Operative roll

[Zunayson]

No you can't my carnage marauder says so

 

No, force speed is a 2.5 modifier, you have a 1.8 modifier.

 

He'd win all day with a free off gcd talented to remove roots move. Instead operatives get a 1/4th of resource, distance cut by half when snared, not usable while rooted, on the gcd roll

 

When you end up comparing it, you see how bad the roll really is compared to speed.

 

also because im feeling lulzy

 

This skill was modeled based on what?

What was the operative modeled off? LOL exactly. I think operatives being agile fast rolling assassins makes more sense than a rolling sniper.

 

Who's retarded idea was it to have an operative non force sensitive character roll non-stop at the speed of light

It's like you're saying operatives don't deserve to roll because they don't have the force. Let's take away the sniper's roll, since theirs is "at the speed of light too." But you don't want it taken away because you get raped by operatives and then whine on the forums.

 

Have you seen how they can run from the spawn to middle in huttball in five seconds 10 seconds earlier than the rest of their team

Yeah, I know they can get there faster. Whats your point? someone has to be the fastest. Did you know assassins can kill people 5 or 10 seconds faster than everyone else? true story, I have vids of chained 8.7k hits.

 

BIoware are you stupid or are you deliberately giving classes overpowered skill to compensate for how unbalance and weak you made them in the beggining?

Technically, operatives were pretty good at the very beginning (You probably weren't there to witness it, though), but were nerfed to the ground over the next couple of months even though I can give you five reasons why anyone could have been as powerful as an operative. They just got blamed because they're melee DPS and they knock you down so it's obvious when they attack you.

 

How can they roll and not drop the ball in huttball

How can you speed and not drop the huttball?

 

You guys have a moronic idea of what pvp should be like.

Tell me more about the evidence you have for such an objective fact.

 

No delay on that cover roll

Dunno exactly what you mean, but there is a delay of 1/2 a second of being rooted after the roll, otherwise we could do jump rolling and bounce rolling (I mastered the former yet not the latter) to increase it's range.

 

I think your developer team are Indian freeleancers that don't even bother testing a skill before implementing it.

Reported for racism.

 

I want to see a novel that speaks about this operative who's special skill was to roll and could roll around a planet in five minutes.

You couldn't even use a normal 110% mount to cross correlia in five minutes. I want to see a novel in the first place about operatives.

 

Idiot.

Edited April 21, 2013 by Zunayson

[Zorash]

As an assasin I would gladly put a CD on maul if it meant taking out the CD in force speed (based on your example). Instead of bothering actually having to pvp I would be winning matches by beating opponents to every objective (which is what's happening) in every warzone not to mention a wonderful grief utility skill for open world ganking. As a healer whenever you get targeted you can roll into the other side of the map and heal yourself. It's dumb no matter how you look at it.

 

WOW your lack of reading comprehension is astounding. My point was that taking only part of an ability to compare it IE leap to roll that roll needs a cooldown is dumb when you ignore the context of my class, i said that quite a few times. Apparently, it's that hard for you to read.

 

No where was i advocating to put a CD on maul or remove the CD on force speed.

Edited April 21, 2013 by Zorash

[Jurakan]

You are defending something that is undefendable which makes you look stupid and desperate to cling on to something wrong just to boost your pathetic chances of ever winning a match without rolling into the horizon in 1.2 seconds to save your own ***. Your essay is as stupid as you are so don't worry about my reading comprehension skills. You have bigger fish to fry. If force speed had no delay you would be criying like a baby asking for it to put a CD on it and we both know it would be OP. But no it has a 1 min cd which is fair otherwise I could run a lap around huttball in what? 10 seconds? idiot.

 

Look at the guy up top talking about mounts as if that had anything to do with the subject. Not even gonna bother with this wimps. When they fix that skill and they will, both of you reroll or quit. That much I am willing to bet. Don't tell me you both play healer ops right? You love rolling into the horizon when you get focused and you enjoy not dying with your pathetic pve gear simply by spamming a skill that should not be spammable. Am I right?

