TheRealCandyMan Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 Wait what, whoah, hold on. KOTOR was not a MMO. It was a RPG. Very big difference. I honestly think you've got the wrong game. SWTOR is simply multiplayer KOTOR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathlight- Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 People that do not want to pay real cash for gear that should be earned do not want to pvp ect with people that just take the easy way to the top. You want to be "uber" earn it. I fail to see what is "über" about one shotting people in recruit when you are full WH augmented geared. By making this post, you admit that being good at pvp is a matter of getting the right gear,no matter your skills. The reason why part of the playerbase wishes to be able to avoid the grind by purchasing gear is so that they can focus on learning and deploying skills, not acquiring gear. I would be equally happy if pvp was strictly skill based, with gear playing no role whatsoever. A good system in my opinion would be an inverted "bolster" system where everyone's stats are set at the same level upon entering a warzone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pathlight- Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 SWTOR is simply multiplayer KOTOR My wording was misleading. I meant that this is my first MMO and I bought it because I liked KOTOR and BW games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pocketthesaurus Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 SWTOR is simply multiplayer KOTOR But therein is the problem, if that is even true. The problem is that this guy wants the best gear so he can compete with other players. If he was playing KOTOR, there would be no issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealCandyMan Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 (edited) I fail to see what is "über" about one shotting people in recruit when you are full WH augmented geared. By making this post, you admit that being good at pvp is a matter of getting the right gear,no matter your skills. The reason why part of the playerbase wishes to be able to avoid the grind by purchasing gear is so that they can focus on learning and deploying skills, not acquiring gear. I would be equally happy if pvp was strictly skill based, with gear playing no role whatsoever. A good system in my opinion would be an inverted "bolster" system where everyone's stats are set at the same level upon entering a warzone. Go play sub 50 warzones then. In fact, lets remove ALL gear from the game. There shouldn't be any gear obtained from any setting, PvE, PvP, nothing. PvE should be all about skill. I should be able to clear EC HM in level 15 greens. Edited July 20, 2012 by TheRealCandyMan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercyflush Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 If you don't have the time to earn your gear then you probably don't have time to enter the areas the gear is needed in and give 100% effort to the event taking place. Buying gear is lazy and if you don't have the time to earn it then the people you are playing with will assume that you don't have the skills to be in the group with them. I for one could care less about hardcore endgame content. I put my time into that years ago in other games and it doesn't appeal to me any longer but I do understand the mentality. Purchased gear will never be the same as the gear you would earn at that same level and true end gamers will know instantly what you have done because it will be a different color, name etc. and you will do nothing but single yourself out and be trash talked to anyone outside of your guild that knows what your skills truly are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilCanuck Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 If you don't have the time to earn your gear... I assure you that I do, in fact, earn my money. It takes a fairly twisted sense of reality to perceive playing a game as 'earning' something and actually working for a living as 'taking the easy way'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealCandyMan Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 I assure you that I do, in fact, earn my money. It takes a fairly twisted sense of reality to perceive playing a game as 'earning' something and actually working for a living as 'taking the easy way'. Why is gear so important to you anyway then? You have access to ALL the stories in the game without having good gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilCanuck Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 Why is gear so important to you anyway then? You have access to ALL the stories in the game without having good gear. I never said I was going to buy anything. I just said that suggesting playtime equates to earning something when, you know, actually earning things doesn't is a bit odd. What's wrong with letting someone with a life outside the game be, for example, competitive in warzones? Are the fry cooks and Walmart stock boys worried someone might end up on equal footing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mercyflush Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 (edited) However you perceive it is not how it will play out in an mmo. If you have thick skin and can take it I say do what you want but the reality is that the only way you will ever come close to buying gear in this game is if it ever goes free to play or they open an online shop. Either way, what you pay real money for will never be the same as what you earn in the game or people would never play the actual game and just buy their items. People forget, or were never a part of beta, that the pvp and stuff were added in due to public outcry to make this game like WoW, who turned around and complained it was copying WoW. All of the biggest complaints since launch are about content that was never a part of the original design and had to be added in less than 6 months