Loot Ninjas

[AlrikFassbauer]

to anyone that stated that companions need gear... WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG!!!

 

Ever played in lavel 30 with a companion still wearing level 1 gear ?

Or don't you play with Companions at all ? (THis sounds very much to me like that.)

 

HOW you write it, it is very wrong what you mean.

 

What I WOULD agree to is - nowadays - that in FPs & in OPS one shouldn't get items for companions.

 

By the way, "my" Risha wears now gear from the Mandalorean Raiders.

Because I went through it solo.

And when I solo it, no-one can dictate me what to do.

 

It's very annoying and I never, ever tolerate it in any group. Even if it is gear that I didn't want/need but a dps or a healer needs it and someone takes it for a companion, I either give them the option to give it to the person that needs it (since player need > companion need) or leave the group. If they want neither they get kicked.

 

I furthermore inform the person's guild about his/her action, which once resulted in the person being kicked from the guild as they value their reputation on our realm.

 

Coruscant's World Boss sometimes drops droid parts.

 

You do play a droid, don't you ?

Edited May 27, 2013 by AlrikFassbauer

[donaldlamont]

They should make it so you can only roll need if it's for your class. Aka a consular won't be able to roll need on a knight's gear. It 's not perfect but it would at least help hinder loot ninjas.

 

The best thing you can do is call them out on rolling need on a green drop, if they still do, boot them prior to the boss to save yourself any trouble.

 

I also like this idea

[lordspyder]

Ever played in lavel 30 with a companion still wearing level 1 gear ?

Or don't you play with Companions at all ? (THis sounds very much to me like that.)

 

HOW you write it, it is very wrong what you mean.

 

What I WOULD agree to is - nowadays - that in FPs & in OPS one shouldn't get items for companions.

 

By the way, "my" Risha wears now gear from the Mandalorean Raiders.

Because I went through it solo.

And when I solo it, no-one can dictate me what to do.

 

Coruscant's World Boss sometimes drops droid parts.

 

You do play a droid, don't you ?

 

I don't care what you do when you're running solo, but when you're in my group, you roll for what you need for you're character or you're out and you end up on my ignore list. That's the end of that story.

 

And obviously if a droid part drops that is a different story all together.

[AlrikFassbauer]

I don't care what you do when you're running solo, but when you're in my group, you roll for what you need for you're character or you're out and you end up on my ignore list. That's the end of that story.

 

And obviously if a droid part drops that is a different story all together.

 

No, it isn't. Because you are forming an OP group to beat the world boss. Don't try to wriggle yourself out of this argument by re-defining words and terms as you like them to be !

[Qaoz]

This is not a loot ninja. This is just you losing a roll.

 

It's a pain in the butt, but it's perfectly legal. It's not your loot until it's in your inventory.

 

Sorry, dude. Them's the breaks.

 

Oh, great, another one of those "social norms don't matter as long as it's within game mechanics" people.

 

Rolling "need" on something you do not "need" ("I need it for my companion/credits" does not count as a legit need) is considered bad mannered. I don't care if they do it in Rift; it displays a complete lack of respect for your fellow group members who did need that particular item.

 

I give people one chance (because I've encountered nubs in The Foundry) and then I initiate a vote-kick. It should be noted that every single ninja looter I've come across has been strangely silent the entire run and afterwards. Sometimes they leave the group immediately after they ninja the item, and I had one person who put me on ignore when I questioned his actions.

 

That shows remorse: They know they did something not socially acceptable and they're running from the confrontation.

 

Why BioWare hasn't put restrictions on loot system already is beyond me. Make it so that only heavy armor classes can roll on heavy armor and so on. If people want to gear up their companions, or wear gear below their armor level (e.g. medium armor on a Juggernaut), they can solo a low level Flashpoint for the moddable gear and then spend the million planet commendations they get from missions on updated mods. That's how I've done it.

 

Having my gear jacked by someone who fails at the game is not fun. Not even remotely fun. I've enough issues trying to convince Marauders that they don't need cunning gear. Jesus, have I lost a lot of items to those guys.

Edited May 27, 2013 by Qaoz

[Mowermanx]

heh i ran a level 50 sm fp,think it was battle of ilum(ran sm as i que for everything there is) anyway at the begining a level 53 types in chat "you all know the diffrence between need and greed right?" as i greed on everything in sm and hm lvl 50 fps i didnt answer,just wanted to get it done asap..anyway halfway thru the instance the same guy starts typing " oh ok then its a loot free for all if you wanna play that way,so will i"..again i just ignores it,i dont care who gets what loot.i think to myself dont get involved ,let them sort it out themselves..anyway we finish the fp and i say thanks to the group etc then i get a whisper from the level 53.." im sick of players like you,you loot ninjas get 1 chance with me,your going on ignore!",so im like ***? guy allready placed me on ignore so could,nt reply to him so i got put on someones ignore list..because i rolled greed on every drop??? maybe next time i should just roll pass? or just stop running these lvl 50 fps i guess

 

Ive seen this quite often, and really, it was said in beta by quite a few that "greed" should be changed to "roll" as a lot of other games use this and new players will be confused.

