So I cancelled my subscription today

[AscendantOps]

I'm subscribed, and I find the new game update satisfying. The only thing that left me scratching my head was the fact that Cathar weren't already available to subscribers, and the outrageous fees for name & legacy change.

[DarthTHC]

Some people have claimed this has P2W-elements, but I see it more as B2P, as you basically support the game a bit to play it better.

 

The only thing that approaches p2w in the cartel market is the +41 crystals, and only because you can equip them at level 10. Others will argue that they aren't p2w because they can be sold on the gtn for credits. In that case, nothing in CM will ever be p2w regardless the stat boost because everything will be able to be sold on GTN.

 

And now, with update 2.1, you have a new race, and the option to modify your appearance. Cool enough, except that you have to pay with money, REAL money, to actually use it. F2P players I can understand having to pay for this, but us subscribers? Come on, we already give you a sum every month

 

No, you do NOT have to pay real money if you are a subscriber. You can get a race change with your subscription, with the condition that a) you didn't blow your cartel coins as fast as you got them or b) if you did, you are willing to wait until you have enough cartel coins to make the change.

 

This, in fact, is far better than other games, especially the big game around the block. For example, if you want to change your race in that game, you will spend $25 in addition to your subscription. There is no other way to do it. If you want to change your race in this game, you could spend $0 if you have or will wait for the cartel coins with your subscription. If you spent all your coins as soon as you got them and you must have the race change NOW because you have all the impulse control of a kid in a candy store, you will pay LESS THAN $25 to do it.

 

The other game charges real money for certain other visual changes to your character, too, and that's the only way to do it. And it charges ingame currency for some minor changes. You can get all those changes here again with your subscription if you somehow manage your cartel coins more intelligently than a crack addict at a meth convention manages his last $10.

 

Summary: Other game: Forces RMT in addition to subscription for many changes. This game: All changes available at no additional cost to your subscription if you're patient and/or disciplined.

 

In addition to that, what’s with the gamble system? Even if I thought it would be ok to use real money for something I’m already paying for, I would sure as hell not spend real money on a gamble to MAYBE get something I’m looking for. I’m looking at you dyes!

 

Yup. That's a ******, isn't it?

 

Now, even all this set aside, here’s what worrying me: they are clearly trying to milk this game as much as possible while it lasts. I would love to be proven wrong on this one, but I think the game is slowly dying. These moves point to an act of desperation. EA is also simply to uninterested in rescuing this sinking ship, maybe because they have other plans for a new SW-based MMO with their new license they got from Disney. So why should I invest more of my time and money into something that might not survive for long?

 

Except that's the exact opposite of what is happening according to information EA gave during their earnings call, during which they are under threat of criminal prosecution if they lie. The said a) subs are increasing and b) revenue is increasing substantially.

 

I'm right with you on the silliness of the random dye packs. Of course, I expected it so I'm not all that angered over it. More like "bemused".

 

All the rest, I suggest you look at additional information and perhaps rethink your position.

[Neglience]

Please name one feature, that was taken out of gameplay since F2P (or even since release).

 

 

As long as you are not spending more than 500-700 CC per month, this is exactly as it is.. you then can have it all, as you do get CC included in your sub.

 

stuff = armors removed in beta and now at the CM. they would have made its way into the game without f2p at some time. now we have to pay for it.

 

feature = barbershop IF swtor would have been a success it would have come at some point.

 

it is just naiv to believe nothing we can now buy for CCs would not have made its way to the actual game without f2p.

Edited May 15, 2013 by Neglience

[BrunoLogan]

Actually I wrote my original post yesterday, and waited until today to actually post it, after moderating it a bit. I also tried to state that I'm not really yelling out in frustration, but I do want the devs to hear my opinion, and by using the forums to this purpuse, other people might join in on the debate.

 

I do disagree that these posts are pointless though, I write in the public forums not only to make the devs see the activity, but also to gather impressions from other players such as yourself. Who knows, maybe I'm missing something important in my reasoning, what better way to get a better picture of the situation than to hear from others?

 

That being said, I'm not quitting the game yet. I still have 88 days as a subscriber that I intend to utilize. After that I'll probably continue for a while as a preferred player, and who knows, maybe I'll resubscribe at that point? I really do like the game, I just don't like the signs I'm seeing.

 

They became pointless due to their big number and, usually, low quality content. Your post might be clean, well thought, educated and polite but, as you can see in this thread, many people just let it fall inside the rage quit posts bag. There are so much entitled attitude since day 1 on this forums that many people just start to filter out these kind of posts, devs included.

