Need Help with PVP Play - Imperial Sniper lvl 50

[Chpappa]

Hello all,

 

I have been having problems with PVP matches. I have only won 2 pvp matches ever in 6 months of playing. Probably played over 40 matches. I must be doing something wrong.

 

Looking for tech trees and screen layouts to help with my play if anyone is able to post. I am also looking for what sequence of shots.

 

Background: I have done marksmen and I average around 14,000-19,000 damage a game. I have all PVP Recruit gear and a battle-master sniper rifle. I switch to Lethality and I would get similar amount of damage ( 12,000 - 17,000) but I felt ineffective in actually killing individuals. I am back to marksmanship. May typical schooting sequence:

 

Armor Reduction, Lazer, Seriers of Shots, Dart, Flash, Ambush, Follow through, Reload series of shots and shoot the next two, Snipe/Takedown/Overload.

 

Please help.

[paul_preib]

What server would this be? Generally speaking a 50 in all greens that stands in the corner and does enough for one medal a match should be able to default to a better then 2-38 record.

 

As is I can still come relatively close to a .500 record strictly solo queuing, and while I think myself relatively solid and am decently geared, I don't pretend to think that I was the sole difference maker that made those matches wins.

 

A am also curious as to the 14,000 to 19,000.... do you mean 140-190k? Because with a BM weapon, even in otherwise recruit that would be about 8 non crithits achieved throughout the course of the entire match.

 

As to recruit except for your BM weapon.... Assuming every match was a loss and you never picked up the daily, with 40 matches under your belt you still should have enough for at least one more expensive and two cheap BM items. Assuming you grabbed the daily about 5 times that would be one more cheap piece of BM gear.

 

That said a few helping hand, bearing in mind my Sniper is probably my least played pvp class so I'll give you advice more from the perspective of another class attacking snipers

 

1.Use areas of cover to your advantage-- in Alderaan when fighting mid camp the top of the ramps for a good field of fire down on the node while being able to knockback most attackers down to the ground, prolonging your time not under duress. In Huttball this is the highest platform level, where again you have a good field of fire to help control mid as well as pick away at ballcarriers.

 

2.Don't lean up against knockback-blockers-- When on my sentinel this is the single biggest mistake that snipers/gunslingers tend to do that affords me an easy kill. The whole purpose of a knockback/root combo is rendered moot when I can force camo in, wedge myself between you and the wall before opening up, then attacking without any worry of getting punched out of range.

 

3.Be a part of the group-- This goes for most folks that are still in mostly (or even partial) recruit-- When someone gets a bead on you you'll go down pretty hard and fairly quick. The best way to contribute is to let the healers and melee get the attention, then find your own little subtle corner and start plucking away at mobs engaged with other members of your group, this will help maximize your uptime and allow you to contribute instead of running out of respawn every couple of minutes.

 

4.Think defensively-- Knockback, entrench, legshot, etc. are perhaps more important then damaging abilities themselves. Again when on my sentinel if I can get a melee opener and they aren't entrenched then it is far to easy to open with and overload saber cauterize (for two dots in one), force stasis (choke) to rip 'em out of cover and do some damage while letting the dot tick away, then apply my other two dots before you can get back into cover and get the knockback off. On a class with mostly recruit armor that's already chewed a hefty chunk of health away before you've ever really done anything. With entrench + knockback you have me pinned several yards away eating damage while you only have the cauterize opener on you yourself.

[Dmasterr]

So, what you are saying is that you are more detrimental to your team than an afker?.

 

Because i played quite a few games as 7 vs 8 and still won like half of those games.

[Brool]

So, what you are saying is that you are more detrimental to your team than an afker?.

 

Because i played quite a few games as 7 vs 8 and still won like half of those games.

 

Atleast he's trying to get better and asking for help. I'll take that any day over someone who think's they are god's gift to pvp and probably are not even close to being as "Pro" as they claim they are.

