Executive Producer Rich Vogel Bails on TOR

[Tuscad]

The game isn't going to die anytime soon, but it will never have a chance at a booming population the likes of which it had the chance to grab at release.

 

And I also agree when it comes to the content delivery pace. When they said they were going to be pushing out content at an "unprecedented" pace, I figured that would mean it would be fast, but the pace they've set is so horribly slow that I can't see them really catching up and turning this game around at this point. There just aren't many second chances in the MMO world.

 

The only way I can see this getting turned around is by EA putting another 200 mil into this game and getting a new team involved.

[ZenMorph]

I feel your pain (or I should say, frustration). Been actively posting on game boards for almost 20 years, not a single warning. I have 12, plus the one's that I've deleted.

 

I love the game also, but I have to ask myself why I would patronize an establishment where the bouncers continually pour beer on my head....just because they've been given the power to do so?

 

As a business owner myself. I understand that there are people in this world that should never be put in charge of anything, and that all systems must be monitored in order to head off potential problems. Can't blame those doing the damage. You have to blame those that are allowing the damage to be done. As I've stated, small sign of a much greater management problem.

 

Anyway, I'm done trying to boost this game, and now questioning why I am investing my time in it. Like any one in a dysfunctional relationship, my eyes are starting to wander. LOL

 

Yep. Ditto. I don't recall how many infractions I have for trying to defend this game, but that I have any at all is disheartening. And I did not resort to profanity or vulgarity in any of those posts.

 

Your dysfunctional relationship analogy is spot on. I find myself logging into Rift more than this game now (I usually keep active subscriptions to a couple of games at a time). I do love this game, but something is amiss here.

[ChazDoit]

I've gotten several infractions from defending this game. What I've learned; Pointing out problems with others logic: Intimidation. Making fun of 133T SP34K? Harassment. Going and posting OP's response from another of his threads where he argues the exact opposite? Spam.

 

My reward? Insults and degradation from CS when I ask for help after I accidentally dropped a quest.

 

My sub is up on Sunday.

 

Might be back when this goes F2P. At least then I'll be getting the CS that would be equal to the amount I'd be paying for.

 

Yeah, forum moderation is a joke here

[Sammennn]

Again, it's sad to see such potential gone to waste.

 

Bioware really wants us to leave. They really want the customers to unsub and find a new game.

 

On 28th August, their wish will become true.

 

It's really despicable watching Bioware doing this to the Star Wars franchise and to its own customers.

 

Sad, but true.

[Tuscad]

Again, it's sad to see such potential gone to waste.

 

Bioware really wants us to leave. They really want the customers to unsub and find a new game.

 

On 28th August, their wish will become true.

 

It's really despicable watching Bioware doing this to the Star Wars franchise and to its own customers.

 

Sad, but true.

 

It will cost them in the end, after EA finishes squeezing Bioware empty like a tube of toothpaste: boom.

[Sammennn]

It will cost them in the end, after EA finishes squeezing Bioware empty like a tube of toothpaste: boom.

 

Boom indeed my friend.

 

Boom indeed.

[Darka]

Sometimes when things get tough, there is a little hard work needed.

It all comes down to how much they are prepared to put in.

There is a chance for anything, but how they respond will define the end result.

[Phenyr]

Quick, fanboys assemble!

 

We need to make this look like a positive thing ASAP.

 

Well if he was so good then why the hell game looks so bad? The fish gets rotten from head not from tail or something like that.

 

never heard of this guy before I dont feel happy nor sad for him. As for the game cant see something even worse then this. Looks like they change something there was another guy that ''left'' some with combat or so i still remember that 'ability delay thread' btw.

 

I hope the 'boat' wont sink that fast though.

Edited July 18, 2012 by Phenyr

[CrazyOldMystic]

"you are right, but leveling goes way way way too fast in swtor, so people hit the emptiness of max level way too fast.

Beta testers pointed that out during development. Themepark only MMO puts tremendous pressure on development to deliver new content really really fast. Some sandbox content to give you things to do in between content updates would have helped wonders. A working massive pvp zone / planet would have helped wonders. But you need to make people care about that. I read a very nice idea that would work well in a pve/pvp mmo. Relics similar to the daoc ones but tie a 10% increase in credit drop instead of a damage increase and alert the whole faction if that was taken or in danger. of course you would need proper working mechanisms to alleviate faction imbalance (I would leave that to the "pvp-experts" from bioware/mythic that obviously never existed.)"