[hages]

No, it isn't. Because you are forming an OP group to beat the world boss. Don't try to wriggle yourself out of this argument by re-defining words and terms as you like them to be !

 

Whar are you saying?

He had right 100% with what he said

Need is for youre char and youre spec

Greed is for offspec,compagnions,alts, ...

droid parts of crafting mats that drop are a different thing. but if everyone rolls greed on them,then theire is no problem to.

Now at the other hand if someone asked the group if he can have that part for his alt/offspec,... and i do not need it. he can have it fron me with plesure.

But ninjaing is for me a kick afther 1 warning.

[lordspyder]

No, it isn't. Because you are forming an OP group to beat the world boss. Don't try to wriggle yourself out of this argument by re-defining words and terms as you like them to be !

 

I'm not doing any thing of the sort. I'm saying and you can quote me on this, If you are in my group and you need on anything other that what you're class can use you are out. The obvious exception being droid parts, you can need to your hearts content.

You have a right to need on what ever you want, and I have a right to kick you out and put you on ignore. You can argue about it all you want, but I play with my wife at all times, and I grantee if I initiate a vote kick it will pass, so you will be gone. The end.

[GreenLantern]

I always roll need on BoE gear. If everyone rolls need on BoE, then nothing will ever get ninja'd. This philosophy dates back to vanilla wow, and is the only way to prevent real ninja looting aside from master looting which in a pug is just another way to ninja. People who roll need on BoP gear they don't actually need are just dbags.

[Asavrede]

I've found almost all groups I've been in have been receptive to kicking loot ninjas, so I initiate votes quite often these days. And yes, it has become more prevalent - earlier the ninjaing was pretty rare and you could usually just solve it by asking them to stop. Now it seems rare to even get a reply if you talk to them.

[Ratajack]

I'm not doing any thing of the sort. I'm saying and you can quote me on this, If you are in my group and you need on anything other that what you're class can use you are out. The obvious exception being droid parts, you can need to your hearts content.

You have a right to need on what ever you want, and I have a right to kick you out and put you on ignore. You can argue about it all you want, but I play with my wife at all times, and I grantee if I initiate a vote kick it will pass, so you will be gone. The end.

 

Really? You guarantee a vote to kick will pass? I guarantee I will NEVER vote to kick someone who rolls need on any piece of gear that they helped to produce, so I would not be too sure of every vote to kick you initiate passing.

[hages]

I always roll need on BoE gear. If everyone rolls need on BoE, then nothing will ever get ninja'd. This philosophy dates back to vanilla wow, and is the only way to prevent real ninja looting aside from master looting which in a pug is just another way to ninja. People who roll need on BoP gear they don't actually need are just dbags.

I disagree.

Rolling need on BoE gear (If youre toon do not needs is) is still wrong in my eyes.

Theire is notting ninja about masterlooter unless the ninja is the ops leader..well then you are screwed :-P

Edited May 27, 2013 by hages

[hages]

Really? You guarantee a vote to kick will pass? I guarantee I will NEVER vote to kick someone who rolls need on any piece of gear that they helped to produce, so I would not be too sure of every vote to kick you initiate passing.

Well they you will be the first who will be kicked in my group with that additude.

[Qaoz]

I always roll need on BoE gear. If everyone rolls need on BoE, then nothing will ever get ninja'd. This philosophy dates back to vanilla wow, and is the only way to prevent real ninja looting aside from master looting which in a pug is just another way to ninja. People who roll need on BoP gear they don't actually need are just dbags.

 

Everyone should roll need on BOE gear, but I disagree that this philosophy dates back to Vanilla WoW. Rolling need on BOE gear in Vanilla WoW would get you marked as a ninja looter real fast. At least on the European servers.

[nateslice]

Allowing Need rolls for companions would be grossly unfair to Smugglers and Agents, because most players like to run with their healer companions, all of which (except for the Trooper's Elara) use the same Medium/Cunning gear as those two classes.

 

Meanwhile, Knights and Inquisitors would benefit disproportionately from such a rule, because it's pretty rare for anyone else to want their gear for companions. Outside of their own classes, they'd only have to worry about Bowdaar or Vector (neither of whom is exactly popular), while the Aim and Cunning classes would have to worry about, well, a lot more than one companion taking their gear.

[Avatarless]

I'm not doing any thing of the sort. I'm saying and you can quote me on this, If you are in my group and you need on anything other that what you're class can use you are out. The obvious exception being droid parts, you can need to your hearts content.

