Sprgmr Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 It seems to be that people feel different about spending free coins they have. With that option you wouldn't be spending. There's probably some psychology crap relating to the difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 (edited) That's why I said an option. Read it all before going at me. Exactly how is it an option. There is no option to forego your coins for a month. It still a BAD IDEA...... made worse by trying to make it "optional". Here's an idea... everyone gets their coins just like every month AND each player has the option to decide if they want to unlock Cathar or not. In other words... status quo process...end result same... no need to create an entire new business infrastructure inside players accounts (and all the bugs that will come with it). Edited April 30, 2013 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilora Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 It seems to be that people feel different about spending free coins they have. With that option you wouldn't be spending. There's probably some psychology crap relating to the difference. Aaah, gotcha. So, I'm assuming you aren't actually proposing that from a super-serious standpoint -- more of a "Really? We're really arguing about something this stupid? Here. Does this make you feel better?" If that's where you're coming from, +10 from me, good sir or madam. I think that is the best post in the thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sprgmr Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 (edited) +10 to you as well Kilora. Well then Mr. Know It All. I just said how people would probably (maybe somewhat) feel different. I don't mind you hating my idea, but do so politely. And Sith, the coins are free, since our sub doesn't cost more than it did before F2P. And please don't start about how our sub is worth less. For me at least, it is worth just the same. Edited April 30, 2013 by Sprgmr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 (edited) It seems to be that people feel different about spending free coins they have. With that option you wouldn't be spending. There's probably some psychology crap relating to the difference. With all due respect... the same psychological triggers that cause reaction to spending coins will also react to being told they don't get coins for the coming month and are forced to take the Cathar unlock instead. The core issue here is people don't like having anything forced on them. Which is ironic because the approach Bioware has taken with F2P is to give players more freedom of choice. In other words.. many people are not consciously aware of their unconscious triggers inside them. They react to stimulus and often without realizing it and working through it to see the logic on the other side of what triggered their reaction. Whenever you see an emotional response to any stimulus.. there is an unconscious trigger being fired off of some form. Edited April 30, 2013 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syas Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 (edited) We will see it free to subscribers as long as you count the free complementary coins we get as free.. That seems to be the big issue.. Using free coins to buy something somehow makes that something not free.. That is why subscriber get those coins.. Is for times like this.. So we have the means to get something without incurring an additional cost.. Real cost not game cost.. F2P people will have to purchase those coins.. We will not.. Some here don't consider those coins as being free as we have to pay for our subscriptions to get them.. Free with stipulations or conditions is a common business practice.. Us paying a subscription doesn't make those coins any less free.. I am sure you know this though.. I totally understand where you are coming from, make no mistake, my statement was, and is, made from a place of entitlement. As a subscriber from Early Access through to today, it would be nice if they gave me a new race as a freebie. I know, 600CC = Free Race, and I don't mind that; I am just saying I don't think it is unreasonable to ask to have access to all Races/Classes as a Subscribing Customer who has pre-purchased both software packages (Original Release and Makeb) without having to spend the CC they give me as a normal boon. I am not saying I am special, just that I (like a number of others) am an avid supporter of the game, and it wouldn't hurt to get Cathar in addition to the 600cc. Edited April 30, 2013 by Syas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sprgmr Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 Again, It would be an option. Good god, this must be how politicians argue, people choose what they want to respond to and listen/read/interpret. No wonder politicians get nothing done. And I agree, you have a choice with the Cathar. Yes or No. Same with everything on the CCM and anything else that changes how your toon looks. With all due respect... the same psychological triggers that cause reaction to spending coins will also react to being told they don't get coins for the coming month and are forced to take the Cathar unlock instead. The core issue here is people don't like having anything forced on them. Which is ironic because the approach Bioware has taken with F2P is to give players more freedom of choice. In other words.. many people are not consciously aware of their unconscious triggers inside them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilora Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 I totally understand where you are coming from, make no mistake, my statement was, and is, made from a place of entitlement. As a subscriber from Early Access through to today, it would be nice if they gave me a new race as a freebie. I know, 600CC = Free Race, and I don't mind that; I am just saying I don't think it is unreasonable to ask to have access to all Races/Classes as a Subscribing Customer who has pre-purchased both software packages (Original Release and Makeb) without having to spend the CC they give me as a normal boon. I am not saying I am special, just that I (like a number of others) am an avid supporter of the game, and it wouldn't hurt to get Cathar in