Edited April 22, 2013 by Jurakan

[Kegparty]

What did I miss? My op can now roll

 

Force Speed (inquis) distance takes roughly 4.3 sec

Same distance using roll 6.2 sec

 

Force Speed = no resource

3 rolls = HUGE amount of resource

[sanchito]

The thing that seriously annoys me with this ability is that the animations can't keep up most of the times, so the guy rolling ends up lagging all over the place.

[Jurakan]

Note how all the ops rerolls are waaa waaaa waaaaaaaa we can't survive without rolling into the horizon and camping there until everyone unfocuses me and I can roll back into safety. Wimps. Edited April 22, 2013 by Jurakan

[Maxtofunator]

Ok, so we don't have a CD on our skill. So what? Leap and force speed are all FREE abilities, not abilities that cost 1/5 of your resource, with one use almost knocking you out of the ideal range of energy recovery. Sith warriors have a 30m FREE leap that gives them their resource so that they can use a slow, and then jugs/guardians have ANOTHER leap. Sorcs simply have force speed, free, with a longer range from 1 force speed than 12m, oh wait a second, did I just throw something truthful out? Yeah, in a short race, the inquisitor/consular will win, trust me, I've tested it. Over time, yeah, scoundrels/op will win a race [we're more cross country than short distance, but that's ok because we can't fight ANYTHING afterwards in cap games/voidstar]. Now, assassins can be COMPLETELY IMMUNE while using force speed, and then simply have a sorc/sage PULL them an extra bit of the way. If anything, this is making the class VIABLE.

 

Yes, I played and won a lot prior to 2.0 on my scoundrel, and I have always played him DPS. I play with friends, one of whom is a shadow and one is a guardian, who both always had to be our ball carrier, and prior to this I just stood in the enemy warzone stealthed to be guardian leaped to, or passed to at the last second. I am glad that I am finally USEFUL in warzones for more than just ninja capping side points, or healer harrassing.

 

If you want to give us a CD on this skill, either GET rid of the energy cost, give us a 25m range, or somewhere in the middle, 10 energy with like a 20m range and maybe, what, a 20s CD? That would make most OP/scoundrel happy because then at least we still have a gap closer, BEING THE ONLY MELEE CLASS WITHOUT ONE

[Wainamoinen]

I read the thread. For others: tl;dr:

 

Assassin: Operative can do something better than me! No fair! Nerf him!

[Maxtofunator]

What did I miss? My op can now roll

 

Force Speed (inquis) distance takes roughly 4.3 sec

Same distance using roll 6.2 sec

 

Force Speed = no resource

3 rolls = HUGE amount of resource

 

QFT. Seriously. Test this, We don't get to ANY NODES at the start of a match to steal the cap from anybody. If your team doesn't send an assassin/shadow to your node in a real game TO BEGIN WITH then that is a huge l2p issue, and that is what you should address. It is simply your fault if you send some class that has no range and no gap closer to the side nodes. OH WAIT! DOESN'T EXIST.

 

I have tried to steal side nodes more than once, and it never works, at most I make it there fast enough to stop them, but then again, so can warrior/knights and consulars/inquisitors. Seems fair to me, but like stated before, they can actually FIGHT once they get there, I just sort of waste all my energy regen skills to fight or autoattack to keep him busy while i wait on backup.

 

And no, we are defending an ability that is keeping us ON PAR in terms of mobility and useful in pvp as EVERY OTHER CLASS. You are just like everyone at launch crying for us to be nerfed because you can't figure out that there are HARD, and when I say hard, i mean hard as a diamond, hard counters to this ability, and it comes at a great GREAT cost to us, unlike force speed. So yeah, if you make roll free, and make it cover the same amount of distance in the same time as force speed, then yeah, take away force speeds CD. Also, take away our being impaired during roll like force speed. I am okay with that. Also, let us roll at both allies and enemies no matter where they are in relationship to us on anything other than the X axis. Totally fine with that buff too.