 

OP, sorry bout that, I'd love to help you but I dont have a sniper. Im sure someone will post some tips tho. GL.

Edited June 21, 2012 by Brool

[Livelyhound]

 

Armor Reduction, Lazer, Seriers of Shots, Dart, Flash, Ambush, Follow through, Reload series of shots and shoot the next two, Snipe/Takedown/Overload.

 

Please help.

 

Depends a bit on what class you are fighting but for the most part as a mm I don't bother with dart unless fighting someone whos likely to stealth without a cleanse.

 

Don't use flashbang on someone youre shooting at its pointless as it will break on the very next shot leaving them much more cc resistant because flash hits for a lot of resolve. Going with your current rotation you might want to swap legshot in there instead.

 

You want to put explosvie probe in your rotation somewhere, I put it usually before ambush.

 

I also tend to save ambush against melee toons for later in my rotation becuase of the attached talented knockback on it. Against a ranged what you have works.

 

You also want to work adrenals, relics etc into your rotation.

 

After that I would hop onto the sniper class forums and have a look around, theres a few good threads there.

 

Edit:

 

Oh also once you are under attack remember to cover -> get shot/hit a bit -> re-cover to reset ballistic dampers.

 

Oh and double also don't focus on the guy hitting you, focus on the target you were on. Use cover pulse to shake the person hitting you and leave them alone, that roots them in place for 5 secs, if you hit you them you only get a 2 second root, so hit your primary target, notice a nme hitting you, cover pulse, hit your current target for 4 seconds, swap to the guy trying to hit you, ambush-kb, to ping them away, re-target your primary guy and shoot a bit more, as the guy tries to hit you again, debilitate, shoot your primary, back to incoming guy, flashbang for 8 secs more time on your primary, evade for 3 more seconds of defence whilst you polish off your target, leg shot the dude attacking you, and run away, with a 5 sec head start

 

This should let you take care of the person you actually want to kill whilst negating your incoming oppenent for the most part. YMMV depending on his cc breakers.

 

I had another thought

 

It's up to you but I tend to not use aoes on my mm for offence cos it keeps you in combat. I therefore dont use orbital strike often or frag grenade. The exceptions being voidstar and novare as you get good nme clusters so its sorta worth it. However I prefer to single target so that I can kill it and exit combat and then regen energy and hp between fights fast. This means I don't have to watch my energy level half so much so I burn a lot of energy inefficient casts to lay on the damage as fast as possible, thus killing my target but having little energy left afterwards.

 

If you aoe with this approach you tend to get stuck in combat and energy starve. So it all depends on the circumstances, but take the opening of huttball where 3 or more people cluster at mid for the ball, tempting for OS, frag and suppresive fire but you are unlikely kill them all and so you are then stuck in combat needing to watch your energy much more. You may find that not aoe'ing whilst on offence suits you better and lets you regen energy faster, keeping you in more fights at peak potential rather than being energy starved, which may be a cause of your low damage output at the moment. Just a thought.

Edited June 21, 2012 by Livelyhound

[Livelyhound]

So, what you are saying is that you are more detrimental to your team than an afker?.

 

Because i played quite a few games as 7 vs 8 and still won like half of those games.

 

Do you ever post anything positve?

 

I cannot think of a single helpful thing I have ever seen you write, making you the most detrimental player on this forum.

[Digtahk]

Lethality is far superior to MM at lower gear levels, easier to play and has far more mobility so you don't get killed as much. It hits harder single target once you have your poisons up and because most of the damage is not "Ranged" you don't get as many deflects misses etc, and is good against all armor classes.

 

If you insist on playing MM don't cast ambush without the 1 second reduction to cast time proc, If you start with explosive probe, series of shots and the instant snipe from taking cover you should have procced it. If you gear is bad you will die a lot because you lack mobility, don't worry about it concentrate on dishing out as much damage as possible while you are alive and finding advantages parts of each playing field to position yourself.

[Dmasterr]

Tough love.

