Guardian DPS: Power or Crit. Also: Focus Vs. Vig

[CapuchinSeven]

if we didn't have some very skilled healers our entire team would've been obliterated by that one Guardian.

 

Yes but to anyone that's looking out for a Focus bomber in a pre made vs pre made battle they stick out like a sore thumb and become very easy to target mark with the green saber and then control.

 

It's not that they are not useful, because they are, but that guy only did that sort of damage because your team let him do it. It's not hard to see they are building their buff for a bomb and then, Hilt, Stasis, Push, Awe them to the point where you can pretty much make them rage at you.

 

Again, I'm not saying the tree is bad or that it's not a good PVP tree, I'm just saying that they only do that damage because a team let them do it, all their damage is focused on those bombs that they have to build up to.

 

While I've seen many amazing Vigilance Guardians, I have never seen anyone able to pull this, or something similiar, off. Where Vigilance is amazing, Focus is divine. (In PvP atleast).

 

From a simple numbers point of view, Focus should always have a higher damage output in the same way Troopers make better score board numbers, they deal large amounts AOE. Vigilance also has a few tricks that make it very useful, like Unremitting.

Edited April 4, 2012 by CapuchinSeven

[Mormoz]

Yes but to anyone that's looking out for a Focus bomber in a pre made vs pre made battle they stick out like a sore thumb and become very easy to target mark with the green saber and then control.

 

It's not that they are not useful, because they are, but that guy only did that sort of damage because your team let him do it. It's not hard to see they are building their buff for a bomb and then, Hilt, Stasis, Push, Awe them to the point where you can pretty much make them rage at you.

 

Again, I'm not saying the tree is bad or that it's not a good PVP tree, I'm just saying that they only do that damage because a team let them do it, all their damage is focused on those bombs that they have to build up to.

 

From a simple numbers point of view, Focus should always have a higher damage output in the same way Troopers make better score board numbers, they deal large amounts AOE. Vigilance also has a few tricks that make it very useful, like Unremitting.

 

Like I said, our entire team was focusing him, but it's never always that easy to take him down so fast. He had healers and tanks backing him up, and quite frankly, not everyone is so smart to actually attack the target with a big mark on his head.

I perfectly get that you can stop and prevent his Sweep Bombing, but that is never as easy in every situation. And once he starts, well, then everyone's getting huge chunks blasted out of their hp.

And that's the exact point, they represent a huge (potential) danger and if they get a chance, it's over. Vigilance specs of course represent threats as well, but no more really than any other class/spec.

 

Vigilance is of course way better for 1v1 fights, but once you're fighting with a group vs a group, especially (for example) when defending a node in Alderaan, and everyone is just clinging together like I don't know what, Focus has incredible potential, to a level that Vigilance can't reach. Alone however, like you said, it can be easily prevented and Focus specs aren't that hard at all.

Edited April 5, 2012 by Mormoz

[CapuchinSeven]

Like I said, our entire team was focusing him, but it's never always that easy to take him down so fast.

 

That's the mistake you're making though (although you're right, it's a nightmare getting PUGs to beat on the marked healer, let alone the Focus Bomber), you don't need to kill them. Watch for them trying to build Singularity (Stasis/Choke is easier to see of course) then Force Push, they try again, Stasis him yourself, even Awe will work.

 

You just need to do anything you can you tie them up, killing them is great but that's not your main worry, just stopping their bombing is your primary concern.

 

Yes it's a pain to have to have a single player on your team dealing with a single player on their team but sometimes that's just the way premades vs premades work.

 

I'm not for one second saying it's as simple as ABC to do, or that Focus Bombs are not very very effective but if your team was hit by them over and over again it's because your team let him do it. When there used to be lots of Focus builds on our server the second we saw a bomb go off, *plop* green saber over his head and I'd spend the rest of the game following him around totally neutralising his bombs (or at the very least pissing him off so much that he'd be focused on me and not hitting whole groups).

 

This is the nature of premades and PUGs though, in the same that healers can totally turn a battle simply because a PUG doesn't bother attacking them.

 

*disclaimer* I am not saying focus builds are not effective, useful or that they don't have a place in premades. I AM saying that they are not THE PVP build.

[fuzzDONTEVENTRIP]

That's the mistake you're making though (although you're right, it's a nightmare getting PUGs to beat on the marked healer, let alone the Focus Bomber), you don't need to kill them. Watch for them trying to build Singularity (Stasis/Choke is easier to see of course) then Force Push, they try again, Stasis him yourself, even Awe will work.

 

You just need to do anything you can you tie them up, killing them is great but that's not your main worry, just stopping their bombing is your primary concern.

 

Yes it's a pain to have to have a single player on your team dealing with a single player on their team but sometimes that's just the way premades vs premades work.

 

I'm not for one second saying it's as simple as ABC to do, or that Focus Bombs are not very very effective but if your team was hit by them over and over again it's because your team let him do it. When there used to be lots of Focus builds on our server the second we saw a bomb go off, *plop* green saber over his head and I'd spend the rest of the game following him around totally neutralising his bombs (or at the very least pissing him off so much that he'd be focused on me and not hitting whole groups).

 

This is the nature of premades and PUGs though, in the same that healers can totally turn a battle simply because a PUG doesn't bother attacking them.

 

*disclaimer* I am not saying focus builds are not effective, useful or that they don't have a place in premades. I AM saying that they are not THE PVP build.

 

I agree. I am a focus guardian and there are many ways to counter our force sweep. We are also squishy and w.o a healer (which 9/10 pugs wont have or the healers will be healing teammates), we go down fast when focused.

 

 

After awhile dps guardians will get used to counters and be about to counter the counters, but it doesnt mean that it isnt annoying. The added time to the singularity stacks + the addition of Resolute granting and instant 4 stacks of singularity will be a nice addition. Still dont know if id trade those for my CD's that are currently going to be nerfed.

 

-fuzz