Healing is fine, they said. Just gear up, they said.

[NoTomorrow]

At least I've never been even close to Glad or R1.

 

Good players have always been able to shut down healers completely on their own.

This video proves absolutely nothing, you cannot simply judge the balancing of a class based on a video.

 

Mercs could need a buff regarding their horrible resource management.

Sorcs could need a big buff regarding their non-existent defensive CD's.

Operatives are fine.

 

You can't just simply say "healers are fine, no buffs needed" when there are 3 completely different healing classes.

 

 

Snipers are absolutely lethal when there is another guy who locks the healer in place/pushes him out into the open field. But I guess that's too much coordination for a DPS who just wants to pewpew everything down.

 

good players can shutdown lone healers, nobody denies that, we are not asking for another healer nerf. But we are definitely against two or more healers being able to sustain themselves more easily than it is possible now. Every extra healer requires exponentially more effort for enemy team to defeat the healer happy team.

 

If we had only huttball warzones, cross healing would not be a problem. But we have 3 warzones where defenders can abuse the crap out of cross healing and just wait for the time to run out.

[BurnsTwoThree]

You want to be brought back to the times when your healing output was greater than the DPS output of a class. During those times, a merc healer could stay in front of a sniper and let him use his full rotation and he will still outheal everything. The interrupt on 12 seconds CD is so damn laughable. You want back to those times when your survivability was basically greater than a tank survivability. Why would any DPS consider this a balanced thing?

.

1.) I am a Sorcerer

2.)That video shows nothing about the current state of the game nor does it reflect any real issues faced in competitive PvP with healers who actually know how to heal but can't because their classes are far too weak.

3.) You might want to check how much of that video was him getting attacked by backpeddling/keyboard turning derps who couldn't interrupt half the spells he casted even though they were putting out damage to kill him and the player guarding him.

 

 

The real question was why would you consider this a good video to prove any sort of points when half the players in the video were some of the worst DPS in this game.

 

Try choosing a video where a healer is actually going against players with gear champ, then come back to this discussion.

[BurnsTwoThree]

good players can shutdown lone healers, nobody denies that.

 

What is being said that good players could shut down healers pre 1.2

 

The nerfs were completely unnecessary and unwarranted. If you were bad, you were complaining about healers pre 1.2

 

 

The ONLY thing wrong with Sorcerers/Sages was double dipping on their large heals, that's it.

[NoTomorrow]

The video showed you one good healer. And showed you how the game WAS before 1.2. Not how it is now. You asking of healers buffs could very much bring back that BS we had prior to 1.2

 

I want to hear your defense of cross healing not being a problem for pvp, especially it not favoring defenders. If you will not find a counter argument for this, then consider your demands for class buffs invalid.

 

 

What is being said that good players could shut down healers pre 1.2

 

The nerfs were completely unnecessary and unwarranted. If you were bad, you were complaining about healers pre 1.2

 

 

The ONLY thing wrong with Sorcerers/Sages was double dipping on their large heals, that's it.

 

LOL! I dare you as a sniper to kill a merc healer before 1.2. I double dare you. May be you should look at things from another side. Pity we cannot have a test server with 1.1 game rules so you could be the DPS and I be the merc healer.

Edited July 9, 2012 by NoTomorrow

[BurnsTwoThree]

The video showed you one good healer. And showed you how the game WAS before 1.2. Not how it is now. You asking of healers buffs could very much bring back that BS we had prior to 1.2

 

I want to hear your defense of cross healing not being a problem for pvp, especially it not favorit defenders. If you will not find a counter argument for this, then consider your demands for class buffs invalid.

 

 

Ranked PvP pre 1.2? No

Overpowered Marauders/Sentinels Pyros/Vanguards pre 1.2? No

Were those players going against them in the video geared? No

Were there a lot of fresh 50s on each team? Yes

 

Cross healing? You can keep a healer CC'd for 8+ seconds if their CC break is on CD and if you have a team smart enough not to break CCs. Any healer can be killed in 2-3 seconds. Cross healing is not a problem, low awareness and intelligence is.