 

I know you probably don't understand class balance by reading EVERYTHING that you have stated for why this ability needs to be nerfed, despite A TON of us coming in here, both op/scoundrels and non-op/non-scoundrels telling you why this ability needs to be there.

Prior to 2.0, my marauder was my favorite character to play in huttball, now they are tied. Ok truthfully, I just recently made both a sorc and sage and that is my favorite, but that is for another reason, when it comes to objectively speaking, my marauder and scoundrel are equal.

[LarryRow]

Dude. Electro Net them. GG

 

Does Dodge remove Electronet? Because it removes every other root and snare that people are insisting will "counter" spammable roll.

 

Operatives were useless in huttball. They need spammable roll

They can heal. They can stealth ahead for passes. They can kill fotm snipers. They have plenty to do without spammable roll. Having the ball and being able to roll on a 6 second cd would still be crazy powerful. They don't need to also be able to get the ball first and hand it off the to the tank Jugg, uncontested, at the beginning of every match.

 

Sorry, but you haven't played a Gaurdian or Juggernaut then.. they can cover like half the huttball map with NO COST, and are able to INCREASE HEIGHT by jumping up.

 

Please tell us more about how Guardians don't require a target for this leap of theirs. Blame the idiot who allowed the leap, not the leaper.

[LovarBoy]

Note how all the ops rerolls are waaa waaaa waaaaaaaa we can't survive without rolling into the horizon and camping there until everyone unfocuses me and I can roll back into safety. Wimps.

 

Sorry, but your postings are laughable. It's obvious that some Operative / Scoundrels made fun of you ( Assassin? ) while using Scamper.

 

Be serious.

 

You want to give a >> 6m/12m + 1/4 of resource << skill a Cooldown? A Cooldown, when Jumps that give you ressource and have a range of 30m only got a ~ 12sec CD? Or Force Speed, that boosts your running speed in a big amount and you can go 30-40m in that time, without energy cost?

 

Are you serious? No you are not. You make just ridiculous postings regarding an ability you actually don't know.

[JouerTue]

Please tell me what ability also lets u safely cross the fire pits in huttball?

 

force speed, guardian leap, force jump, pulls.

[JaingSkiratapwns]

It needs modified in some way due to its game breaking Ina wiz like voidstar, you can get far enough ahead that the other team doesn't even have a shot at catching up. And on novarre coast and civil war, there's no chance of taking a side turret from them, they just come rolling up and interrupt you. And don't get me started on how ridiculous operative medic is with the roll.

 

 

My suggestion would be buff it some and put it on a cool down. Because if it doesn't get a buff but a cd it just becomes a poor mans hightail it. I'd make it a 12 meter roll and a 20 sec cd, with snares not affecting its range, same as sniper/slinger.

Edited April 22, 2013 by JaingSkiratapwns

[HollowVamp]

This skill was modeled based on what? Who's retarded idea was it to have an operative non force sensitive character roll non-stop at the speed of light? Have you seen how they can run from the spawn to middle in huttball in five seconds 10 seconds earlier than the rest of their team? BIoware are you stupid or are you deliberately giving classes overpowered skill to compensate for how unbalance and weak you made them in the beggining? How can they roll and not drop the ball in huttball? You guys have a moronic idea of what pvp should be like. No delay on that cover roll? I think your developer team are Indian freeleancers that don't even bother testing a skill before implementing it. I want to see a novel that speaks about this operative who's special skill was to roll and could roll around a planet in five minutes. Idiots.

 

want to know what its based on? WoW monks.

[Seireeni]

My suggestion would be buff it some and put it on a cool down. Because if it doesn't get a buff but a cd it just becomes a poor mans hightail it. I'd make it a 12 meter roll and a 20 sec cd, with snares not affecting its range, same as sniper/slinger.

 

Actually, sniper roll is 18m.

