Wow is Sith Warrior Jug gimped

[Noth]

Juggernauts are amazing. I'm rolling a Rage Jugg and I'm usually in the top 2 on pvp. No im not trying to brag, but we have so much mobility that its ridiculous. You just need to play the class right. Stuns galore.

 

As rage spec you have 1 stun and that stun also stuns you. Then you get a stun later on that last 6 seconds is aoe and breaks on damage. Hate to tell you this IA get that at a very low level, and their's is ranged and lasts 8 seconds.

[XDrcaul]

I tank with the Jug just fine, depends what skill set you chose. For questing I recommend the middle skills set. Use the Immortal skill set for PVP and Raids.

[iinsom]

let me guess, you get a pocket healer and roll over lower levels. Grats I can do that too, so can any class. Typically if a class is so difficult to play in order to even reach what other classes reach easily, it is gimp. Or you are tank spec which is the least gimped of the specs for jugg.

 

no i don't. i sometimes group with guild mates that heal, but usually i solo queue or group with a juggernaut and a assassin. I'm marauder btw, not jug. what i mentioned before was about my friend the jug who is awesome at it.

Edited December 19, 2011 by iinsom

[Kabaal]

Low level immortal seems to be bad in pvp. At ~19 I switched to dps and feel a lot more useful. I'll try immortal again at later levels, maybe.

 

Wanted to say I'm enjoying my juggy (23 now) in both pvp and pve. I do ok 1v1 in pvp (win most).. grass is always greener, play what you want.

 

Around 26 is the time to try out Immortal for PvP. I've been immortal since day one and it wasn't until around then that it started feeling like i was contributing much in the matches. 31 now and i'm tough to kill to the point that 1 v 2 i'll usually at least kill one of them before i die. Can't wait for saber throw <3

 

I can understand why people think the class is poor at lower levels but it does get better, it's a good class but i do think that the others have the edge on it. A tank specced sin can dish out a crap load of damage and the powertech is just a beast. In hind sight i'd probably have one of those as my main but i'm still enjoying it and there is some love for juggernauts incoming soon in a patch if the devs stick to their word.

[ururururu]

I don't feel we need a buff? Except AOE hate in PVE situation.. holding aggro on BH is a pain.

[Thundergulch]

I wouldn't say that the Jugg is gimped, I would say that it's "buggy".

I don't PVP at all, but for instance I was on Balmorra and I was level 21 at the time.

I was farming nodes and saw 4 level 18 strong mobs and figured I would kill them and harvest the node they were next to.

I'm a synthweaver and relatively geared up pretty good for my level.

They shredded me!!

I couldn't believe it.

I can take on 2 same level elites, but these 4 strong mobs that were 3 levels below me just tore me up!

 

Either the Orange chest and Legs that I had are bugged (fully modded), or something is not right with the class.

 

Something else that happens alot, is when I'm running a Heroic 4man with dedicated healer, at times I notice that my health drops FAST.. but not all the time, it's random mobs that tear me up.

 

90% of the time my Jugg is a beast, and I can tank anything, the other 10% of the time it's like he's wearing paper for armor.

 

 

Edit:

Full Immortal spec, Def stance.

Edited December 19, 2011 by Thundergulch

[Nanotech]

let me guess, you get a pocket healer and roll over lower levels. Grats I can do that too, so can any class. Typically if a class is so difficult to play in order to even reach what other classes reach easily, it is gimp. Or you are tank spec which is the least gimped of the specs for jugg.

 

Maybe you're just bad; ever thought of that? I'm 23 and I don't have any complaints as a Veng-spec'd Jugg. Everyone says it should get better or be easier at higher levels, well I think it's pretty damn good right now. The class needs a little work, but I think some of you just need to L2P or re-roll.

[shierkahn]

Honestly, I can say I do not seem to have the same issues that others are reporting. My character hits hard, and does not get hit hard. We seem to be very stat dependant though.

[Noth]

Maybe you're just bad; ever thought of that? I'm 23 and I don't have any complaints as a Veng-spec'd Jugg. Everyone says it should get better or be easier at higher levels, well I think it's pretty damn good right now. The class needs a little work, but I think some of you just need to L2P or re-roll.

 

When I was 23 I was rolling face. I roll face now against people who have no idea what they are doing. Anyone who knows what they are doing will not let a Venge jugg stay close as the venge jugg as little mobility, and little CC.

 

Now it is not uncommon for me to run into people close to my level and while I will crit for 1.5k with impale and almost that with scream (wearing purples and blues), I'll get crit for 3k back to back from range. You'd think they'd be squishier than me when i get to them? nope, they tear me down faster in melee range or have so many outs it's not even funny.