 

Cross healing is a problem for backpeddling/keyboard turning kiddies like this one geared healer was in Civil War. Go watch your video and see how much they stand still not casting abilities because they have to turn to face the healer you linked.

 

Cmon Professor Walsh Jr. You can do better than that.

 

 

LOL! I dare you as a sniper to kill a merc healer before 1.2. I double dare you. May be you should look at things from another side. Pity we cannot have a test server with 1.1 game rules so you could be the DPS and I be the merc healer.

Kiddo, the problem was low damage Snipers. Why do you think they buffed them in the first place? It had nothing to do with the healers.

 

I wouldn't need to be cross healed to be able to live through two snipers back then. Hell if they didn't change snipers and still nerfed healers as they are now I could probably still live through two or three of them because they were THAT bad.

Edited July 9, 2012 by BurnsTwoThree

[iphobia]

good players can shutdown lone healers, nobody denies that, we are not asking for another healer nerf. But we are definitely against two or more healers being able to sustain themselves more easily than it is possible now. Every extra healer requires exponentially more effort for enemy team to defeat the healer happy team.

 

If we had only huttball warzones, cross healing would not be a problem. But we have 3 warzones where defenders can abuse the crap out of cross healing and just wait for the time to run out.

 

CC the other heals while having 4 dps focus one of them.

With good coordination, you are able to CC them for at least 8s.

4 dps won't need this long to kill one, even with guard up.

 

They cc your dps and the healer survives?

Well, put pressure on them until the resolve is gone and try again.

You do also have 2-3 healers anyway, so you have enough time for this.

 

For me it's fine that you need to setup burst and cc to kill a healer while the other team needs to setup their own cc/peel to make the healer survive.

Edited July 9, 2012 by iphobia

[anwg]

He is a sorc, open your eyes and read, it's not rocket science. Your credibility went out the window after you posted this:

 

How is he wrong? The math has been done multiple times on this forum.

[NoTomorrow]

Ranked PvP pre 1.2? No

Overpowered Marauders/Sentinels Pyros/Vanguards pre 1.2? No

Were those players going against them in the video geared? No

Were there a lot of fresh 50s on each team? Yes

 

Cross healing? You can keep a healer CC'd for 8+ seconds if their CC break is on CD and if you have a team smart enough not to break CCs. Any healer can be killed in 2-3 seconds. Cross healing is not a problem, low awareness and intelligence is.

 

Cross healing is a problem for backpeddling/keyboard turning kiddies like this one geared healer was in Civil War. Go watch your video and see how much they stand still not casting abilities because they have to turn to face the healer you linked.

 

Cmon Professor Walsh Jr. You can do better than that.

 

Every extra healer requires exponentially more effort to bring down. Hell, you don't even need to ask your friends who you will heal next, you just look on that health bar and see who has less health than others. You don't need any coordination with other healers. And that 8 second CC? Muhahahaha! that crap can be cleansed. Have one sorc healer and one tech healer, and you can remove any CC from anyone. And for those extra situations when i use a tech CC on a tech healer so the sorc healer cannot purge it, you have cc breaker no problem.

 

Got more entertainment to provide us on topic about how healers are terribly underpowered?

Edited July 9, 2012 by NoTomorrow

[NoTomorrow]

CC the other heals while having 4 dps focus one of them.

With good coordination, you are able to CC them for at least 8s.

4 dps won't need this long to kill one, even with guard up.

 

They cc your dps and the healer survives?

Well, put pressure on them until the resolve is gone and try again.

You do also have 2-3 healers anyway, so you have enough time for this.

 

For me it's fine that you need to setup burst and cc to kill a healer while the other team needs to setup their own cc/peel to make the healer survive.