 

I encourage players to get better on their own, experiment,research and figure out stuff on their own. NOT being spoon fed some "strategy" that gets obsolete as soon as the enemy figures out how to counter it, or a new patch.

 

Learning the process on how to come up with a good strategy, etc. You know, "teach a man to fish".

 

Copy-paste gear and strategy from better players do not promote personal growth and skill, and you will always be 2 steps behind from the people that came up with said strategy, gear setup, talent specs.

[Livelyhound]

Tough love.

 

I encourage players to get better on their own, experiment,research and figure out stuff on their own. NOT being spoon fed some "strategy" that gets obsolete as soon as the enemy figures out how to counter it, or a new patch.

 

Learning the process on how to come up with a good strategy, etc. You know, "teach a man to fish".

 

Copy-paste gear and strategy from better players do not promote personal growth and skill, and you will always be 2 steps behind from the people that came up with said strategy, gear setup, talent specs.

 

What a crock of...

 

Your earlier post had no encouragement in it whatsoever, you know " to get better on his own"

It also had no teaching on how to come up with a good strategy, you know NO "teaching a man to fish" AT ALL.

 

You spout so much rubbish about yourself on this forum it's just funny.

[Dmasterr]

I am not an adept of "you catch more flies with honey" ideology.

 

So don't hold your breath for getting encouraged to do stuff, in a positive way, from me.

Edited June 21, 2012 by Dmasterr

[Akyio]

My honest humble opinion: problem is recruit gear.

 

Literally, being in recruit gear and fighting against 80% of people in PvP who have BM/WH or half BM/WH results in being killed too quickly while not really doing much damage at all. As you get BM you will see difference.

 

Also please don't tell me that you need more skill or whatever. Grinding gear in PvP results in getting skiled in PvP, you don't get your WH or BM out of sky, you get it from winning, losing matches where sometimes it's interesting to play, sometimes frustrating.

If you meet someone with WH, he/she is going to be skilled more than you with recruit gear, because he/she spent hours to grind that gear in PvP.

Edited June 21, 2012 by Akyio

[Berenja]

Unless im fighting a high resistance tank i usually don't bother with Shatter Shot. It's on GCD(Global CoolDown) and we have to make the best use of those.

 

Usually you should open up with a laze target - snipe - followthrough. This is some quick damage, and enables the 1.5 second Ambush cast for reactive shot. If your target is moving towards you putting in a legshot will be beneficial for you. At that point you have a 2 second window to deal dmg without breaking the snare, usually enough ambush.

Next queue up explosive probe and start series of shots.

 

Save your Flashbang/Cover Pulse/Debilitate for defensive purposes. Entrench is also extremely strong, sometimes it's worth popping it when noone is attacking you because you expect to get stunned/attacked soon.

 

This is a general idea of what to do when you can sit still and fight people, if you're more on the move, focus your damage abobut getting in and out of cover and getting instant snipes + followthroughs. Weave in as many leg shots as possible (I'd recommend to take the talent that gives reduced cooldown)

 

Positioning is something you really need to learn yourself, since it's hard to explain.

Generally you want to be towards the back of the team, just around the healers. This way you have time before the enemy melee approaches you, and you can help defending the healers thus resulting in more heals for you, by peeling for them with Cover Pulse, Flash, Debilitate and a lot of Leg Shots.

 

That's about it, personally i think Snipers are one of the most rewarding classes to play in PvP once you "get it" they offer a lot of disruption, damage and both indirect & direct control to fights. I hope you enjoy

[Livelyhound]

I am not an adept of "you catch more flies with honey" ideology.

 

So don't hold your breath for getting encouraged to do stuff, in a positive way, from me.

 

Then why on earth would you be so dumb as to post in a thread specifically asking for help?

You appear to not be an adept at any philosophy so far judging by your responses in this thread.

 

Back on topic: Oh and forgot ot mention earlier, that it's worth picking up the smoke bomb as a MM, not just for your own defensive use but to also help out your healers. If you notice a melee/ranged heavy class like us snipers hitting one of your healers use your smoke for their benefit.

