No Changes to Shield Tech in 1.4?

[af_raptura]

I am trying to be as diplomatic as possible, so I apologize in advance if this sounds too much like a QQ thread.

 

I read the current patch notes for the PTS. I saw how the abilities in the pyrotech tree were getting their range decreased. I can understand the reasoning because they perform very well in pvp as it is. I also saw how the advanced prototype skills were buffed. I must admit, I am very happy for them, and it might encourage me to try that tree sometime in the future. There are no changes listed for the Shield Tech tree, however, and I feel that this must be addressed. I was hoping that since they decreased the range of the electro-dart, they would give some sort of buff to the shield techs to compensate. Ultimately, this does not affect PvE too much, but in PvP where a tank's job is to frustrate the opposition, it just feels our best tool was taken away. Add to that that the other tank specs are generally preferred in PvP, and this puts Shield Tech players in a more difficult situation for PvP gameplay.

 

I won't ask for much since I am aware it is tough to balance all these classes, so how about this: maybe increase the time associated with the slow in the neural overload. Maybe to 4 seconds from its current 2.

 

I also encourage responses as there may be better alternatives to buffing shield techs that I may not have thought about.

[nDjiin]

I am hoping that they haven't given us the full list of changes, like they have in the past. Otherwise they have done a very strange job of balancing the classes - which for the first time in a while, I thought they were starting to do a good job of it.

[af_raptura]

I hope your right. There is still time to make changes, but I don't think the shield techs are getting anything in 1.4.

[Evuo]

I I won't ask for much since I am aware it is tough to balance all these classes, so how about this: maybe increase the time associated with the slow in the neural overload. Maybe to 4 seconds from its current 2.

 

 

That would be a great start, to take it a bit further perhaps an AoE slow would help by giving PT/VG tanks the same option both the other two tank ACs have.

 

Another defensive cooldown or a reworking of smoke grenade to reduce accuracy of all attack types could be another approach.

Edited September 11, 2012 by Evuo

[MishraArtificer]

That would be a great start, to take it a bit further perhaps an AoE slow would help by giving PT/VG tanks the same option both the other two tank ACs have.

 

Another defensive cooldown or a reworking of smoke grenade to reduce accuracy of all attack types could be another approach.

From a COMPLETELY PvE standpoint, I'd love it if they tweaked the range, spread, and damage of Mortar Volley/Death from Above to match the major AoE attacks of the other classes (Orbital Bombardment/Freighter Fly-by, etc.). But God knows what that'll do to those poor, miserable, suffering PvPers, right?

[nDjiin]

From a COMPLETELY PvE standpoint, I'd love it if they tweaked the range, spread, and damage of Mortar Volley/Death from Above to match the major AoE attacks of the other classes (Orbital Bombardment/Freighter Fly-by, etc.). But God knows what that'll do to those poor, miserable, suffering PvPers, right?

 

On the whole they dont care what happens to those who PvE - so I wouldnt lose too much sleep over how it effects them

[CitizenFry]

That would be a great start, to take it a bit further perhaps an AoE slow would help by giving PT/VG tanks the same option both the other two tank ACs have.

 

Doesn't your railshot apply an AOE slow?

[af_raptura]

@CitizenFry

 

You know, when they first implemented the AoE damage to the rail shot in the tanking tree, I thought the same as you, that since it is damage from the Ion Gas Cylinder, it would apply the slow effect. I have used it numerous times trying to kite mobs in PvE, and I never really noticed a difference in their speed. I *have* noticed it when I use rocket punch or rapid shots, though. Maybe I'll try again tonight and see if this effect really happens, though I don't think that was their intention. An on demand AoE slow would be really great, but it might there is a fine line between a strong and an overpowered class.

 

I also like Evuo's suggestion to change oil slick's effects slightly.

Edited September 11, 2012 by af_raptura

[Evuo]

Doesn't your railshot apply an AOE slow?

 

No, the 2 second slow only has a 15% chance to be applied to your railshot target. The intial IGC damage and dot are the only things that spread.

[MishraArtificer]

Frankly, even the range nerf on Cryo Grenade/Electro Dart doesn't even bother me...I usually rush in with Storm/Jet Jump and THEN pop the stun, anyway.

 

Then again, I'm a Tank, not a DPS, so I have no idea how that would affect others. YMMV.

[af_raptura]

@MishraArtificer

 

I am kind of in the same boat as you (also a tank). Since I spend most of my time within 10 meters, I am not going to miss the 30 meter range to the electrodart except in PvP where I used it to buy a squishy some time from a distance.

[Adrenalracer]

That would be a great start, to take it a bit further perhaps an AoE slow would help by giving PT/VG tanks the same option both the other two tank ACs have.

 

Another defensive cooldown or a reworking of smoke grenade to reduce accuracy of all attack types could be another approach.

 

How about adding a movement speed slowdown effect to Oil Slick?

[af_raptura]

I would welcome basically any buff to oil slick. As it is, its pvp usage is limited. I justify using it by thinking that since accuracy > 100% is armor penetration, then oil slick temporarily buffs my armor. But even that is limited to melee and ranged attacks. A slow attached to it would at least effect everyone.

[oakamp]

ST only need to change to it can take at least 3 ppl attack ST at the same time, but it wont die without any heals,

i said many times, but wont care anymore, just waste my money, still have many days b4 expire.

[Evuo]

As it is, its pvp usage is limited. I justify using it by thinking that since accuracy > 100% is armor penetration, then oil slick temporarily buffs my armor.

 

Accuracy has nothing to do with armor penetration. Accuracy over 100% will reduce the target's defense (ranged and melee) and resistance (force and tech) chance.

