Ashlockheart Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Its 2013, and there are 2 paths in front of starwars that are clear. How ever befor I lay the paths out for you Bioware. Let me first say that Starwars the Old Republic is a great game. I love every thing about it. I can't really think of that many things I don't like about it. The only thing that really comes to mind is bugs, but most will be fixed in time. I know. Now having said all of that. Lets look at were the game its self can go. The Path Of The Great Story This path is what Stars is still on right now for the most part. In this its all about the story of each class, and player. How every thing interacts with them, and companions. Its were the game takes your breath away, and you feel like your really in it. Every thing you do as a big affect on it. Witch is were Bioware can shine even brighter in the game. There are small little areas of other cools things in the game such as pvp, pets, and so on, but they wouldn't be main goal in this path. Now with great story also comes with better community. The better the story the more players talk about it, and enjoy it together, and keep open minds. The Path Of Greed This Path is what most Mmos have taken now. In this its about pvp, gear, inside games, and most of all what only the company wants, and not the gamer. Most of your time is spent mostly on gear, and grinding for some thing. Not many things interact with the player any more, The storys in the game have also been changed were they end up being much shorter so the players can keep there minds more set on gearing up, and other ingame activites. The one other big thing in this path is there ends up being many things added to the game in very short pereids of time to keep the intrest of the player insted of the story, and interactsions. The biggest down fall in this also is with things being more about gear, grinding, and ingame activites then that means players tend to arggue more about who should get this, or I need this, and so on. Blizzard ends up being a big exsample in this. How ever it all depends on what path the game takes in witch can change the players mind set, and how they talk to others. There is alot more I can add to each path, but I don't want to make this a long post. I just want to give Bioware an idea of whats infront of them. I just hope they choose wisely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jedimasterjac Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 It's more if EA's choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grombrinda Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Yeah ...it's all up to EA now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rankyn Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 If you ever think it's more about what the player wants than what the company wants, you're only kidding yourself. Businesses are in business to make money. As long as the cash flow is acceptable to the bean counters, they will continue to do things the way they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Syanis Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Sorry to burst your bubble but while the SW universe has a great story the majority of players its not about the story that keeps them around and even if it was one can go through stories so fast and run out of the said stories to stick around. Most players its about friends, raiding, pvp, and the never ending pursuit of better gear and the perfect combination. However Bioware's current major mistake is making gear to easily obtainable. When you can basically never do a raid and get close to the best gear the game has to offer or suck at pvp and still get the best pvp gear eventually it loses its value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashlockheart Posted January 1, 2013 Author Share Posted January 1, 2013 If you ever think it's more about what the player wants than what the company wants, you're only kidding yourself. Businesses are in business to make money. As long as the cash flow is acceptable to the bean counters, they will continue to do things the way they want. Keep in mind though businesses can make just as much money with lissining to the customers likes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzina Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 It's up to EA. And they have chosen a 3rd path: Super greed: Super greed means making false statements, knowing they are false, if it makes you money in the short-term. Super greed means 'accidentally' promising features on the back of the box that don't exist if you think it will sell you more copies. Super greed means investing heavily in lawyers to prevent class action lawsuits rather than behaving legally to begin with. Super greed means investing more heavily in PR than programming. Super greed means talking about "teams" for every area of the game but never saying all teams are comprised of just one person, and that one person can be on both the PVP and the operation team. A path was chosen for 2012. Now 2013 is here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignicity Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 It's up to EA. And they have chosen a 3rd path: Super greed: Super greed means making false statements, knowing they are false, if it makes you money in the short-term. Super greed means 'accidentally' promising features on the back of the box that don't exist if you think it will sell you more copies. Super greed means investing heavily in lawyers to prevent class action lawsuits rather than behaving legally to begin with. Super greed means investing more heavily in PR than programming. Super greed means talking about "teams" for every area of the game but never saying all teams are comprised of just one person, and that one person can be on both the PVP and the operation team. A path was chosen for 2012. Now 2013 is here. Zomg! I think I'm in lust! Awesome post! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rankyn Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Keep in mind though businesses can make just as much money with lissining to the customers likes.They do. However they have access to more data than just forum whines. They have actual numbers based on what players do and don't do and act on them. So if 500 people whine on the forums about something they don't like but 50000 people in-game not only do it but do it repeatedly, they're going to go with the silent majority rather than the vocal minority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignicity Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 (edited) They do. However they have access to more data than just forum whines. They have actual numbers based on what players do and don't do and act on them. So if 500 people whine on the forums about something they don't like but 50000 people in-game not only do it but do it repeatedly, they're going to go with the silent majority rather than the vocal minority. Are you trying to tell me that we all really enjoy running dailies? (first example that came to mind) If it's the only way to get something, of course people are going to do it and do it repeatedly, even if they don't like it. In game data mining can only tell you so much. It certainly can't tell you what your customers thought while they were doing that specific activity. That's what forums are for! Edited January 1, 2013 by Ignicity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChaoticDynamite Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Yea the ball is no longer in their court unfortunately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rankyn Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 If it's the only way to get something, of course people are going to do it and do it repeatedly, even if they don't like it.And yet, people keep doing it. If they didn't do it, BioWare would suddenly sit up and say, "Hey, people aren't doing X anymore. We should do something different." Unfortunately, people keep doing repetitive activities so the designers continue to build things based around what players are actually doing in their game. As long an enough people keep doing an activity, that activity will continue to be encouraged regardless of how much you or I may dislike it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignicity Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 (edited) And yet, people keep doing it. If they didn't do it, BioWare would suddenly sit up and say, "Hey, people aren't doing X anymore. We should do something different." Unfortunately, people keep doing repetitive activities so the designers continue to build things based around what players are actually doing in their game. As long an enough people keep doing an activity, that activity will continue to be encouraged regardless of how much you or I may dislike it. So that's your argument for why in your opinion, people should stop posting things they dislike about this game on this games forums? *Sigh* Edited January 1, 2013 by Ignicity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rankyn Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 So that's your argument for why in your opinion, people should stop posting things they dislike about this game on this games forums?That's my argument for why people who think that they know what's better for the game than the people who have actual data about the game (as opposed to personal preference and supposition) should chill the hell out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ignicity Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 (edited) That's my argument for why people who think that they know what's better for the game than the people who have actual data about the game (as opposed to personal preference and supposition) should chill the hell out. HAHAHA! So if you were a dev you would ignore your player base. Good to know. Actually.... Are you a swtor dev? That would make perfect sense! Edited January 1, 2013 by Ignicity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farstrider Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Unfortunately Dailies are a necessary evil, and make massive sense from a dev investment vs. player time investment perspective. As far as metrics are concerned, they can only tell you so much, only cold hard facts, that players are engaging with a certain feature or mechanic, not that they are enjoying doing it or their motivation for doing so (which is obvious in some respects) As for player feedback, the playerbase for SWTOR seem (based on the forums alone) exceptionally volatile and rarely happy, but then players tend to submit feedback publically and more... vocally, for something they are displeased with than something they enjoy. Just the human condition I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratajack Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 HAHAHA! So if you were a dev you would ignore your player base. Good to know. Actually.... Are you a swtor dev? That would make perfect sense! Once again, if 500 people complain about dailies(your example) on the forums, but 50,000 people do them and do them everyday, or most days, then the devs are more likely to listen the silent 50,000 and not the vocal 500. Unfortunately, even if those same 50,000 hate doing dailies, yet do them anyway, the devs only see that 50,000 people are doing dailies repeatedly. If people wish to see a change, then the devs need to see a reason for change, and not just 500 people complaining on the forums. Those 50,000 people need to stop doing dailies repeatedly. Then the devs would see not only the 500 people on the forums, but also the 50,000 dailies going undone each day, and would be more likely to make a change. The same theory applies to the new expansion. I know many are not happy about it not being free. I would prefer it to be free, as well. If enough people continue to sub, or even play for free, and buy the expansion, then EA has no reason not to charge for this, or future expansions. The only way to make EA listen