Edited June 21, 2012 by Livelyhound

[Dmasterr]

Then why on earth would you be so dumb as to post in a thread specifically asking for help?

You appear to not be an adept at any philosophy so far judging by your responses in this thread.

 

Back on topic: Oh and forgot ot mention earlier, that it's worth picking up the smoke bomb as a MM, not just for your own defensive use but to also help out your healers. If you notice a melee/ranged heavy class like us snipers hitting one of your healers use your smoke for their benefit.

 

Pointing out that no amount of copy-paste, is going to make him a better player. All improvements gained by doing that are superficial and temporary.

[Knockerz]

As people have already stated being a fresh 50 means your going to be undergeared for some time. While I don't have a max sniper I do have a fresh sage, which gets ripped apart in recruit gear quickly. Thus, I try to play a supportive role and avoid the front lines in pvp.

 

Use your channeled aoe to unstealth players. If you catch them at a distance said player will not have an opener. I'm a bit surprise not as many players try to hunt for stealth classes. All except the op shadow/assassin are squishy once out of stealth.

 

You can use your aoe pulse ability to knock down players in huttbal and force them to run back. Only classes with a range closer like jk/sith warriors can possibly leap back.

 

I'm not too sure about this, but if you can find a cover spot on the warzone and you take cover you take in less damage than if you were to just crouch.

 

Also don't get out of cover/crouch. A lot of smart players will try to get you out of cover using stuns, use your pvp button to get out of stuns.. When you use cover/crouch you get a defense bonus,

 

The only classes that are a problem are madness spec sorcerer/sages or healers who los you. You really need a class with a snare like jk/warrior combine with your dps will make it very hard for that healer to heal. Otherwise, not much you can do about it. This is coming from a lvl 41 sniper and my 50 commando healer.

 

This a bit off topic, but it's probably best to do some pvp rounds before you reach 50 and save 2k warzone points. Thus, once you ding 50 you can buy some BM gear immediately.

Edited June 21, 2012 by Knockerz

[Prisoner]

Tough love.

 

I encourage players to get better on their own, experiment,research and figure out stuff on their own. NOT being spoon fed some "strategy" that gets obsolete as soon as the enemy figures out how to counter it, or a new patch.

 

Learning the process on how to come up with a good strategy, etc. You know, "teach a man to fish".

 

Right, because that's totally what you were doing there. I think I just sprained my eyeballs from rolling them so hard.

 

To the OP - My main is a SS Gunslinger, and I have a pretty decent pvp record. I really think though that while recruit gear sucks and probably is part of your problem (as is the lack of binding abilities to keys if you aren't doing that too), more than particular kinds of builds,gear, or rotation - winning depends on situational awareness, strategy and learning what your class should be doing in each battleground. So some things particular to snipers and slingers that I've learned through trial and error:

 

In Huttball, stay up on the catwalks as much as possible. Your job is to pew pew from above to help control the middle. But even more than killing, it's your cc and knockbacks that are most important. Keep those catwalks clear, but stay in cover if you're somewhere a JK wants to force leap to. If you're on defense with your knockback by punting people down into the pits. Watch not only where the ball runner is, but were the guys are who are ahead of him, because that's who they're going to pass the ball to if they're smart. Knock down or kill those guys if you can. Use root to snare the ball runners in the fire. On offense, one of your best abilities is your flash grenade, so use it, especially when you see a bunch of people mobbing the ball carrier. Use your knockback to protect the ball carrier too if you're nearby. And if the ball gets tossed to you, instantly start looking for someone to pass it to unless you're the only one around and have a clear path to the goal line. Because ranged pew pew is just too squishy to try and rambo their way through.

