Does sniper have any counter now?

[PoliteAssasin]

Don't worry it wasnt addressed to you, whoever you are. I think I'll be able to sleep tonight. Edited February 23, 2013 by PoliteAssasin

[TonyDragonflame]

Snipers are artillery... you cant win war without them, but you cannot win war also only with them.

 

They are good as is, ever with new abilities. Quite good balanced class.

Very good snipers can kill any my chars but I'm dont anger about it. Its not frustrated as fight with assasin, cuz you are dont die stunned and always can planning your fight, and using LoS.

[AsheraII]

1v1

Snipers and Gunslingers don't exactly fall into the regular rock/paper/scissors game. Instead, they're part of the "who gets the jump" game, like the stealthing Operatives/Scoundrels and Shadows/Assassins. But give them a finger, and they'll take your whole hand with it. Still a good staelther getting the jump on a sniper/scoundrel should normally win.

 

Now, some classes are NOT part of that "get the jump" game: knights/warriors, BH/Troopers and sages/sorcs. If they got the jump on some Sniper looking in the wrong direction, then I think a good pyrotech/Assault or a good sage/sorc would have the best chance of winning the race. A knight or warrior simply does not.

 

Does the increased stealth detection change all this? I think it will depend a lot on strategy and which warzone we're talking. A sniper protecting a node at Novara Coast will be a tough nut to crack for a stealther. On the other hand, in a Huttball game, everything is much more mobile. A sniper would really have to stay put guarding his own ramp to get that detection up. And that's just not gonna happen. Keeping their own ramp clean is what Snipers do best, but it still involves a lot of running around and repositioning. So there will still be plenty opportunity for stealthers to sneak past or simply get the jump on them.

 

1vX

One sniper vs multiple enemies? Yes, it happens. It generally doesn't look good for the sniper, as long as the enemies keep some very simple rules.

1. Keep their healer out of the fight! Either stay out of LOS, or have the healer just outside attack range for the first 5-6 seconds. You do NOT want your healer singled out and killed.

2. Keep CC's up. Sniper damage has to ramp up, so stun him, and you slow down the ramp up. He should be dead before the big hitters start flowing. Repeat 5k+ hits excluding crits are completely normal for a sniper if you let him set up properly and proceed. I've survived Marauders who brought me down to 50% while they were still over 80% at some point, simply because they never interrupted my rotation, and let me proceed through the entire explosive probe -> shattershot -> series of shots - takedown sequence. Stupid, yes.

 

XvX

Kill the healer? Yes, and kill that pesky sniper right after!

As long as you leave the sniper alive, for EVERY enemy your team takes down, the sniper takes down a member of your team, on top of the people taken down by the rest of the snipers' team. A 2v2 quickly turns into a 1v0 when the first team has a sniper and the second team does not. A 4v4 turns into a 3v2 when the first team has a sniper while the second team does not.

And remember, keep your healers outside the snipers' sights where possible, whether it's LOS or range.

If your team has a stealther, then let the sniper blow one or two cooldowns before the stealther uncloaks and takes care of the sniper. Whether it's through CC or backstabbing, the stealther is the one that's most suited to handling the sniper. Even with the coming detectionbuff. When the sniper is looking at the fight infront of him, he's not looking at what's coming from behind. But he did just waste one or two of his cooldowns that would've saved him in the ensueing 1v1 against a stealther.

A persistant sniper staying on his initial target might still get that kill, but he won't survive against a good stealther anymore, not even if he switches target right away.

[Zunayson]

What class are you playing? You seem to have a lack of understanding how to use the tools at your disposal to beat a sniper.

 

Considering concealment's exfiltrate, we can laugh at a sniper pretty well...

