his leadership position. Or how well Malgus will do. Firstly, on Grievous, the guy is used to commanding droids. Not living things. So he's not going to consider the loss of troops as a big deal. He's also pretty much useless in commanding the Sith, who will see him as laughable. These Sith come from a time of extreme Imperial patriotism, and that includes Sith dominance and alien oppression. Which leads me to Malgus. You know, the guy who -betrayed the Sith he's now commanding?- Even if that's somehow forgiven, he's still a radical Sith, and the Sith Warriors aren't about to do his bidding without question.

 

I'll try not to post much more until Marcelo can get on. Sorry!

 

Don't know from where you take that Lianna has almost no shipyards. It was one of the most important of the galaxy, the HQ of Santhe/Sienaar. Also, saying ot produced only fighters is bad information, or omission of it. Also, you assume that all your planet's resources will be at your disposal, which is clearly not the case. Besides of cloning facilities, what do you expect getting from Kamino? And from Bothawui? Your planets maybe a lot better, if all it's resources could be used by you, which is not the case. By the other hand, my planets gives me all the advantages you can think of: difficult terrain, far from main hyperspace routes, except Lianna, all, again except Lianna, will favor Dark Side users. Your planets, except Bothawui, offers little advantage for you to defend. And to finish, the Commerce Guild had factories on Korriban as it had low-taxes, so not just I get my droid factories, I make them for a reduced price.

 

First of all, no technology is not being taken into account. Second, my ships outnumbers vastly yours, and you are soundly excluding the ships my supplier will provide me with, which includes Recusant-class light destroyers, outmatching any of your starships.

 

Your forget that Grievous was a Khaleesh warlord. That's enough to show how good staregist he was. He used the droids in that way cause it was the best tactic. He was important enought that Sidious himself traded Anakin for him. That shows how vital he was for the CIS. Add the fact that he know your forces better than anyone from your leadership, he can very much be the reason you will lose. And remember, Malgus went to an opposite way from the Empire, aliens were very welcome, specially if it was a tactical genius and a master swordsman. Also, don't play that card, it's ridiculous. A lot of Sith followed Malgus, including Darths, so it wasn't like all the Sith Empire was against Malgus. If he defeated the assault team and survived, do you think the Sith would follow him or a broken Empire?

[Selenial]

Just to note, Lianna did pretty much just produce fighters.

 

Santhe/Sienar in itself was mainly the Fighter side of the Imperial Navy, and Raxus Prime was it's Capital Ship yard.

[StarSquirrel]

Just to note, Lianna did pretty much just produce fighters.

 

Santhe/Sienar in itself was mainly the Fighter side of the Imperial Navy, and Raxus Prime was it's Capital Ship yard.

 

Wasn't Kuat the Capital Shipyard of the Imperial Fleet?

 

That said, Marcelo, all your droids are highly susceptible to HK-01 so I'd be very careful how much faith you'd put in those. Also, Lianna was mostly starfighters (possibly frigates) but would likely not be able to build many large warships and certainly not nearly at the scale of Mon Cal.

 

As for your fleet, you outgun, not outnumber Warren (appreciate the difference). Even so, the ability of DS hacking to destroy your ships/ship crews via utility droids and the Commerce guild droids each ship transports from within is ever present and will certainly come into play.

 

Also, UB (G0-T0 in particular) aren't big on direct attacks. Don't expect that to happen unless G0-T0 has a very good reason.

 

Now to Beni- 4 days for 500+ rather large ships to travel the smaller hyperspace lanes through Hutt space? Doubtful, easily a 6-10 days at minimum, more if they coordinate with the Kamino fleet. And how in the hell wouldn't G0-T0 know about it ahead of time anyway? (heck they pass 2 of his planets on the way) Also, I'd like to see those strike teams (assuming imperial forces on hoth sized) land only to find their own heavy weapons turn on them while they're outnumber and outranged by the defenders while fighting on Geonosis. On Kamino the terror units will rip them a new one.