 

I too, would like to pay game currency for body cosmetic changes but I understand perfectly why BW decided to go this way. This game is the result of people's work ran by a business. It must make money. Paying for this kind of stuff is a way they have to monetize the game for the F2P players while protecting the subscriber covering the expenses with the monthly CC bonus. Like I said, you can easily get 600CC/month but you have to manage them like you do your real life money.

[JPryde]

To have it all is a little bit exaggerated I think, I get 600 CC per month but I already spent it on other cosmetic things I liked. Which is the point, why should I be limited in my choices in a game I'm actively paying for? I just don't like being treated as a F2P player when I'm an active subscriber. I don't want to have limits on my choices, especially when the only option to avoid those limits are by paying more money.

 

I believe the basic problem here is to find a good balance between subscribers and F2P players. It is evidently very difficult, but we can only hope they listen to us so they can improve the game experience for the better.

You are not treated like a F2P player.

 

1. you do get 500-700 CC with your subscription, which a F2P does not get.

2. you get 50% discount on all cosmetic changes of your char other than race change. F2P does not get any discount.

3. you get 33% discount on all race changes. F2P does not get any discount.

 

So after getting repeatedly proven wrong, could you now please stop claiming, that you are treated "like a f2p" ?

[Akfuia]

I am not a fan of gambling either, I do regret using CCs on packs, holding to that one might just give me the items I want. Alas, it's usually never the case, though on a side-note, those do get the items you want can be on the GTN for in-game credits even with the ridiculous pricing and all.

 

So you can "eventually" get that dye you wanted even if it takes several weeks to farm up the credits to buy it or using stripends to buy CM items to sell.

[NycoFox]

Sorry, it is a 'Rage, I quit post!' and you are venting.

 

Apology accepted

 

So have I, nice statue of Darth Malgus sat on my desk as a security key stand and art book on shelf. Six month sub is £46.14 for me. It wasn't very nice in the beginning it was bearable. No UI customisation, No group finder, No legacy system, No colour match and after the first couple of months No server population. I would advise you to take the rose tinted monitor screen off.

 

Well I agree that in the beginning it was not perfect, or close to it. But every single MMO is like that in the beginning, with very few exceptions. The stories were still solid however, and I had a very good time playing the game from the beginning.

 

What's important in a game like this is not just how it is in the beginning, but how it evolves from there. My reason for this thread is to indicate that I am worried about the direction it's headed in.

 

There are no P2W options in SWTOR that I can find.

 

I agree to this, they have luckily avoided those elements so far.

 

What have you been spending your CCs on?

 

Level 7 ship modules for four of my characters

 

Are you a little bitter because you've been milking the 700cc from your sub as a free credit generator and don't have any left?

 

Could be, which is my point: why am I limited in content when I'm already paying?

 

You say 'milk', I say 'make it profitable'. They are a corporation their goal is to increase the profit margins. They are not there to give you free stuff.

 

That's very understandable. But I return to my original point: I'm already paying, so they're not giving it to me for free.

 

I think the Makeb expansion shows a better insight into how to develop content for an MMO style story driven game and a part of me wishes the whole game was a little more like that.

 

I agree to this as well. I prepaid for Makeb, and the price was for once quite reasonable. It would be more nice if they included the expansion for the subscribers of course, but I can see that the expansion had quite a lot of development time behind it.

Edited May 15, 2013 by NycoFox
Missing a / in the [QUOTE]

[DarthTHC]

I'm subscribed, and I find the new game update satisfying. The only thing that left me scratching my head was the fact that Cathar weren't already available to subscribers, and the outrageous fees for name & legacy change.

 

Be patient. They'll discount the name change fees. They always put new, highly desired stuff like that up at idiotic pricing because people WANT IT NOW DAMMIT!

 

When the initial spike of buys dries up, they'll discount it to get the rest of us who are a bit more frugal.

[NycoFox]

You are not treated like a F2P player.

 

1. you do get 500-700 CC with your subscription, which a F2P does not get.

2. you get 50% discount on all cosmetic changes of your char other than race change. F2P does not get any discount.

3. you get 33% discount on all race changes. F2P does not get any discount.

 

Yes, we get some more goodies that the F2P players don't. However, it's not really the point here. As you said, we get discounts, and yes they might be cheaper and yes we get a small pile of coins included every month, but we are still required to purchase the items we want. This sure feels like F2P elements to me.

[DarthTHC]

Yes, we get some more goodies that the F2P players don't. However, it's not really the point here. As you said, we get discounts, and yes they might be cheaper and yes we get a small pile of coins included every month, but we are still required to purchase the items we want. This sure feels like F2P elements to me.

 

If you're using the cc's that come with your sub, it should feel no more like "purchasing" than buying stuff off the GTN or from a vendor for credits.

[lonewolfza]

I read this thread and laughed.

 

So many Bioware/EA fan boys. So little time to flame them all.

