Darth-Rammstein Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 Sounds like you're mad you're being called out as only good because you're playing an easymode class... See what I did there?! Either contribute to the conversation in a meaningful way or don't post at all. Childish remarks do nothing to prove any point. No class in this game is hard to play, the fact you think you need skill to execute any other classes rotation is laughable at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthBloodloss Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 (edited) My main is almost fully Elite War Hero geared Pyro Merc. (I always wonder what would it would be like it I picked a different class...) I have 1290 expertise and like 970 bonus damage with the 260ish relic proc. I don't remember the last time I got the 5k damage medal. Was probably 4-7 days ago. I play everyday and melt all sorts of lowbies in recruit gear. Why am I "not allowed" to crit for 5k? (Its because I'm a Merc) When I unretired my Mara, with horrible gear I was doing huge AoE crits. I never played as rage spec while leveling up, or the 1-2 weeks he was at 50 before I retired him. But in 3 minutes after spec'ing to rage and going into a WZ I was sad because of how easy it was. Edited January 8, 2013 by DarthBloodloss Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VigDiath Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 I can't lie, before I specced into Rage/Focus I enjoyed my Anni spec Mara. The issue is that I get slaughtered by other Maras/Sentinels who spec into Focus and and crit 7k per smash. It's a no brainer. It's a DPS race and the best way to beat them is to join them. When they buff Anni again, I'll go back into that tree. Actually, since I'm doing less pvp on my mara might just do it anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RogueNights Posted January 8, 2013 Share Posted January 8, 2013 I just don’t understand how people still hate smashers so much.. then again I think I know why.. I rolled one lvld it and geared it out w/ the purpose of doing pure dps (I’d previously only healed and done hybrid dps – tank..) I rolled people in lowbie so badly it was ridiculous, however when I got to 50.. I really wasn’t satisfied. In reality It comes down to the aoe affect.. and smash just not being that good if you’re not pulling off multi person smashes. Against a single target the common smash are not all that great at all, and it tends to be that way against better players… So for lack of a better way of putting it, generally the build outperforms dps wise against bad players, and under performs against good ones… hence always going to appear ridiculously op to a portion of players.. I think the question is more, if their is a mechanic that a player does not understand, how big should the disadvantage be? Smash is definitely very much on the high side, in terms of punishing people who don't play against it correctly.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rhakoth Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 No class in this game is hard to play, the fact you think you need skill to execute any other classes rotation is laughable at best. The fact I wasn't even referring to skill at all and more about making childish remarksrather than anything constructive and how they can be thrown back and you missed it completely is laughable. What I;m laughing aboyut even more is your attempt to throw it back in my face yet again shows your lack of ability to grasp simple concepts. I'll say it again - If you don't have anything of worth to say other than snide remarks in an obvious attempt to troll then stay out of the conversation because it makes you look silly at best and adds nothing of worth. Needless to say you'll still fail to see the point so I'm going to stop here and simply wish you godspeed spiderman! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomeJagoff Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 You are calling me out and you don't even know what 3 buttons to use for a smash? lol...wow. 1) Leap 2) Crush 3) ? 4) Profit Yep you guessed it. The missing step has been Smash this whole time. And the difference between fully augmented and no augments is about 50 bonus damage so that doesn't matter much really. If you don't drop several smashes for 4k in a WZ (even in recruit gear) then you need to re-arrange some hotkeys or something. Don't forget 1) Enrage 2) Leap 3) ? 4) Profit (when spec'd into unstoppable instead of crush, so Nothing can interrupt your smash after you leap, not even a bubble stun) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyDragonflame Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 Smash is definitely very much on the high side, in terms of punishing people who don't play against it correctly.. "Shii-Cho swordplay was simplistic and raw. In the hands of a master, the bladework was described as "like watching water flow over the falls."[8] However, less adept practitioners displayed much more basic and somewhat clumsy performance. In combat, Form I encouraged deliberate tactics, calling for continuous, step-by-step advancement while cutting off the opponent's angles.