[PoliteAssasin]

Again saying that knights and warriors can't beat snipers is simply false. I wonder what the skill level is on your server, because if the knights and warriors I've seen on the PTS are of any indication, they don't have a clue as to what they're doing. Even if a sniper gets the jump on me, I'm still going to kill it. And I know of other sentinels who function the same. We have more ways of dealing with your class than you have with ours. And this is taking into account all three specs. I solo queue 99% of the time, the only reason I have no problems going in alone is because I know how I counter every class I will come across, as I've played them all to lean their weaknesses. The only class I as a sentinel have an issue besting is an equally skilled tankasin. Snipers? They're a joke. I see them brag all the time about how they are our anti class when in fact they're not. They're anti bads. I always pick them out of a crowd just to remind them what my class is capable of, killing them. Now you can tell yourself whatever you like to make you feel better, but the reality is that your class isn't good for 1v1ing anything, let alone a sentinel or marauder. all of the classes that had no issues with them before will continue to best them in combat.

[Sydexlic]

Face it, the game is no longer Star Wars : the Warrior Republic. All I hope now is that all the warriortards won't FoTM reroll to sniper now.

[Keldaur]

Again saying that knights and warriors can't beat snipers is simply false. I wonder what the skill level is on your server, because if the knights and warriors I've seen on the PTS are of any indication, they don't have a clue as to what they're doing. Even if a sniper gets the jump on me, I'm still going to kill it. And I know of other sentinels who function the same. We have more ways of dealing with your class than you have with ours. And this is taking into account all three specs. I solo queue 99% of the time, the only reason I have no problems going in alone is because I know how I counter every class I will come across, as I've played them all to lean their weaknesses. The only class I as a sentinel have an issue besting is an equally skilled tankasin. Snipers? They're a joke. I see them brag all the time about how they are our anti class when in fact they're not. They're anti bads. I always pick them out of a crowd just to remind them what my class is capable of, killing them. Now you can tell yourself whatever you like to make you feel better, but the reality is that your class isn't good for 1v1ing anything, let alone a sentinel or marauder. all of the classes that had no issues with them before will continue to best them in combat.

 

MM hardcounters smashbrothers on 1on1.

 

Also on my sniper i never focus marauders if he is not the focus, the reason is because i can root, blind, stun, root, knockback them till they sit down in a corner looking pretty, but i have to concede that is something really rare to find if you are pugging.

[PoliteAssasin]

I've never fought snipers as a smasher, don't really use that spec. But as a watchman or combat, you can Knockback, root, and stun all you like, you won't prevent me from killing you.

 

 

Face it, the game is no longer Star Wars : the Warrior Republic. All I hope now is that all the warriortards won't FoTM reroll to sniper now.

 

You're right this new update does seem to favor ranged now. Its really hard to say how things will be for certain with the exploit, but in the coming days we will find out. From my time playing the PTS before people caught on to the exploit I didn't see much of a difference on my sentinel however. But I will also point out that we aren't able to fully optimize our gear, and people haven't gotten used to their new trees/abilities. I'm looking forward to seeing for myself if melee is finished or not. But atm I'm confident it should be fine.

Edited February 24, 2013 by PoliteAssasin

[Smashbrother]

mm hardcounters smashbrothers on 1on1.

 

Also on my sniper i never focus marauders if he is not the focus, the reason is because i can root, blind, stun, root, knockback them till they sit down in a corner looking pretty, but i have to concede that is something really rare to find if you are pugging.

 

lolwut?!

[Smashbrother]

Again saying that knights and warriors can't beat snipers is simply false. I wonder what the skill level is on your server, because if the knights and warriors I've seen on the PTS are of any indication, they don't have a clue as to what they're doing. Even if a sniper gets the jump on me, I'm still going to kill it. And I know of other sentinels who function the same. We have more ways of dealing with your class than you have with ours. And this is taking into account all three specs. I solo queue 99% of the time, the only reason I have no problems going in alone is because I know how I counter every class I will come across, as I've played them all to lean their weaknesses. The only class I as a sentinel have an issue besting is an equally skilled tankasin. Snipers? They're a joke. I see them brag all the time about how they are our anti class when in fact they're not. They're anti bads. I always pick them out of a crowd just to remind them what my class is capable of, killing them. Now you can tell yourself whatever you like to make you feel better, but the reality is that your class isn't good for 1v1ing anything, let alone a sentinel or marauder. all of the classes that had no issues with them before will continue to best them in combat.