before release so it never got thorough bug testing or feedback. Edited July 20, 2012 by Mercyflush Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhilCanuck Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 However you perceive it is not how it will play out in an mmo. If you have thick skin and can take it I say do what you want but the reality is that the only way you will ever come close to buying gear in this game is if it ever goes free to play or they open an online shop. Either way, what you pay real money for will never be the same as what you earn in the game or people would never play the actual game and just buy their items. People forget, or were never a part of beta, that the pvp and stuff were added in due to public outcry to make this game like WoW, who turned around and complained it was copying WoW. All of the biggest complaints since launch are about content that was never a part of the original design and had to be added in less than 6 months before release so it never got thorough bug testing or feedback. Never is a long time. EA's management would monetize their grandmas if they thought people were looking to buy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saurakk Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 I assure you that I do, in fact, earn my money. It takes a fairly twisted sense of reality to perceive playing a game as 'earning' something and actually working for a living as 'taking the easy way'. You are talking about two mutually exclusive things to try to make a point and it simply does not work. Just because you earn your money does not mean you can use that money to buy anything you want. You want better cardiovascular health, you exercise. You want to create a painting, you paint it. You want to get high end video game gear, you play the content to be rewarded it. Your money purchases the gym membership, the painting supplies, and the access to the game...it does not give a right to the rewards of the efforts expected to be put in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PainOfDemise Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 You are talking about two mutually exclusive things to try to make a point and it simply does not work. Just because you earn your money does not mean you can use that money to buy anything you want. You want better cardiovascular health, you exercise. You want to create a painting, you paint it. You want to get high end video game gear, you play the content to be rewarded it. Your money purchases the gym membership, the painting supplies, and the access to the game...it does not give a right to the rewards of the efforts expected to be put in. At least someone gets it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NasherUK Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 (edited) Because pay to win games die about a month after they are released... SWTOR is using pretty basic mechanics you see in most MMORPGs. If you don't like it then your playing the wrong type of game. Edited July 20, 2012 by NasherUK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anzel Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 You are talking about two mutually exclusive things to try to make a point and it simply does not work. Just because you earn your money does not mean you can use that money to buy anything you want. You want better cardiovascular health, you exercise. You want to create a painting, you paint it. You want to get high end video game gear, you play the content to be rewarded it. Your money purchases the gym membership, the painting supplies, and the access to the game...it does not give a right to the rewards of the efforts expected to be put in. My problem is with your last point in bold above. SWTOR doesn't use this mechanic. Instead of acquiring gear from playing all of the available content (Flash Points, Multiple Class Stories, Multi-Factions, Operations, War Zones, Planet Quests, Crafting, etc.) you are stuck killing the same 8 people over and over and over and over again on the same 4 (FOUR) maps. I mean really... Either just let me buy my gear or leverage the legacy system and other content already in the game. I'm sick of the same daily/weekly/war zone grind. I want to play other character classes. I want to do all of the operations. I want to explore all of the worlds, etc. etc. etc. ***Please note that space is excluded in the above post. Space in SWTOR is an UNHOLY ABOMINATION to all things STAR WARS and should be removed immediately and never spoken of again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PainOfDemise Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 (edited) I'm sick of the same daily/weekly/war zone grind. I want to play other character classes. I want to do all of the operations. I want to explore all of the worlds, etc. etc. etc. You don't need gear to play the other classes, nor explore all of the worlds and all that other crap. You don't even need to be 100% geared to do all of the operations, even with EC, it's not what gear you have it's if you know what to do. And if you want to do Operations, than do them. You get the GEAR from there instead of buying it ahead of time where you get NOTHING out of the Operation. Edited July 20, 2012 by PainOfDemise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