[af_raptura]

Accuracy has nothing to do with armor penetration. Accuracy over 100% will reduce the target's defense (ranged and melee) and resistance (force and tech) chance.

 

I see. I seem to have been mistaken. Now that you put it that way, it seems that oil slick has even less value than I previously thought.

Edited September 14, 2012 by af_raptura

[Rypht]

I'm very sad to find nothing for shield techs in this patch, with all the negative feedback from the survey thread for the pvp side of shieldtech, I'd have expected a small buff at least. Or a change, or something.

[af_raptura]

I know what you mean. I am currently having some fun in the sub 50 bracket with my shield tech powertech and shield specialist vanguard, but I really wish I had some more utility.

[Irishpierre]

Ive just run a few WZs (Level 31) and have gotten, roughly per match, 45-60k protection depending on the game mode. (60k highest on Civil War, non stop fighting action in the center.) I LOVE the tanking spec, though tell me what you guys think of this...Keep in mind, I didn't read -all- suggestions

 

-Add a ST skill to increase the damage reduction and/or duration of our Shields (current is 25% Reduc iirc)

 

-Longer duration of Oil Slick/Shorter CD and change to reduced damage instead of reduced Accuracy (stacks with our current damage reduction?)

 

-Increase the duration or the potency of our Aggro stealing darts (In PVP, its our protect)

 

Something along those lines (just one of them, not all) would have sufficed. It's not that we're totally at a loss in PVP, just as far as tanking, each tank class has that ONE thing that makes them that tank. Shieldtech, other than having a high shield chance/absorb, for me, doesn't have that one ability or an "osht" button like a Tanksin, Jugg, etc..have.

 

Could be different at 50, we could roll face and I not even know. But I do farely well pre50, but if it's different, then I'll stand corrected lol

[Evuo]

Could be different at 50, we could roll face and I not even know. But I do farely well pre50, but if it's different, then I'll stand corrected lol

 

Vanguards/Powertech's get the base of their abilities early in comparison to some other classes, for example Jedi Knights -- receive their first stun at 24 while a Trooper/Bounty Hunter would have had theirs by level 12. With the lack of abilities and talent points at lower levels some classes cannot reach their potential as quickly as others. With that eliminated it's a completely different story at 50.

[verfallen]

Vanguards/Powertech's get the base of their abilities early in comparison to some other classes, for example Jedi Knights -- receive their first stun at 24 while a Trooper/Bounty Hunter would have had theirs by level 12. With the lack of abilities and talent points at lower levels some classes cannot reach their potential as quickly as others. With that eliminated it's a completely different story at 50.

 

Actually lets set something straight. Only the tank-tree of the jug/guardian really gets stuns. The marauder/sentinel gets roots and snares aplenty, and no stuns at all (note that they don't need them as they are) and the vengeance/rage (and their mirror counterpart) keep choke/stasis, but while it prevent action from your foes, it also prevent you from action by its channeled-type ability. Even more, its duration is therefore open to pushback, with no more range than electro-dart.

 

Now the tank tree gets two actual stuns, one three sec from a choke upgrade, and backhand, which beats shield-tech. So do the tank-assassin, in a way with the knockdown on spike and electrocute. However, even if confortable at close range, the PT still keeps nearly max efficiency at 10 meter, and some 30 meter reach the two others simply cannot match. Chances that unload won't apply a slow from ICG are rather low imo. Its not a sure one, but a probable one.

 

For the rest, its about timing that charge or grapple with the very good stun you DO have. PT are still very mobile and have a very wide circle of harrassment efficiency around them. One does not simply kite a PT.

[Evuo]

Actually lets set something straight. Only the tank-tree of the jug/guardian really gets stuns. The marauder/sentinel gets roots and snares aplenty, and no stuns at all (note that they don't need them as they are) and the vengeance/rage (and their mirror counterpart) keep choke/stasis, but while it prevent action from your foes, it also prevent you from action by its channeled-type ability. Even more, its duration is therefore open to pushback, with no more range than electro-dart.

 

I hope after reading my reply you realized I was identifying the disparities in abilities granted to classes and advanced classes throughout the leveling process which can lead to a different experience than a situation where everyone has unlocked all their potential abilities (50).

 

Now onto your comment about Force Choke/Stasis either not being a stun or being limited to an advanced class:

 

Actually lets set something straight, heres the tooltip description of force choke (an ability available to all sith warriors/jedi knights [don't even need to select an AC] as force stasis via level 24):

 

Chokes the target, crushing and stunning it while Force Choke is channeled. Deals 787 kinetic damage every second. Builds 1 rage per second.

Edited October 11, 2012 by Evuo

[af_raptura]

Irishpierre brings up a good point in that it would be nice to have a strong defensive cool down. Either buff energy shield or oil slick. But that would probably require a redesign of the class in that a strong defensive cooldown necessitates less passive mitigation. Its a thought to consider. I must admit to being somewhat jealous of all the stuff assassins and juggernaughts get. And even marauders with their 4 second god-mode (lol, but you know what I mean).

 

Still, that would leave us without much extra utilities. I would be happier with a cc or AoE slow. Maybe they should change the no escape talent in our tanking tree so that carbonize adds a slow effect after the stun wears off. At least that would give me an AoE slow.

 

I am having fun in the sub 50 bracket. Yesterday, I spent an entire voidstar match guarding a merc healer that did a great job keeping me alive. I kept tuanting too and we were eventually pulling two or three defenders at a time, distracting the enemy long enough so that our allies could plant the bomb on the door. I still love my powertech, but I need a little more utility to really dominate the warzone.

Edited October 11, 2012 by af_raptura