[15] Shii-Cho was specialized towards engaging multiple opponents, the wide, sweeping motions being ideally suited towards attacking numerous adversaries. However, Form I was not as useful against single opponents, as such enemies had complete mobility and could find a weakness in Shii-Cho's comparatively clumsy bladework. As the most simplistic form, Shii-Cho was the first form taught to initiates within the Jedi Order." http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Form_I:_Shii-Cho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HollowVamp Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) Seriously does every incompetent person in PvP have to jump on the smash train, come on guys there are 8 AC and there are so many lolsmash idiots its unreal. Just went up against a team with 5 in and its so boring playing against these teams. Please lets have a bit of variety here its just getting stupid. Instead of QQing about how op smash is, why don't you learn how to avoid it.. theyre going to enrage leap and smash, or leap choke smash... use a knockback, a cc, mez or stun, have a friend sorc with you and pull you away, etc, have and teamate pt pull him away from the group, it's teamplay Edited January 11, 2013 by HollowVamp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sowwy Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 (edited) I would understand their decision to withhold balance adjustments if the expansion was a month or so away, but it isn't. Indeed, its not due to release for quite a few months still. Their attitude seems callused from this customers perspective and its disappointing. Bubble and smash is not merely an imbalance, they're flat out breaking the pvp experience. Have the devs played against a stacked bubble/smash team? This could be used as a case-study for bad design in an MMO. I would be embarrassed had I been on the team responsible for the above class changes. And we're not even really discussing the CC issue. Instead of QQing about how op smash is, why don't you learn how to avoid it.. theyre going to enrage leap and smash, or leap choke smash... use a knockback, a cc, mez or stun, have a friend sorc with you and pull you away, etc, have and teamate pt pull him away from the group, it's teamplay 1 smaher is manageable, but thats seldom the case in today's pvp environment. Edited January 11, 2013 by Sowwy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esiqual Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 I will repeat a potential fix I have stated in many other smash/sweep threads. All they need to do it is make force potency stacks apply to bladestorm / force scream and move the force potency talents into tier 5 or 6 of the rage/focus tree to stop potential sentinal / mara hybrids. This means that their hardest hitting ability is single target but cant really miss and has a ten meter range. It also means they cant auto crit that hardest hitting base damage ability in the game and have to really on rng like everyone else in a burst spec has too. This would also fix some of their sustained dps issues because they have a auto crit sweep/smash as a follow up to that force scream. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esiqual Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 I will repeat a potential fix I have stated in many other smash/sweep threads. All they need to do it is make force potency stacks apply to bladestorm / force scream and move the force potency talents into tier 5 or 6 of the rage/focus tree to stop potential sentinal / mara hybrids. This means that their hardest hitting ability is single target but cant really miss and has a ten meter range. It also means they cant auto crit that hardest hitting base damage ability in the game and have to rely on rng like everyone else in a burst spec has too. This would also fix some of their sustained dps issues because they have a auto crit sweep/smash as a follow up to that force scream. Edit: for spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benderoni Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 In the world of Stun Wars "Smash" is definitely the biggest problem Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fellow-Canadian Posted January 11, 2013 Share Posted January 11, 2013 People are not understanding the issue. It's not that smash is OP 1 vs 1. It's that the hardest hitting ability in the game is an instant AOE. The problem becomes worse when there are several smash monkeys running around ( as there often are) smashing an area and obliterating anything standing near by. There is no defense or amount of team coordination that could possibly nullify several smash monkeys. If smash was huge spike damage on a single target only there would not be anywhere near as many complaints about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WaywardOne Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 (edited) People are not understanding the issue. It's not that smash is OP 1 vs 1. It's that the hardest hitting ability in the game is an instant AOE. The problem becomes worse when there are several smash monkeys running around ( as there often are) smashing an area and obliterating anything standing near by. There is no defense or amount of team coordination that could possibly nullify several smash monkeys. If smash was huge spike damage on a single target only there would not be anywhere near as many complaints about it. If your team stands more than 5m from each other then the most the smashers will be able to focus on is 1 or 2 of you. If you stand 10m apart a team of 4 smashers will only get one person every 10 secs assuming you don't cc/kill/taunt any of them and their target doesn't have good gear and/or one of the abilities that limits/nullifies smash damage. Presumably during that 10 seconds the remaining team can focus one or two of them. It really is not that hard. Edited January 12, 2013 by WaywardOne Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthBloodloss Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 Last night I killed the same guy 3 