 

I have to disagree with you on the part of leveling. When I leveled my toon in classic world of warcraft it was brutal, very similar to swtor in the area of difficulty. You just cant barge in and hope to win, you have to look over the area, and make sure your not taking on too many npcs. As far as how fast it goes, honestly between all my toons I never got that feeling of fast leveling. You also have to remember reaching max level is not the end. The flashpoint, and operation system was not set up for quick and easy. You have to work at it, Now that statement is under the idea of someone playing the game when they can, but also have a work schedule to work around. Of course I am sure someone could get maxed out gear in a week if thats all they did was play swtor. On the pvp end well it needs allot of work. I found the warzones to be small, I also found the mechanics as nothing new. I do think they need a planet or area with a pvp/pve set up. A area with walkers, players coming in on dropships, and then getting loaded off. I dont mean a cinema. I mean your own the dropship and you can look down . This is star wars, what swtor needs right now is a pvp/pve area based on a battle type like we saw in the movie star wars the clone wars episode 2 at the end. Lastly space you can argue for this poor set up they have now all you want with the well I dont want to have to think. I can tell you right now they lost players over there space set up. A space sim like swg is also what this game needs.

[TheRealCandyMan]

 

I have to disagree with you on the part of leveling. When I leveled my toon in classic world of warcraft it was brutal, very similar to swtor in the area of difficulty. You just cant barge in and hope to win, you have to look over the area, and make sure your not taking on too many npcs. As far as how fast it goes, honestly between all my toons I never got that feeling of fast leveling. You also have to remember reaching max level is not the end. The flashpoint, and operation system was not set up for quick and easy. You have to work at it, Now that statement is under the idea of someone playing the game when they can, but also have a work schedule to work around. Of course I am sure someone could get maxed out gear in a week if thats all they did was play swtor. On the pvp end well it needs allot of work. I found the warzones to be small, I also found the mechanics as nothing new. I do think they need a planet or area with a pvp/pve set up. A area with walkers, players coming in on dropships, and then getting loaded off. I dont mean a cinema. I mean your own the dropship and you can look down . This is star wars, what swtor needs right now is a pvp/pve area based on a battle type like we saw in the movie star wars the clone wars episode 2 at the end. Lastly space you can argue for this poor set up they have now all you want with the well I dont want to have to think. I can tell you right now they lost players over there space set up. A space sim like swg is also what this game needs.

 

Yes you can. Gear literally doesn't even matter until you hit 50.

[Rikeryo]

don't worry guys, gw2 will be our salvation.

[Kraye]

probably not a good thing

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/174300/SWTORs_executive_producer_leaves_BioWare_amid_layoff_reports.php

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/07/17/swtor-executive-producer-leaves-bioware-new-layoffs-rumored/

 

Thanks for everything chief! Hope this turns out to be more good news then bad.

 

Massive Sub Losses (that continue), Server Merges, Continual Layoffs, Resounding Dislike For TOR.......no wonder he left.He jumped a sinking ship, good for him, its time move on to something that doesn't leave him covered in shame.

[Muskaan]

So, now BW:Austin has lost both Gordon Walton and Rich Vogel who were the two studio heads in Austin.

 

http://www.tentonhammer.com/node/69468

 

Here's a old video from 2009 where you can hear them talk about their vision on SWTOR.

 

I foresee many more layoffs in BW:Austin's future. Really sorry about that.

[Saltydogg]

probably not a good thing

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/174300/SWTORs_executive_producer_leaves_BioWare_amid_layoff_reports.php

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/07/17/swtor-executive-producer-leaves-bioware-new-layoffs-rumored/

 

Thanks for everything chief! Hope this turns out to be more good news then bad.

 

Like I have been saying this is how it starts. Just like it did with Warhammer. EA is a business and will run this game as such.

[ChazDoit]

So Bioware is going to end up like Westwood?

 

Gee, thanks EA for ruining two of my favorite gaming companies.

Edited July 18, 2012 by ChazDoit

[Fornix]

don't worry guys, gw2 will be our salvation.

 

And it's that kind of mentality which is going to be cause to all the negative publicity GW2 will be getting by september/october. Way too many people are bringing these MMO releases into some sort of next coming of jesus.

[Valkirus]

And it's that kind of mentality which is going to be cause to all the negative publicity GW2 will be getting by september/october. Way too many people are bringing these MMO releases into some sort of next coming of jesus.

 

I donot think so. GW2 lead designers have been pretty upfront of what it will be lack and what it will offer. It will appeal to a lot of players and some will not like it. The fact it will be FTP once you buy the game will entice a bunch of players who at this time cannot justify spending 15 bucks a month on a MMO. Do I plan on playing it? Nope. They need to offer a free trial for me to even consider it. Going to be a lot more careful from now on.

[Deewe]

True ! the others just sounds like they blow smoke up your behind. Beeing honest with the customers the MMO crowd will get you way longer with most people.

Thing is MMO aren't about short term vision nor speeches.