You have a right to need on what ever you want, and I have a right to kick you out and put you on ignore. You can argue about it all you want, but I play with my wife at all times, and I grantee if I initiate a vote kick it will pass, so you will be gone. The end.

 

I see nothing wrong with this but it needs to be understood that it won't change anything. Unfortunately it is an inherent problem with F2P games and also a carry over from WoW and the 'group finder'.

 

In 'older' MMO your in-game reputation was everything. It was important to be seen as a reliable and honest player in order to ensure that you had a spot in end game raiding and so forth. If you got a bad rep in Everquest for example you could pretty much forget ever being able to do anything in a group. The community would know who the 'ninjas' were and would block you out of everything, even kill you with mob trains if they saw you camping for a quest you were trying to complete.

 

But it was a smaller community back then and a different style of game.

 

I tend to 'blame' the WoW group finder set up mostly since it works across all servers. You click group finder, get in a group with players from other servers that you don't even say 'Hi' to. Smash through the instance with everyone rolling Need then quitting without even saying 'tks' or 'bye' and simply que for the next run. There is no point blocking people cause you will likely never see them again anyway and they are all on different servers.

 

So anyway, I generally accept that if I'm using the group finder then it's going to be a free for all since the group finder makes it a lot more impersonal. At least I think that's how it's perceived. For good or bad?

 

My only suggestion would be to find a good and active guild and just stick to grouping with them when you are actually after certain gear. With the new bonuses to XP for being in a guild it's a good time to find one.

[Jeweledleah]

So, you want to be able to decide who is "more entitled" to any drops, regardless of the fact that the drop would not exist without the efforts of all present?

 

As I said before, if someone helped produce the loot, I will not deny them the right to roll however they wish.

 

If I am playing an mercenary and a chest piece with cunning drops, I won't roll need over the sniper in the group, but I will not tell the sniper he can't roll need if a chest piece with aim drops. In fact, I'll invite him to roll need if it would be an upgrade for kaliyo. If I really want that piece of gear, I'll run that instance again, and to the OP, if I out level that particular piece of gear too quickly to run that instance again, then I guess I really didn't "need" it all that much in the first place.

 

Maybe I just come from a different generation with different values.

 

I don't know what generation there is, but its certainly strange one.

 

companions did NOTHING to contribute to the run. so they don't get to have a need roll, unless group doesn't mind.

 

and like another person already mentioned - gearing companions is easy if you just keep doing the content WITHOUT needing on loot for them.

its not as bad during leveling flashpoints, because you tend to outlevel the drops fairly quickly (more annoying if you are also going for specific look, but its always possible to come back and solo), but people retain this attitude throughout the game, because they think its ok to do and next thing you know, you are losing upgrades that could have improved your performance in a hardmode flashpoint and made everyone's life smoother, because some jerk didn't think 58th were good enough for the companion, some of them don't even use at all other then for crew skills missions.

needing for companion is no better than needing for alts - its disrespectful jerk behavior. we all could use that piece of gear one way or another. I could rip mods and send them to an alt, or alts companion, if my own companions are already done. it doesn't mean I should need on it. priority goes to people who can use the gear directly.

[Ratajack]

Well they you will be the first who will be kicked in my group with that additude.

 

That would be a first. I've never been kicked from a group, even when I vote no on a vote to kick.

 

But, I'm not surprised that some people would be unable to handle running with someone they can't bully.

Edited May 27, 2013 by Ratajack

[Miragecg]

I've been playing MMO for 13 years now... And what i call Ninja Looting is people rolling "need" on every loot.

Rolling "Greed" on item you don't need for you char, you just want it either for your companion or for making money it's normal and it's for that purpose that "Greed" was made.

 

Saying "You're Ninja Looting" to peoples who only roll "Need" on what they need it and "Greed" on what they don't need it, it's just plain stupid (sorry, but it's what i think) because "Need" > "Greed"... So people rolling "Need" don't have to worry about losing their roll to someone rolling "Greed".

[Ratajack]

I don't know what generation there is, but its certainly strange one.

 

companions did NOTHING to contribute to the run. so they don't get to have a need roll, unless group doesn't mind.

 

and like another person already mentioned - gearing companions is easy if you just keep doing the content WITHOUT needing on loot for them.

its not as bad during leveling flashpoints, because you tend to outlevel the drops fairly quickly (more annoying if you are also going for specific look, but its always possible to come back and solo), but people retain this attitude throughout the game, because they think its ok to do and next thing you know, you are losing upgrades that could have improved your performance in a hardmode flashpoint and made everyone's life smoother, because some jerk didn't think 58th were good enough for the companion, some of them don't even use at all other then for crew skills missions.

needing for companion is no better than needing for alts - its disrespectful jerk behavior. we all could use that piece of gear one way or another. I could rip mods and send them to an alt, or alts companion, if my own companions are already done. it doesn't mean I should need on it. priority goes to people who can use the gear directly.