addition to the 600cc. I still think, from a marketing/PR perspective, they should've thrown "Founders" a bone. "Anyone who has the Founder title will have the Cathar unlocked for free." or "Anyone who purchases a 3-month subscription to the game, will be able to purchase Cathar with in-game credits." I don't really care about how they did it, because I don't really have much interest in playing Cathar. But I would've loved to be part of the discussion on that -- just to see the reasoning behind some of the things they've done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syas Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 I still think, from a marketing/PR perspective, they should've thrown "Founders" a bone. "Anyone who has the Founder title will have the Cathar unlocked for free." or "Anyone who purchases a 3-month subscription to the game, will be able to purchase Cathar with in-game credits." I don't really care about how they did it, because I don't really have much interest in playing Cathar. But I would've loved to be part of the discussion on that -- just to see the reasoning behind some of the things they've done. Exactly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason_ralph Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 Aaah, gotcha. So, I'm assuming you aren't actually proposing that from a super-serious standpoint -- more of a "Really? We're really arguing about something this stupid? Here. Does this make you feel better?" If that's where you're coming from, +10 from me, good sir or madam. I think that is the best post in the thread I feel hurt that the /popcorn or /pretzels&beer did not get a plus +10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason_ralph Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 I still think, from a marketing/PR perspective, they should've thrown "Founders" a bone. "Anyone who has the Founder title will have the Cathar unlocked for free." or "Anyone who purchases a 3-month subscription to the game, will be able to purchase Cathar with in-game credits." I don't really care about how they did it, because I don't really have much interest in playing Cathar. But I would've loved to be part of the discussion on that -- just to see the reasoning behind some of the things they've done. I do not believe that giving *Founders* Cathar would go over with the rest of the community... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilora Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 I feel hurt that the /popcorn or /pretzels&beer did not get a plus +10 AH! I think I missed that one >.< /popcorn only gets a +5 /pretzles&beer gets a +1 -- unless it's a really good beer. Because I hate pretzles. /jawaeatingpopcorndrinkingabeer would've gotten a +1mil, and would've created cuteness with the destructive power beyond that reachable by dividing by zero. Clearly, it's the end of the day for me, and my brain has lost all of the caffeine I've poured into it all day. >.< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 (edited) I still think, from a marketing/PR perspective, they should've thrown "Founders" a bone. "Anyone who has the Founder title will have the Cathar unlocked for free." or "Anyone who purchases a 3-month subscription to the game, will be able to purchase Cathar with in-game credits." I don't really care about how they did it, because I don't really have much interest in playing Cathar. But I would've loved to be part of the discussion on that -- just to see the reasoning behind some of the things they've done. Inb4 the CE owners pile on note: I am a CE owner, but I do not subscribe to the classic CE owner entitlement demands..... and they hates me for it too. Edited April 30, 2013 by Andryah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajikMyst Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 I totally understand where you are coming from, make no mistake, my statement was, and is, made from a place of entitlement. As a subscriber from Early Access through to today, it would be nice if they gave me a new race as a freebie. I know, 600CC = Free Race, and I don't mind that; I am just saying I don't think it is unreasonable to ask to have access to all Races/Classes as a Subscribing Customer who has pre-purchased both software packages (Original Release and Makeb) without having to spend the CC they give me as a normal boon. I am not saying I am special, just that I (like a number of others) am an avid supporter of the game, and it wouldn't hurt to get Cathar in addition to the 600cc. I agree with you.. My over all point was simply, how they are handling this isn't false advertisement as the OP implied, and what they did wasn't a violation of any access to any choices.. They did nothing wrong.. Beyond that.. I will certainly never say no to anything free.. But I am not going to complain if it isn't.. I have over 3k in coins.. My wife has over 4k.. We both have more than enough to unlock the Cathar the moment they go live.. It isn't going to cost us a thing.. Other than some Cartel Coins.. Which we get for free.. Am I going to get the Cathar?? Don't know.. My wife certainly will.. She is excited.. I probably will just to fuss around with it and see what they look like.. I mean it isn't costing me anything.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason_ralph Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 AH! I think I missed that one >.< /popcorn only gets a +5 /pretzles&beer gets a +1 -- unless it's a really good beer. Because I hate pretzles. /jawaeatingpopcorndrinkingabeer would've gotten a +1mil, and would've created cuteness with the destructive power beyond that reachable by dividing by zero. Clearly, it's the end of the day for me, and my brain has lost all of the caffeine I've poured into it all day. >.< Beer is home brewed; it's a court thing (I live in a court), and we have brewing contests... Weekendly. Oh, and can I nominate Collector's Edition owners on getting a Jawa skin? Reason: about 99.99999% of the community would love to punt us off of the fleet... