StrikePrice Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 Of course they are. Logs and UI add-ins make the game better. People who object to them lost a long long long time ago. Welcome to the genere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamataKahn Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 WoW was once like that, but now the entire game is nothing but a troll-off, to see which trolls can troll the other troll, or run of the mill "internet ******" who thinks he is the best of the best, even though often they are really bad. I loathe the idea of even having to interact with a vast majority of the population because everyone is a rude ******e. That's just people, you going to have jerks no matter what. of the things that I feel contributed to this, would be damage meters, gearscore, cross-realm BGs, and Random Dungeon/Trade finder. all of these things are benificial, but promoted the deterioration of the games community. That's ridiculous and completely false. You're acting like the community was so good before those tools, it wasn't. And hello, you can put those people on ignore and not group with them, it's not hard. There is no reason not to have the level of mod support and cross server tools that WoW has. It can can only benefit the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aericyn Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 Since playing without logs - keep them. What a refreshing way to just "play" the game. When they are implemented - please let me turn them on or off as an optional feature. A simple toggle option in UI. Ben said "Use the Force Luke". Not "Check your DPS meter, newb!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clocknane Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 Let all the whining end! It is over, we're getting combat logs and with that, the ability to parse and analyze the data. Source: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/698619/Misc/SWTOR/fan_sum_02_qa_georg_zoeller.mp3 EDIT: Yes, I mirrored the source in case it gets deleted or something. Transcript: Played Wow since its beta stages which means I played it with and without damage meters. I was in a guild that downed every piece of content the devs through at us within a few weeks of its release. I saw what happened to the game after damage meters, gear score, etc were implemented. The game became a cest pool for elitst and honestly ruined the game for a lot of folks, including me. I for one, will not be participating in guilds who carry that mentality. It is just as easy to clear hard content without meters as it is with them. IN my experience, people who use these or want them in game abuse them and act like total tools when they obtain them. Thanks, but no thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevonDs Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 There are so many games with these sorts of things. Why not leave this game without one. If you want this stuff you have lots of choices. Many of us love this game pretty much the way it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nonoka Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 The people screaming for the addons are the same ones who can't use the ingame map to find class trainers on Corusant" "Ohh noes, you mean I actually have to select a filter to find my trainer...LAME" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shumney Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 Because people don't like to be reminded that they're only succeeding on the hard work of others? I guess, if you call playing a game "hard work". When a game becomes "work", the fun is gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malkosha Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 The reign of the sexually frustrated mini-generals with delusions of godhood has begun. All hail those with no life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RankinBass Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 I guess, if you call playing a game "hard work". When a game becomes "work", the fun is gone. A game is still something that you have to exert some amount of effort into playing. That effort is generally also referred to as work. So when you see someone call it work, think of it instead as the effort put into the game. Some people put a lot of effort into games, some people put in less. The people who put a lot of effort into the game want more tools with which to be more effective with their efforts. They want to know how to do more damage, do more healing, or tank longer. They like knowing that if they failed at an encounter, that they can use the tools available to pinpoint that failure, then work at overcoming that problem. The down side is that some people misuse these tools as a way to set themselves above others. The thing to remember though, is that these people will find some way to act unpleasant, even without these tools being available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optiris Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 great this game just went to crap, next will be gear score same thing that ruined WoW for me, people who can't get along without these things should not play mmorpg's. role playing game. can't you just make som servers where you allow this crap for the people who like it and the rest of us don't have to deal with it? cookie cutter specs inc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicarras Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 Let all the whining end! It is over, we're getting combat logs and with that, the ability to parse and analyze the data. Source: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/698619/Misc/SWTOR/fan_sum_02_qa_georg_zoeller.mp3 EDIT: Yes, I mirrored the source in case it gets deleted or something. Transcript: Awesome, we will finally be able to analyze our own performance and help friends get better! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nastrodamous Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 great this game just went to crap, next will be gear score same thing that ruined WoW for me, people who can't get along without these things should not play mmorpg's. role playing game. can't you just make som servers where you allow this crap for the people who like it and the rest of us don't have to deal with it? cookie cutter specs inc... So you are upset that other people outperform you...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optiris Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 "So you are upset that other people outperform you...... " oh god yes you're right that's why i'm upset you are so insightful!!!!! it's not because it's a role playing game, it's not because it's supposed to be fun. what i think is funny really funny it's people who need this to be any good at a game because if someone doesn't spell it out, you are completely lost. I can play this game. but you need someone to tell you how you are doing because you can't on your own. good job! want a cookie or a gold star? people that need a damage parser, a cookie cutter spec or gear score are people who can't play the game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjeldsen Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 Any kind of performance meters is bound to cause issues.. First and foremost in the tuning of raid content and classes. There will be one build and a list of BIS items to go with the build for the different classes. The raid encounters will be tuned around a higher performance since most will end up using the exact same builds as everyone else. elitsjerks2 anyone? I think most of this is unavoidable in the long run, but it wont help the game at all, the best way to keep the game alive for a long time is to keep the experience fresh and varied and avoid the pitfalls of the "other" mmo. Build content for the 1337, make it so hard that it´s really 1337, and don´t nerf it just to make sure