PVP healing needs to be nerfed to pre 2.0

[Jadescythe]

This passive aggressive, L2P, "you a bad", that sort of behavior brings no value to the thread. It's a defensive mechanism that some people employ when they wish to terminate a debate instead of resolving it.

 

You say the only advantage premades have is maybe a slight boost in party composition. Well that's a huge boost. Every premade party will want to have a good healer at its core because they know that's going to help team the most, and them personally. Sometimes there's no healer on the other side. Same thing with tanks that use guard. Maybe other side has a healer, but no tank. Only premade has tank. So, the PUG side's healer is much less effective at healing because it's much squishier.

 

Try to bring a bit of thought and reflection to the issue instead of just threadbombing ad hominems.

 

Wait, is this a healer thread or a premade thread in disguise? Either way, Merc/Mando and Sorc/Sage healers are fine. Op/Scoundrel healers are a little over the top at the moment. Are any of them unkillable or do they require massive amounts of coordination to kill? No.

 

Saying learn to play in a nice, helpful way is just fine. Saying that the argument that you clearly do not know how to play is invalid holds no water when EVERYONE is saying it. I apologize if it hurts, but face the realization that you may be doing something wrong. There may be mechanics that you can take advantage of. But literally any DPS class/spec can kill a Sorc/Sage healer.

 

Make sure you interrupt the RIGHT heals. Save your CC for when they can't be interrupted and for when they are about to die. Have your burst ready for the last CC so they have no health left when your CC ends. Get the tank away from the healer via knockbacks and CC when others are attacking the healer. It doesn't take coordination if you know what needs to happen. If someone is on the tank, then get the healer away and keep them busy so the tank dies. Doing the opposite of what someone else is doing will be all the coordination you need.

[General_Aldo]

This passive aggressive, L2P, "you a bad", that sort of behavior brings no value to the thread. It's a defensive mechanism that some people employ when they wish to terminate a debate instead of resolving it.

 

You say the only advantage premades have is maybe a slight boost in party composition. Well that's a huge boost. Every premade party will want to have a good healer at its core because they know that's going to help team the most, and them personally. Sometimes there's no healer on the other side. Same thing with tanks that use guard. Maybe other side has a healer, but no tank. Only premade has tank. So, the PUG side's healer is much less effective at healing because it's much squishier.

 

Try to bring a bit of thought and reflection to the issue instead of just threadbombing ad hominems.

 

You are assuming that the premade and pug were at equal skill to begin with. Which we all know that people who premade have more INDIVIDUAL SKILL than people who pug.

 

With this logic, we can conclude that the premade will win with or without team composition or voice communication since they have higher INDIVIDUAL SKILL; which is the largest contributing factor toward winning regular warzones.

 

Stop making excuses and get better

[anwg]

And that is precisely why team queuers need to be in a separate queue from solo queuers.

 

Or learn to coordinate with your teammates.

[AngusFTW]

What idiot necroed this

[PloGreen]

And that is precisely why team queuers need to be in a separate queue from solo queuers.

 

You just mark the healer and tell people to go for healer. Then interupt cc if possible, knock back etc. try and separate guard from healer. No VoIP or premade is needed to kill one healer with a guard. Just a bit of communication in game.

Edited December 11, 2013 by PloGreen

[AngusFTW]

Hell, in reg queues most tank and healer combos aren't that great... if they stand too close together any class with aoe can really make there life a misery. i've done it plenty of times as merc, sorc, smasher.. anything with aoe if the tank and healer are too close will do a fair bit of dmg and if the rest of the team helps support its pretty much GGGGG . Good combos know about better positioning etc but in regs they aren't all that common tbh.

So funny when you get a combo that isnt so great and they eat my mercs fusion missile + DFA.. the tanks health just DROPS usually..

Edited December 11, 2013 by AngusFTW

[Arkerus]

Healing needs a significant scale back. Throughput is entirely too high. One healer is fine. Once you have multiple healers circle healing each other there is nothing that can be done.

 

This has nothing to do with DPS being stupid or not using interrupts. Anyone who has played any kind of PvP in this game can see that once 2 or 3 healers back each other up, the point is simply not winnable.

[Arkerus]

lol

 

I hope you realise that the majority of "pre-mades" aren't actually using voice-chat at all. Their only advantage over your PUG is perhaps a slightly better team composition. But since they can only queue in groups of 4, it doesn't really make much difference. Most PvP groups are just players who like PvPing together, or grouped up so they could fill their team with better players. Very few are actually PvP guilds using voice-chat.

 

Focus-firing a healer does not require voice-chat. Interrupts do not require voice-chat. Well-timed CCs do not require voice-chat.

 

If you can't kill a Sage/Sorc healer you're just bad. It's as simple as that. They are so squishy, that even my poorly geared Scoundrel in healing gear could tear them apart when specced into Scrapper. You're playing a Deception Sin. You are MADE to kill squishy healers. This is a L2P issue.