 

Since ranged DPS are only a threat but not a hard counter to healers, this is why the warzones are crawling with Maras PT because this is the only reliable solution to defeat this cross healing. This is the ONLY solution. And now the OP is basically asking to get the buffs so that he can survive even this.

 

I am not asking for healer nerfs, but i don't want any changes in this game that would empower cross healing. Things need to die in a warzone. This is why we are all playing SWTOR. If you are that much into healing and dieing makes you feel bad, i can recommend this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theme_Hospital

Edited July 9, 2012 by NoTomorrow

[BurnsTwoThree]

Every extra healer requires exponentially more effort to bring down. Hell, you don't even need to ask your friends who you will heal next, you just look on that health bar and see who has less health than others. You don't need any coordination with other healers. And that 8 second CC? Muhahahaha! that crap can be cleansed. Have one sorc healer and one tech healer, and you can remove any CC from anyone. And for those extra situations when i use a tech CC on a tech healer so the sorc healer cannot purge it, you have cc breaker no problem.

 

Got more entertainment to provide us on topic about how healers are terribly underpowered?

 

http://www.torhead.com/ability/70qAWyv/force-stun

http://www.torhead.com/ability/4HpLzfj/electrocute

 

Have fun dispelling those stuns or the 15 others in this game. All you need is one player on each cross healers if they are non-operative healers and they are completely shut down (assuming they aren't terrible at playing their class).

 

Got more entertainment on how to completely dismantle any awful argument I bring up?

Fixed. And yes actually I do.

Edited July 9, 2012 by BurnsTwoThree

[NoTomorrow]

Force Stun: SpellDamage: SpellType=>Force

 

http://www.torhead.com/ability/aQq06F0/purge#comments

Purges a friendly target of up to 2 negative mental or Force effects.

 

If this for some reason (which would really be weird) does not work, then it should definitely remove the 8 second whirlwind. Flashbang another 8 second mezz should be cleansable too as its a mental effect.

 

Same goes for electrocute vs merc and operative cleanse.

 

For your own sake and sanity, i prey to Gods that i am wrong, otherwise all this effort you put into this thread will drive you mad.

Edited July 9, 2012 by NoTomorrow

[knell]

No. Healers are the most powerful class on the battlefield. Gear up to end game gear,L2P, and join an 8man with a competent tank.

 

/thread

 

So you telling me I need a tank to heal?

[John_Whalen]

*sigh*

My last post was deleted because it was deemed "inappropriate by the rules of conduct." In short I was too rude, so Bioware removed my post in case I hurt anyone's feelings. I'm not apologizing for what I said because it was true. I will however say it nicely, well nicer, than before. Perhaps it will actually help someone reading this thread, instead of just getting scared off of healing by reading all of the complaints on this thread.

 

Gear can only take you part of the way people. Sure it helps, and sure if you do it properly it will help a lot. However from what I am reading on this thread you guys are assuming that if you gear up you can sit in one spot and heal all day long without dying. That's simply not true! Healers and casters throughout the ages have near always had the same weakness; they can't take a hit.

 

Healers are meant to be protected while they repair the damage being done to tanks and damage characters. If you are a healer and are taking damage then your team is supposed to react and take care of the problem. If they cannot react then there are ways to protect yourself. Pop your Force Armor/Static Barrier to absorb the incoming attacks, maybe toss out a stun if you have one available, and hit your Force Speed. Defend yourself from attacks from behind then run away as fast as you can. Lead your opponent over to your tanks or dps. Once your team has engaged the person attacking you, turn around and make sure your team does not need help with that enemy. If they do, provide it, if not, throw some heals down on yourself.

 

Healing does not need to be as hard as people keep making it out to be. It's very little about your gear and mostly about your ability to read a battlefield and how responsive your teammates are. I only recently made a healer on TOR and in my first warzone I had top heals and I think, three deaths total. This was on a fair sized game of Novare Coast. But because I have played healers and remembered their basic weaknesses, I knew how to avoid them and survive. Because of that I was able to keep multiple tanks and damage characters alive long enough to hold nodes and win the game.