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilora Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 Inb4 the CE owners pile on note: I am a CE owner, but I do not subscribe to the classic CE owner entitlement demands..... and they hates me for it too. Hahaha :-D I suppose I should've added that in, as well, as another "or". Best solution? Probably would've been to give subscribers the abillity to buy them with in-game credits /OR/ CCs. Personally? I'd still use the CCs >.< But, We wouldn't have to worry about F2Pers or Preffereds QQing about it! HAH! They can't access the forums, can they! SWEETNESS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jason_ralph Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 Inb4 the CE owners pile on note: I am a CE owner, but I do not subscribe to the classic CE owner entitlement demands..... and they hates me for it too. Hate is too strong of a word... The scene from Mr & Mrs Smith with John talking to the therapist and how he'd like to strangle Jane is more accurate.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajikMyst Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 I still think, from a marketing/PR perspective, they should've thrown "Founders" a bone. "Anyone who has the Founder title will have the Cathar unlocked for free." or "Anyone who purchases a 3-month subscription to the game, will be able to purchase Cathar with in-game credits." I don't really care about how they did it, because I don't really have much interest in playing Cathar. But I would've loved to be part of the discussion on that -- just to see the reasoning behind some of the things they've done. I don't know.. I think some other folks are right on this one.. It would just open it up to more QQ from whatever group of folks that subscribe aren't getting it.. I am a 6 month subber, I have the CE, and I am a founder.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kilora Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 Beer is home brewed; it's a court thing (I live in a court), and we have brewing contests... Weekendly. Oh, and can I nominate Collector's Edition owners on getting a Jawa skin? Reason: about 99.99999% of the community would love to punt us off of the fleet... Hahahahahahahaha. I would pay BW $60 for an expac that included only one thing. Jawa punting. Also, beer that is homebrewed is always a win. Even if it tastes nasty -- the fact that it's homebrewed makes me happy. Especially if said homebrewer gets better >.< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlbo_Nabbins Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 Wow, we agree. I'm charged ~$15 a month for my subscription, so it's not free of charge and neither is the CC stipend. If the CCs are free, then every other thing included with a subscription is also free and the monthly fee is, what, a processing fee to allow us access to all the game features we get for free? No that is a truly stupid premise. When I stay in a hotel and I get a free breakfast it is a Free breakfast. When I go to the supermarket and "buy one get one free" then the second one is indeed free. The $15 pays for the subscription, the CC are complimentary and free, they are a reward for subscribing. The incentive for subscribing is not the CC, its the removal of all the restriction on accessing content that is applied to people who are not subscribers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlbo_Nabbins Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 No, actually I can prove it. Musco posted (go search dev tracker) that they do, in fact, consider the subscriber stipend when producing cartel coin driven content. Which is not a bad statement to make. Of course BW can consider the stipend - so that items are priced at a level that means that subs do not need to spend extra cash to get the things that are added to the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
branmakmuffin Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 (edited) No that is a truly stupid premise. Then it must be yours. When I stay in a hotel and I get a free breakfast it is a Free breakfast. When I go to the supermarket and "buy one get one free" then the second one is indeed free. The $15 pays for the subscription, the CC are complimentary and free, they are a reward for subscribing. They are an inventive to subscribe, same as the breakfast is an inventive to stay at the hotel. Duh. The incentive for subscribing is not the CC, its the removal of all the restriction on accessing content that is applied to people who are not subscribers. CC, removal of restrictions, conceptually the same: incentives to subscribe. But keep arguing if you like. Sorry, your edit isn't included in the quote. But give me a break! A new species is NOT QUALITY OF LIFE. It's freaking customization fluff! Dude, relax. It's not worth bursting an artery over. It's a freakin' computer game. New species, armor dye, haircuts, FPs, OPs, WZs, it's all game content, whatever you choose to personally call them. Edited April 30, 2013 by branmakmuffin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlbo_Nabbins Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 They are an inventive to subscribe, same as the breakfast is an inventive to stay at the hotel. Duh. Whether they are an incentive or not is irrelevant (and not something I was even referring to), the fact is that they are free, something that you claimed was not the case. That free breakfast is free, that 2nd item in a BoGoF is also free. So duh. But I have noticed that you do like to move the goalposts as soon as your arguments are shown to be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 The incentive for subscribing is not the CC, its the removal of all the restriction on accessing content that is applied to people who are not subscribers. Actually.. I think you are right about that.... considering the difference between sub and free in this MMO. The CCs are a reward for being a smart consumer more so then an incentive to subscribe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
branmakmuffin Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 Whether they are an incentive or not is irrelevant That is of utmost relevance re: the discussion about whether a sub's monthly CC stipend is free or simply one of the many features (compared to Preferred/F2P) subs get as part of what they pay for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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