 

Nothing to see here. Just another "healers are rocket scientists, DPS are morons".

[Sangrar]

this thread talks about nerfing all heals, but what about commando heals! I mean really, you going to nerf us more!! after 2.0 people yelled about scoundrels and a little about sages, as for commandos people still look at us as if we are a joke! If healing gets nerfed do not nerf commandos anymore, as it is we are now only competitive healers when we are fighting in 8v8, as for arena, well, when I go in as a healer commando they literally said "f*** we wanted a scoundrel" and was, after we lost because I couldn't compete with the operatives heals, they said "commandos suck Spaceboomer, don't f***ing que again you stupid f****er commando heals suck you dumb*** don't que for ranked", I reported that moron as well as some other who made similar statements, and well, now I don't play ranked. Point is, if you nerf heals, exempt commandos from it, we have had a tough time thanks to nerfs brought on because back then people thought we were unbalanced, even though that "imbalance" was not nearly as bad as now, and was definitely not enough to necessitate nerfs and buffs that extreme, which threw balance off a lot.

[mandrillagon]

this thread talks about nerfing all heals, but what about commando heals! I mean really, you going to nerf us more!! after 2.0 people yelled about scoundrels and a little about sages, as for commandos people still look at us as if we are a joke! If healing gets nerfed do not nerf commandos anymore, as it is we are now only competitive healers when we are fighting in 8v8, as for arena, well, when I go in as a healer commando they literally said "f*** we wanted a scoundrel" and was, after we lost because I couldn't compete with the operatives heals, they said "commandos suck Spaceboomer, don't f***ing que again you stupid f****er commando heals suck you dumb*** don't que for ranked", I reported that moron as well as some other who made similar statements, and well, now I don't play ranked. Point is, if you nerf heals, exempt commandos from it, we have had a tough time thanks to nerfs brought on because back then people thought we were unbalanced, even though that "imbalance" was not nearly as bad as now, and was definitely not enough to necessitate nerfs and buffs that extreme, which threw balance off a lot.

 

I really sympathize with your post a lot and its sad just regular nice people like you get the social abuse that you described from the "hardcore elitists" out there. It would be a very cruel blow against commando/merc spec healers to be nerfed in any way and the social condemnation they face in ranked matches (such as the abuse you suffered) pretty much proves the point.

[RaptorClown]

Healers trying to facetank my vigilance guardian usually die. They need either crosshealing or to be guarded by a tank to survive. Even if they manage to survive without outside help, they're forced to heal themselves and not their teammates.

 

@Aelaias vigilance guardians are doing fine in pvp. People love to see big yellow numbers on their monitors which is why you don't see much of them. The only thing they should add is a utility skill that no other classes have (a group buff for example). Other than that, they're fine.

 

aoe damage debuff is more than enough as utility skill

[NogueiraA]

You PVP whinners LOVE to mess PVE.

Nerf the HEALING, not the classes. Like, inside PVP areas healing is decreased by 50%. Do not touch the classes for a nerf.

[Sangrar]

I really sympathize with your post a lot and its sad just regular nice people like you get the social abuse that you described from the "hardcore elitists" out there. It would be a very cruel blow against commando/merc spec healers to be nerfed in any way and the social condemnation they face in ranked matches (such as the abuse you suffered) pretty much proves the point.

 

thanks, the saddest part is I am 16 and I am pretty sure those guys were twice my age and yelling that to a minor

[madtycoon]

If healing gets nerfed do not nerf commandos anymore, as it is we are now only competitive healers when we are fighting in 8v8, as for arena, well, when I go in as a healer commando they literally said "f*** we wanted a scoundrel" and was, after we lost because I couldn't compete with the operatives heals, they said "commandos suck Spaceboomer, don't f***ing que again you stupid f****er commando heals suck you dumb*** don't que for ranked", I reported that moron as well as some other who made similar statements, and well, now I don't play ranked.

 

LOL

 

Your 3 second pushed back casted heal that does a little over 4k wasn't keeping anyone alive? Shocking!

Edited December 12, 2013 by madtycoon

[BuzzingFridge]

Which we all know that people who premade have more INDIVIDUAL SKILL than people who pug.

 

With this logic, we can conclude that the premade will win with or without team composition or voice communication since they have higher INDIVIDUAL SKILL; which is the largest contributing factor toward winning regular warzones.

 

I agree with your basic point; individual skill wins Warzones, not voice-chat.

 

But it's wrong to suggest that premades always have a higher individual skill level. Many premade healers are actually terrible because they've always played with a great tank and have never learned how to position themselves, time their CCs and defensive CDs and use their cleanse on a regular basis. Their teammates cover for them al the time, so they never actually learn how to play their class properly. I've beaten loads of pre-mades from "PvP guilds" in normal PUGs where everyone was solo-queuing on my team. And I've grouped up with other players that were new to PvP and at a significantly lower skill level than me. Not all PvP groups are good. Some are average, and some are even bad.