 

In the other three games, where you're basically guarding or capturing nodes, try to find a good place to plant yourself where you're sort of hidden from everyone and a bit back (next to pillars, up on balconies) so that people won't notice you right away. You will be surprised how many bad players will let you pew pew from afar indefinitely. You'll have one of the best view of the battleground from ranged, so if you see healers, mark them and focus fire them (and encourage your team to do the same). And make sure to keep an eye on the nodes. You don't have to kill people to keep them from capping, just interrupt them. Use your aoe to protect nodes - you have three of them, don't rely only on orbital strike.

 

Other random things. Don't always use your cc breaker as a reflex. If you're not taking a bunch of damage and no one is capping in front of you, hold off and just eat the time because you're probably going to need it right after that. Stick with the group or at least one other player if possible. You're squishy, even in decent gear, so going off alone is unwise.

[LarryRow]

Learning the process on how to come up with a good strategy, etc. You know, "teach a man to fish".

 

You are not so much teaching OP to fish as you are convincing him/her that fishing is too hard, beyond her abilities, and you hate all people that don't fish as well as you. OP will probably stop fishing altogether with feedback like yours.

 

Do you really think the swtor ocean needs less fishers?

[BambulaGTS]

Hello all,

 

I have been having problems with PVP matches. I have only won 2 pvp matches ever in 6 months of playing. Probably played over 40 matches. I must be doing something wrong.

 

Looking for tech trees and screen layouts to help with my play if anyone is able to post. I am also looking for what sequence of shots.

 

Background: I have done marksmen and I average around 14,000-19,000 damage a game. I have all PVP Recruit gear and a battle-master sniper rifle. I switch to Lethality and I would get similar amount of damage ( 12,000 - 17,000) but I felt ineffective in actually killing individuals. I am back to marksmanship. May typical schooting sequence:

 

Armor Reduction, Lazer, Seriers of Shots, Dart, Flash, Ambush, Follow through, Reload series of shots and shoot the next two, Snipe/Takedown/Overload.

 

Please help.

 

6 month is 6*30=180 days.

 

Over 40 matches, minimum average 0,2 matches in a day.

 

You know, practise makes perfect.

 

Over 40 matches is simply not enough.

[ScribbleC]

Which server are you on? I'm still learning myself, but my main is a Sniper that's been kicking around for a while now, and I have managed to learn a couple of tricks. If you are on Nightmare Lands I would be happy to give you a hand.

[Calvin_Mago]

The easiest fix at the moment is your rotation, which doesn't make any sense at the moment, especially with the dart followed by flashbang. It looks like you are currently full marksman, so a good opening rotation should be something like:

 

Laze target->Snipe->Followthrough->Series of Shots->Ambush (1.5 sec)->Followthrough

 

When a target has little chance of getting out of your line of sight and/or most of your other abilities are on cooldown, you should hit Target Acquired->Rapid fire/ SoSx2-3

 

And remember to use Takedown whenever possible.

 

Of course the major factors for us in WZ dps are utilizing positioning and cooldowns to survive and still be able to find good targets, but I think you will pick that up that in time.

[Ybini]

A lot of good advice but also remember, no matter how uber you might be in super death augmented warhero gear, if your team isn't geared as well, they'll drop like flies and you'll get mowed down by a group. So don't take it too personal when you lose rounds.

[DaTick]

I am in the Lethality tree, so I can't give yo marksmanship rotations.

 

You're rotations should vary depending on the health of the opponent, but here's my full health opener for Lethality spec.

 

I always open with shatter shot (20% armor reduction for EVERYONE) then corrosive dart, corrosive grenade, weakening blast, then Cull (notice its about setting up the big hit) If they are still up then series of shots, Laser+Ambush, then take-down should do it. I can usually drop a healer, or decently geared tank with just that set. This by itself should also yield you close to 20K damage by itself.

 

Another way to get a lot of damage & probably get yourself killed at the same time is to charge into the midst of a big fight drop in to cover+entrench+ballistic shield then drop orbital strike on yourself+everyone else in the area. You'll need to use all your other defensive cool-downs to stay alive long enough for orbital strike to complete.