 

Please, please, please, do not simply complain because you've had some bad games. Also please, please, please do not blame it on your gear or teammates every time you die or lose. When you lose in a game, sometimes it's just because the other team outplayed yours, or you just need to change up your game type. Don't play a healer like a dps or a tank and you'll find that you will survive and ensure victory to your team time and time again!

[iphobia]

Force Stun: SpellDamage: SpellType=>Force

 

http://www.torhead.com/ability/aQq06F0/purge#comments

Purges a friendly target of up to 2 negative mental or Force effects.

 

If this for some reason (which would really be weird) does not work, then it should definitely remove the 8 second whirlwind. Flashbang another 8 second mezz should be cleansable too as its a mental effect.

 

Same goes for electrocute vs merc and operative cleanse.

 

For your own sake and sanity, i prey to Gods that i am wrong, otherwise all this effort you put into this thread will drive you mad.

 

I don't know where you get your info from, but you cannot cleanse stuns/mezzes. None of them. I have yet to find one I could cleanse as a Sorc heal.

You can't even cleanse roots.

Only "cc" you can cc are slows.

Edited July 9, 2012 by iphobia

[BurnsTwoThree]

Force Stun: SpellDamage: SpellType=>Force

 

http://www.torhead.com/ability/aQq06F0/purge#comments

Same goes for electrocute vs merc and operative cleanse.

.

 

Good luck dispelling when you have 3 people on you with no incoming heals. You will probably dispel the 5 slows on the other guy before even touching any of the CC abiltiies. As well as the fact you cannot bring multiple Sorc healers to groups anymore. You're just asking to lose if you do. They only way to go is to have multiple OPs with possibly another Hybrid DPS/Hybrid healer who's main focus is to CC and provide off heals. That's not how a healing class should ever be in Ranked PvP.

 

 

So if you're a Sorcerer getting CC'd you're screwed. If you're a Sorcerer getting focused your screwed from low numbers, slow heals, no defensive CDs.

 

 

I don't know where you get your info from, but you cannot cleanse stuns/mezzes. None of them. I have yet to find one I could cleanse as a Sorc heal.

You can't even cleanse roots.

Only "cc" you can cc are slows.

You can dispel Whirlwind, that's about it.

Edited July 9, 2012 by BurnsTwoThree

[BurnsTwoThree]

*sigh*

My last post was deleted because it was deemed "inappropriate by the rules of conduct." In short I was too rude, so Bioware removed my post in case I hurt anyone's feelings. I'm not apologizing for what I said because it was true. I will however say it nicely, well nicer, than before. Perhaps it will actually help someone reading this thread, instead of just getting scared off of healing by reading all of the complaints on this thread.

 

Oh so that's why I went from being one of the top Sorcerers on my server to just any other "above average" status healer.

 

Yeah, I don't think so. Being average doesn't sit well with me and PvP is near unplayable for a Sorcerer healer.

 

Unfortunately all you can come up with is "WELL MAYBE PPL CANT REED DAH BATTLEFEELD RITE"

 

Yeah that's not it either. People don't run 2 OP healers for nothing.

[islander]

So you want to survive focus fire by half the enemy team by yourself?

 

L2 team play with a tank that guards and taunts, cc peels. and try not to face tank them.

 

LOL, maybe in a good non-PUG ranked team. This is NOT normal PvP though. You're lucky to get a guard in normal PvP - while the guard tank goes and plays DPS.

What you're asking - other then the not facetanking - is unrealistic.

Edited July 9, 2012 by islander

[John_Whalen]

Oh so that's why I went from being one of the top Sorcerers on my server to just any other "above average" status healer.

 

Yeah, I don't think so. Being average doesn't sit well with me and PvP is near unplayable for a Sorcerer healer.