[BuzzingFridge]

This passive aggressive, L2P, "you a bad", that sort of behavior brings no value to the thread. It's a defensive mechanism that some people employ when they wish to terminate a debate instead of resolving it.

 

You've refused to listen to any of our advice so far. Everyone who has posted in this thread has disagreed with your claim that Sage healers are OP. This isn't a "debate". You're not interested in accepting the truth. You just want someone to agree with you and tell you that your inability to kill the squishiest class in the game is nothing to do with your skill level.

 

Yes, it's the game's fault. SWTOR is not letting you kill a squishy Sage. You're the greatest player on your server. You know your class inside-out. It's not your fault you get teamed up with such god-awful players when you queue solo. Pre-mades are unfair and should be removed from the game.

 

Do you feel better now, or are you going to continue this qq thread necro?

[fungihoujo]

Just use your infinite CC and interrupts, and coordinate with more than 1 dps- healers are a cinch to kill, sounds like a l2p issue.

[fungihoujo]

This passive aggressive, L2P, "you a bad", that sort of behavior brings no value to the thread. .

 

Unless you're talking about healers who are having trouble with staying alive while being constantly root/stun/interrupt locked and focus fired by 10k/hit bursters in mere seconds- in which case it's a perfectly valid argument, amirite?

[KhalDrogoe]

Yes revert mercs to pre 1.2 healing.

[Vodrin]

Carnage/Combat - 8-9k screams + ataru procs. + three roots....

 

Commandos/Mercs - 11-12k hits...

 

Snipers - 8-10k ambushes, series of shots/speed shot, charged burst/snipe + trick shot/follow through....

 

LT/TK Sorcs/sages - multiple ways to set up 10k+ burst attacks (affliciton, thundering blast + proc + chain lgihtening proc)

 

Guardians/sents/maras/juggs/sins/shadows/snipers/gunslingers - executes that hit for 8-10k

 

All this tells me one thing: I need better gear.

[L-RANDLE]

All this tells me one thing: I need better gear.

 

Its not so much about gear. Its more about spec, setup, and luck. And potentially an enemy not carrying full EXP via bolster or gear.

[Ottoattack]

All this tells me one thing: I need better gear.

 

My avg HSM critic on a sorc is 9K plus, and more of 11K with power and main stats proc. Same for smashes, which is a guaranteed critic. It is not a L2P our need better gear. Having said so, sorc healer or dps should be able to hold their ground against when enemy. But constant focus fire from 2-3 enemies, ops are way better hands down.

[Vodrin]

You are assuming that the premade and pug were at equal skill to begin with. Which we all know that people who premade have more INDIVIDUAL SKILL than people who pug.

 

With this logic, we can conclude that the premade will win with or without team composition or voice communication since they have higher INDIVIDUAL SKILL; which is the largest contributing factor toward winning regular warzones.

 

Stop making excuses and get better

 

They also tend to have better gear. Right now my sent cannot kill any respectable healer that is well geared. In this case it is not a class balance problem, a pre-made vs, solo problem, or any other similar complaint that I have seen in this thread. It's due to the fact that even with the bolster I do not have enough strength stacked to do the kind of burst I need for killing anything solo that is receiving heals. As a result I try only to attack targets that other DPS players on my team are attacking. Once I have a few more pieces of augmented PvP gear that will change.

 

In any case I am also not seeing this major problems with the sorc/sage healers being overly tough to kill and it makes me wonder what the player who resurrected this thread is doing differently.

 

Its not so much about gear. Its more about spec, setup, and luck. And potentially an enemy not carrying full EXP via bolster or gear.

 

My Blade Storm with precision strike and OS ticking is only critting for 5K at best. It's definitely a gear issue.

 

PS: half my gear is old level 50 PvE stuff.

Edited December 12, 2013 by Vodrin

[HanSollo]

So were snipers, smashers and pretty much every other dps class.

 

Once again, if you think healing is OP please go solo queue on your healer, record your matches, then come back and post your results - 10:1 odds that your viewpoint on healing will change (and you might learn how to counter these classes in the process).

 

Or, bad dps who are capable of producing more burst dps than any healer can should stop QQing because they actually have to work for a kill when the enemy team has competent tanks and healers.

 

BTW, I eat 10k+ hits on my sage/sorc from mercs, full expertise... NOT all healers are scoundrels/operatives.

 

That's the problem guard makes it so you don't need to worry about healing yourself ever 55% reduced dmg? that *********** retarded high and OP.

Get caught hightail 30 times in a row throw 2 heals in and don't worry about it. but as much as you complain about heals not being OP I consistently see healers healing for more then 1 mil in WZs where as a person breaking 1mil in DMG is very rare because OP/scoundrel have so many escapes its retarded and the simple fact is you should not be able to heal for more then what another person can DPS. If you don't understand why feel free to ask.

[helloder]

You do understand that this OP combo: tank jugg plus operative healer usually does together ~ 30% of the damage of one good marauder? Edited December 12, 2013 by helloder