utio Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 You don't need gear to play the other classes, nor explore all of the worlds and all that other crap. You don't even need to be 100% geared to do all of the operations, even with EC, it's not what gear you have it's if you know what to do. And if you want to do Operations, than do them. You get the GEAR from there instead of buying it ahead of time where you get NOTHING out of the Operation. I tell you something you could get out of operations that isn't gear. Fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealCandyMan Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 I never said I was going to buy anything. I just said that suggesting playtime equates to earning something when, you know, actually earning things doesn't is a bit odd. What's wrong with letting someone with a life outside the game be, for example, competitive in warzones? Are the fry cooks and Walmart stock boys worried someone might end up on equal footing? You can be competitive in WZ already. It's 90% skills and 10% gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealCandyMan Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 My problem is with your last point in bold above. SWTOR doesn't use this mechanic. Instead of acquiring gear from playing all of the available content (Flash Points, Multiple Class Stories, Multi-Factions, Operations, War Zones, Planet Quests, Crafting, etc.) you are stuck killing the same 8 people over and over and over and over again on the same 4 (FOUR) maps. I mean really... Either just let me buy my gear or leverage the legacy system and other content already in the game. I'm sick of the same daily/weekly/war zone grind. I want to play other character classes. I want to do all of the operations. I want to explore all of the worlds, etc. etc. etc. ***Please note that space is excluded in the above post. Space in SWTOR is an UNHOLY ABOMINATION to all things STAR WARS and should be removed immediately and never spoken of again. Do you understand the difference between PvP and PvE? Because this post seems to suggest that you do not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyinSpaghetti Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 I made a similar thread here: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=507881 However, I'm on about end game after columi and why it's difficult to do HM ops to progress on to rakata gear unless you happen to have 7 of your best buds playing the game at the exact same time as you. I've hit a wall trying to interact with guilds and/or PuG's with the current system in place, which led me to unsub. However if the OP is on about getting columi then that's easy with group finder, I got most of my columi in the first week of group finders launch, just as soon as I went to progress on to hard mode ops I rang into the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NabooJedi Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 I've bought the game and paid for my subs, just as the rest of you have. I now find that this game (like many other mmorpgs) all but locks you out of the high end content unless you have silly amounts of time to spend getting the ridiculous gear that imbalances pretty much everything. In these games gear is everything, with perhaps a little sprinkling of co-ordination of one's keyboard fingers. I work hard and have young kids, meaning that I'm lucky to get on once or twice each week. There is no chance of me getting my pvp kit to play at a fair level or join operations. I have one 50th level character. At the exponential rate of gear-upping (if that term should exist), I will simply never be able to take part in aspects of the game I already pay for. There is a Daily on the Fleet and a Weekly on the Fleet specifically for Level 50. The Daily has you play 6 Rounds of PVP (So maybe about 1 and 1/2 hours of your week) and the Weekly has you try to win to win 9 PVP Rounds (so maybe it might take you one or two weeks from what your schedule leaves time for.) If you just do that little by little over time, you get 400 of both Regular WZ and Ranked WZ comms total by just doing both once. Hope this helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Pants Posted July 20, 2012 Share Posted July 20, 2012 (edited) Go play sub 50 warzones then. In fact, lets remove ALL gear from the game. There shouldn't be any gear obtained from any setting, PvE, PvP, nothing. PvE should be all about skill. I should be able to clear EC HM in level 15 greens. no. not at all. do not remove gear. remove the STATS from gear obtained post max lvl. not one single person has been able to counter any argument have put forward since the very beginning of this thread. just the silly people who think time investment = earning gear. Edited July 20, 2012 by Darth_Pants Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRealCandyMan Posted July 21, 2012 Share Posted July 21, 2012 no. not at all. do not remove gear. remove the STATS from gear obtained post max lvl. not one single person has been able to counter any argument have put forward since the very beginning of this thread. just the silly people who think time investment = earning gear. Why shouldn't this be the case? Why do casuals feel they should have access to the same gear that is only attainable via hard modes? Why aren't they content with "having fun" and simply going through the story mode content? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Pants Posted July 21, 2012 Share Posted July 21, 2012 Why shouldn't this be the case? Why do casuals feel they should have access to the same gear that is only attainable via hard modes? Why aren't they content with "having fun" and simply going through the story mode content? I have explained many many times on previous pages. Please go and read them. Also, i find it amazingly amusing that your counter argument is simply "why not" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havokk Posted July 21, 2012 Share Posted July 21, 2012 I've bought the game and paid for my subs, just as the rest of you have. I now find that this game (like many other mmorpgs) all but locks you out of the high end content unless you have silly amounts of time to spend getting the ridiculous gear that imbalances pretty much everything. I've bought these paints and paintbrushes, just as the rest of you have. I now find that it takes silly amounts of time to actually paint a picture. Why can't I just pay someone else to paint it and then put my signature at the bottom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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