 

That doesn't prove much. They most likely already used their cds on someone else, which will make them easy kills.

 

Duel some good ones w/o starting fight standing next to them, and see how it goes.

[dcgregorya]

In the past, it was sniper > marauder, assassin > sniper.

With snipers now able to detect stealth and adding a roll to their arsenal, I don't see how sniper can lose to really much of anything.

 

Did I miss something here?

 

In 1vs1? Not that 1vs1 matters but these classes should win or at least have a great chance of winning vs snipers :

 

1) Marauders - any spec

2) Juggernauts

3) Pyro PT

4) Sorcs (especially madness)

5) Mercenaries (especially pyro)

6) Assassins - tank or madness

 

Snipers are ok, but once you know their rotation, you win. Seriously, play a sniper to 50, you'll have no trouble killing them after that.

[PoliteAssasin]

That doesn't prove much. They most likely already used their cds on someone else, which will make them easy kills.

 

Duel some good ones w/o starting fight standing next to them, and see how it goes.

 

I actually already did. Dueling is one thing I'm big on, can't assess an individuals skill without fighting them in a pure 1v1. Dueled my servers best sniper, he tried all 3 specs and still couldn't beat me. I have an answer for everything they're going to throw my way. Its not skill, its just class counters.

 

You make it seem like I'm drawing my conclusion base on warzone encounters, when in fact its the snipers who fight people who are unaware or without cooldowns and figure they're that classes counter.

 

 

 

The poster above has it right. They're good for support, but 1v1s they do terrible.

Edited February 24, 2013 by PoliteAssasin

[dcgregorya]

Right now, as a combat sent, if I am able to get into melee range of a sniper without him noticing / targeting me, I win. If he sees me at 30m, he wins. I consider this a perfectly fine balance. But with the new 18m roll, this goes out for a toss. Earlier the best he could do to open gap was flashbang + run. Now, he just rolls 18m away from me. The roll breaks roots, so crippling throw won't work. Basically, this tips the balance completely in favor of the sniper.

 

As a sentinel, I have 2 choices for dealing with snipers now:

a> Only fight those foolish enough to position themselves close to walls / pillars

b> Spec focus and ignore snipers

 

Guess with the semi-buff to focus (who in the right mind buffs focus ?!) and the even more pathetic ramp up of watchman (watchman now needs 30 sec to ramp up), which one I am going to spec for PvP ?

 

c) Use cloak to close if non-carnage or combat.

d) Go carnage/combat for the root break on cloak.

e) Time saber ward to block their ambush + series of shots when necessary.

f) Obfuscate? -90% accuracy sound useful to you against a class that has almost no tech attacks?

g) Profit.

 

Honestly there's no reason you should ever die to a sniper since there's almost always someone else to jump to in order to create gap - I don't really see the issue. So what if they roll away? Leap to someone near them or walk in the opposite direction to force them to come towards *you* (then use leap).

Edited February 24, 2013 by dcgregorya

[muhidin]

lolwut?!

 

 

30% dmg absorbed from ballistic dampeners, 60% aoe dmg reduction when entrench is up, a sniper can effectively reduce a smash to cause well...very little damage, or no damage if he pops a shield probe or drops ballistic shields to rub it in.

 

It's possible to kill a sniper as a mara, but it is also very possible to do the opposite, speaking as someone who has leveled both classes to 50 and has a decent understanding of their playstyles and cooldowns, the trick is to know what to look for:

 

i.e don't hit a mara when he has rebuke or undying pain up, make sure to save target acquired for his saber ward, i.e. refresh ballistic dampeners and do not under any circumstances fill his resolve, make ample use of leg shot, and in the off chance that's he's dumb enough to use his escape, debilitate his ***.