[Zorash]

They can heal. They can stealth ahead for passes. They can kill fotm snipers. They have plenty to do without spammable roll. Having the ball and being able to roll on a 6 second cd would still be crazy powerful. They don't need to also be able to get the ball first and hand it off the to the tank Jugg, uncontested, at the beginning of every match. .

 

They have plenty to do but are subpar at it. Lets look at everything you stated they can do.

 

1) stealthing for passes

 

Assassins are 10x better with speed burst that takes you farther then 6m, 3s immunity to force/tech attacks, so immune to a majority of CCs. Can knockback ppl that are near the ledge so he can get a free open pass.

 

2) kill FOTM snipers

 

Assassins are better because they have higher burst and if they're losing the fight they can always knock the sniper off forcing him to find a new position or get stomped by all the melee below.

 

LOL 6s cooldown that costs 1/4 of my energy, that takes me 6m eway. Ok, so I run 1m faster per second then anyone assuming i had the energy to blow it on CD. How is that an even remotely good ability? I can spend 20+ seconds running away with roll spending a ton of energy just to have an assassin catch up to me with 1 speed burst.

 

Putting a 6s CD on it makes it worse then leap, which gives resources and can jump up ledges. Speed burst which will cover more distance in the 20s CD. On top of that speed burst costs zero resources and they didn't have to spend multiple GCDs to get anywhere.

Edited April 22, 2013 by Zorash

[LarryRow]

They have plenty to do but are subpar at it. Lets look at everything you stated they can do.

 

1) stealthing for passes

 

Assassins are a little better with speed burst that takes you farther then 6m, but on a medium cooldown, 3s immunity to force/tech attacks on a much longer cooldown, so immune to a majority of CCs. Can knockback ppl that are near the ledge so he can get a free open pass.

 

2) kill FOTM snipers

 

Assassins are better because they have higher burst and if they're losing the fight they can always knock the sniper off forcing him to find a new position or get stomped by all the melee below.

 

LOL 6s cooldown that costs 1/4 of my energy, although by the time it was off cd I'd have my energy back that takes me 6m away, 12 if not snared or I use Dodge. Ok, so I run 1m faster per second.....I cut out this part because it didn't make any sense, as if somehow a 12-m teleport every six seconds is worthless vs force speed.

 

Putting a 6s CD on it makes it worse then leap, which gives resources to a class that has to build resources to have any and can jump up ledges, but only to a target. Speed burst which will cover more distance in the 20s CD. On top of that speed burst costs zero resources and they didn't have to spend multiple GCDs to get anywhere.

 

I did my best to tidy up your immature rant that conveniently ignored a lot of important points.

[Zorash]

I did my best to tidy up your immature rant that conveniently ignored a lot of important points.

 

My post is so bad you proclaim but you didn't correct me. Clearly like I said assassins>>>operatives at the stealthing role, you didn't prove any evidence against that nor did you provide it against snipers.

 

You didn't even provide evidence how speed burst or leap is worse then operative roll on a 6s CD or even without a CD. Clearly you're the immature one when you can't even provide a rational argument that disproves anything I said.

[JaingSkiratapwns]

Actually, sniper roll is 18m.

 

That dawned on me right after I posted it, I was just heading out the door so I couldn't fix it.

 

 

Another idea that I thought of was turn the roll into more of a force run like ability. Breaks roots, 3 seconds of increased speed, 20 sec cd.

[LarryRow]

My post is so bad you proclaim but you didn't correct me. Clearly like I said assassins>>>operatives at the stealthing role, you didn't prove any evidence against that nor did you provide it against snipers.

 

You didn't even provide evidence how speed burst or leap is worse then operative roll on a 6s CD or even without a CD. Clearly you're the immature one when you can't even provide a rational argument that disproves anything I said.

 

This is not a surprising response coming from someone who is only seeing one side of an argument and has no desire to entertain the other side. Operatives have plenty of advantages compared to Assassins, but you only want to compare the aspects that support your argument.