 

Also, in a few days it does take I see the plants on Geonosis producing 8-13 thousand droids easily all from scratch so Grievous would have to make an all out assault and couldn't split his forces nearly as much.

 

Regardless of how long it takes, I still say Mon Cal will the be prime fight location due to its proximity and importance. If UB can take total space dominance then it'll be up to G0-T0 and the Black Sun blockade runners to get the job done.

Edited September 1, 2013 by StarSquirrel

[Warren-Stride]

Marcelo, I'm only addressing a small part of your post because most of the other points are covered and rebutted further into the thread than you have currently read.

 

Don't know from where you take that Lianna has almost no shipyards. It was one of the most important of the galaxy, the HQ of Santhe/Sienaar. Also, saying ot produced only fighters is bad information, or omission of it. Also, you assume that all your planet's resources will be at your disposal, which is clearly not the case. Besides of cloning facilities, what do you expect getting from Kamino? And from Bothawui? Your planets maybe a lot better, if all it's resources could be used by you, which is not the case. By the other hand, my planets gives me all the advantages you can think of: difficult terrain, far from main hyperspace routes, except Lianna, all, again except Lianna, will favor Dark Side users. Your planets, except Bothawui, offers little advantage for you to defend. And to finish, the Commerce Guild had factories on Korriban as it had low-taxes, so not just I get my droid factories, I make them for a reduced price.

 

The Pentagon is the HQ of the U.S. military. But it's not making tanks. Similarly, Exxon's HQ isn't drilling oil beneath it. Just because Lianna is an HQ of Santhe/Sienaar doesn't mean it actually has a ton of production. I challenge you to find evidence that Lianna produces anything other than fighters.

 

On planets, I feel like you misunderstand. My planets have metal. Your planets have no metal. Even if you could create more ships, where are your metals coming from? Geonosis and Bothawui have minerals. Nar Shaddaa's black market has metals. But where is the Commerce Guild going to buy or mine their needed materials?

 

My planets have little defense? I went over this in my opening argument. I would politely request you read the whole thing.

 

My space force has already been nerfed to make it only twice as large as yours. And that's quite a nerf.

 

And lastly, your supplier. The Commerce Guild is great. But tell me, where are they making these ships you say they can make? Korriban, your supply hub, the planet you supplier operates from, has no shipyards whatsoever. The Commerce Guild will not be able to produce any ships unless it's out of Lianna, which has quite a few prolems itself.

 

In contrast, Mon Calamari, Nar Shaddaa, and Bothawui all have shipyards. Which puts the DS at three (with one of the three best in the galaxy) and the UB at one.

Edited September 1, 2013 by Warren-Stride

[Warren-Stride]

Objective-based

G0-T0 and his droid allies are ruthless. They will not let anything, including morals, get in the way of victory. The Droid Supremacy is well equipped to go for a “cutting off the head” strategy. With stealth tech, smuggling vessels, stealthed infantry, two assassins, an intelligence network, and defecting droid allies, the Droid Supremacy can easily set up a strike team scenario, if not an assassination.

 

War

The Droid Supremacy is more than capable of waging war. With plenty of credits, resources, and some of the best production facilities the galaxy has ever seen, it can easily supply itself with whatever reinforcements it may need. Having defensible locations and an entire droid army committed to defense, the Droid Supremacy can withstand attacks on its worlds.

 

Evasive Maneuvers

The Droid Supremacy is more than capable of winning a Kaggath, even if it is hopelessly outmatched. With G0-T0’s stealth and decoys (that could be placed all over the galaxy), hunting him down becomes nearly impossible. Meanwhile, the forces G0-T0 needs, his assassins and a few stealth units, will track down and kill the enemy’s leader.

 

I'd like to point out that we've only been debating one strategy the DS could use, War. But even if the DS lost the war (IF, BIG if), Evasive Maneuvers would kick in. And this whole time, Objective-based is in the works.

Edited September 1, 2013 by Warren-Stride