 

I swear to god as a sniper whenever I lost to maras it was because I tried facerolling him, you can't faceroll a mara, they just have too much utility for it to work, you gotta play smart and don't fall for the los trick in which you get out of cover to chase him while he's pillar humping giving him a free leap.

[dcgregorya]

It's possible to kill a sniper as a mara, but it is also very possible to do the opposite, speaking as someone who has leveled both classes to 50 and has a decent understanding of their playstyles and cooldowns, the trick is to know what to look for:

 

Yup. Generally these two will boil down to skill. I do however give the edge to the marauder, because he has the ability to escape, whereas the sniper does not (and probably still won't with the 18m roll).

[muhidin]

c) Use cloak to close if non-carnage or combat.

d) Go carnage/combat for the root break on cloak.

e) Time saber ward to block their ambush + series of shots when necessary.

f) Obfuscate? -90% accuracy sound useful to you against a class that has almost no tech attacks?

g) Profit.

 

Honestly there's no reason you should ever die to a sniper since there's almost always someone else to jump to in order to create gap - I don't really see the issue. So what if they roll away? Leap to someone near them or walk in the opposite direction to force them to come towards *you* (then use leap).

c)smart actually, in most cases a sniper will always get the first hit, but ingenious use of cloak throws this up in the air for either party.

d) Leg shot or knockback? In either case if you cloak against one I can just use the other on you.

e) target acquired 30% accuracy boost and 15% armor pen, I love using this on maras/juggs with saber ward up, and because of the comparable cooldowns, he'll always have his target acquired when you pop saber ward.

f) flashbang, debilitate, or if i'm feeling cocky enough i sit in cover with my ballistic dampeners and use shield probe or evasion(although i'd rather save the latter for lightsaber throws/ravage).

 

A good sniper will never fall for the get out of cover to chase me los trick, he can simply legshot you from 35m if he's quick, or simply use combat roll to close the distance without leaving cover, it's cooldown is short enough for use to make ample use of it.

Edited February 24, 2013 by muhidin

[muhidin]

Yup. Generally these two will boil down to skill. I do however give the edge to the marauder, because he has the ability to escape, whereas the sniper does not (and probably still won't with the 18m roll).

 

Maybe I'm biased in favor of sniper but I feel that with generous use of legshot and cc, a mara will be forced to use most of his cooldowns just to deny the sniper the ability to whittle him down comfortably, most snipers I see simply don't understand that we have the best cc in the game.

[BambulaGTS]

Every single major balancing patch there is a sniper new fotm talk which is ****.

 

Will never be fotm cause average dudes just can't play turret, they are quickly bored without some hot stuff like charge or stealth.

 

And I like maras talking ****. In ideal matchup (robots playing instead of players) mara should be defeated 1 on 1 if he starts from 30 m.

 

In reality you probably never get ideal matchup, cause people use to make errors. And that errors are possible from both sides.

[NoTomorrow]

Every single major balancing patch there is a sniper new fotm talk which is ****.

 

Will never be fotm cause average dudes just can't play turret, they are quickly bored without some hot stuff like charge or stealth.

 

And I like maras talking ****. In ideal matchup (robots playing instead of players) mara should be defeated 1 on 1 if he starts from 30 m.

 

In reality you probably never get ideal matchup, cause people use to make errors. And that errors are possible from both sides.

 

^^ Pretty much this. You need a special mindset to play a turret class, what i am seeing however is ppl coming from a mobile class to sniper and playing it just like some sort of assassin or something. making stupid mistakes, geting leaped to, pulled by melee.

 

As for Sniper vs. Marauder, i never underestimated this match-up and always did my best to shut them down. I admit that there are certain conditions under which marauder will win. However I'd rather have an intelligent, respectful talk with knowledgeble marauders than with the ones who just like to troll.

[muhidin]

Lol maras, even as a engineering sniper I fear los sages/sorcs far far more, with my uncleansable probe and plasma probe I can give them a chase(try chain stunning/rooting a sage inside your plasma probe, many lulz will be had), but honestly as a sniper I find that I i will never work harder to kill another class, impossible if you're mm and he humps those pillars all day, diff with leth tho.