 

Unfortunately all you can come up with is "WELL MAYBE PPL CANT REED DAH BATTLEFEELD RITE"

 

Yeah that's not it either. People don't run 2 OP healers for nothing.

 

Well then how about you explain to me how I am always one of the top three healers in every warzone I play in?? And I'm not even level 30. So I'm clearly doing something better than you

[Finionn]

my best suggestion would be to go heal pve. i tried doing pvp healing on my sorc but as much as i tried it was just too frustrating so i decided to go pve even though im not really a pve person. although im not a huge fan of pve i liked healing pve(well liked it more than pvp healing) so there ya go..i only looked at the first page but im assuming the next 34 were filled with random arguments that dont answer the op's post

[BurnsTwoThree]

And I'm not even level 30

 

There's your answer champ.

[islander]

If you solo queue and there is no tank to guard you strongly consider quitting immediately. The WZ, not the game.

 

If you will only ever solo queue - reroll dps. This is the game BW has given us.

 

LOL, if I took this advice on quitting, I'd never be able to warzone. I just suck it up and make the best of it. I typically still only die 3-5 times a zone. That's if I'm truly on my own. I'm at 1200 expertise, a hair under 17k hps.

[islander]

Well then how about you explain to me how I am always one of the top three healers in every warzone I play in?? And I'm not even level 30. So I'm clearly doing something better than you

 

You're playing in the minor leagues amigo. Really, you are. You're learning good lessons, make no mistake. Doing well in 10-49's is great. People who are terrible at 10-49 warzones should just retire from PvP because they will be nothing but dead weight at 50.

You'll get really broken in at 50 though. Trust me on this.

Edited July 9, 2012 by islander

[Darth_Philar]

The trick to being a successful Sorc healer is to defend your team's node that no one is attacking. Your job consists of calling incoming hostiles and harassing them while you pray for reinforcements to arrive.

 

If you actually try to stop and heal you will melt like a sno-cone in hell during July.

[Sock_Bramson]

Meh, I've seen good healers from each of the three classes, and I myself love pvping on my sorc healer. Anyone having problems either needs a bit more time in normal WZs to gear up, needs to tweak their spec, needs to play with other competent pvpers, or needs to change their playstyle.

 

For example, while some sorc healers are able to do well with the AoE if they have some good tanking/peels/cc to back them up, they are much easier to shut-down after 1.2. After 3 ugly matches with my hybrid spec, I got used to it and have been keeping myself and my teammates alive ever since. Sure, you're gonna die every now and then against competent teams, but that's to be expected. (this may blow your mind, but healers are high-priority targets)

 

Even though I play with guys that could probably protect me if I used the AoE, I feel like I'm much more useful with the extra survivability talents from the Lightning tree, and I almost always outheal AoE sorcs/sages (and op/merc healers) because I stay alive longer.

 

Don't give up on pvp healing. It's completely viable and incredibly fun as long as you take a bit of time to adjust your playstyle.

 

-Hedley Melange <Physics>, Dreshdae-->The Shadowlands-

[islander]

I play a Merc healer and if I'm paired with a sorc in WZ they become my focus target over anyone else. My priority is always to keep them alive and pumping out heals to the entire group. One healer is never enough for a WZ and being put in that situation is a lot of what I think makes things so frustrating for people.

 

Its funny you say this. I run a 21 point heal spec, I primarily heal then DPS when its practical. I work GREAT with merc/ops healers.

When I enter any warzone, this is my personal marching orders:

 

1) 100% bubble uptime - I can recast every 17 seconds per person

2) I focus my single target heals on the main healer first, anyone guarding me second

3) if no healing required, I DPS on the target who'll die the quickest (or cc someone else, whatever I deem smart)

 

I have a slightly harder time working with a fellow sorc healer because they bubble folks as well. I tend to have a little downtime due to accidentally trying to rebubble people still on cooldown (from other sorc bubbles)

Edited July 9, 2012 by islander