 

My entire point was that a 6 second, or even a 4 second, cooldown on this obviously broken ability would make it balanced against some of the other utility abilities that other classes have.

[Zorash]

This is not a surprising response coming from someone who is only seeing one side of an argument and has no desire to entertain the other side. Operatives have plenty of advantages compared to Assassins, but you only want to compare the aspects that support your argument.

 

My entire point was that a 6 second, or even a 4 second, cooldown on this obviously broken ability would make it balanced against some of the other utility abilities that other classes have.

 

I am so biased yet you didn't disprove anything I said. There is no way an operative is better at stealthing at the goal line than assassin, which I proved with evidence. Yet, you don't provide any. I know what I am talking about it's obvious you don't.

 

Any team ranked team that brings an operative with a 4s CD or 6s CD on the roll over an assassin for goal line stealthing is just plain bad.

 

Show me why operatives are so good? Even in your previous example you stated what an operative can do in huttball and I showed exactly why operatives are inferior to assassins in the role you provided. It's obvious you're the one who doesn't have an argument given that you can't disprove mine.

 

In the end you're just another troll.

Edited April 22, 2013 by Zorash

[LarryRow]

I am so biased yet you didn't disprove anything I said. There is no way an operative is better at stealthing at the goal line than assassin, which I proved with evidence. Yet, you don't provide any. I know what I am talking about it's obvious you don't.

 

Any team ranked team that brings an operative with a 4s CD or 6s CD on the roll over an assassin for goal line stealthing is just plain bad.

 

Show me why operatives are so good? Even in your previous example you stated what an operative can do in huttball and I showed exactly why operatives are inferior to assassins in the role you provided. It's obvious you're the one who doesn't have an argument given that you can't disprove mine.

 

In the end you're just another troll.

 

lol, u mad kid? Afraid someone will take your new toy away?

 

I am not going to list all the things that operatives and assassins can do, because you are so good at the game you know them already. Of course, you are lying and probably a horribad (I really like your sig and avatar by the way) so it won't do any good either way.

 

Maybe expand your head for a second to realize that stealthing to the goal line isn't all that operatives and assassins do in huttball, and you may even mature a couple of years.

 

In the end, you're just another brat.

 

/thread

[Coldin]

Sorry...but the Operative roll is simply too costly that you'll have "all your energy back" by the time it finishes. If you wait for energy to return, it takes about 3 seconds, time enough for at least one more roll. If you use the roll 3 times, guess what? You're down to less than 50% energy and into the bad zone of energy regen. It's very difficult to get one's energy back if they manage to get it to near zero. The only thing that helps us here is a long cooldown, and that's only a partial energy restore. Unfortunately, the alacrity changes haven't done much for our energy regen rates. Simply takes too much alacrity to make a noticeable difference.

[Aetrus]

Because Adrenaline Probe and Stim Boost do nothing for energy regen, right?

 

You shouldn't be able to roll with the ball in Huttball, just like you can't stealth with the ball. And it should probably have a small 5-6 second CD that doesn't set off the global cooldown. Operatives need to be mobile in combat and Exfiltrate does that. But there's no way they should be able to beat out Force Speed or Carnage Predation easily by chaining back-to-back-to-back rolls.

Edited April 22, 2013 by AnusReaper

[Butwaldgrim]

Because Adrenaline Probe and Stim Boost do nothing for energy regen, right?

 

You shouldn't be able to roll with the ball in Huttball, just like you can't stealth with the ball. And it should probably have a small 5-6 second CD that doesn't set off the global cooldown. Operatives need to be mobile in combat and Exfiltrate does that. But there's no way they should be able to beat out Force Speed or Carnage Predation easily by chaining back-to-back-to-back rolls.

 

I don't want to take away anything from what you are saying, but I just start laughing when a guy named "AnusReaper" is making such a serious statement. This coming from a guy named 'Butwaldgrim". LOL!