 

Seriously, play another class and actually see how the Jugg is actually lacking. Any class can own against dumb players. Immortal Jugg is a god in Huttball though.

 

no i don't. i sometimes group with guild mates that heal, but usually i solo queue or group with a juggernaut and a assassin. I'm marauder btw, not jug. what i mentioned before was about my friend the jug who is awesome at it.

 

You jugg friend who is a tank... It has the tools to do well in pvp. Not having those tools is a massive downgrade.

Edited December 19, 2011 by Noth

[Achesoma]

Immortal is the most solid Jugg tree, esp at higher levels. After about level 35 or so they become really strong. Getting Backhand, Crash, and Force grip in the tree's 5th tier makes a big difference. Of course your spec is only as good as your team plays together. Not to mention, your role isn't dps. You should be protecting your healer or disrupting theirs. Tactics are very important in TOR pvp WZs. If you're not working as a team you will fail hard and feel gimped. Mindlessly zerging does not work in this game.

 

As of right now, I wouldn't waste time with Vengeance or Rage as a Jugg since comparatively to other dps classes they are mediocre at best and can't tank. Mostly in part to their form dependence. Soresu form is all around far superior to Shii-Cho and Shien forms due to the significant defenses players give up in exchange for some mild damage increase.

 

Give it time, MMOs are always evolving. A good motto to follow as a MMO player: "If there is something you don't like just wait because it will change."

[ururururu]

Honestly, I can say I do not seem to have the same issues that others are reporting. My character hits hard, and does not get hit hard. We seem to be very stat dependant though.

 

I was looking around inspecting other juggernauts and was surprised how many were sporting aim (powertech) type heavy armor. Was like 1 out of every 3 juggs.

[Noth]

Give it time, MMOs are always evolving. A good motto to follow as a MMO player: "If there is something you don't like just wait because it will change."

 

It has been given time. These same complaints have been in beta for months (ever since they removed pull from juggs and did some overhaul to it).

[Achesoma]

It has been given time. These same complaints have been in beta for months (ever since they removed pull from juggs and did some overhaul to it).

 

I know. But it will change again....and again....and again. It's just the life of playing MMOs. For those of us from beta is seems like forever but you have to remember we haven't even hit the official release day yet. Six months from now I bet we'll be seeing "nerf Jugg" threads here.

[Nanotech]

When I was 23 I was rolling face. I roll face now against people who have no idea what they are doing. Anyone who knows what they are doing will not let a Venge jugg stay close as the venge jugg as little mobility, and little CC.

 

Now it is not uncommon for me to run into people close to my level and while I will crit for 1.5k with impale and almost that with scream (wearing purples and blues), I'll get crit for 3k back to back from range. You'd think they'd be squishier than me when i get to them? nope, they tear me down faster in melee range or have so many outs it's not even funny.

 

Seriously, play another class and actually see how the Jugg is actually lacking. Any class can own against dumb players. Immortal Jugg is a god in Huttball though..

 

Let me reiterate that everyone says Jugg gets BETTER at higher levels. Except you.

 

I don't have any of these problems you mention, though. Force Charge/Unstoppable/Chilling Scream is all I have ever needed to keep up with my target. I play against levels 10 to 50, just like you. Also: I have played other classes, but I didn't create a TANK class to /faceroll DPS meters even though sometimes I do.

Edited December 19, 2011 by Nanotech

[Noth]

Let me reiterate that everyone says Jugg gets BETTER at higher levels. Except you.

 

I don't have any of these problems you mention, though. Force Charge/Unstoppable/Chilling Scream is all I have ever needed to keep up with my target. I play against levels 10 to 50, just like you. Also: I have played other classes, but I didn't create a TANK class to /faceroll DPS meters even though sometimes I do.

 

I never said they didn't get better because they do. Other classes just get even better. Against another class if they know what they are doing there is no way for me to beat them. Unstoppable gives me 2.5 seconds of freedom against them (GCD of charge) after that they can do what ever they want. Chilling scream only helps if they decide to blow their CC during unstoppable or simply try and run, both show a poor awareness. I've been burned down by a single player in the 15 seconds it took for charge to come back (even with blowing saber ward. Not a single thing i could do.

 

Please tell me how my two biggest attacks that I can reliably use in pvp critting for 1.5k is balance against other classes reliable attacks critting for 3k+ with those classes not giving up much survivability (heavy armor is not much more survivable, heals, escapes, shields) while also having more CC is balanced.

[Nanotech]

I never said they didn't get better because they do. Other classes just get even better. Against another class if they know what they are doing there is no way for me to beat them. Unstoppable gives me 2.5 seconds of freedom against them (GCD of charge) after that they can do what ever they want. Chilling scream only helps if they decide to blow their CC during unstoppable or simply try and run, both show a poor awareness. I've been burned down by a single player in the 15 seconds it took for charge to come back (even with blowing saber ward. Not a single thing i could do.