would be for enough people to not only unsub due to being charged for the expansion, but also to stop playing altogether until EA changes its ways. I'm not saying to stop complaining on the forums. Complaining on the forums may make you feel better, and venting can be good for the soul. Don't fool yourself, though, into thinking that the only source of input the devs have is the forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bahdasz Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 ROFL Yes dude, they're probably going to re-model their entire 3Q/4Q FY13 business and marketing strategies based on the OP. I'm sure they're shaking in their shoes right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VonFoxFire Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 (edited) Its 2013, and there are 2 paths in front of starwars that are clear. I just hope they choose wisely. Or maybe they'll try pressing the escape button to see which path has the better ending. Edited January 1, 2013 by VonFoxFire Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fornix Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 Are you trying to tell me that we all really enjoy running dailies? (first example that came to mind) If it's the only way to get something, of course people are going to do it and do it repeatedly, even if they don't like it. In game data mining can only tell you so much. It certainly can't tell you what your customers thought while they were doing that specific activity. That's what forums are for! Forums are the worst tool to go by, since what happens? People who enjoy those dailies will not bother to post about them on the forums. People who hate them, will post their dislikes on here. BioWare would listen to them and take out dailies? Those who enjoyed their dailies will head for the forums and complain how they liked them, and how now they are left with nothing to do. BioWare will now have to do what, reimplement those dailies their metrics already indicated were well played anyway? Dailies are in no way required to be done, it's fully by own choice. Especially as it stands right now where even in terms of endgame gear, dailies are hardly a requirement with relics coming from PvP as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
errant_knight Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 (edited) Well, the op isn't wrong. Neither are those who say that it's up to Ea and that people should chill some-although I would have phrased that differently. Story and interactions is what makes Bioware games great, here and elsewhere. It's what brought the many people to this game who've never even tried an mmo before, let alone stayed, joined guilds for the first time and discovered what a fun and social thing gameplay can be. But that makes this a different kind of mmo. Content can't roll out at the pace people are used to in other mmos because there's actual, meaningful content--expensive content that takes time to produce. 1. There is no free lunch. F2P is a misnomer, called so for marketing purposes. It's really a la carte gaming where you play piecemeal instead of paying in one lump sum. It's always more expensive than a subscription, not just here. Gaming companies haven't moved to it because they make less money. 2. The idea that having a subscription entitles you to everything added to the game forever and ever makes no sense. Stretch that idea into the future and you can see that. It would mean that every addition to the game and expansion = smaller profit margin. Again, there is no free lunch. 3. Good content takes time. We all saw what happened when EA made them push DA2 out the door before it was ready. Not only that, it made the mistake of trying to be all things to all people and ended up doing none of those things well. The class stories will take *a lot* of time. They're the same amount of content as 8 single player rpgs that have to mesh and create an over-arching whole. That's not trivial. Content like Makeb is an excellent stop gap measure to keep the story rolling in the meantime. Fully voiced and animated as it is, that content isn't trivial either, or cheap (see no free lunch.) 4. Bioware is between a rock and a hard place, the rock being EA and the hard place being the fan base. Admittedly PR and communication has been poor. Things happened that caused panic, like the dismantlement of the original dev team, Bioware downsizing and they laying off of the writers. Bioware probably had nothing to do with any of that, but really aren't in a position to point the finger at EA--and while a statement that the class stories were still in the works would have calmed things down considerably, they may also not be in a position to do that. While things are likely in place to do so, including previously written content, I suspect that there are benchmarks that have to be met to get the go ahead from EA to commit to them and make an announcement. You see where this is going, right? Yep. No free lunch. Edited January 1, 2013 by errant_knight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogmaticus Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 TOR is in a similar place in which DCUO was a year ago. Today that game is becoming really incredible and 2013 looks even more awesome for them. I remember reading simillar things in their forums that I am reading now here, so I hope that the path for TOR will be one to glory as well. This year is crucial. New content and proper F2P model candetermine the success (hopefully). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevlarto Posted January 1, 2013 Share Posted January 1, 2013 (edited) It's more if EA's choice. Yep it's EA's choice and we should know all the path they will take, greed, over all else, Bioware is just a fond memory of good games past since they are no more.. But my hopes are they take the path to glory, stranger things have happened Edited January 1, 2013 by kevlarto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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