 

Doing that will usually yield the medal for 2.5K damage in 1 shot and if your lucky about 40K damage (if you have it specced for the extra 3 seconds) You'll also be targeted by EVERYONE, but you'll be reducing damage for your team by 20% and landing some heavy hits.

[DarkDruidSS]

Hello all,

 

I have been having problems with PVP matches. I have only won 2 pvp matches ever in 6 months of playing. Probably played over 40 matches. I must be doing something wrong.

 

Looking for tech trees and screen layouts to help with my play if anyone is able to post. I am also looking for what sequence of shots.

 

Background: I have done marksmen and I average around 14,000-19,000 damage a game. I have all PVP Recruit gear and a battle-master sniper rifle. I switch to Lethality and I would get similar amount of damage ( 12,000 - 17,000) but I felt ineffective in actually killing individuals. I am back to marksmanship. May typical schooting sequence:

 

Armor Reduction, Lazer, Seriers of Shots, Dart, Flash, Ambush, Follow through, Reload series of shots and shoot the next two, Snipe/Takedown/Overload.

 

Please help.

 

Your key problem is that you are looking at PvP like PvE. I would start there. The one thing about PvP is there really isn't a set rotation because there are too many variables in a given fight.

 

You're spending a lot of setup time in your rotation. Series of shots is mostly a filler for me. I don't waste armor reduction on medium or light armored players. My general opener would be fresh cover > Laze > Snipe > Ambush > follow through > snipe > series of shots > follow through... if they are below 30% Take down anywhere in there that is appropriate. You can also throw and explosive probe in there if you have the distance from the enemy and energy to afford using it.

 

I would take Dart out of your rotation completely as marksmanship, except when fighting a sin or operative on the off chance their cleanse is on CD so you can pop them out of stealth if they vanish. You can ambush > legshot for a knockback and root. Cover pulse for another knockback and root. Save debilate and flash bang until you are in trouble and make sure you use Entrench to be able to stay in cover and be immunie to CC. Also very key to remember that legshot is a root and doesn't affect resolve. So you can apply this to an enemy no matter what is going on... barring they are not movement impairing immune.

 

Here is my marksmanship build. I am in a mix of recruit/battle master with my War Hero augemented sniper rifle.

http://www.torhead.com/skill-calc#400bsrbdRsRGZbIZh.1

 

That's my 2 cents. I hope it helps.

Edited June 21, 2012 by DarkDruidSS

[stuffystuffs]

OP, you can't be the sole reason that your teams are losing so much.

 

The Imps must really suck on your server....I thought my server was bad.

 

However, you can definitely improve your own game and get more medals (even when losing) and possibly make a difference in a close match to secure a win.

 

But I wouldn't expect to win most of the time even if you become the best sniper on your server. Just seems like your server has a lot of bad puggers that probably don't have gear.

 

One thing I learned PUGing as a sniper is when to recognize when you are probably going to get ROFLSTOMPED by the other team. It's pretty easy...just look at your teammate's gear before the match. If everyone has at least recruit, those matches typically go well (I still sometimes lose those matches but they aren't a total wipe at least). If you have a couple of people who have 0 expertise (or just a few hundred) then you will probably lose unless the other team is in the same boat. If you get on a team like this, try not to get discouraged and just do your best and remember you are probably not the reason the team lost (considering you have gear and are actually trying to do well). You could leave a match like this, but you could stay on and use it for practice and experience (especially practice your defense since you will be getting focused a lot).

 

Another thing, try to discuss strategy with the team before the match starts...remind people to call out 'inc', etc.

 

Others in the thread have covered how to improve your own numbers/performance so I won't touch on that.

Edited June 21, 2012 by stuffystuffs

[leshojoy]

Do you ever post anything positve?

 

I cannot think of a single helpful thing I have ever seen you write, making you the most detrimental player on this forum.

 

hahahaha love this, was thinking the same thing. These are the people you do NOT want to play with, that's for sure.