everyone is ready with new gear for expansions :-) And let the rest of the world be as fun a possible, with encounters that doesn´t require MAX of anything except use of the classes different abilities. Those that wants to play world of addons knows where to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teliko Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 Oh boy, I can't wait for cookie-cutter builds and TOR Elitist Jerks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ColonelKer-Nal Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 (edited) You are fighting a boss for 2 hours, and someone keeps killing the wrong thing, but you aren't sure who's doing it because it's a 16 person op group and it's chaos. What do you do? In your world, you quit trying because you don't know who's failing. In my world, I check the log and see who killed the wrong thing, and tell them to stop or remove them from the group. Are you worried that you'll be that guy or what? It's not fair to the other 15 people who have no idea who's doing the totally wrong thing. And so the DPS that wasn't directed at the boss is STILL not directed at the boss because you kicked it from the group. And if the lack of that DPS was going to make the raid fail, then kicking it from the group was going to guarantee the raid will fail There's the logic of meters for you. I should be greatful they are in, now I can get kicked for no reason by the people I didn't want to start the raid with anyway. Actually, it's better than that. If the group leader insists in meters, I'll know better than to stay with that group. Hopefully someone will make an after action log parser, I do like to look at my own output. But my output is none of your damn business. I already have a paying job working for a bunch of clueless jerks. I don't need a second job doing the same thing, er I mean nto be raiding with them as well. Edited December 25, 2011 by ColonelKer-Nal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kjeldsen Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 So you are upset that other people outperform you...... Troll much? It´s a fact that dmg meters, "perfect builds" and BIS lists does 2 things. 1: It makes it so much easier to "outperform" anyone, including you. 2: There is no outperforming when everyone is doing the same thing, the only difference is the time available and if you read guides. http://www.worldofwarcraft.com go there, it´s a great game that has everything you ask for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfing Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 Ohhh joy how long to item level now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenmartin Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 LOL What you see as belittling it actually more along the lines of /whisper Paperclip hey man since you joined the guild your dps has been pretty low. I checked your gear and you are geared well. Good job on that! Do you need some rotation help? If so please ask we've got alot of players who play your class and spec and would love to help you out. No it's not. Your attitude is pathetically selfish. Here is what you are telling people. I PAY MY 15 DOLLARS A MONTH TO PLAY THE GAME I WANT TO PLAY!!!!!!!! Conveniently ignoring that the other people in the raid also pay 15 dollars and don't want to have to carry you through content. Here's the problem you and people like you appear to have, you don't understand that a raid is a team. In order to operate correctly a team has to be able to work together. When a team member decides he'd much rather be a delicate sunflower than a team player they are no longer an asset to the team. I know 16 year olds who don't have problems with these concepts. It's not work for them. I weep for the 'adults' who find these concepts laborious. Dear god. What kind of people am I playing this game with. People never step back and look at what they type. Where in someones life does this make sense? I hope my life never nears this place. Self evaluation time. It's a game. Get real. "Do you need some rotation help?" wth. wth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kalfear Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 You can keep your damage meters and combat logs. agree from what Ive seen of the self proclaimed Damage meter crowd, they need to worry less on numbers and more on actually understanding the encounters and their FULL ABILITY LIST. But what ever, wont effect me any as Ill simply not play in groups that advertise meters and junk! I tend to stick with people I have good experiences with in a group and ignore the others. If a damage meter makes these players think they are better then they are, have at it. Just a item to hide their short comings from what Ive seen out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skeelol Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 (edited) Ohhh joy how long to item level now? Item level already exists in game. It's called armor rating. agree from what Ive seen of the self proclaimed Damage meter crowd, they need to worry less on numbers and more on actually understanding the encounters and their FULL ABILITY LIST. But what ever, wont effect me any as Ill simply not play in groups that advertise meters and junk! I tend to stick with people I have good experiences with in a group and ignore the others. If a damage meter makes these players think they are better then they are, have at it. Just a item to hide their short comings from what Ive seen out there. Funny you should mention that. Most people wanting DPS meters are top end raiders which means they excel at everything not just DPS. The ones that are against it ...well you know the story Edited December 25, 2011 by Skeelol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seismax Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 agree from what Ive seen of the self proclaimed Damage meter crowd, they need to worry less on numbers and more on actually understanding the encounters and their FULL ABILITY LIST. But what ever, wont effect me any as Ill simply not play in groups that advertise meters and junk! I tend to stick with people I have good experiences with in a group and ignore the others. If a damage meter makes these players think they are better then they are, have at it. Just a item to hide their short comings from what Ive seen out there. Really? Whatever other complexes people may have, as long as they're not hiding their performance that's fine by me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optiris Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 (edited) Item level already exists in game. It's called armor rating. Funny you should mention that. Most people wanting DPS meters are top end raiders which means they excel at everything not just DPS. The ones that are against it ...well you know the story These are the people that can't play the game without being told every little thing, it's ok some people can't handle the challenge without their crutches just give these people a few servers with the add ons they are a vocal minority let the rest of us enjoy the game Edited December 25, 2011 by Optiris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seismax Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 These are the people that can't play the game without being told every little thing, it's ok some people can't handle the challenge without their crutches just give these people a few servers with the add ons they are a vocal minority let the rest of us enjoy the game No, a crutch would be something that you gimp around on. This is closer to buying a car and getting off the sidewalk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTeMpLaR Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 Thank god. So tired of seeing retarded arguments as to why it shouldn't be in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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