 

That is where you are simply trying to justify denying someone the chance to benefit from there efforts. You want to separate the player and the companion because it makes you feel better when you deny that other player their right to roll however they see fit. The same happened in that other game with dual spec. The argument then was "the spec you're in". It's all just attempting to justify stacking the deck in your favor when it comes to loot.

 

You want to claim that the companion contributed nothing to the kill. You claim the the characters did all the work. Next time you are in a FP, do nothing during the boss fight. Don't hit a single key. Then tell me how much your character contributed to the kill. The PLAYER contributed to the kill, not the character, not the companion, the PLAYER. The PLAYER has the right to roll.

[SonsofKohral]

I recently ran a FP and the whole time there was no loot that dropped for me. Sucks, but hey it happens. On the last boss an item dropped and I swear that I thought the armor type was mine, so I rolled need. Of course I roll a 99, get it and I leave the group. A few seconds later, one of the guys from the instance whispers me asking me:

 

"Can your character use that?"

 

Lo and behold, I couldn't use it. Fortunately, I whispered him back to meet me in the fleet and gave it to him, his toon could've used it.

 

Accidents happen. Because of his courtesy, I realized that I indeed couldn't use it and was more than happy to give it to someone who could use it. However, if he had yelled at me and cursed me out, calling me a noob, I would have vendored that item so fast, his head would have spinned.

[hages]

That would be a first. I've never been kicked from a group, even when I vote no on a vote to kick.

 

But, I'm not surprised that some people would be unable to handle running with someone they can't bully.

 

This has nothing to do with bullying. I am not even close to a bully.

If you respect other you would not need on theire gear. It is plain simple.

If you do not respect that, then you do not belong in an Mmo.

[nateslice]

A Sentinel's right to take my Gunslinger's gear for Doc is trumped by my right to choose not to associate with that player anymore.

[Jeweledleah]

That is where you are simply trying to justify denying someone the chance to benefit from there efforts. You want to separate the player and the companion because it makes you feel better when you deny that other player their right to roll however they see fit. The same happened in that other game with dual spec. The argument then was "the spec you're in". It's all just attempting to justify stacking the deck in your favor when it comes to loot.

 

You want to claim that the companion contributed nothing to the kill. You claim the the characters did all the work. Next time you are in a FP, do nothing during the boss fight. Don't hit a single key. Then tell me how much your character contributed to the kill. The PLAYER contributed to the kill, not the character, not the companion, the PLAYER. The PLAYER has the right to roll.

 

of for cripes sakes...

 

yes player pushed the buttons. but next time you do the flashpoint, which avatar of the player is there? and its NOT companion. getting gear for companions does NOTHING for this or future runs of the flashpoints, because, guess what? those companions will STILL NOT BE IN THERE.

 

THE PLAYER has a right to roll need on gear that upgrades the stats of the avatar that is directly present in a group content they are running. that's it anything else? greed, or ASK.

 

also this

 

A Sentinel's right to take my Gunslinger's gear for Doc is trumped by my right to choose not to associate with that player anymore.

 

and this

 

This has nothing to do with bullying. I am not even close to a bully.

If you respect other you would not need on their gear. It is plain simple.

If you do not respect that, then you do not belong in an Mmo.

 

edited to add. by your reasoning, I'm perfectly justified in getting faster queues on my tanks and needed on all the gear that I could use on my dps alts, since they don't get queues nearly as fast, but since, I the player am pushing the buttons, its totally ok for me to need on gear that could be direct upgrades for someone's avatar currently in a group, right? and the fact that i'm depriving someone of direct upgrades, someone who potentially waited for a while to get that group in a first place, is completely and utterly fair?

whatever generation you are from? i'm glad I'm not from the same generation.

Edited May 27, 2013 by Jeweledleah

[Spatology]

I recently ran a FP and the whole time there was no loot that dropped for me. Sucks, but hey it happens. On the last boss an item dropped and I swear that I thought the armor type was mine, so I rolled need. Of course I roll a 99, get it and I leave the group. A few seconds later, one of the guys from the instance whispers me asking me:

 

"Can your character use that?"

 

Lo and behold, I couldn't use it. Fortunately, I whispered him back to meet me in the fleet and gave it to him, his toon could've used it.

 

Accidents happen. Because of his courtesy, I realized that I indeed couldn't use it and was more than happy to give it to someone who could use it. However, if he had yelled at me and cursed me out, calling me a noob, I would have vendored that item so fast, his head would have spinned.

 

If I could, I would vendor your account.