 

End of the day SWTOR is no WoW. And as such it is dying and they are desperately trying to keep it afloat.

F2P is a market scheme that I do not agree with, and thus I am playing my days out until my sub ends.

 

[JPryde]

End of the day SWTOR is no WoW.

I agree and I am thankful for that every day I play SWTOR

[Kilora]

End of the day SWTOR is no WoW. And as such it is dying and they are desperately trying to keep it afloat.

F2P is a market scheme that I do not agree with, and thus I am playing my days out until my sub ends.

 

Apparently you haven't paid any attention to EAs earning calls. F2P has caused sub numbers to rise -- and has more than doubled their monthly profit.

 

The game is NOT at risk of dying. They don't have to try to keep it afloat. It is turning quite the profit, and continues to every day.

 

Alas -- I understand the F2P business model isn't for everyone. I hope you enjoy the remaining time in your sub -- and wish you the best of luck in finding another game.

[Arkerus]

I read this thread and laughed.

 

So many Bioware/EA fan boys. So little time to flame them all.

 

End of the day SWTOR is no WoW. And as such it is dying and they are desperately trying to keep it afloat.

F2P is a market scheme that I do not agree with, and thus I am playing my days out until my sub ends.

 

 

Someone lives in "pretend land".

[Xenith]

I cancelled about a week ago. Subscribers paying for haircuts, facial hair, tattoos, etc. is just beyond anything remotely reasonable. I know, i get 500 CC for my $15, that somehow justifies making subscribers pay for everything. You can spray perfume on crap, but it's still crap.

 

This ^. Thank you BW.

[CaptianFordo]

I read this thread and laughed.

 

So many Bioware/EA fan boys. So little time to flame them all.

 

End of the day SWTOR is no WoW. And as such it is dying and they are desperately trying to keep it afloat.

F2P is a market scheme that I do not agree with, and thus I am playing my days out until my sub ends.

 

 

http://kotaku.com/top-warcraft-guild-disbands-blaming-the-raiding-commun-501808931

 

http://kotaku.com/world-of-warcraft-loses-a-million-subscribers-down-to-496616055

Edited May 15, 2013 by CaptianFordo

[tiennen]

Hmmm

 

 

Well, I just resubbed last night. So, looks like Bioware lost one, and gained one back.

 

 

And yep, been here since beta.

 

 

Just wanted to bring this to some people's attention: Yes, the game may be losing some subs, but it is gaining others. You are not a special butterfly, and the game will continue to be around even after you unsub--stop acting like you're important.

Edited May 15, 2013 by tiennen

[DarthMintCake]

I will keep paying for my sub and continuing supporting this great game. Keep up the good work guys

[Toxxo]

Hmmm

 

 

Well, I just resubbed last night.

 

 

And yep, been here since beta.

 

 

.

 

You just completely contradicted yourself.

[Toxxo]

 

http://kotaku.com/world-of-warcraft-loses-a-million-subscribers-down-to-496616055

 

OMG - only 8 MILLION subscribers left? ****!!!

[tiennen]

You just completely contradicted yourself.

 

 

Did I?

 

I stopped subbing when it went F2P. So yep, been here since beta.

 

You know, with F2P, people can be here without actually subbing. SHOCKING ISNT IT.

 

 

But, despite being able to play the game without a sub, I have decided to re-sub, now that the game looks like it is not going down the tubes anymore.

Edited May 15, 2013 by tiennen

[DarthTHC]

I read this thread and laughed.

 

So many Bioware/EA fan boys. So little time to flame them all.

 

End of the day SWTOR is no WoW. And as such it is dying and they are desperately trying to keep it afloat.

F2P is a market scheme that I do not agree with, and thus I am playing my days out until my sub ends.

 

 

Why are you wasting your time in a game you're leaving when the other game is "so much better"?

[jordanph]

Why are you wasting your time in a game you're leaving when the other game is "so much better"?

 

because his he is so full of meat!

[BadOrb]

All this fuss over a barbers shop and such fluff ? The Cathar race needs to pay for the coding and production time it took to make it , so yes it costs CC. If they sell enough then they will make a new race.

 

Cheers,

 

BadOrb.

[PlasmaJohn]

All this fuss over a barbers shop and such fluff ? The Cathar race needs to pay for the coding and production time it took to make it , so yes it costs CC. If they sell enough then they will make a new race.

so what you're saying is that Aric Jorgan or any of the other Cathar NPC's never existed in game?

 

In case you missed my point, most of the heavy lifting was already done. If it took three EA employees more than a week to add them to the character creation menu they were slacking. Using a 100USD loaded rate and a 40hr work week, that's 12,000USD. Even if it took them a month, the cost would have been trivial compared to monthly revenue.