 

Yep i know, operatives and maras blah blah, but sages are my true kryptonite. /pops flameshield

[Keldaur]

30% dmg absorbed from ballistic dampeners, 60% aoe dmg reduction when entrench is up, a sniper can effectively reduce a smash to cause well...very little damage, or no damage if he pops a shield probe or drops ballistic shields to rub it in.

 

It's possible to kill a sniper as a mara, but it is also very possible to do the opposite, speaking as someone who has leveled both classes to 50 and has a decent understanding of their playstyles and cooldowns, the trick is to know what to look for:

 

i.e don't hit a mara when he has rebuke or undying pain up, make sure to save target acquired for his saber ward, i.e. refresh ballistic dampeners and do not under any circumstances fill his resolve, make ample use of leg shot, and in the off chance that's he's dumb enough to use his escape, debilitate his ***.

 

I swear to god as a sniper whenever I lost to maras it was because I tried facerolling him, you can't faceroll a mara, they just have too much utility for it to work, you gotta play smart and don't fall for the los trick in which you get out of cover to chase him while he's pillar humping giving him a free leap.

 

 

You didn't notice his nickname... "Smashbrother".

[Zunayson]

Burst, defensive cooldowns, leap immunity, now an escape mechanism also. You can't have it all. In the end of the day the other ranged classes did not really have any serious escape mechanisms, and they never had the same defensive cds and leap immunity that sniper had. The roll is force speed except better as it comes with cc immunity, while a force speed can be stunned. I just cant believe how you cannot see that force speed was unnecessary or you just trolling and want your class to have everything. Well done you got force speed now also.

 

^This: Snipers have proactive defenses, like leap immunity, but also have reactive defenses like leg shot, KB, and now roll. Mercs have reactive defenses ONLY: KB, root, and now the fishing net.

 

But I still like the no cooldownness of the scoundrel's roll bettar.

[NoTomorrow]

^This: Snipers have proactive defenses, like leap immunity, but also have reactive defenses like leg shot, KB, and now roll. Mercs have reactive defenses ONLY: KB, root, and now the fishing net.

 

But I still like the no cooldownness of the scoundrel's roll bettar.

 

The sniper stealth detection thing is basically a frontal cone only detection. From behind you really need for the stealther to horribly mess up in order to be detected.

 

Merc needs a 45s CD on his electro net. I feel like this would be an adequate response to many of their problems in the game.

Edited February 24, 2013 by NoTomorrow

[cycao]

^^ Pretty much this. You need a special mindset to play a turret class, what i am seeing however is ppl coming from a mobile class to sniper and playing it just like some sort of assassin or something. making stupid mistakes, geting leaped to, pulled by melee.

 

As for Sniper vs. Marauder, i never underestimated this match-up and always did my best to shut them down. I admit that there are certain conditions under which marauder will win. However I'd rather have an intelligent, respectful talk with knowledgeble marauders than with the ones who just like to troll.

 

Most people that play sniper thinks its easy, and they all faceroll with it and im talking left to right rolling of the face not right to left rolling of the face. Against a good sniper I get destroyed with the root on knockback and leg shot I just sit there and get torched.

[Zunayson]

The sniper stealth detection thing is basically a frontal cone only detection. From behind you really need for the stealther to horribly mess up in order to be detected.

 

Merc needs a 45s CD on his electro net. I feel like this would be an adequate response to many of their problems in the game.

 

Yes, stealth detection is yet another proactive defense.

 

Most people that play sniper thinks its easy, and they all faceroll with it and im talking left to right rolling of the face not right to left rolling of the face. Against a good sniper I get destroyed with the root on knockback and leg shot I just sit there and get torched.

 

Honestly snipers have been op like this from launch, I was like (sorry for cliche) diamond in the rough once I got followthrough, I felt like I wasnt having fun because people ran away. And when they sat infront of me, then I would unless 3 series of shots and lulz would ensue