 

While TOR in it's actual state is in dire need of a few quick wins, they need even more to revamp their whole communication behavior.

 

The game is going free to play, still it won't save the game unless they fix the core of the game.

Turbine built F2P on top of DDO then LotRo but both of them were highly polished, which is not the case with TOR.

Would TOR goes F2P in its actual state it would be even worse than now and the demise of the game.

Edited July 19, 2012 by Deewe

[Ensquire]

I donot think so. GW2 lead designers have been pretty upfront of what it will be lack and what it will offer. It will appeal to a lot of players and some will not like it. The fact it will be FTP once you buy the game will entice a bunch of players who at this time cannot justify spending 15 bucks a month on a MMO. Do I plan on playing it? Nope. They need to offer a free trial for me to even consider it. Going to be a lot more careful from now on.

 

It was hard to be careful with this game... Knight of the Old republic, is on my list of top ten best games ever, i think TOR maybe gets bottom 100 list, or honorable mentions

Edited July 18, 2012 by Ensquire

[Ensquire]

Thing is MMO aren't about short term vision nor speeches.

 

While TOR in it's actual state is in dire need of a few quick wins, they need even more to revamp their whole communication behavior.

 

The game is going free to play, still it won't save the game unless they fix the core of the game.

Turbine built F2P on top of DDO then LotRo but both of them were highly polished, which is not the case with TOR.

Would TOR goes F2P in it's actual state it would be even worse than now and the demise of the game.

 

F2P system may not fix the core of the game, but the player will be more forgiving because he's not paying or forced to pay

Edited July 18, 2012 by Ensquire

[odiamh]

This is Warhammer: Age of Reckoning all over again....

[Valkirus]

It was hard to be careful with this game... Knight of the Old republic, is on my list of top ten best games ever, i think TOR maybe gets bottom 100 list, or honorable mentions

 

I agree. I loved KOTOR and still have the game. Looking back, I enjoyed TOR even...played as KOTOR 3. Not worth a sub however.

[Tuscad]

I agree. I loved KOTOR and still have the game. Looking back, I enjoyed TOR even...played as KOTOR 3. Not worth a sub however.

 

I agree with this as well.

[Ensquire]

And it's that kind of mentality which is going to be cause to all the negative publicity GW2 will be getting by september/october. Way too many people are bringing these MMO releases into some sort of next coming of jesus.

 

The difference between GW2 and a monthly subscription MMO, is the player will forgive bugs, missing feature, and probably have more patience because he's not forced into paying a monthly subscriber fee.

On a plus note the game does not have a pay to win feature to piss off its player base.

 

I loved this game until a month prior to Transfers and I just can't bring myself to renew my subscription this august

 

 

Looking at Steam and game made by valve

DOTA 2 (players peaked today at 70k)

Team Fortress 2 (Players peaked at 57k)

 

Its hard to argue the F2P method does not work

 

GW2 never interested me until now but seeing how the play model is so flexible and player friendly, it makes the step really easy to do

Edited July 18, 2012 by Ensquire

[ikemenn]

The difference between GW2 and a monthly subscription MMO, is the player will forgive bugs, missing feature, and probably have more patience because he's not forced into paying a monthly subscriber fee.

On a plus note the game does not have a pay to win feature to piss off its player base.

 

I loved this game until a month prior to Transfers and I just can't bring myself to renew my subscription this august

 

 

Looking at Steam and game made by valve

DOTA 2 (players peaked today at 70k)

Team Fortress 2 (Players peaked at 57k)

 

Its hard to argue the F2P method does not work

 

GW2 never interested me until now but seeing how the play model is so flexible and player friendly, it makes the step really easy to do

 

This will be my 3rd beta weekend for gw2. and i have to say. the developers have been up front with everything. I know what im going to see on release and what im.currently expecting to see will be close to each other. have you seen their answers to player questions!!!! they are all well thought out concise answers that have nothing to hide!! they answer all the big hitting questions and concerns of the public.. have not even ONCE seen that on SWTOR. there are a lot of coverage of gameplay, discussions and flaws of it on the internet. basically the developers have been transparent / open about everything. also to add their developers do actually read forums and reply BACK!!

 

the gw2 bwe2 felt like it was ready already. spent more than 30 hours over the 3 day beta and came across no bugs. ( not saying that 100% the game has no bugs). game is smooth as silk. probably because they built the whole thing from the ground up nothing like swtor even after 6 months in release.

 

people who say its normal for people to be laid off after the game is developed. i say bs... arena net have had the same people since the start of guild wars 1 through to its expansions and are now working on gw2. thats 7 years!! only 1 resigned so far that i know of, the GW2 lead artist of 8 years employment started out as a ground texture artist have moved on and left last month. and they also have actual official explanation to his resignation on good terms.