times within the same 10 chat lines on my screen, each death was a 5.2k+ smash. I realized at that point, that guy would never respect me as a person....lol The Mara is just another alt, but I'll admit I enjoy having sub-par Mara skills and still being able to wreck people in the few games I play each day with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zataos Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 On my server I have seen entire PVP guilds that have nothing but Smashers, Healers and Pyro's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esiqual Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 I like the general idea of a burst AOE spec in pvp not just in swtor but in many other types of pvp games. So i dont think smash should be denied a high burst attack even if it is AOE even though i think that AOE being instant damage is the wrong choice. The only thing that could be considered OP in rage/focus designing a burst spec around an auto crit ability. Giving any burst spec in any type of pvp that type of consistent damage is fundamentally designed flawed. Burst specs in any type of pvp are supposed to have a major draw back of not having any type of consistent damage numbers. By consistent i mean sustained. When you allow a burst spec to determine when its largest hitting attacks are going to do their burst then it leads to synergies that are too strong when stacked like we see with rage/focus and warriors executing the smash at the same time. Burst is supposed to have a drawback which is RNG. Thats why they should move singularity stacks to bladestorm / force scream but allow the auto crit smash to remain. Their hardest hitting ability is then single target and subject to the same RNG rules that other burst specs are governed by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthBloodloss Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 I just dislike how quickly and frequently it can be pulled off. Its not like people complain because of Smash's POTENTIAL. They are complaining because of its actual "average" damage of over 5k. If it didn't auto-crit AND get +100% damage bonus, it wouldn't hit for that much every time.Or if they couldn't use crush AND choke to build stacks.Or if they couldn't leap AND intercede to proc an auto-crit.Or if all filler attacks didn't reduce the CD of Smash. Its not just any 1 of these things. Its when you combine all of them together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Penang Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 Roll a Sniper/Gunslinger. I am currently doing this to combat lolsmashers and pyro powertechs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Obirayy Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 Ok I'm not big on reading the patch notes so can someone explain to me why smash is so popular?? I've got a smash guardian that I've been playing since 1.1 - same talent tree, same gear, same stats(increased with gear). And now all of a sudden it becomes OP? I think the problem is sentinels going smash spec, it's all guardians have at the moment to keep them as a good dps class and keep up with the sents and vanguards. So any info would be great thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fungihoujo Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 Just roll it- BW takes about half a year to rebalance their mistakes- or longer. Chances are smash is still going to be OP in 2014. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benderoni Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 Just roll it- BW takes about half a year to rebalance their mistakes- or longer. Chances are smash is still going to be OP in 2014. Somebody call the waaambulance.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoliteAssasin Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 Smash is not OP. it's in groups that it can be, but that can be said of any burst dps spec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth-Rammstein Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 (edited) People are not understanding the issue. It's not that smash is OP 1 vs 1. It's that the hardest hitting ability in the game is an instant AOE. The problem becomes worse when there are several smash monkeys running around ( as there often are) smashing an area and obliterating anything standing near by. There is no defense or amount of team coordination that could possibly nullify several smash monkeys. If smash was huge spike damage on a single target only there would not be anywhere near as many complaints about it. You are correct, no amount of team work could possibly work to cc the target, interrupt smash with knockback, bubble shield, or at the very least stand more than 5 meters away from your allies. Thanks for playing... Edited January 12, 2013 by Darth-Rammstein Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth-Rammstein Posted January 12, 2013 Share Posted January 12, 2013 Ok I'm not big on reading the patch notes so can someone explain to me why smash is so popular?? I've got a smash guardian that I've been playing since 1.1 - same talent tree, same gear, same stats(increased with gear). And now all of a sudden it becomes OP? I think the problem is sentinels going smash spec, it's all guardians have at the moment to keep them as a good dps class and keep up with the sents and vanguards. So any info would be great thanks sents/mara are a bunch of fotm rollers and as such guardians/juggs will get nerfed along side them...guilty by having same base class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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