 

Please tell me how my two biggest attacks that I can reliably use in pvp critting for 1.5k is balance against other classes reliable attacks critting for 3k+ with those classes not giving up much survivability (heavy armor is not much more survivable, heals, escapes, shields) while also having more CC is balanced.

 

I've already answered your gripes and i'm not going to sit here and debate theorycrafting with you. All you are describing is how you get beat by people better than you, plain and simple. I am fighting the same level range of people in Warzones that you are with the same level of arbitrary difficulty. I have already mentioned that I don't have the problems you do, or at least not to the extent you seem to be having them.

 

Please tell me how you manage to crit half as hard at a higher level as I do at a lower level and the answer not be either: a) It's bugged or b) you're doing it wrong.

Edited December 19, 2011 by Nanotech

[Noth]

I've already answered your gripes and i'm not going to sit here and debate theorycrafting with you. All you are describing is how you get beat by people better than you, plain and simple. I am fighting the same random levels of people in Warzones that you are with the same level of arbitrary difficulty. I have already mentioned that I don't have the problems you do, or at least not to the extent you seem to be having them.

 

Please tell me how you manage to crit half as hard as I do at a higher level and the answer not be either: a) It's bugged or b) you're doing it wrong.

 

Here's the thing, I have these problems and adapt to them. I regularly am in the top on damage and protection (even as a dps spec) and MVP in warzones, very hard to do If I am bad. I roll face on people that don't know what they are doing, but people that do know what they are doing have no problem keeping me off of them. As more people learn how to do so, the problem will only become worse. Rather see it not become that bad. And again the issue has existed for months. If there was really nothing wrong it would had died down a lot more.

 

As for the critting I can't say because I'm in purple and blue strength gear with stacked crit (even some expertise on it as well)

[Dharagada]

How big an impact does expertise have?

 

Since lower level players do not generally have expertise gear (but do get boosted stats) and higher level players do have expertise gear that could be the difference.

Edited December 19, 2011 by Dharagada

[Kabaal]

 

Please tell me how you manage to crit half as hard at a higher level as I do at a lower level and the answer not be either: a) It's bugged or b) you're doing it wrong.

 

I can believe that, maybe not half as much but definately less. I hit for quite a bit less at 31 than i did at 15. Its not just damage, my basic resistance is ~8% lower now too (have more than enough higher abilities to make up for that though) even though my gear is as good as it gets for my level. It's that silly bolster system they have in place and nothing to do with the class, that should sort itself out once we start getting end game gear on though

Edited December 19, 2011 by Kabaal

[iinsom]

when i was in beta the people with expertese gear crushed everybody

[iinsom]

I can believe that, maybe not half as much but definately less. I hit for quite a bit less at 31 than i did at 15. Its not just damage, my basic resistance is 8% lower now too even though my gear is as good as it gets for my level. It's the silly bolster system they have in place and nothing to do with the class, that should sort itself out once we start getting end game gear on though

 

my damage is lower as well however my gear is pretty sub par atm, i have a bunch of upgrades waiting for me at level 29 tho so we'll see if that helps. Its not about anyone doing anything wrong or a bug, it's the algorithm used to determine the bolster buffs stat increases is creating an inconsistency

Edited December 19, 2011 by iinsom

[Nanotech]

I can believe that, maybe not half as much but definately less. I hit for quite a bit less at 31 than i did at 15. Its not just damage, my basic resistance is ~8% lower now too (have more than enough higher abilities to make up for that though) even though my gear is as good as it gets for my level. It's that silly bolster system they have in place and nothing to do with the class, that should sort itself out once we start getting end game gear on though

 

Sounds broken to me, unless this is the whacky result of gear/level equalization combined with bolstering.

Edited December 19, 2011 by Nanotech

[Lord_Itharius]

Once you get to around lvl 33, Rage Juggernauts start doing amazing burst damage with Obliterate + Force Choke + Smash, some of the best in the game in fact. They're also arguably the most mobile AC with force charge, unleash, and obliterate, and of course you have access to Guard, threatening scream/taunt and to intercede at lvl 50, reducing the enemy team's damage by a huge amount. Also, you get chilling scream as a Juggernaut, which slows down everyone's speed by 50% for 9 seconds, and it costs only 1 rage as Rage spec or none as Immortal spec. Spammable, too.

 

Tanky dps will be the PvP metagame at lvl 50, just like in League of Legends. You'll see.

Edited December 21, 2011 by Lord_Itharius